Sony and Nintendo might as well just merge - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 42 Old 01-17-2014, 03:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Iwata made some comments very recently (today ?) where he basically said that Nintendo is going to have to make some significant changes to their business strategy.

I think they should explore the idea of a merger with Sony. First off, the PS4 is selling very well, and would sell even better if people knew that Mario and Zelda would be coming to that hardware soon. The Vita would be given new life with Mario and Zelda games coming to it as well. It just makes so much sense for these two japanese companies to come together to battle the evil Microsoft from the west (just kidding).

Seriously though... how awesome would it be if Nintendo and Sony got together ?

Let Sony handle the development of all hardware and internet infrastructure stuff, and just let Nintendo make killer games. I would suggest for Sony to buy Nintendo, or for Nintendo to buy Sony, but I think their market caps are so close to each other that neither option is available. Maybe if Sony spun off their video game division, and sold it to Nintendo, then that would make the most sense.
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post #2 of 42 Old 01-17-2014, 03:19 PM
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Absolutely not. Nintendo just needs a big change. New management including a new CEO. They are also stuck in the times. Plus they knew nothing about HD and have a crappy network. Again this was caused from not getting with the times. So, many things wrong with the Wii U. From the name to the marketing alone. Plus very underwhelming specs. With out a doubt this will be Nintendo's first console failure. Will they remain hard up with themselves or learn from these mistakes? Its up to them. They are pretty hard headed atm. Going to take a massive wake up call for some movement and changes.

The biggest thing that irritates me is the CEO. Has admitted being responsible for Wii U's initial failure. Yes he wont step down. I say its to late to save this sinking Wii U ship. And it will remain a 1st party console for the remainder of its life.
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post #3 of 42 Old 01-17-2014, 03:23 PM
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found the story you were talking about:

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/445870/nintendo-thinking-about-a-new-business-structure/


Nintendo 'thinking about a new business structure'
But president Satoru Iwata insists "it's not as simple as enabling Mario to move on a smartphone"
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post #4 of 42 Old 01-17-2014, 03:28 PM
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They need to stop trying to invent the wheel. They had a fluke with the Wii and got lucky. It's not going to happen again.

I see a future like sega. They will eventually be software and maybe handheld only. Because they can apparently do that well, still. I stopped playing with handhelds a long time ago, so I can't really comment.

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post #5 of 42 Old 01-17-2014, 03:31 PM
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I'd love Zelda on my ps4.
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post #6 of 42 Old 01-17-2014, 03:37 PM
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Who wouldn't want to see Zelda, Mario, Metroid (Retro would make it breathtaking on the PS4), F-Zero, Star Fox and so many others on the most powerful console?

Of course if Nintendo made a console with top end specs (no mandatory expensive controller and no mandatory motion sensor packed in either to keep the system at a reasonable price) that works as well.
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post #7 of 42 Old 01-17-2014, 03:44 PM
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I think Nintendo would be more successful as a software only company actually. They could focus on the few great titles they make and sell them for all applicable systems.

I'm guessing people would still buy it. I stopped being interested in Nintendo products after not buying into the Wii. I have no kids, so no alternate interest in their products.

I might buy a Mario game if it was released on PS4 or PC.

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post #8 of 42 Old 01-17-2014, 05:22 PM
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A friend and I have been saying this for a while. I grew up on Nintendo so many memorable moments in gaming right back to pounding my head against the wall playing Super Mario Brothers. I stopped playing Nintendo products about 6 months after buying the Wii, I just cant stand the wacky jump around the living room controls. I play games to relax and that shiny new PS4 and its wonderful controller help make it so. I couldn't imagine playing a graphically intense Mario or Zelda game with a proper controller. My kids started asking for a Wii U, I said absolutely not!! When they asked why I said you can have my ps3 and I'm going to buy us a new PS4. My son who is 7 thought about it for about 5 seconds and I never heard about the Wii U from him again.

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post #9 of 42 Old 01-17-2014, 05:50 PM
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Anyone that thinks Wii with its top offerings was all about jumping around the living room didn't spend much time with their purchase. There were dozens of excellent traditional experiences to be found on the Wii.

