$200 Blu-ray players this year expected says Sigma Designs VP of Strategic Marketing - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 166 Old 03-02-2008, 06:56 PM
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Originally Posted by wish View Post

While your statement is certainly true for some lame people who have this infatuation with a particular brand I'm pretty sure they are a minority. Most on this forum, me included, are interested in AV. Blu-ray is the only sheriff in town so if you want new titles in HD, you have to eventually go blu.

How about trying to go with an open mind. Comments like "we" "they" and "fanboyism" are buzz words that aren't helping the situation and will continue to draw posts from those who aren't as interested in AV as playing tug of war.

"Open mind"? How about we just be honest and call it what it is? Sorry if my comments are not politically correct for you, but they weren't targeted at anyone in particular in this thread but just based on what I'm still seeing out there and it is a pretty big minority still....though it will hopefully/likely change as time goes on. I've been entrenched in these forums for the last two years (and actually supported BOTH formats) so I'm only basing it on my experience and I know others can relate.

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post #92 of 166 Old 03-02-2008, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by DavidHir View Post

You have to understand it's simply a hate of Blu-ray (which usually contains some anti-Sony sentiment) and/or case of (HD DVD) fanboyism that's preventing many of the people you're referring to from buying a BD unit. Price is only an excuse. If it wasn't price, then it would be profiles (even though most would never use the extra features profile 1.1 or 2.0 would allow). If it wasn't that, it would supposedly be BD+, etc.

Fanboyism runs both ways. Heaven forbid you have a dissenting point against Blu-ray, the PS3, or Sony. You should be happy with what is available and never ask for better.

Of course, I think the fanboys on both sides are silly. If you're happy with (going back to) up-converted DVD's, you probably shouldn't be hanging out in the HDM areas. On the other side, I'm always amazed that some people seem to be happy about the profile mess and high prices.

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post #93 of 166 Old 03-02-2008, 09:15 PM
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The sad fact is most of the good movies I like have lots of grain and Directors Intent so they dont look as good as Chicken Little or Aeon Flux......this I think is the biggest reason why, Even though I can afford it, Do not see the need to re-buy movies on BD and buy a player now....even at $200..........but I probably would if it was a Name brand and fully featured....actually lets say a final spec....

PS- I did pick up Old School and Anchorman on HD DVD last night for $9.99 at Frys though......I am watching Blade Runner now.....Sad to see HD DVD gone but taking advantage of the sales!!

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post #94 of 166 Old 03-03-2008, 12:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Tomlin View Post

Nice.

Even the cheapest of HD DVD supporters should be able to cough up $200 for a Blu-ray player.

Or maybe not.........

Comments like this should have you expelled from the forum. I have come hear, eager to learn what I can about BR since HD DVD failed. I'm sorry we aren't all as Rich as you and can afford anything our hearts so desire. I refuse to go BR until prices drop to the $200 level, and preferably a little lower. I have a dedicated HT, am quite educated with a fine profession. However, it's not a matter of being cheap or coughing up the $200 as trying to get the best for my money.

Tony
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post #95 of 166 Old 03-03-2008, 07:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonybradley View Post

Comments like this should have you expelled from the forum. I have come hear, eager to learn what I can about BR since HD DVD failed. I'm sorry we aren't all as Rich as you and can afford anything our hearts so desire. I refuse to go BR until prices drop to the $200 level, and preferably a little lower. I have a dedicated HT, am quite educated with a fine profession. However, it's not a matter of being cheap or coughing up the $200 as trying to get the best for my money.

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post #96 of 166 Old 03-03-2008, 07:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Tomlin View Post


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post #97 of 166 Old 03-04-2008, 08:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonybradley View Post

I refuse to go BR until prices drop to the $200 level, and preferably a little lower.

Blaspheme against the mighty and powerful Blu-ray Disc and have the audacity to call it "BR"??? Comments like this should have your ISP cut off your internet service as well as cable/satellite connection and basnish you to the local library for week of reading text off of volumes of paper bound in books!

See, I can do that too

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post #98 of 166 Old 03-05-2008, 01:44 PM
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Sorry, Sony Electronics CEO says no licenses for cheapo blu-ray players and prices won't drop below $299 this year.

