Rock Band: The Next Great Franchise - Page 13 - AVS Forum
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post #361 of 6042 Old 11-25-2007, 12:16 PM
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EDIT: I'm removing this post because I must have been smoking crack -- I was wrong. I haven't fixed the drum solo/fill lag problem yet. I thought it was due to my audio system lagging because of some sort of processing. This turns out not to be true. I think.

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post #362 of 6042 Old 11-25-2007, 03:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dagware View Post

EDIT: I'm removing this post because I must have been smoking crack -- I was wrong. I haven't fixed the drum solo/fill lag problem yet. I thought it was due to my audio system lagging because of some sort of processing. This turns out not to be true. I think.

Dan

Not sure what we can do about this, actually. Either our TVs will have a lag to correct or not. And if it does, it'll show up in the fill sections. Try switching your TV to its native resolution. That helped for me. Next I'll try switching from optical on my audio system.

It's just too bad that there is a problem like this. I would consider this a near perfect game, otherwise....even though it's not a problem so much with the game itself, but with my TV and sound system. (Which still sucks, cuz I spent a fortune on them!) I'm bummed mostly because I think it would be a blast if the fill sections were in time for me. Having said that, though, I had about 5 friends over last night, and everyone was hooked on the game from the first song! One friend, a drummer, picked up the game INSTANTLY! It was amazing....he'd never played it before, and by the 3rd song was ready for hard....and he even did well on that level! Good stuff.
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post #363 of 6042 Old 11-25-2007, 03:25 PM
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Oh, and again, a good song to check if you've got lag in the free-style sections is in the beginning of "Black Hole Sun". before the drum part comes in, you can improvise whatever notes you want for about 15 seconds, or so.
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post #364 of 6042 Old 11-25-2007, 03:32 PM
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can someone who has this game please tell me how long the usb cords are for the mic and drum set. Im getting this game, but i have my ps3 in the next room, so i want to know how long of usb extension cords i need to get. Thanks
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post #365 of 6042 Old 11-25-2007, 04:18 PM
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118 inches (9' 10") for the drum cable.
183 inches (15' 3") for the mic cable.
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post #366 of 6042 Old 11-25-2007, 04:52 PM
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thank you so much
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post #367 of 6042 Old 11-25-2007, 11:09 PM
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Moved up to medium difficulty on drums. Wow, this is getting challenging Get between 85-95% on most songs except the nightmare songs. Cherub Rock killed me on Medium Difficulty as I only got 77%

No problems yet on any of my instruments. Had to re-calibrate when I went to medium difficulty on drums cause I notice it was off. This will probably help me out on the guitar sections also.

Havent tried online play yet. Anyone experiencing any lag online?

"I need it. Buy it. Store it." - Tony Stark
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post #368 of 6042 Old 11-25-2007, 11:15 PM
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If this has been mentioned, I apologize. Just didn't feel like reading through all the pages.

With this game, do you need to have 4 people to play all the instruments, or can you get away with 1 or 2 and still make it work?


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post #369 of 6042 Old 11-26-2007, 12:37 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Imp View Post

If this has been mentioned, I apologize. Just didn't feel like reading through all the pages.

With this game, do you need to have 4 people to play all the instruments, or can you get away with 1 or 2 and still make it work?

You can play solo, 2, 3, or 4.
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post #370 of 6042 Old 11-26-2007, 04:24 AM
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Back in High School, about 10 years ago, I taught myself the drums by playing to CDs and went on to be in a couple of cruddy bands but it was fun jamming. With that said Rock Band is probaby the coolest video game due to the electronic drum kit it comes with. I was able to start on hard and have played several on expert.

I posted a video on youtube of me playing Maps on expert. If you'd like to see it click the link http://youtube.com/watch?v=tODK3TOJGrc

FYI, I didn't play the two solos so I could gain more energy and not fail out when it gets to the hard parts. You'll notice I play the third solo and active overdrive.

