Optical (Dolby Digital) vs HDMI (TrueHD) Sound - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 171 Old 10-09-2007, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Uptown193 View Post

So for those of you who have True HD and DTS-HD now. Is there a big difference now from when you had only DTS?

Please give me real responses.

it's kinda of wierd, I have a 7.1 setup, usually running dts-es or dd - ex, and then going from that back to 5.1, it's odd. sounds seems richer. LFE needs worked on tremendously, volume is a bit lower, but certain sound effects stand out much more. Going back to listening to an optical cable sounds as if the actors are in a tin can.

"Go Blue"
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post #92 of 171 Old 10-09-2007, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Uptown193 View Post

So for those of you who have True HD and DTS-HD now. Is there a big difference now from when you had only DTS?

Please give me real responses.

DD to TrueHD YES!

DTS one have not had the pleasure.

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post #93 of 171 Old 10-09-2007, 08:41 PM
 
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thanks i cant wait to get my Onkyo 705
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post #94 of 171 Old 10-10-2007, 09:31 AM
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Hello wondering if you guys can help I just got the Denon AVR-2808CI (avr-988) and the Pioneer Elite VSX-91TXH (vsx-9120txh-k) denon was $1200+ tax and the Pioneer was $999+ tax but the guy told me he will give me an extra $200 of on the Pioneer if and when I return the Denon both are HDMI 1.3 and will do the new sound formats.

I hooked up the denon yesterday night and poped in Apocalipto BR and it sounds amayzing then I played Resistance and it too sounds awesome, are there any other titles that might help me with my dilema?
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post #95 of 171 Old 10-10-2007, 11:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Massiso View Post

Hello wondering if you guys can help I just got the Denon AVR-2808CI (avr-988) and the Pioneer Elite VSX-91TXH (vsx-9120txh-k) denon was $1200+ tax and the Pioneer was $999+ tax but the guy told me he will give me an extra $200 of on the Pioneer if and when I return the Denon both are HDMI 1.3 and will do the new sound formats.

I hooked up the denon yesterday night and poped in Apocalipto BR and it sounds amayzing then I played Resistance and it too sounds awesome, are there any other titles that might help me with my dilema?

Actually in your case this is more of a question of which AVR works better with your speakers. In either case you gave the AVR's arent doing anything except running the PCM from the PS3 to their DAC, and then to the Amp sections, and out to the speakers. Apocalipto has an Uncompressed PCM soundtrack (no need for DD or DTS stupid properitary gimme all the money format crap ..sorry..off on a tangent there)..back on point. The (uncompressed) LPCM track gives you the same end result as Dolby HD or DTS-HD (after decoding) Same with Resistance, it's an LPCM 5.1 or 7.1 track, so the AVR does nothing but DAC it and Amp. You dont really need a 1.3 AVR.. and IF the PS3 does get DTS-HD, you wont need 1.3 at all as the PS3 will be decoding these formats onboard, and still send LPCM to the AVR.
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post #96 of 171 Old 10-15-2007, 01:00 AM
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i was planning on getting either an older onkyo 7.1 (790) or a new onkyo 5.1 (600) and running it through PS3 optical because i thought hdmi and optical were digital and were equal, but after reading this thread, apparently they are not.

Should i find a receiver from a not as good brand that has hdmi pass through so i can get lossless, or sitck with onkyo and the 2.1 signal? im trying to pay somewhere between 250 and 350.

another thing, does the ps3 even support full 7.1 sound? the few blurays i have are only 5.1 and the games dont say what thier audio is, is it worth it, living in a small room?
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post #97 of 171 Old 10-18-2007, 02:44 PM
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Hey guys whats up. Long time reader first time poster. OK

I have a question regarding my current setup.

I just recently got the Sharp Aquos 52"D64U which is HDMI 1.3 compatible. I also just picked up a new receiver the Pioneer VSX-1017, its one step below the elite series but still has HDMI connectivity. I also obviously have a PS3.

Ok, my current setup is
HDMI from PS3 ---> Receiver
Optical from PS3 --> Receiver
HDMI from Receiver --> TV

I want to be able to experience 1.3 Audio and Video with my new TV and PS3 for bluray and games.

Currently the only reason I have to have the optical from the PS3 to receiver is because the HDMI cable is passing the audio right to the TV speakers and not to the Surround System. When I change the sound setting on the PS3 to HDMI the sound only comes from the TV speakers and not my receiver!!

