End of Nintendo?? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 35 Old 02-01-2013, 11:28 AM - Thread Starter
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The Wii U is a bust (so far). And the legendary gaming company's future is looking increasingly bleak

Nintendo had no choice but to go all in with the Wii U, the newest in a long line of ostensibly childhood-defining game consoles. Unfortunately, the company also inherited the weighty expectations of the original Wii — which, if you'll remember, became a surprise hit when it debuted in 2006, or just two short years after the world was first introduced to a little-known senator named Barack Obama. But ever since the Wii U hit store shelves last November, sales have been disappointing. Now the company is dramatically lowering its forecasts for the future.

Initial sales figures indicate that Nintendo has so far sold just 3.06 million Wii U game consoles, and anticipates moving just four million Wii U units through March — far below previous estimates of 5.5 million, predictions that weren't even that optimistic to begin with.

Initial reviews of the Wii U were mixed. Yes, it's fun. But the console failed to offer a compelling reason for consumers to free up dusty shelf space alongside their Xbox 360s or PlayStation 3s. Some critics say the console is confused, and Nintendo didn't know if it was targeting mature gamers fixated on first-person shooter games like Call of Duty and Borderlands, or more casual fans like the original Wii did with its motion-sensing nunchuck. Further complicating matters is a nimble new mobile industry, dominated by non-committal, take-anywhere games like Temple Run and Angry Birds.

"Nintendo needs a change in strategy," Michael Pachter, a gaming research analyst for Wedbush Securities, tells The New York Times. Even though Nintendo is an instantly recognizable brand the world over, the company still doesn't license its gaming titles for other platforms (ever see Mario on an iPhone?). To make matters worse, on Thursday, Nintendo president Satoru Iwata said that the company has no intention of lowering the price of its $300 flagship gaming system anytime soon. "We were already offering it at a good price," he said.

That means Nintendo, unless it releases a best-selling breakout title soon (Zelda, perhaps? Super Smash Bros. Brawl?), will continue on its path toward an increasingly dark future. The company already had its worst year ever in 2011. Dramatic restructuring seems imminent.

Consoles — compared to phones, tablets, laptops, and many other gadgets — have a much slower product cycle. Manufacturers only press "reset" every couple of years so that game-makers aren't constantly readjusting to new hardware.

For quickly aging dinosaurs like Nintendo, that means more plodding along. More disappointing forecasts. More reluctant critics. More lost opportunities to earn the trust of lifelong fans. More, more, more. (Or for Nintendo, less, less, less?)

"People have to try it to see it is fun," Iwata said of the Wii U. Undoubtedly, it is.

But unfortunately for Nintendo, "fun" just isn't good enough anymore
[/]

http://news.yahoo.com/game-over-nintendo-132800446.html

Personally I like my Wii for the most part. I have younger kids thus enjoy the younger type games. If Nintendo was smart, make a version II of the WII; HDMI, 1080P and offer a few more non cartoonish games for adults.

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post #2 of 35 Old 02-01-2013, 12:49 PM
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Help, just rolled my eyes so hard they rolled back in time to 20 years ago which is roughly when people first started saying Nintendo was doomed
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post #3 of 35 Old 02-01-2013, 12:56 PM
 
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Troll post is trolling.
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post #4 of 35 Old 02-01-2013, 01:21 PM
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Why so much Nintendo hate?

"If Nintendo was smart, make a version II of the WII; HDMI, 1080P and offer a few more non cartoonish games for adults."

Isn't that what the Wii U is?
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post #5 of 35 Old 02-01-2013, 01:32 PM
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Oh god, not here too. OUT! Back to the depths with you!

WiiU: moothemagiccow

PSN: moothemagiccow (duh)

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post #6 of 35 Old 02-01-2013, 04:23 PM
 
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Coming in 210 million short isn't the end of the world after the profits from the Wii. Personally I think the WiiU will be a bust of a machine, but it won't kill Nintendo. It'll just be more like the gamecube, or the N64 (if it's "successful")
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post #7 of 35 Old 02-02-2013, 09:57 AM
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http://ca.ign.com/articles/2013/01/30/nintendo-financials-reveal-wii-u-sales

This article on the subject seems far more realistic.

Doomed? Seriously? No way. The Wii U is a very innovative system and it's doing just fine. Not every system comes out of the gate like the Wii. The Wii U will be fine.