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post #371 of 6042 Old 11-26-2007, 07:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Kess View Post

Not sure what we can do about this, actually. Either our TVs will have a lag to correct or not.

I want to be perfectly clear here. IMO, the lag is NOT caused by the TV set or audio equipment. Here's an example: Let's say I'm playing a song and keeping a steady beat on the left or right pad. When the fill section comes up, if I keep the same beat going into the fill section, the drum sounds are suddenly delayed. What I mean is, when the stick hits the pad, the drum sound from the game is delayed. But only in the fill sections.

I read on the Rock Band tech support forum that one guy claims to have called EA and complained, and they're sending him a new drum kit. I doubt this will solve the problem, but who knows? If it does, I will do the same.

Here's the thing I don't understand: Since this only happens in the drum fills, I don't see how it can be a hardware issue. It certainly seems that it could ONLY be a software issue. But if this were true, then why doesn't everyone have this problem? I find it hard to believe that nobody notices it -- it's so obvious as to be glaring. So, I'm still confused.

Dan


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post #372 of 6042 Old 11-26-2007, 08:18 AM
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Here's what's going on -- when you are "playing" outside of the solo sections, you are in fact just causing the pre-recorded drum track to play (or not play). Everything can be delayed to match your system and it all works. If you miss a hit, the miss might be delayed until the next hit, but this doesn't tend to be very obvious. But when you are playing the solo sections, it suddenly becomes much more obvious that when you hit the drums it takes time before the sounds play. This is a fact of life with modern TVs and AV equipment, although setting your system up carefully can minimize the problem, as noted elsewhere.
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post #373 of 6042 Old 11-26-2007, 08:35 AM
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FWIW - I really had a distaste for the RB guitar, but after playing on it in solo mode for about ~20 songs or I think I prefer it over the les paul. The firmness really makes for much tighter action (that's what she said...) and I feel much more accurate with it. I like how all the fret buttons are flush with the neck as well. I think that it takes some getting used to but for those on the fence I would give it a chance. Put down the drum-sticks for a while and play the guitar for a few hours.

Is it just me, or is the RB guitar section spot on compared to GH3? I know when GH3 came out there were a lot of discussion on how it would drop notes and/or not register hits.

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post #374 of 6042 Old 11-26-2007, 09:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abaddon View Post

Here's what's going on -- when you are "playing" outside of the solo sections, you are in fact just causing the pre-recorded drum track to play (or not play). Everything can be delayed to match your system and it all works. If you miss a hit, the miss might be delayed until the next hit, but this doesn't tend to be very obvious. But when you are playing the solo sections, it suddenly becomes much more obvious that when you hit the drums it takes time before the sounds play. This is a fact of life with modern TVs and AV equipment, although setting your system up carefully can minimize the problem, as noted elsewhere.

I think the only way to solve the problem would be to be able to set a second lag calibration for the fill sections. As it is now, the calibration settings act to correct the entire song. Then again, it doesn't seem to matter what settings I use...none of them seem to be able to allow me play in real time, without delay.
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post #375 of 6042 Old 11-26-2007, 11:20 AM
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First and foremost, the wife and I love the game. That says a lot as up until I purchased it for a 'party' game for company at Christmas, I just didn't get the GH/RB rage. I can say 'I got it' now - very fun...

With that said, I'm really bummed about not being able to get an extra guitar that would work as a bass to allow 4 people to play at once. To say that the 4 player aspects of this game were 'misleading' is quite an understatement, IMO. I don't plan on buying another complete bundle just for a guitar, so it looks like I'll have to wait on the individual peripheals to go on sale later.

Sincerely,
Frustrated Band Leader
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post #376 of 6042 Old 11-26-2007, 12:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abaddon View Post

Here's what's going on -- when you are "playing" outside of the solo sections, you are in fact just causing the pre-recorded drum track to play (or not play). Everything can be delayed to match your system and it all works. If you miss a hit, the miss might be delayed until the next hit, but this doesn't tend to be very obvious. But when you are playing the solo sections, it suddenly becomes much more obvious that when you hit the drums it takes time before the sounds play. This is a fact of life with modern TVs and AV equipment, although setting your system up carefully can minimize the problem, as noted elsewhere.