Now do I just connect the HDMI from the PS3 directly to the TV and leave the Optical from the PS3 to the receiver?? In order to get HDMI 1.3 Video thats my only option but how can i get the Audio from the HDMI to go through my surround sound system? Thanks for the help in advance!!!

I have a fever and the only cure is more Blu-Ray....
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post #98 of 171 Old 10-18-2007, 03:25 PM
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if it has hdmi pass through then only video goes through the receiver.
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post #99 of 171 Old 10-18-2007, 03:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lb_oz View Post

if it has hdmi pass through then only video goes through the receiver.

Ok, I get that part but then how do I get to use the HDMI for audio through the PS3 and not just video?

I have a fever and the only cure is more Blu-Ray....
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post #100 of 171 Old 10-18-2007, 04:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ3118 View Post

Hey guys whats up. Long time reader first time poster. OK

I have a question regarding my current setup.

I just recently got the Sharp Aquos 52"D64U which is HDMI 1.3 compatible. I also just picked up a new receiver the Pioneer VSX-1017, its one step below the elite series but still has HDMI connectivity. I also obviously have a PS3.

Ok, my current setup is
HDMI from PS3 ---> Receiver
Optical from PS3 --> Receiver
HDMI from Receiver --> TV

I want to be able to experience 1.3 Audio and Video with my new TV and PS3 for bluray and games.

Currently the only reason I have to have the optical from the PS3 to receiver is because the HDMI cable is passing the audio right to the TV speakers and not to the Surround System. When I change the sound setting on the PS3 to HDMI the sound only comes from the TV speakers and not my receiver!!

Now do I just connect the HDMI from the PS3 directly to the TV and leave the Optical from the PS3 to the receiver?? In order to get HDMI 1.3 Video thats my only option but how can i get the Audio from the HDMI to go through my surround sound system? Thanks for the help in advance!!!

in the receivers thread - your answer awaits. but here - this will help. by default - your pioneer receiver ships with a setting on called HDMI THROUGH. do you see it on your lcd when you start the ps3 on it and no optical? that is why the sound is going through to the tv from the hdmi.

i had the same issue - same with others.

you must swich your receiver HDMI audio setting to AMP - and not THROUGH.

look in the troubleshooting section of your receiver manual for SOUND problems. you will see it talk about sound going to tv and not amp - it will then tell you how to change it on your amp.
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post #101 of 171 Old 10-18-2007, 04:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mixxxer View Post

in the receivers thread - your answer awaits. but here - this will help. by default - your pioneer receiver ships with a setting on called HDMI THROUGH. do you see it on your lcd when you start the ps3 on it and no optical? that is why the sound is going through to the tv from the hdmi.

i had the same issue - same with others.

you must swich your receiver HDMI audio setting to AMP - and not THROUGH.

look in the troubleshooting section of your receiver manual for SOUND problems. you will see it talk about sound going to tv and not amp - it will then tell you how to change it on your amp.


Ok problem solved. Called pioneer and they told me these models will not pass through HDMI audio no matter what. In the meantime I ran across the street to the local best buy and upgraded to the pioneer elite 91 series that has hdmi 3.1 tru HD and DD hd and will pass through audio all for $200, got them to knock off 200 off the MSRP and just exchanged the other receiver i bought from them....thanks guys for the help

I have a fever and the only cure is more Blu-Ray....
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post #102 of 171 Old 12-15-2007, 11:26 AM
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Hi,

When using HDMI, does the PS3 have HDCP over the audio stream or is that just for the video stream?

Also, if I pass my PS3 through a 1.2a HDMI splitter and then to a 1.3 HDMI receiver, will I still be able to access the Multichannel-PCM and True-HD Audio features of 1.3 HDMI?

Thanks
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post #103 of 171 Old 12-15-2007, 12:06 PM
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Lossless is somewhat of a waste of money if your speaker set-up cost less than a new F-150

Only watches movies on celluloid in the DOP's personal home theater.
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post #104 of 171 Old 12-15-2007, 12:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShapS View Post

I'm using optical for my ps3-reciever connection and it sounds incredible! I was under the impression that optical was better, but guess not. It sounds awesome as is.

lol. That may have been true a few years ago. Not anymore.
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post #105 of 171 Old 12-17-2007, 08:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hexcode99 View Post

Hi,

When using HDMI, does the PS3 have HDCP over the audio stream or is that just for the video stream?

Also, if I pass my PS3 through a 1.2a HDMI splitter and then to a 1.3 HDMI receiver, will I still be able to access the Multichannel-PCM and True-HD Audio features of 1.3 HDMI?