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post #8 of 35 Old 02-02-2013, 10:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sschantz View Post

The Wii U is a bust (so far). And the legendary gaming company's future is looking increasingly bleak

Nintendo had no choice but to go all in with the Wii U, the newest in a long line of ostensibly childhood-defining game consoles. Unfortunately, the company also inherited the weighty expectations of the original Wii — which, if you'll remember, became a surprise hit when it debuted in 2006, or just two short years after the world was first introduced to a little-known senator named Barack Obama. But ever since the Wii U hit store shelves last November, sales have been disappointing. Now the company is dramatically lowering its forecasts for the future.

Initial sales figures indicate that Nintendo has so far sold just 3.06 million Wii U game consoles, and anticipates moving just four million Wii U units through March — far below previous estimates of 5.5 million, predictions that weren't even that optimistic to begin with.

Initial reviews of the Wii U were mixed. Yes, it's fun. But the console failed to offer a compelling reason for consumers to free up dusty shelf space alongside their Xbox 360s or PlayStation 3s. Some critics say the console is confused, and Nintendo didn't know if it was targeting mature gamers fixated on first-person shooter games like Call of Duty and Borderlands, or more casual fans like the original Wii did with its motion-sensing nunchuck. Further complicating matters is a nimble new mobile industry, dominated by non-committal, take-anywhere games like Temple Run and Angry Birds.

"Nintendo needs a change in strategy," Michael Pachter, a gaming research analyst for Wedbush Securities, tells The New York Times. Even though Nintendo is an instantly recognizable brand the world over, the company still doesn't license its gaming titles for other platforms (ever see Mario on an iPhone?). To make matters worse, on Thursday, Nintendo president Satoru Iwata said that the company has no intention of lowering the price of its $300 flagship gaming system anytime soon. "We were already offering it at a good price," he said.

That means Nintendo, unless it releases a best-selling breakout title soon (Zelda, perhaps? Super Smash Bros. Brawl?), will continue on its path toward an increasingly dark future. The company already had its worst year ever in 2011. Dramatic restructuring seems imminent.

Consoles — compared to phones, tablets, laptops, and many other gadgets — have a much slower product cycle. Manufacturers only press "reset" every couple of years so that game-makers aren't constantly readjusting to new hardware.

For quickly aging dinosaurs like Nintendo, that means more plodding along. More disappointing forecasts. More reluctant critics. More lost opportunities to earn the trust of lifelong fans. More, more, more. (Or for Nintendo, less, less, less?)

"People have to try it to see it is fun," Iwata said of the Wii U. Undoubtedly, it is.

But unfortunately for Nintendo, "fun" just isn't good enough anymore
[/]

http://news.yahoo.com/game-over-nintendo-132800446.html

Personally I like my Wii for the most part. I have younger kids thus enjoy the younger type games. If Nintendo was smart, make a version II of the WII; HDMI, 1080P and offer a few more non cartoonish games for adults.


I am more a PC gamer and just happened to catch this thread. Hell, the last Nintendo system I had was a Gamecube. But this article seems to be written by someone totally unfamiliar with consoles. Like this statement: "the company still doesn't license its gaming titles for other platforms (ever see Mario on an iPhone?)". As if this is a strange concept in console gaming lol. Is he aware of the Halo, Forza, Gears of War - Xbox franchises? God of War, Uncharted, Killzone, Twisted Metal, Metal Gear, Gran Turismo - Sony franshises? I think the franchises are more a positive of how a system survives rather than what brings it down. That is just terrible business journalism IMO.

Another statement: "Manufacturers only press "reset" every couple of years so that game-makers aren't constantly readjusting to new hardware". Now we all now a that Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo do not release a new console every "couple" of years. This is just dumb to write. Xbox 360 has been around since late 2005 yes? PS3 since late 2006, same for the original Wii. A "couple" is just the wrong word to use here. And these long waits between systems is the way of the business, nothing new. The original NES was released in North America in 1985. The SNES wasn't released until 1991.
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post #9 of 35 Old 02-03-2013, 06:57 AM
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Nintendo is far from doomed. But console makers are going to have to get used to a smaller share of the pie going forward.

The gaming industry has changed paradigms. It's been working one way for the past twenty years, but now it's rapidly shifting gears. Mobile gaming has eaten into Nintendo's portable market, and it's starting to eat into the overall console market, too. But that doesn't spell D-O-O-M. It just means that the big console manufacturers will have to make do with less (just like the rest of us!).

Also, Nintendo really blew it with their marketing strategy for Wii U. Even my gaming friends thought the Wii U was a Wii peripheral.