I think a combining of handheld and console into one product line is all that Nintendo needs. They just about are able to satisfy customers with their 1st/2nd party offerings on two distinct platform lines already. Make it where everything is directed at a single platform and I think Nintendo can eliminate most of the negative effects on their business from 3rd parties ignoring Nintendo. And sell enough units and they just might naturally migrate back over and eventually erase this probelm even if it would require special effort to serve Nintendo customers due to drastically different performance levels than competing platforms. They're businesses and they go where their customers are rather than the other way around.

I think remaining the platform holder is key to Nintendo succeeding in the software realm. Otherwise, they will merely focus on software that sells best which often doesn't include beloved franchises like the Metroid series. There's tremendous value there for Nintendo and its shareholders in a series like Metroid that goes far behind just what a particular game will directly earn. Make them multiplatform and suddenly the only incentive Nintendo will have is the money they directly earn from the sale of the game itself. We'd be relegated to Mario platformers, Zelda releases, Mario Kart, Animal Crossing, and Super Smash Brothers...

If they were to align themselves with Microsoft or Sony if the worst case happened instead of just going multiplatform, I wouldn't rule out Microsoft. Sony seems like a more obvious pairing since it holds a significant presence in Japan and also has a handheld line, but it also could be an excellent way for Microsoft to finally make headway into the Japanese marketplace.
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post #10 of 42 Old 01-17-2014, 06:13 PM
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Nintendo needs to be selling their games on the Apple Store, Xbox, and PSN.

Take all the people that bought Plants Vs. Zombies... and multiply it by 10x for EVERY title!
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post #11 of 42 Old 01-17-2014, 09:04 PM
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What does that solve? Apple doesn't have the controls necessary to enjoyable play almost anything from Nintendo's back catalog and if they start peddling their classics on XBLA and PSN, what's the incentive to buy the Wii U for $60 new releases? All that does is communicate to the public that we'll soon be multiplatform and you'd be nuts to be buying this new system for $300 to play brand new games when we're doomed. This isn't 1982 when releasing your games on the competition was commonplace and widely accepted.

They just came off a 100 million units sold console. They have rough waters that call for big steps to be taken, but not knee jerk reactions that completely change the company because of a few bad months. Their core is just fine and they should look to preserve that as best as they can while addressing the issues here that have plagued them like their horrible marketing with the Wii U that has left much of the general public either unaware of it or thinking it's an add-on accessory for their existing system.

They don't need to follow Sega's model. And frankly, where have you people been? Look at how things have progressed with Sega since they left the console business. They're not exactly putting out a modern classic AAA game every few months.

Why in Heaven's sake would you want Nintendo to follow down that path for?
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post #12 of 42 Old 01-17-2014, 10:03 PM
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Don't know about merging but Nintendo could open up its legacy library and probably make a killing. Who's to say they couldnt keep making consoles plus put NES, SNES, and maybe N64 titles out on mobile and other places. Would seriously expand their market. Those controls are nothing special. Heck you can emulate most of it many platforms now. For me it makes no sense to buy a new Nintendo console just to play old games but if they were available on something I already owned...
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post #13 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 12:05 AM - Thread Starter
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I think that both of these companies can really help each other. Think of how strong a combined Sony and Nintendo would be in the video game market ? I mean, it would be unfair to any perceived competition. Mario and Uncharted under one flag. The biggest problem in this fantasy scenario is that it will never happen due to the pride that would have to be swallowed by both companies.

Still, I think aligning with Sony would be smarter than just being a 3rd party. If they could convince Sony to spin off SCEA as a private entity, and then Nintendo just buys it outright. They could change the name to the "Nintendo PS4" lol....
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post #14 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 01:43 AM
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In the past, we almost had a Nindendo PlayStation.
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post #15 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 01:52 AM
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I didn't say I wanted them to follow Sega's model. I see them heading that way and it would benefit me, personally. I'm not going to buy another Nintendo device if they keep trying to design a machine around new gimmicks.

There's a big difference in the number of quality titles between the 2 companies. Nintendo would be more successful as a software company than Sega is.