What you're saying sounds completely reasonable. However, I honestly don't think this is what's happening. With that said, I have no other good explanation, so I will do some further experimenting tonight and see what I come up with. Thanks.

Dan


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post #377 of 6042 Old 11-26-2007, 01:04 PM
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I think the issue is pretty straightforward...just not to me!

Let's say you've done the calibration, and you get a 100 ms delay. What does that mean, exactly? That your video is 100 ms behind the audio? That would make sense. I'm guessing the game compensates for this lag by delaying the audio by 100 ms...in other words, it makes the audio come out of your speakers 100 ms later. (To sync up with the video, as it's a little behind the audio.)

Now, this works fine in the sections where things have been delayed for you to play in time to the video and audio. However, when you get to the fill sections, where there are no visual cues to keep you in perfect time with your lag, the game is unable to predict which notes you're about to hit, so there is no reference point for the delay....so when you hit the drum, you hear a 100 ms delay in audio and video when you hit a pad. The audio and video are still in sync with each other, but because you're brain doesn't have a built in 100 ms lag, you're now out of time with the audio and video.

Oh dear. I think I need a nap now.

If anyone would care to help clear this up, that'd be awesome!
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post #378 of 6042 Old 11-26-2007, 01:10 PM
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I think you are spot on with your explanation. The game can calibrate a lag and utilize it only for the known "hard-coded" drum tracks, but the improvised one's will have whatever lag your setup was calibrated for.

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post #379 of 6042 Old 11-26-2007, 01:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pikasauce View Post

I think you are spot on with your explanation. The game can calibrate a lag and utilize it only for the known "hard-coded" drum tracks, but the improvised one's will have whatever lag your setup was calibrated for.

What took me two long-winded paragraphs you said far more effectively in one sentence! I think we've got the problem figured out. Now how to fix it? Like I've already said, I think the only way to get these fill sections in time, is to have a separate calibration for these sections. Something like that would be patchable from Harmonix, wouldn't it? Or would a sudden calibration mess up your beat?
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post #380 of 6042 Old 11-26-2007, 01:23 PM
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The problem with this explanation is that I experienced the lag, right out of the box, without any calibration at all. In the Easy drum tutorial, the first part about "making noise", I hit the pad and about a quarter second later the sound comes out. So for me, it's obviously not related to calibration.

For me, the better explanation seems to me that my audio system has a delay. I'm going to be able to verify this tonight by hooking the RCA outs from the PS3 to my mixing board and amp I used to use with my band. I can guarantee you that does NOT have a delay. So tonight will tell.

Dan


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post #381 of 6042 Old 11-26-2007, 01:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kess View Post

Like I've already said, I think the only way to get these fill sections in time, is to have a separate calibration for these sections.

What, you can't adjust on the fly? Just hit the pads earlier in the fill sections!

I remember a piano player I once knew who had perfect pitch. We went to an orphanage in Mexico, and the piano there was severely out of tune. Even worse, the lower keys were waaaay off. He was able to adjust on the fly and play different keys that were closer to the correct pitch. It was really amazing.

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post #382 of 6042 Old 11-26-2007, 01:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dagware View Post

The problem with this explanation is that I experienced the lag, right out of the box, without any calibration at all. In the Easy drum tutorial, the first part about "making noise", I hit the pad and about a quarter second later the sound comes out. So for me, it's obviously not related to calibration.

Dan

No, the explanation would still fit with your lag. It's possible that you just have a negative value lag.
A - 20, for instance. Which would mean your TV is 20 ms ahead/faster than your audio. It's still a lag, just the other way around. Maybe your audio is doing too much processing? Then again, I'm thinking it would be far more likely that your TV would be behind your audio. Do you know if the game defaults the lag to zero, out of the box? It's also possible that you had a default lag, without realizing it.