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post #10 of 35 Old 02-04-2013, 08:40 AM
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Originally Posted by confidenceman View Post

Nintendo is far from doomed. But console makers are going to have to get used to a smaller share of the pie going forward.

The gaming industry has changed paradigms. It's been working one way for the past twenty years, but now it's rapidly shifting gears. Mobile gaming has eaten into Nintendo's portable market, and it's starting to eat into the overall console market, too. But that doesn't spell D-O-O-M. It just means that the big console manufacturers will have to make do with less (just like the rest of us!).


This is the part that disturbs me- Sony and MS have shown no ability to penetrate the booming mobile market, leaving Apple/Google to do whatever they want in mobile OS space, and Nintendo as the only (real) player for dedicated gaming handlhelds... problem is exactly what you said, if mobile gaming is already eating this much of Ninty's lunch in portable and obviously negatively impacting console sales, the strategy for the big 3 has quite clearly become multitasking.

Thanks to iPhone, gaming, TV, media, social networking, and tablet/smartphone are all inseparable and all we're going to get going forward.100% integration is upon us, gents. Ps4/Nextbox will be gaming-centric, but almost certainly have loads more streaming media and social integration that what we've seen to date.



We'll always have Nintendo, they're not doomed, but honestly... the idea that WiiU somehow competes as the "entertainment hub of choice" is just false. Enjoy it for the first party games we'll eventually get and be happy.


Also: Ninty screwed themselves missed the HD boat, just mentioning HD as a feature in 2013 feels like:


Quote:
Also, Nintendo really blew it with their marketing strategy for Wii U. Even my gaming friends thought the Wii U was a Wii peripheral.

Agreed. And they've done surprisingly little to change that. The promotional shots they're running now show the gamepad front and center, which is all but blocking the very Wii-like console behind it. Other than the blue logo, there's nothing that distinctly shows the fickle, uniformed consumer that this is a new console rather than a new gamepad accessory.

[[B]EDIT[/B]] Exhibit A:
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post #11 of 35 Old 02-04-2013, 09:34 AM
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Yeah, I just had a friend over who's not a hardcore gamer or anything but owns a Wii and 3DS and regularly plays at least the latter. She saw my Gamepad and said "Why does your Wii have a screen?" She had literally no idea what it was. She had never even heard of the Wii U.

Anecdotal evidence, sure, but more and more I'm thinking Nintendo could've helped themselves tremendously by just going with the simple "Wii 2" name. Even if they still did the same ****** job marketing, at least when people did hear about it the reaction would definitely be more of an immediate "Whoa, there's a NEW Wii? That thing that was ridiculously popular for over three years?" and less "Is that a peripheral or something?" "Wii 2" says the next gen is HERE, right now. "Wii U" still kinda says "Uh here's a thing, figure out what it is or don't, we don't care."
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post #12 of 35 Old 02-04-2013, 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by ThisOneKidMongo View Post


Anecdotal evidence, sure, but more and more I'm thinking Nintendo could've helped themselves tremendously by just going with the simple "Wii 2" name. Even if they still did the same ****** job marketing, at least when people did hear about it the reaction would definitely be more of an immediate "Whoa, there's a NEW Wii? That thing that was ridiculously popular for over three years?" and less "Is that a peripheral or something?" "Wii 2" says the next gen is HERE, right now. "Wii U" still kinda says "Uh here's a thing, figure out what it is or don't, we don't care."

Wii DS perhaps? Meh, guess that's why I don't work in marketing biggrin.gif. How about an entirely different name than Wii?

But to your point, I agree that there could be a branding issue here. I think the 3DS suffered from the same identity crisis as well, considering that 1) its primary feature/gimmick isn't something you can really emphasis in TV commercials, and 2) at first glance it looked indistinguishable from the older DS. I'm sure the average soccer mom thought it was just the next system in the DS/lite/ i/XL line and not the 'next gen' Nintendo handheld.

Too many systems and games....not enough time or money!

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post #13 of 35 Old 02-04-2013, 07:49 PM
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They should've at least revived the Super prefix.

I think Super Wii or Super Wii U, while sounding even more 'toy like' and looking and sounding stupid (But so does Wii and Wii U), would more clearly communicate to the consumer than just the U suffix has that this is a successor to the Wii and isn't just a accessory while still maintaining a brand that sold 100 million console's that Nintendo wanted to bring over to the next generation.