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post #16 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 02:37 AM - Thread Starter
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The biggest conundrum that Nintendo is in right now, is the fact that the Wii U is basically a dead man walking if you know what I mean. The problem is, what is Nintendo going to actually do about it ? It's not the virtual boy. Nintendo was able to get away with killing off the virtual boy and nobody really noticed. If they kill off the Wii U, everybody is going to notice. If they don't kill off the Wii U, it's going to just be on life support for the next several years, dragging down Nintendo's bottom line. So they are truly in a damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario. The other thing, is even if they do kill the Wii U off, they won't be able to get a new system out fast enough to really salvage anything for the next several years. I mean, how fast could they potentially get a new system together ? November 2016 at the earliest is my line of thinking, considering how long it takes them to make software. By November 2016, the Xbox One and PS4 will be at their absolute peak, and Nintendo won't be able to compete with that, even if there system is bringing more power. Developers will have learned the ins and outs of the XB1 and PS4 by that time, and they will have some amazing stuff out on those consoles, and I just don't see a brand new system coming in and disrupting things.

Other than hooking up with either Sony or Microsoft, I don't really see a good exit strategy for Nintendo, in terms of ending the Wii U gracefully, while at the same time creating some new market from scratch, cause the 3DS isn't going to be enough to sustain them.


You know.... there is this thing called the Occulus Rift.
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post #17 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 02:53 AM
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Nintendo should just go the software only route. They haven't made a decent console since the Gamecube. Might as well cut the cord.

Unfortunately the Occulus Rift will never make it out of niche gaming market unless they redesign the crap out of it. I'd never wear that thing on my head and I doubt I'm not alone in that one.

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post #18 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 03:55 AM
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Don't get me wrong, I too thought there were some great titles on the Wii, I for one loved Supermario Galaxy, and a few others. My kids have nearly worn that console out between the many games they have and Netflix. But, Nintendo doesn't care what people want, they can't even give us DVD playback for crying out loud. That is one simple feature they could have implemented in the Wii that would have been used extensively by my children. Atleast with the Gamecube they had an excuse because of the form factor of the discs.

I was so excited when I got my PS2 to be able to play DVD's, my PS3 and now PS4 (while lacking at the moment) are the center of my media experience. I haven't owned a stand alone DVD player in a long time or stand alone Blu-ray player ever.

I may actually buy the kids a Wii U when the price finally drops enough, but I won't be using it. I don't have time to play the games I want to play, like my steam backlog for example.

It would be nice if Nintendo could get it right and make relevant Hardware to compete with the other consoles, I was a Nintendo kid and will never forget the excitement of getting a new Nintendo.

Sorry for the random, incomplete thoughts!

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post #19 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 08:28 AM
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People play the Nintendo games on their other devices with emulators.

So just sell the real deal and make some $.

With the profits you can invest in R&D for the successor to Wii U.
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post #20 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 09:33 AM
 
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I don't know about Sony, the culture and markets are very different.

Read somewhere someone mentioned they should merge with Disney, and it make sense to me. Although I'm not sure if that would entail dropping hardware support. Then again it's not like MS was big into hardware around the time they got into XB.

Leveraging Disney IP's (including star Wars and Marvel) with Nintendo would really, really give them a leg up. They'd have more of a in with western markets, and would retain the wholesome image of both commonalities (Even as Disney has plenty of adult IP's and offerings). They also should be thinking of ways to open up titles to other devices besides Nintendo hardware from the last gen once they stop support for that gen. As said above, plenty of people already run them on emulation; and when you think about it many of these old games and game mechanics are very suitable for tablet and mobile. Cleaning up sprite work and offering a original/HD button to cycle between a HD cleanup and the original, while selling them for $5 a pop, would be a gold mine.

Really though, they can rebound from one failure. They just realize that a critical success from out in left field followed by doubling down on gimmicks isn't going to work. The causal Wii was dead as soon as tablets because a thing, and it the end it only increased the deterioration of their relationship with 3rd party publishers. There's a careful balance between consumers, publisher, and company needs that needs to be balanced if you're going to be in the console business.
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post #21 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 09:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Brad View Post

Nintendo should just go the software only route. They haven't made a decent console since the Gamecube. Might as well cut the cord.

Unfortunately the Occulus Rift will never make it out of niche gaming market unless they redesign the crap out of it. I'd never wear that thing on my head and I doubt I'm not alone in that one.

This.

Consoles aren't really appealing to the general masses anymore. The Wii had its moment, but that target is moving to mobile/tablet gaming. The more "hardcore" gamer wants something that keeps pushing the visual quality of their investments. Nintendo has libraries that gamers want, but some aren't willing to invest in the hardware. If they made the games available to Sony & MS, the could easily make a killing. Merger might be too extreme and could possible see their culture/ideology be overrun and effectively make them a non-existent company.

