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post #991 of 2401 Old 07-26-2012, 05:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Scott Simonian View Post

Heh. Yeah, good luck with ARMA2 + gamepad. Lol. wink.gif

Exactly. I had to dig out the old wired mouse to even attempt it. tongue.gif

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post #992 of 2401 Old 07-26-2012, 07:08 PM
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Heh. Yeah, good luck with ARMA2 + gamepad. Lol. wink.gif

Explain ARMA2 to me like I was 5. Looks COD to me.
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post #993 of 2401 Old 07-26-2012, 08:05 PM
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Heh. Yeah, good luck with ARMA2 + gamepad. Lol. wink.gif

Lol, hell good luck with ARMA2 + mouse and keyboard! I suck so bad at that game. Got my ass handed to me all the time. Definitely not your typical FPS, and nothing like COD lol.
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post #994 of 2401 Old 07-26-2012, 10:14 PM
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Explain ARMA2 to me like I was 5. Looks COD to me.

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Lol, hell good luck with ARMA2 + mouse and keyboard! I suck so bad at that game. Got my ass handed to me all the time. Definitely not your typical FPS, and nothing like COD lol.
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Looks COD to me.
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...and nothing like COD lol.
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Looks COD
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nothing like COD

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post #995 of 2401 Old 07-27-2012, 03:03 AM
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lol so true
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post #996 of 2401 Old 07-27-2012, 11:21 AM
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Honestly I've never even touched the unmodded Arma2 game to know for sure the differences... though at some point this weekend I'm going to invest some time in the tutorial because I think it'll be helpful for DayZ. DayZ is an excellent mod though, that's for sure. ... I just keep getting shot by other survivors who don't trust anyone. biggrin.gif

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post #997 of 2401 Old 07-29-2012, 08:06 PM
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post #998 of 2401 Old 07-29-2012, 09:18 PM
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Lol yeah

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post #999 of 2401 Old 07-29-2012, 09:57 PM
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10ft. means there's a good chance you're sitting too far from your display anyway dude.........i sit about 6 ft. away from my 55'' and play PC Games. Right now i have a board for my kb-m but will look into some kind of tray on wheels in the future. Most peeps i suspect like to browse the net at the same time they game so moving over to the couch isn't not a good idea, for that i just move over to the desk then move back to the futon.

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post #1000 of 2401 Old 07-29-2012, 10:43 PM
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Yeah dude we are all pretending. I guess since you ripped your PC out of your living room because Windows/Steam at 10 feet sucks balls, and a keyboard and mouse is unacceptable in the living room, and gaming on a PC in your living room is a vile experience we will no longer see you commenting in the HTPC gaming forums or in your own thread for that matter. Cool rolleyes.gif
I have a Shuttle HTPC hooked up to a 60" plasma with Ascend speakers all around and an SVS sub-woofer. Contrary to darklordjames' comments, gaming on it is a thing of beauty. I could give a crap less about Steam not supporting a gamepad. Most of the games I play I specifically use the mouse and keyboard. This is the main reason I have an HTPC, because I prefer the mouse and keyboard with the types of games I play. And yes, I have a PS3 and an XBOX 360.
So in summary, my experience is total opposite of darklordjames. Steam and Windows on my HTPC works/looks great, and PC gaming in the living room is a blast. And no, I am not pretending.

Who says gamepads aren't supported with Steam? I use one (or two) all the time. I was just playing Trine co-op with my son last night through Steam using two XBOX wireless controllers....or are you talking about the Steam interface itself? IDK, I have a regular HTPC in my living room with the 46".....my game room has the 100" 3D PJ and 7.1 surround....and a KB/M biggrin.gif
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post #1001 of 2401 Old 07-30-2012, 12:59 AM
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Originally Posted by darklordjames View Post

It doesn't matter if Witcher can use a gamepad, as Steam's interface can't. I ripped my PC back out of the living room. Windows/Steam at 10 feet suck balls, and a mouse and keyboard is unacceptable in the living room no matter how much people around here try to pretend otherwise.
I'll try again when Steam Big Picture hits, or Windows 8 remote desktop'd to my iPad for control. As it stands, gaming on a PC in the living room is still a vile experience.

