Denon DVD3800BDCI Owner's Thread - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 05:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikefl52 View Post

Lee - Thanks for the informative review, I look forward to hearing more impressions from you and others who have already obtained theirs.

I cannot wait till I get back to the States next week where mine ordered from ABT Electronics will be waiting. Also have to order some interconnects for the analog out. Oh and some BR movies since I have none at this time - any suggestions to show off the player and that are good movies at the same time?

Is there any chance of making this thread a sticky since I am sure there will be quite an interest in it going forward?

Suggestions for BD demos (in no particular order):

1) Planet Earth (audio not great but video makes up for it)
2) SpiderMan 3
3) Crank
4) Any of the Pirates of the Caribbean movies
5) Lost: Season 3
6) Ratatouille

List is only for A/V content. I'm not vouching for the actual movie itself.

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post #32 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 05:57 AM
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Anyone using 24P this player?

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post #33 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 05:57 AM
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Lee, could you comment on the responsiveness of the disc tray after you press "Eject"?
One of my pet peeves against prior Denon DVD players has been tray responsiveness.

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post #34 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 06:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RBFC View Post

I/P was on. After reading the manual, I thought for sure it'd work. Nope.... The 1080p/24 selection is "grayed out" so you can't even choose it. I went back and tried the I/P off with no luck either. Couldn't get it to work.

Lee

Interesting that it does not work. Perhaps this is an EDID issue? I have a Lumagen Vision Pro HDP video processor which has the capability to modify the EDID information sent to the player. It will be interesting to see if I can get the 3800 to send out 1080p24 to the Lumagen.

I am just in shock they don't have an equivalent "source direct" mode like the Pioneer Elite models. Having the ability to "force" 1080p24 these days is a fairly critical feature, in my opinion. I am not going to cancel my order, though!

Mark
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post #35 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 06:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by giomania View Post


I am just in shock they don't have an equivalent "source direct" mode like the Pioneer Elite models. Having the ability to "force" 1080p24 these days is a fairly critical feature, in my opinion. I am not going to cancel my order, though!

Mark

The Pioneer has a source direct mode. However that is
not a force mode. It only works when it gets the right
EDID handshake verifying the display can support 1080p/24.

Or like you - I have a D2 in the chain and the D2 responds
with the correct EDID for 1080p/24 mode.

If people are not seeing 1080p/24 working - then most likely
their display is not really 1080p/24 capable of Denon has
a BUG.

But forcing 1080p/24 is a HDMI licensing violation.
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post #36 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 07:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bferr1 View Post

Lee, can you give approximate booting/loading times for the player and BD-J discs like the Pirates movies? Thanks.

The machine loads the discs I did try faster than I've seen other players do. I'll try the Pirates discs as I go further with the testing. It doesload Fox discs very quickly, and is virtually silent (tray operation, etc.)

Lee

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post #37 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 07:33 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EWL5 View Post

Most BD's are encoded at 1080p/24 so anytime you can get from source to display without any chance of being altered (ie. 2:3 pulldown) is optimal. My plasma is not 1080p but with the 1080p/24 "mode" on (ie. PureCinema ADV), it refreshes at 72Hz, which is a multiple of 24 and hence, becomes 3:3 pulldown.

I have seen the benefits from my PS3 during panning scenes that are so smooth compared to normal 2:3 pulldown. The PS3 did not have the ability to force 1080p/24 until a recent firmware (yet another indicator that Sony has listened to the home theater crowd). In reality, a "forced" mode should never be a deal breaker but it is definitely a perk that seems to be a Sony standard moving forward.

Edit: Thanks Lee for your review and congrats on a superb machine. Hoping to hear more from Calvin too.

I will try the "Pure cinema advanced" mode on the Pioneer later and report if this will allow the Denon to put out 1080p/24. Thanks for the tip!

Lee

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post #38 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 07:34 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drhankz View Post

The Pioneer has a source direct mode. However that is
not a force mode. It only works when it gets the right
EDID handshake verifying the display can support 1080p/24.

Or like you - I have a D2 in the chain and the D2 responds
with the correct EDID for 1080p/24 mode.

If people are not seeing 1080p/24 working - then most likely
their display is not really 1080p/24 capable of Denon has
a BUG.

But forcing 1080p/24 is a HDMI licensing violation.

The Pioneer manual clearly states that 1080p/24 is an acceptable input resolution. If it won't handshake, oh, well.............

Lee

B&W 801D (Left,Right), B&W HTM1D (center), B&W CWM8180 x 3 (6.1 surround), JL Audio F113 x 2 (subwoofers), Krell Foundation pre-pro, Krell EV403 (front 3 channels), Krell S1500/3 (rear 3 channels), OPPO 105D (Blu-ray, SACD, DVD-A), Calyx Audio DAC24/192, MacMini w/ 2TB drive (server), Purist Audio interconnects & speaker cables, Pioneer PRO-HD1540 plasma 60"
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post #39 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 07:37 AM
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It's nice to know the analog out audio quality is so good. The engineering and parts content that goes into the audio analog output stage is probably a key factor in the cost of this player.