It's all kind of confusing. I mean, how does audio from movies and Tv figure out your TV's lag to sync up the things properly? I other words, why don't you have to calibrate your lag for TV shows?
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post #383 of 6042 Old 11-26-2007, 01:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kess View Post

What took me two long-winded paragraphs you said far more effectively in one sentence! I think we've got the problem figured out. Now how to fix it? Like I've already said, I think the only way to get these fill sections in time, is to have a separate calibration for these sections. Something like that would be patchable from Harmonix, wouldn't it? Or would a sudden calibration mess up your beat?

I should say that the lag experienced during the drum fill is the true lag inherent to your system. Ideally this should equal whatever the game calibrates it to be it LCD, PLASMA, etc.

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post #384 of 6042 Old 11-27-2007, 08:42 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pikasauce View Post

FWIW - I really had a distaste for the RB guitar, but after playing on it in solo mode for about ~20 songs or I think I prefer it over the les paul. The firmness really makes for much tighter action (that's what she said...) and I feel much more accurate with it. I like how all the fret buttons are flush with the neck as well. I think that it takes some getting used to but for those on the fence I would give it a chance. Put down the drum-sticks for a while and play the guitar for a few hours.

Is it just me, or is the RB guitar section spot on compared to GH3? I know when GH3 came out there were a lot of discussion on how it would drop notes and/or not register hits.


I think the hardcore GH players are having trouble with the RB controller for the above reasons (stiffness, flush fret buttons right next to each other, etc) and automatically dismiss the controller as "it sucks". Folks like me who rock medium on GH have less trouble. In fact, I've stepped it up and am now playing all the RB songs on hard and even dabbling with expert. I like the controller. My boys (5starred 99% of all GH songs on expert), hate it. LOL.

I personally like the frets on the fender as it makes sliding to the feared orange button a whole lot easier. Not a fan of the stiff strum bar but i'm getting used to it. I'm sure new iterations of a RB guitar will be introduced to make everyone happy in the upcoming months.
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post #385 of 6042 Old 11-27-2007, 09:02 AM
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I think that the stiffer flipper actually feels more realistic; I especially enjoy it on the Metallica songs with the constant "open E" strumming.

Anyone tried drums on expert? I've been trying to learn Enter Sandman and boy is that fun. I had to use practice mode at 60% to learn the first few opening sequences, but once you get it down it really does feel like you're playing.

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post #386 of 6042 Old 11-27-2007, 09:06 AM - Thread Starter
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Played online for the first time this last weekend. Some guy selected Freeze Pop's song on hard. The first time hearing/playing it. LOVE IT! Haven't tried it on drums but killed it on guitar. Cool song.
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post #387 of 6042 Old 11-27-2007, 09:12 AM
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Has anyone downloaded Fortunate Son? I'd really like the song but I'm wondering if it is good cover. Does it even sound like CCR?

I wish there was some sort of 30-second preview feature.
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post #388 of 6042 Old 11-27-2007, 09:14 AM
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Yes, it sounds like CCR and is a fun song to play.

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post #389 of 6042 Old 11-27-2007, 09:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Yes, it sounds like CCR and is a fun song to play.

My son loves drums on this song. He's currently ranked #1.
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post #390 of 6042 Old 11-27-2007, 09:37 AM
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I have downloaded everything for RB available for PS3 and I have been happy with all the songs - even the covers (including CCR's FORTUNATE SON).

However, I started to experience the broken downstring syndrome last night, and after reading the Rock Band forum and taking apart the instrument I have determined that I have the cheap two pieces of metal touching version of the guitar. I have applied for a warranty replacement, but I have not heard anything back from them on shipping. I can still play - I have even gotten 100% of the notes on hard - but I break every "string" of consecutive notes with a double strum or breaking a held note. In addition to the inability to play the Les Paul, this has been another black mark on Harmonix and Rock Band, which is too bad - it's a great game to play when it's working!

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