If you read above you will see the original complaint of not being able to use a control pad in the Steam interface. Of course many games support the controller itself. And as you say, Trine and Trine 2 work great with a control pad. As for those types of lesser known games that also support a control pad: Limbo, Braid, Bang Bang Racing, Insanely Twisted Shadow Planet, Bastion, Renegade Ops, Vessel, Choplifter HD, Trials 2 Second edition (tried these all personally).

Re-installing ARMA2 so I can try the DayZ mod. That does look pretty cool.

Sounds like you have nice setup, miahallen. Now that makes 6 of us here that have a PC hooked to our TV...
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post #1002 of 2401 Old 07-30-2012, 01:54 AM - Thread Starter
 
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"10ft. means there's a good chance you're sitting too far from your display anyway dude"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/10-foot_user_interface

10ft experience versus 2ft experience is an extremely common way to refer to the difference between sitting on a couch and sitting at a desk and how interfaces need to be tailored to different uses. "10ft' is a nice, round number, not an exact measurement. An exact measurement would be 7.5ft with a 64" display. Perfectly excessive. That exact measurement is entirely beside the point though.

Of course hardly anybody here seems to be interested in the actual point, and is instead trying to pick out specific details to dispute. Missing the forest for the trees a bit, eh? "You sit too far away!" "Your gear must be crap!" "It works fine for me and four others on this forum of 100,000 users!"

To reiterate for those that don't actually read threads before posting to them, the current 10ft interface for PC gaming suuuuucks. This is not a debatable point. This is a universal truth backed by every entity in every related industry. Sure, a handful of people here have kludged together systems that work for them, or just deal with having a mouse in a setup where a mouse is an extremely inelegant solution to the problem. This of course doesn't mean that any of you have actually solved the problem, but instead simply means that you have decided to live with the compromise. Again, if that works for you, great! More power to you. Keep on keeping on! But again, there is a reason that the number of people on this enormous forum that are actually "HTPC Gaming" numbers in the single digits.
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post #1003 of 2401 Old 07-30-2012, 09:26 AM
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Why is a mouse so bad all of a sudden when you're sitting on a couch and looking at a larger monitor from further away? I've lost the thread in your argument right around there, James. Also, why is some dumbed-down interface so much better than just using the normal Win7 environment? I seriously don't follow the argument that the rest of us who are perfectly happy using g'damn Windows are naive or some crap because I certainly don't want or need any simplified UI experience. Seriously, I don't. I have used Windows computers my whole life. It's no more difficult than using an iPad. I just so happen to be able to do anything I need to do unlike the latter.

Just teach your girlfriend how to use Windows and build coordination to use a mouse. tongue.gif

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post #1004 of 2401 Old 07-30-2012, 12:46 PM
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Well dad gummit I know I am getting a bit off topic, but for those who are interested in the DayZ mod for ARMA 2 you will need the Operation Arrowhead expansion to use the mod. I just reinstalled ARMA2 and started to download the mod when I noticed this on the DayZ website. mad.gif

Operation Arrowhead is $19.99 on Steam if you already have ARMA2. Guess I am gonna have to hang this one up as I am not paying $20 to try out a mod.
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post #1005 of 2401 Old 07-30-2012, 01:13 PM
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Well dad gummit I know I am getting a bit off topic, but for those who are interested in the DayZ mod for ARMA 2 you will need the Operation Arrowhead expansion to use the mod. I just reinstalled ARMA2 and started to download the mod when I noticed this on the DayZ website. mad.gif
Operation Arrowhead is $19.99 on Steam if you already have ARMA2. Guess I am gonna have to hang this one up as I am not paying $20 to try out a mod.

I believe the developer is working on an eventual standalone DayZ release. My guess is he'd want that out by the end of the year if that's at all possible, if only to keep the momentum that the mod already has going. Obviously I don't know if that's definitely the plan though.

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post #1006 of 2401 Old 07-30-2012, 02:32 PM - Thread Starter
 
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"Why is a mouse so bad all of a sudden when you're sitting on a couch?"