Not to mention that a good chunk of their fanbase remembers the last time Nintendo used that prefix. There's no mistake in the minds of the many customer's that remember that era that the Super Nintendo wasn't just the same old thing that they had been playing for years before. And I don't recall there being much confusion back then that it represented a new generation of game console (But that was perhaps more thanks to their marketing than the name itself).

Personally though, I'd of just killed off the Wii name. Almost kind of wish that rumor of just calling it Nintendo had came around. it wouldn't even cause an issue for the classic gamer and search engines since NES is in such widespread use to refer to that platform. I didn't like this name over half a decade ago and I still don't like it.
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post #14 of 35 Old 02-05-2013, 07:43 AM
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I feel like no one actually likes the "Wii" name, but I think it's wise to keep it. Sure, the luster might have come off some in the past couple years, but there's still value in it. Like you said, it sold a bazillion units, and was the hot item for three Christmases straight. It makes sense to maintain continuity, especially as it's backwards-compatible with Wii games and controllers.

Branding is for the casuals, and "Wii 2" would let kids and parents etc. know on no uncertain terms that this is the next gen of that thing everyone was obsessed with for a few years. To me, even "Super Wii," despite the reference to Nintendo's heritage, runs the risk of merely sounding like an HD upgrade, or indeed, a controller add-on, to the uninformed.
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post #15 of 35 Old 02-05-2013, 07:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leo_Ames View Post

They should've at least revived the Super prefix.

I think Super Wii or Super Wii U, while sounding even more 'toy like' and looking and sounding stupid (But so does Wii and Wii U), would more clearly communicate to the consumer than just the U suffix has that this is a successor to the Wii and isn't just a accessory while still maintaining a brand that sold 100 million console's that Nintendo wanted to bring over to the next generation.

Not to mention that a good chunk of their fanbase remembers the last time Nintendo used that prefix. There's no mistake in the minds of the many customer's that remember that era that the Super Nintendo wasn't just the same old thing that they had been playing for years before. And I don't recall there being much confusion back then that it represented a new generation of game console (But that was perhaps more thanks to their marketing than the name itself).

Personally though, I'd of just killed off the Wii name. Almost kind of wish that rumor of just calling it Nintendo had came around. it wouldn't even cause an issue for the classic gamer and search engines since NES is in such widespread use to refer to that platform. I didn't like this name over half a decade ago and I still don't like it.



I would have been in line at midnight on launch day for a Super Wii... I find it ironic that Wii U is the first time Nintendo actually designed a console that's supposed to do more than just play games, making this the actual "Entertainment System"...


but yeah, they absolutely fumbled on the name. This one sucks
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post #16 of 35 Old 02-05-2013, 08:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThisOneKidMongo View Post


Branding is for the casuals, and "Wii 2" would let kids and parents etc. know on no uncertain terms that this is the next gen of that thing everyone was obsessed with for a few years. To me, even "Super Wii," despite the reference to Nintendo's heritage, runs the risk of merely sounding like an HD upgrade, or indeed, a controller add-on, to the uninformed.

I thought the Wii U was effectively an HD upgrade( albeit with a nifty touchscreen gamepad) and a few other bells and whistles?

Too many systems and games....not enough time or money!

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post #17 of 35 Old 02-05-2013, 09:12 AM
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I meant it makes it sound more like an add-on or expansion to the existing Wii, rather than the brand-new console that it is.
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post #18 of 35 Old 02-05-2013, 10:56 AM
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I meant it makes it sound more like an add-on or expansion to the existing Wii, rather than the brand-new console that it is.

Well in that case, was that a concern when NES went to Super NES? I don't recall there being much confusion as to whether or not the latter was a brand new console. I personally don't care much for the Wii name, but considering how so many of us have fond memories of Super Nintendo, going 'retro' and calling it Super Wii( or maybe Super Nintendo Wii) may have been a nice touch. I suppose at the end of the day what's in a name, but its still on the company to market the thing to avoid any misconceptions.

Too many systems and games....not enough time or money!

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post #19 of 35 Old 02-05-2013, 12:17 PM
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I don't remember if there was much confusion over the NES/SNES, but the market was less crowded and much simpler then. The concept of an incremental console upgrade didn't really exist so there was less potential for confusion.

To be clear, I don't necessarily dislike the "Super Wii" name, I just think it's not as 100% clear and statement-making as "Wii 2."
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post #20 of 35 Old 02-05-2013, 12:40 PM
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The name won't kill it. Once word of mouth spreads and the games start rolling out, things will be fine. Sure, the advertising could have been better. I agree with that.
But for what it's worth, at the Super Bowl party I attended, everyone knew that the Wii U was a new system by Nintendo. Not an add on.