Thanks

As far as I know HDMI period, supports all audio formats. 1.3 is for video 24hz and deep field image etc. You should get Multi-PCM. The PS3 can not pass True-HD it passes it as Multi-PCM, the same thing.

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post #106 of 171 Old 12-17-2007, 08:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schnurmac View Post

As far as I know HDMI period, supports all audio formats. 1.3 is for video 24hz and deep field image etc. You should get Multi-PCM. The PS3 can not pass True-HD it passes it as Multi-PCM, the same thing.

It it not the same thing. Your receiver takes in the PCM and passes it to your speakers as PCM.

If it was True HD your receiver encodes it differently for an entirely DIFFERENT sound. I have heard both from my same setup there is a 110% noticeable difference.

I have a fever and the only cure is more Blu-Ray....
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post #107 of 171 Old 12-17-2007, 01:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ3118 View Post

It it not the same thing. Your receiver takes in the PCM and passes it to your speakers as PCM.

If it was True HD your receiver encodes it differently for an entirely DIFFERENT sound. I have heard both from my same setup there is a 110% noticeable difference.

Really?, theoretically it should be exactly the same, some Pioneer rec are adding on some form of precessing for bitstreamed audio maybe thats what you hear?, or maybe its because your levels were not matched?(one is 4dbs higher than the other) I am not contesting as I have not tested with the HD soundtracks, but for DD and DTS sent as both PCM and Bitstream sound exactly the same when my rec is set to Direct (no precessing at all)
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post #108 of 171 Old 12-18-2007, 08:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ3118 View Post

It it not the same thing. Your receiver takes in the PCM and passes it to your speakers as PCM.

If it was True HD your receiver encodes it differently for an entirely DIFFERENT sound. I have heard both from my same setup there is a 110% noticeable difference.

What do you have that outputs TrueHD to tell the difference?
The only thing I know of that can decode and pass TrueHD is the A35 or XA2 one or the other cant remember.
It might be 10% better. The PS3 cannot pass TrueHD so how can you tell the difference. It converts it to PCM which is the same thing because its all your going to get. 7.1 MultiChannel is awsome on Drakes Charter.

I would like to know If the PS3 can pass dts HD? Because my AVR can handle it. I dont have any movies with it.
Or does it convert it to PCM?

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post #109 of 171 Old 12-18-2007, 08:26 AM
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For those of you that posted getting rid of your HD DVD players because you got a PS3. I would'nt do that. The PS3 doesnt upconvert SD DVD as well as the HD DVD players IMOP. I put A Christmas Story in my PS3. It looked nasty. I know its an old movie. I put it in my A2 WOW what a huge difference.
IMOP the BR movies I have dont compare to HD DVD movies either
Pirates 3 and Spiderman looked ok. About as good as the SD version played on my A2

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post #110 of 171 Old 12-18-2007, 09:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schnurmac View Post

For those of you that posted getting rid of your HD DVD players because you got a PS3. I would'nt do that. The PS3 doesnt upconvert SD DVD as well as the HD DVD players IMOP. I put A Christmas Story in my PS3. It looked nasty. I know its an old movie. I put it in my A2 WOW what a huge difference.
IMOP the BR movies I have dont compare to HD DVD movies either
Pirates 3 and Spiderman looked ok. About as good as the SD version played on my A2

The ps3 is one of the best upconverting DVD players i have seen, i am sure you have not set the upconverting settings correctly
And as far as the movies again something within your setup, your probably only outputting 480p
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post #111 of 171 Old 12-18-2007, 10:13 AM
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My setting:

PS3 video->HDMI-> TV
PS3 audio->Optical (output)->converter->Coax (input)->Philips Home Cinema Set


So I won't be able to experience DolbyTrueHD Audio? Or do I?

I must say when I play a BlueRay movie and swich to TrueHD-Audio I am really amazed
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post #112 of 171 Old 12-18-2007, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T0Y0 View Post

My setting:

PS3 video->HDMI-> TV
PS3 audio->Optical (output)->converter->Coax (input)->Philips Home Cinema Set


So I won't be able to experience DolbyTrueHD Audio? Or do I?

I must say when I play a BlueRay movie and swich to TrueHD-Audio I am really amazed

NO. The PS3 converts it to PCM then your AVR gets it as MultiChannel.
TrueHD can only be carried over HDMI or Analog connections. Coax or optical can not handle uncompressed LPCM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Its carrying bitstream. What is the audio out optical set to on your PS3? I bet its bitstream. Change it to PCM tell me what happens.