Where does it go? The thin, heavily textured arm? The cushion next to me at an extremely odd angle? My squishy leg? Do I need to bring in yet another surface in order to use the mouse? A mouse on a couch is a kludge at best. It is very plainly an interface device designed for a desk that functions poorly in other situations.

Flip the argument around. Let's put a touchscreeen monitor on a desk and take away the keyboard and mouse. This is obviously dumb and inefficient. Requiring the user to hold their arm up in front of them for their entire computing session is painful. Typing anything longer than a paragraph is horrible. This is a backward move. Why? Because a touch panel works great for a tablet, the interface that it was designed for. Forcing it on to the desktop is a kludge, pressing the wrong interface device to the wrong surface. This is the exact same reason KBM is a terrible interface for the living room.


And yes, DayZ is pretty rad. It does a great job at building tension, something that is a rarity in the medium.
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post #1007 of 2401 Old 07-30-2012, 04:03 PM
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Every mouse I've used with the exception of an optical, has worked fine on a couch arm, or a pillow.

If it's just navigation that bothers you, use this. Logitech Wireless Touch

Or if you want to game with a mouse and kb, get any wireless kb and a wireless mouse that uses the darkfield tech. Those work on any surface, glass included.

Or, how about finding that 3rd party program (forgot the name) that allows you to set your controller up to work as the mouse?

I see you saying that they've all 'compromised' or 'lived' with it rather than solving the problem, but from what it sounds like in your posts, you refuse to put any effort into solving it yourself and just expect someone else to do it..

I'm not trying to start a fight here, but there are a few different solutions to the problem, and you refuse to acknowledge any of them.

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post #1008 of 2401 Old 07-30-2012, 04:16 PM
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I use a wireless trackball mouse. I can use it in any place, any position. No problems. smile.gif

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post #1009 of 2401 Old 07-30-2012, 04:26 PM
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The one main important reason why I drag my PC down to my living room home theater setup is so I can play games using the mouse and keyboard. I have done this for years. First game I played on my home theater setup was DOOM 3 when it just came out. That was a long time ago. So...the reason that you, Darklordjames, despise the use of a PC in the living room, is the one very reason why I have a PC in my living room. The "kludge" is the reason I and many others do it. Apparently, there are several in here that are in the same boat as me (as are many of my friends and coworkers). Ok, we are in the minority. It works for us but not you. We get it. When FPS's, third person shooters, or any other games that benefit from a mouse and keyboard, no longer supports a mouse and keyboard on a PC, then I will stop playing PC games on my home theater. At least until I am bored with the older ones that do smile.gif

I guess I can see why those who only want to use a control pad on their HTPC would hate the mouse and keyboard interface, but I will never be in that camp and am too old school for that line of thought.

I love me some mouse and keyboard. All the other things (1080P, smooth frame rates, added special effects, etc) are icing on the cake. I want to play Skyrim all modded out, or Serious Sam 3:BFE, or Metro 2033, or Crysis and Crysis Warhead, or Diablo 3 WITH A MOUSE AND KEYBOARD on my home theater setup. This is why I do it. If the next generation of consoles have full support for USB mouse and keyboard setups, then my HTPC days may be numbered. I am not crazy about any of the mouse and keyboard setups used with current gen consoles. However, I have not looked lately at the options.
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post #1010 of 2401 Old 07-30-2012, 04:48 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Ah, the "I'm old school and you must be new to this" argument. Dude, QuakeGL s-video out of my Riva128 to a CRT projector at +100". Or Final Fantasy 9 running at 640x480 with gorgeous bilinear filtering on ePSXe instead of the PSX's 320x240 non-filtered texturing to the same display. I've got you beat by a good 6 years on how long I've been giving this a try off and on. It was a kludge back in '97, and it's a kludge today.

I do love how I repeatedly say "Hey, if the kludge it works for you, more power to you", yet the responses are still exceptionally defensive.