Quote:


"I don't think $200 is going to happen this year. Next year $200 could happen. We'll be at a $300 rate this year. $299 will happen this year."

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post #99 of 166 Old 03-05-2008, 02:21 PM
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Quote:


Comments like this should have you expelled from the forum. I have come hear, eager to learn what I can about BR since HD DVD failed. I'm sorry we aren't all as Rich as you and can afford anything our hearts so desire. I refuse to go BR until prices drop to the $200 level, and preferably a little lower. I have a dedicated HT, am quite educated with a fine profession. However, it's not a matter of being cheap or coughing up the $200 as trying to get the best for my money.

Ah. In that case, I'd recommend picking up a 40 gig PlayStation 3, available from your local retailer for $399. I own one, as do many others here, and can tell you it's an excellent machine that loads discs quickly and has great bells and whistles like built-in WiFi, audio/video/photo streaming, and top-notch DVD upconversion.

Sony has subsidized the PS3 heavily in an effort to (a) get more Blu-Ray players on the market and (b) sell game licenses. Therefore, you're getting what's really about a $700 player for $400. If and when off-brand players drop to $200, it will be because they're able to manufacture them for around $100. They won't have any of the bells and whistles, and the build quality won't be great, but they will do the bare minimum for the bare minimum.

So your choices are: a $100 player for $200, or a $700 player for $400. I have a pretty good idea what the better choice is, but it's up to you.
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post #100 of 166 Old 03-05-2008, 02:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopstretch View Post

Sorry, Sony Electronics CEO says no licenses for cheapo blu-ray players and prices won't drop below $299 this year.

You don't foreshadow what the prices will be in December when it is only March. Time will take care of itself.

We know that Funai is making Blu-ray players, and they are the main provider of inexpensive DVD players for WalMart. My guess is that WalMart already has this lined up and prices will be under $200 for entry-level machines in Q4.

If not, hey, I paid $1400 for my first DVD player and $400 for the second. Current pricing of Blu-ray players would be find were it not for the expectations raised by Toshiba's pricing strategies during the late war.
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post #101 of 166 Old 03-05-2008, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by tonybradley View Post

I refuse to go BR until prices drop to the $200 level, and preferably a little lower. .

Well, I "refuse to go BR" until prices drop to the $190 level

Who cares what your entry price is?
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post #102 of 166 Old 03-05-2008, 02:42 PM
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Originally Posted by rlsmith View Post

If not, hey, I paid $1400 for my first DVD player and $400 for the second. Current pricing of Blu-ray players would be find were it not for the expectations raised by Toshiba's pricing strategies during the late war.

Agreed - a lot of people were spolied by Toshiba's heavy subsidizing.

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post #103 of 166 Old 03-05-2008, 02:59 PM
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Unfortunately, it looks like the end of the format war won't be bringing any major price cuts to the world of Blu-Ray anytime soon. According to Sony Electronics CEO Stan Glasgow: "I don't think $200 is going to happen this year. Next year $200 could happen. We'll be at a $300 rate this year. $299 will happen this year." via Gizmodo and News.com
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post #104 of 166 Old 03-05-2008, 04:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Hopstretch View Post

Sorry, Sony Electronics CEO says no licenses for cheapo blu-ray players and prices won't drop below $299 this year.




Sony's desire to make some of the billions back that they have lost subsidizing their PS3s and other players may end up biting them in the butt.

Nothing like a nice dose of over-confidence in one's product and where it stands currently in the marketplace to help insure that it stays a niche item.
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post #105 of 166 Old 03-05-2008, 04:32 PM
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Well as an owner of the Sony BDP-300 for only $217, I can say it still ain't worth it. They are buggy and slow and there are too few Blu-Ray movies out there. Add to this many of the Blu-Ray movies don't look much better than a good up converted DVD. Will Profile 2 players help? Maybe. Maybe not, since they are in bed with Sun Java, which has always been buggy and unreliable on PC's. I can see the need for ethernet ports on these things since the Java crap will always be downloading updates and patches. I can see them wanting to download a software update or patch every time I load a disc to play a movie.