Even my buddies wife knew, and she's no gamer.

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post #21 of 35 Old 02-27-2013, 11:04 AM
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They have 40 some off BILLION USD in CASH reserves... They are sticking around for at LEAST another 30+ years... even if Wii U becomes another Gamecube.. Nice try!

And I can gurantee all the fantools of Sony and MS will be eating crow with the sales of their respective consoles.. this industry is in for one hell of a ride.. and it WON'T be a good one!
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post #22 of 35 Old 02-27-2013, 01:28 PM
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They do not have 40 billion USD in cash. They were just shy of 9.8 billion USD for that statistic in their 2011 annual report. And it dropped significantly to just 5.6 billion in their 2012 annual report.

Their 2013 report should be released in just a few weeks. Their bank account could be looking awfully barren soon if it takes as big of a drop or even more. Hard to believe with continued losses, a relatively new handheld on the market, a brand new console that is starting off slowly, continued drops in DS/Wii revenue, and the general slowness in pulling the world out of this recession (And with videogaming revenue in general flat or down significantly) that they were able to do anything over the past year but draw even more money out of reserves.

That said, I agree that Nintendo will be just fine. I'm only disagreeing with the figure you posted.
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post #23 of 35 Old 02-27-2013, 08:19 PM
 
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Pff! Leo with his "facts" and "math". wink.gif
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post #24 of 35 Old 02-28-2013, 06:05 PM
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People have been calling the "End for Nintendo" since the N64 days.... seriously.
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post #25 of 35 Old 03-01-2013, 01:53 AM
 
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Can we all just agree to stop responding to this troll thread, unsubscribe, and let it die?
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post #26 of 35 Old 03-01-2013, 08:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leo_Ames View Post

They do not have 40 billion USD in cash. They were just shy of 9.8 billion USD for that statistic in their 2011 annual report. And it dropped significantly to just 5.6 billion in their 2012 annual report.

Their 2013 report should be released in just a few weeks. Their bank account could be looking awfully barren soon if it takes as big of a drop or even more. Hard to believe with continued losses, a relatively new handheld on the market, a brand new console that is starting off slowly, continued drops in DS/Wii revenue, and the general slowness in pulling the world out of this recession (And with videogaming revenue in general flat or down significantly) that they were able to do anything over the past year but draw even more money out of reserves.

That said, I agree that Nintendo will be just fine. I'm only disagreeing with the figure you posted.

so you are claiming they lost 9.8 - 5.6 = 4.2 billion?? That can't be accurate... not sure where you are finding these numbers..

the truth is they are all going to suffer.. all three console manufacturers made big mistakes imo.. both sony and ms rolling a 7-8 year console cycle (and clearly pushing beyond that as we are seeing ports of "next gen" games for those two platforms) and nintendo who definitely started a craze and the bubble burst after the three year mark and because it was sub HD they lost a TON of hardcore fans and during that same period probably ticked off publishers who sometime had to make "special versions" of games..
eek.gif
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post #27 of 35 Old 03-01-2013, 08:08 PM
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According to Wikipedia Nintendo has 1.3 trillion yen in assets FY 2011.
That is a tad under 14 billion in assets in US dollars.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nintendo

Something tells me they are not going anywhere so soon.
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post #28 of 35 Old 03-01-2013, 10:33 PM
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post #29 of 35 Old 03-02-2013, 08:11 AM
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pend.. yup.. that about sums it up!!
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post #30 of 35 Old 03-02-2013, 10:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vdoggie View Post

so you are claiming they lost 9.8 - 5.6 = 4.2 billion?? That can't be accurate... not sure where you are finding these numbers..

http://markets.ft.com/research/Markets/Tearsheets/Financials?s=7974:TYO&subview=CashFlow

Where did you get your numbers from?

http://markets.ft.com/research/Markets/Tearsheets/Financials?s=6758:TYO&subview=CashFlow
http://www.insidermonkey.com/blog/sony-corporation-sne-hunkers-down-before-ps4-arrives-39584/

Sony is in rough shape too. The change isn't that great from last year, but from 2010 it is a significant decrease.

http://markets.ft.com/research/Markets/Tearsheets/Financials?s=MSFT:NSQ&subview=CashFlow

MS's Cash Reserves are down, but not by such a significant percentage.
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