RBFC, I take it you have found no downside to using the analog outs, correct? All of the decoding and processing you wanted the player to do via the analog outs appears to be working as you wanted?

Have you tested DTS-HD HR tracks yet? How 'bout Dolby Digital Plus? There was some concern from the Denon manual that the analog outs would only get the lower quality "core" or "associated" track when trying to play those.

Also, are you using the player's own bass and speaker management for the analog outs, or have you disabled that so that you are doing it in your AVR?
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post #40 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 07:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

It's nice to know the analog out audio quality is so good. The engineering and parts content that goes into the audio analog output stage is probably a key factor in the cost of this player.

RBFC, I take it you have found no downside to using the analog outs, correct? All of the decoding and processing you wanted the player to do via the analog outs appears to be working as you wanted?

Have you tested DTS-HD HR tracks yet? How 'bout Dolby Digital Plus? There was some concern from the Denon manual that the analog outs would only get the lower quality "core" or "associated" track when trying to play those.

Also, are you using the player's own bass and speaker management for the analog outs, or have you disabled that so that you are doing it in your AVR?
--Bob

Glad I'm online with a few more minutes this AM!

I have The Condemned and House of 1000 Corpses to try for DTS-HR. I'll let you know.

DTS-HD/MA and Dolby TrueHD both lit up the indicators on the Denon's front panel when playing those tracks, and the sound quality was such that I have no doubt that the correct decoding was occurring.

I am using the bass management and speaker delay/level settings in the player, since the AVR4806 does not process its analog "EXT IN" inputs. The settings were simple to make and worked very well.

Associated equipment:

B&W 801D (left, right)
B&W HTM-1D (center)
B&W CWM8180 (left surround, right surround, single back surround = 6.1)
Krell EVO 403 amplifier (l,c,r)
Denon AVR4806 (preamp, processor, surround amplifiers)
Denon DVD3930CI (SACD, DVD-A) via DenonLink
Denon DVD3800BDCI (BD,CD, SD-DVD yet to test)
Purist Audio cabling
DirecTV HR20 HD DVR
Pioneer PRO1540HD 60" plasma via HDMI

Lee

B&W 801D (Left,Right), B&W HTM1D (center), B&W CWM8180 x 3 (6.1 surround), JL Audio F113 x 2 (subwoofers), Krell Foundation pre-pro, Krell EV403 (front 3 channels), Krell S1500/3 (rear 3 channels), OPPO 105D (Blu-ray, SACD, DVD-A), Calyx Audio DAC24/192, MacMini w/ 2TB drive (server), Purist Audio interconnects & speaker cables, Pioneer PRO-HD1540 plasma 60"
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post #41 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 07:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RBFC View Post

The Pioneer manual clearly states that 1080p/24 is an acceptable input resolution. If it won't handshake, oh, well.............

Lee

My post did say - Display or Bug.

The Bug could be in either device.
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post #42 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 08:07 AM
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hi !
is it possible to have the audio menu settings to obtain dolby true hd and dts ma via analogue out ?
thank you
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post #43 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 08:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Also, are you using the player's own bass and speaker management for the analog outs, or have you disabled that so that you are doing it in your AVR?
--Bob

Doing it the AVR (or pre/pro) would require doing an A/D in the AVR which does not seem desirable, so I would imagine using the "pure" or "direct" without processing in the AVR would be the way to go since the 3800 has level, phase (distance) and a somewhat variable cross-over for the subwoofer.

The only thing that I think it does not have is any THX (I think) or other porcessing, but to be honest with a lossless source, do you really want to do this? I would be interersted to hear if people apply THX corrections to the lossless audio formats.

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post #44 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 08:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drhankz View Post

My post did say - Display or Bug.

The Bug could be in either device.

Since the 6th generation, Pioneer plasmas have been able to accept 1080p/24 under the PureCinema ADV mode (I own a 6th gen Pro1130). The difference is that my plasma was not advertised with this feature whereas 7th gen onward were. Since Lee owns a 7th gen (1540), his plasma should have it hardcoded in the EDID whereas I always need a forced mode. Someone feel free to correct me on this if I'm wrong.

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post #45 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 08:40 AM
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Originally Posted by LHutchin View Post

Does anyone know of a retailer that would be prepared to ship one of these internationally?

Thanks
Lance

but in europe BD is region B, in usa region A
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post #46 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 09:00 AM
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FWIW RE: Lumagen Video Processor and forced 24P:

I couldn't get my Sony BD player to output 24P to my Radiance processor even though 'forced to do so' in the Sony set up menu. However, when I turned off ALL other input resolutions in the Lumagen EXCEPT 24P it worked out fine..