Jon
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post #106 of 166 Old 03-05-2008, 04:45 PM
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Originally Posted by aviman33 View Post

Add to this many of the Blu-Ray movies don't look much better than a good up converted DVD.

Riiiight.

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post #107 of 166 Old 03-05-2008, 08:17 PM
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Originally Posted by aviman33 View Post

Add to this many of the Blu-Ray movies don't look much better than a good up converted DVD.

My god, the amount of crapola coming out of these threads post format war is absolutely disgusting, and furthermore, complete untruths.

Seriously, you need a cornea replacement if you truly believe your statement.
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post #108 of 166 Old 03-06-2008, 06:04 AM
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Originally Posted by eskimo2176 View Post

My god, the amount of crapola coming out of these threads post format war is absolutely disgusting, and furthermore, complete untruths.

Seriously, you need a cornea replacement if you truly believe your statement.

I call them as I see them... I'm viewing with both a 100" front projection and 50" plasma. And yes, some look spectacular but others don't look much better than I can get on my DVB-318 DVD player upconverted via component. Basically, I see tier 3 Blu-Rays to be slightly better than up converted SD DVD's. And tier 4 & 5, no better than SD DVD up converted.

And stick your format war comments up your blow hole. I"m not part of any format war. I only own the Sony BDP-300. I've never owned a HD-DVD player.

Jon
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post #109 of 166 Old 03-06-2008, 06:36 AM
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The last few posts should be removed by the moderator. Read the rules about posting!!!

As they say challange the post not the poster.
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post #110 of 166 Old 03-06-2008, 07:36 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by CritterNYC View Post

Unfortunately, it looks like the end of the format war won't be bringing any major price cuts to the world of Blu-Ray anytime soon. According to Sony Electronics CEO Stan Glasgow: "I don't think $200 is going to happen this year. Next year $200 could happen. We'll be at a $300 rate this year. $299 will happen this year." via Gizmodo and News.com

Sony CEO is just trying to prop up margins as long as he can.

Kinda silly for him to say wait until prices drop when they just announced $399 and $499 2.0 players. Osborne effect and all that.

He does not have control of his competitors and low cost manufacturers like Funai.

The lead SoC vendor for Blur-ray, (Sigma Systems) talking in a trade or financial analysis (ie not directed for consumer consumption) is probably a more accurate source than a public interview.

With a new Sony Blu-ray player, 2.0 profile going at $399 MSRP, thats a MAP (minimum allowed publicly advertised price of $349) for a few months. Expect $299 Amazon and street prices on that dominant Sony branded BD-Live player by the end of the year.

It easily follows a that lessor brand, like a Wal-Mart player built by Alco would sell for $50 less of a brand premium, just because its Alco not a Sony. So the target price of a lessor brand is $50 or more below the street price of the upper tier brand. Plus MAP pricing cannot be enforced.

Then say a profile 1.1 Bonus view player will sell for normally $50 less than a BD-Live player.

So if we have $299-$349 Sony BD-Live players by the end of the year, it follows that we will probably have $199-$249 Bonus View Funai players by the end of the year as well.


Despite the Sony CEOs comments now.

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post #111 of 166 Old 03-06-2008, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by rwestley View Post

The last few posts should be removed by the moderator. Read the rules about posting!!!

As they say challange the post not the poster.

That post was crapola!

Better?

Brandon
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post #112 of 166 Old 03-06-2008, 09:26 AM
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$299 retail means $200 street, especially around Christmas. So there you go.
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post #113 of 166 Old 03-06-2008, 09:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonybradley View Post

Comments like this should have you expelled from the forum. I have come hear, eager to learn what I can about BR since HD DVD failed. I'm sorry we aren't all as Rich as you and can afford anything our hearts so desire. I refuse to go BR until prices drop to the $200 level, and preferably a little lower. I have a dedicated HT, am quite educated with a fine profession. However, it's not a matter of being cheap or coughing up the $200 as trying to get the best for my money.

what he said!
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post #114 of 166 Old 03-06-2008, 09:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kosty View Post

Sony CEO is just trying to prop up margins as long as he can.

Kinda silly for him to say wait until prices drop when they just announced $399 and $499 2.0 players. Osborne effect and all that.