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post #113 of 171 Old 12-18-2007, 12:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Conan450 View Post

The ps3 is one of the best upconverting DVD players i have seen, i am sure you have not set the upconverting settings correctly
And as far as the movies again something within your setup, your probably only outputting 480p

Ugh no my set says PS3 displaying 1080p.
A2 displaying 1080i and looks better.
What setting do you recommend on the PS3?

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post #114 of 171 Old 12-18-2007, 02:06 PM
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Ok. I am now confused.

I am getting an Onkyo Receiver which has 2 Optical Inputs.

My plan is to have my PS3 and Cable box pass audio directly to my Receiver and video directly to my TV.

As far as the PS3 is concerned the only thing I can not get using the Optical Cable is this True HD...right?

I have never heard of True HD (not a huge audiophile) but I am assuming Dobly and DTS will be fine on my ears. It has to be better than just the TV audio.
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post #115 of 171 Old 12-18-2007, 02:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Player2 View Post

Ok. I am now confused.

I am getting an Onkyo Receiver which has 2 Optical Inputs.

My plan is to have my PS3 and Cable box pass audio directly to my Receiver and video directly to my TV.

As far as the PS3 is concerned the only thing I can not get using the Optical Cable is this True HD...right?

I have never heard of True HD (not a huge audiophile) but I am assuming Dobly and DTS will be fine on my ears. It has to be better than just the TV audio.

Which one are you getting?

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post #116 of 171 Old 12-19-2007, 05:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schnurmac View Post

Which one are you getting?

Onkyo HT-SR600
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post #117 of 171 Old 12-19-2007, 07:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Player2 View Post

Onkyo HT-SR600

Dolby Digital is the highest you get. It does have a MultiChannel input though. If someone made an adapter which I dont see possible. (HDMI to HDMI
w/analog for audio). Then you would get TrueHD. If you get an BR or HDDVD player with analog out yes you would be in business.

Alot of in depth info on TrueHD is in link below. Recommend people reading before posting questions here about TrueHD capabilities.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=640949

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post #118 of 171 Old 12-19-2007, 07:46 AM
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This is from the post HD A1 XA2 audio questions.
S/PDIF Coaxial or Toslink (optical) Digital Audio Connection (same as current DVD players)
If SPDIF Audio Output is set to Bitstream (the default) you will get the new formats either transcoded or re-encoded to standard DD or DTS. The format depends on the disc, but the launch titles all use "Advanced Content" which is re-encoded to DTS at 1.5 Mbps by the XA1 and A1. See the "Advanced Con." row in the attached table for details.
If SPDIF Audio Output is set to Bitstream (the default) standard DD or DTS streams on DVDs will be passed as that bitstream.
You can only get 2 channel PCM over SPDIF. If you set SPDIF Audio Output to PCM, you will only get 2 channels. See the attached table.

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post #119 of 171 Old 12-19-2007, 08:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schnurmac View Post

Dolby Digital is the highest you get. It does have a MultiChannel input though. If someone made an adapter which I dont see possible. (HDMI to HDMI
w/analog for audio). Then you would get TrueHD. If you get an BR or HDDVD player with analog out yes you would be in business.

Which would be better to use on a PS3 as a BR player? And analog is your typical composites?

Also, dont mean to highjack the thread, but will it be better to get just the receiver thats included with the S600 and possibly different types of speakers? Or the whole system is nice? Reason im asking is i was at CC today and i was listening to the S600, they didnt have it hooked up to the tv, but i put it on the radio station and it sounded like crap for some reason. The sub had no kick to it. Its now got me thinking about buying just the receiver and separate speakers and sub.
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post #120 of 171 Old 12-20-2007, 08:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DocWB View Post

Which would be better to use on a PS3 as a BR player? And analog is your typical composites?

Also, dont mean to highjack the thread, but will it be better to get just the receiver thats included with the S600 and possibly different types of speakers? Or the whole system is nice? Reason im asking is i was at CC today and i was listening to the S600, they didnt have it hooked up to the tv, but i put it on the radio station and it sounded like crap for some reason. The sub had no kick to it. Its now got me thinking about buying just the receiver and separate speakers and sub.

Yes analog is composite.
IMOP I would buy an AVR and seperate speakers. If you keep an eye on their web site you can pick up the 805 for $699.00. I dont know what your budget is? Amazon has the S600 for $219.00. A buddy of mine has this receiver. It sucks. It weighs nothing.

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