The frustration is of course that a likely good solution is "right around the corner", but that corner is located in Valve Time.
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post #1011 of 2401 Old 07-30-2012, 07:10 PM
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Quote:
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Ah, the "I'm old school and you must be new to this" argument.

Where are you getting this qoute from? Who said anything about you or anyone being new to anything?
My you have a large digital penis there btw.
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post #1012 of 2401 Old 07-31-2012, 01:02 AM - Thread Starter
 
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"Where are you getting this qoute from?"

In the name of genuine curiosity, is English your primary language? Not to be insulting, but you do know that in written English we use quotation marks for a variety of things other than direct quotes, right?
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post #1013 of 2401 Old 07-31-2012, 06:40 AM
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Not to be insulting dlj, but you do know there's a quote function on this message board, right?

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post #1014 of 2401 Old 07-31-2012, 06:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darklordjames View Post

..."It works fine for me and four others on this forum of 100,000 users!"... blah blah blah...
Make that five. biggrin.gif

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post #1015 of 2401 Old 08-01-2012, 12:14 AM
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Originally Posted by darklordjames View Post

In the name of genuine curiosity, is English your primary language? Not to be insulting, but you do know that in written English we use quotation marks for a variety of things other than direct quotes, right?

Why yes, english is my primary language. And I know it well enough to see when someone is manipulating what I wrote to mean something entirely different.

Here is what I wrote: "but I will never be in that camp and am too old school for that line of thought."
Here is what you twisted it to mean (and put it in quotations to make it seem like someone said it): Ah, the "I'm old school and you must be new to this" argument.
I never said you or anyone was new to anything. I was saying that I am just stuck in my old ways. So even if you weren't quoting, but paraphrasing, you still missed the meaning of my statement. If you are gonna try to give lessons on English, then you need to try to understand what is written in English.

And not only that, but you argue to say you can use quotation marks for things other than direct quotes, but then you quote something that I did say in the post prior to yours without using the quote function built into the forum! WTF?? Seriously dude? We are supposed to guess now if Darklordjames is quoting someone directly in the thread or using quotation marks for something other than a direct quote (which Darklordjames himself said could be a variety of things). LOL wow. Thanks to rich3fan for pointing that out.
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post #1016 of 2401 Old 08-01-2012, 01:28 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Yes, a quote function in a piece of software totally overrides a millennium of English language development. Yup. Totally. That is also why the entire English speaking world has stopped using full words but instd spks n rites n sms lolcat now, right? What are you guys doing using "for" instead of "4" and "you" instead of "u"? The last five years overrides all of written English history. That is your side of the argument in regards to the Quote button, isn't it? Why aren't you following your own internal logic?

There is this magical thing called "context". We use it to discern why quote marks are being used. It's seemed to have worked out pretty well for us so far.

Yes, yes. Where oh where did I just quote the word "context" from in Hawk's text...
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post #1017 of 2401 Old 08-01-2012, 01:56 AM
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post #1018 of 2401 Old 08-01-2012, 02:22 AM
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See I understood dlj's quotes around the whole I'm oldschool thing he was emphasizing, and I got his point. But unlike him, I also understood that Hawk wasn't using the generalization that dlj thinks he was using. Sounds to me like both people in this argument misunderstood/misread, or however else you want to describe it. Maybe both people need to take a step back, calm down, and gather themselves and read the posts clearly before continuing a rather fruitless flamewar.



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post #1019 of 2401 Old 08-01-2012, 06:34 AM
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post #1020 of 2401 Old 08-01-2012, 07:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darklordjames View Post

Yes, a quote function in a piece of software totally overrides a millennium of English language development. Yup. Totally. That is also why the entire English speaking world has stopped using full words but instd spks n rites n sms lolcat now, right? What are you guys doing using "for" instead of "4" and "you" instead of "u"? The last five years overrides all of written English history. That is your side of the argument in regards to the Quote button, isn't it? Why aren't you following your own internal logic?
There is this magical thing called "context". We use it to discern why quote marks are being used. It's seemed to have worked out pretty well for us so far.
Yes, yes. Where oh where did I just quote the word "context" from in Hawk's text...
Who's he talking about? confused.gif

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