He does not have control of his competitors and low cost manufacturers like Funai.

If Sony has some say in which companies can be licensed to manufacture BD players (as he implies in the interview) then he would in fact have some degree of control over the likelihood of low-cost players from those vendors being produced.

Quote:


not until the BDA decides to license the tech to them, and Glasgow implied it's gonna be a while before that happens.

Of course, since BD media sales currently only occupy 2% of the overall market, this is an impossibly arrogant position for Sony to adopt.

But as this is Sony we are talking about, is anyone surprised?
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post #115 of 166 Old 03-06-2008, 12:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Sony is not the BDA.

Funai and others already are showing bare bones profile 1.0 Bonus View players.

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post #116 of 166 Old 03-06-2008, 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by luclin999 View Post

If Sony has some say in which companies can be licensed to manufacture BD players (as he implies in the interview) then he would in fact have some degree of control over the likelihood of low-cost players from those vendors being produced.



Of course, since BD media sales currently only occupy 2% of the overall market, this is an impossibly arrogant position for Sony to adopt.

But as this is Sony we are talking about, is anyone surprised?

The BDA hasn't licensed the standard to any Chinese manufacturers.

"On Blu-ray pricing, Mr Glasgow expects prices of players to drop to as low as $299 by the end of the year. They currently cost $399 and higher. He feels the price of a player could fall to about $200 by the end of 2009.

The prices of Blu-ray players are not expected to fall as precipitously as they did with regular DVD players. The Blu-ray Association, the group controlling the standard, has yet to license it to Chinese manufacturers, who would be expected to drive down prices."

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/ca6017de-e...0779fd2ac.html
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post #117 of 166 Old 03-06-2008, 02:54 PM
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All the talk about refusing to buy into Blu-ray until price is whatever is getting tiresome. Even if there is a watered-down BD player at $199 with 1080i, no coaxial or analogue out etc., like the A2/A3, I suspect these people are still not happy. They'll shift the price point to $99.

Audiosceptics accept audio trials using 25 people. A recent Oxford study with over 353,000 patient records from 639 separate clinical trials shows for every 1,000 people taking diclofenac or ibuprofen there would be 3 additional heart attacks, 4 more cases of heart failure and 1 death every year.

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post #118 of 166 Old 03-06-2008, 03:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willyd View Post

The BDA hasn't licensed the standard to any Chinese manufacturers.

According to BDA licensing website, the following China/Taiwan companies are licensed to make BD players.

China Hualu Group Co., Ltd
DESAY A&V SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY CO., LTD
Dongguan Contel Electronics Co., Ltd
Express Luck Industrial Limited
FORWORLD ELECTRONICS Co., LTD
Gowell Electronic Limited
Lite-On I.T.
SHENZHEN MTC CO., LTD
TCL Technoly Electronics (Hui Zhou) Co., Ltd
Tonic Digital Products Ltd
WINBASE ELECTRONICS CORP., LTD

Keith Jack
Sigma Designs
BD, IPTV, HDTV decoder supplier
Blog: http://www.keithjack.net
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post #119 of 166 Old 03-06-2008, 04:17 PM
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Originally Posted by kjack View Post

According to BDA licensing website, the following China/Taiwan companies are licensed to make BD players.

China Hualu Group Co., Ltd
DESAY A&V SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY CO., LTD
Dongguan Contel Electronics Co., Ltd
Express Luck Industrial Limited
FORWORLD ELECTRONICS Co., LTD
Gowell Electronic Limited
Lite-On I.T.
SHENZHEN MTC CO., LTD
TCL Technoly Electronics (Hui Zhou) Co., Ltd
Tonic Digital Products Ltd
WINBASE ELECTRONICS CORP., LTD

Thanks for that info. I was just paraphrasing the article (hadn't really done much extensive research). I could probably go for a Lite-On Blu-Ray player!
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post #120 of 166 Old 03-06-2008, 04:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilian.ca View Post

All the talk about refusing to buy into Blu-ray until price is whatever is getting tiresome. Even if there is a watered-down BD player at $199 with 1080i, no coaxial or analogue out etc., like the A2/A3, I suspect these people are still not happy. They'll shift the price point to $99.

Agreed.

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