Ultimately, someone just needs to bring back the Dreamcast and remake Shenmue! tongue.gif

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post #22 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 10:19 AM
 
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Another thing to think about is Nintendo's hardware troubles will also be Sony and MS's eventually. PC too. (though probably not for another 2-4 generations)

Computing technology is converging fast, and if I had to bet the final device would be a small personal smartphone like PC that'll blow current Titan gaming rigs out of the water. You wirelessly sync it to display devices and peripherals as needed. They're cheap, replaceable, and available in a few different flavors. Because they're mass produced (and mass demanded) they offer better price performance than anything else on the market. And as fab and production facilities move to meet that new type of demand, prices for the smaller markets of consoles and PC's are going to go up, eventually prohibitively.

It's a long ways off, but it is something to keep in mind. Eventually we will all be booting into SonyOS / SteamOS / DXGameOS on similar devices and playing everything from casual to AAA titles streamed to the display device from a tiny device you take out of a pocket and put on the coffee table.
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post #23 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 11:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

I don't know about Sony, the culture and markets are very different.

Read somewhere someone mentioned they should merge with Disney, and it make sense to me. Although I'm not sure if that would entail dropping hardware support. Then again it's not like MS was big into hardware around the time they got into XB.

Leveraging Disney IP's (including star Wars and Marvel) with Nintendo would really, really give them a leg up. They'd have more of a in with western markets, and would retain the wholesome image of both commonalities (Even as Disney has plenty of adult IP's and offerings). They also should be thinking of ways to open up titles to other devices besides Nintendo hardware from the last gen once they stop support for that gen. As said above, plenty of people already run them on emulation; and when you think about it many of these old games and game mechanics are very suitable for tablet and mobile. Cleaning up sprite work and offering a original/HD button to cycle between a HD cleanup and the original, while selling them for $5 a pop, would be a gold mine.

Really though, they can rebound from one failure. They just realize that a critical success from out in left field followed by doubling down on gimmicks isn't going to work. The causal Wii was dead as soon as tablets because a thing, and it the end it only increased the deterioration of their relationship with 3rd party publishers. There's a careful balance between consumers, publisher, and company needs that needs to be balanced if you're going to be in the console business.

you are right if they went with disney they would kill it...

also i remember at one point Nintendo was quoted as saying "we will never be sega" (meaning going software only), also sony and nintendo already had a chance to work together... there would have never been a PS1 if it would have happened.
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post #24 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 01:50 PM
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PC too. (though probably not for another 2-4 generations)

Don't be so sure.

The death knell is near for Microsoft Windows.
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post #25 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 02:32 PM
 
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Don't be so sure.

The death knell is near for Microsoft Windows.

Brought to you by MS. I'm pretty convinced it's why Valve is trying to position themselves with hardware and more importantly a software platform (SteamOS). I'm guessing Gabe thinks it's just a matter of time until MS moves completely to the cloud and tablet/mobile, as which point pushing PC gamers into their XB ecosystem will be "good enough".
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post #26 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 05:43 PM
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Don't be so sure.

The death knell is near for Microsoft Windows.

not saying you are wrong, but with how slow people are to change (especially corporate america which uses windows), i think windows is going to be around for a while longer..
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post #27 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 08:13 PM
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Good grief, how many of these "Nintendo is Doomed" stories can there be in my lifetime?

500 gigs FTW.
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post #28 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 08:45 PM
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Good grief, how many of these "Nintendo is Doomed" stories can there be in my lifetime?

42.

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post #29 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 08:49 PM
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As many times as they fail at making systems.

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post #30 of 42 Old 01-18-2014, 09:19 PM
 
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Quote:
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not saying you are wrong, but with how slow people are to change (especially corporate america which uses windows), i think windows is going to be around for a while longer..

They're already making the moves. Within a decade a good chunk might be using Azure "terminals" with everything running server side, including your friendly IT tech guy and the help desk. My place of work already contracts out to IBM, where a few years back we had our own IT guys. Now if a guy needs to come out we get charged, and there's always pressure to not have that happen, to "save money".

Microsoft is actually pushing the idea that any legacy programs will be supported through the cloud / emulation, rather than through windows and on site. Run anything from old mainframe code to XP to Windows 8.

Corporate goes to the cloud, home goes to your smart device be it tablet, phone, or smart screen. No idea when it'll happen, but it's the way the wind is blowing.
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