There are more than a handful of [op amps] that sound so good that most designers want to be using them as opposed to discreet transistors. Dave Reich, Theta 2009
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post #47 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 09:15 AM
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Just got the 3800 today for my demo room!

Adz
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post #48 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 09:43 AM
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can someone whos has the 3800 check to see if has the same issue the 2500
had with the true hd in resident evil 3, these were held back a while after the
2500 was release just curious.
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post #49 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 09:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thebland View Post

FWIW RE: Lumagen Video Processor and forced 24P:

I couldn't get my Sony BD player to output 24P to my Radiance processor even though 'forced to do so' in the Sony set up menu. However, when I turned off ALL other input resolutions in the Lumagen EXCEPT 24P it worked out fine..

That trick works for the LGBH200 too.
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post #50 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 10:06 AM
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My 3800 will be here tomorrow morning so hopefully I can help answer some questions.

Search or copy and paste-> Joe Rod Home Theater .Com <-to check out my latest Reviews.

Check out these new Lighted Cup Holders:
http://hstrial-jrodriguez996.homeste...=1402680301175
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post #51 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 10:18 AM
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You using 24P, Joe?

There are more than a handful of [op amps] that sound so good that most designers want to be using them as opposed to discreet transistors. Dave Reich, Theta 2009
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post #52 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 10:19 AM
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Hell yeah Bland, I plan to test your composite trick first. I promise.

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post #53 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 10:47 AM - Thread Starter
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I went completely through the setup menus of my Pioneer plasma and was able to activate the 1080p/24 output of the Denon 3800!!

I DID have the plasma set to "Pure Cinema Advanced" mode, but someone had changed the "AV selection" to "Standard", which didn't allow the handshake via HDMI. I reset the AV selection to "Pure" and 1080p/24 was available for selection in the 3800's setup menu.

The increase in picture quality was substantial. Images were much more 3-dimensional and colors were more natural.

At this point, a VERY happy 3800 owner.

Thanks to others for suggesting that there must be some setup goof that didn't allow me to access the 1080p/24.

More reports to follow.

Lee

B&W 801D (Left,Right), B&W HTM1D (center), B&W CWM8180 x 3 (6.1 surround), JL Audio F113 x 2 (subwoofers), Krell Foundation pre-pro, Krell EV403 (front 3 channels), Krell S1500/3 (rear 3 channels), OPPO 105D (Blu-ray, SACD, DVD-A), Calyx Audio DAC24/192, MacMini w/ 2TB drive (server), Purist Audio interconnects & speaker cables, Pioneer PRO-HD1540 plasma 60"
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post #54 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 10:50 AM
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Joe .... You da man!

There are more than a handful of [op amps] that sound so good that most designers want to be using them as opposed to discreet transistors. Dave Reich, Theta 2009
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post #55 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 10:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thebland View Post

FWIW RE: Lumagen Video Processor and forced 24P:

I couldn't get my Sony BD player to output 24P to my Radiance processor even though 'forced to do so' in the Sony set up menu. However, when I turned off ALL other input resolutions in the Lumagen EXCEPT 24P it worked out fine..

Jeff, what Sony player do you have?

I have the Pioneer Elite BDP-HD1 (same as the Sony S1?) and a Lumagen Vision Pro HDP, and am able to send 1080p24 to the Lumagen.

Thanks.

Mark
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post #56 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 10:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RBFC View Post

I went completely through the setup menus of my Pioneer plasma and was able to activate the 1080p/24 output of the Denon 3800!!

I DID have the plasma set to "Pure Cinema Advanced" mode, but someone had changed the "AV selection" to "Standard", which didn't allow the handshake via HDMI. I reset the AV selection to "Pure" and 1080p/24 was available for selection in the 3800's setup menu.

The increase in picture quality was substantial. Images were much more 3-dimensional and colors were more natural.

At this point, a VERY happy 3800 owner.

Thanks to others for suggesting that there must be some setup goof that didn't allow me to access the 1080p/24.

More reports to follow.

Lee

Lee, would you please edit your original post to reflect this, so we don't get repeat queries?

Thanks.

Mark
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post #57 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 11:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RBFC View Post

I went completely through the setup menus of my Pioneer plasma and was able to activate the 1080p/24 output of the Denon 3800!!

I DID have the plasma set to "Pure Cinema Advanced" mode, but someone had changed the "AV selection" to "Standard", which didn't allow the handshake via HDMI. I reset the AV selection to "Pure" and 1080p/24 was available for selection in the 3800's setup menu.

The increase in picture quality was substantial. Images were much more 3-dimensional and colors were more natural.

At this point, a VERY happy 3800 owner.

Thanks to others for suggesting that there must be some setup goof that didn't allow me to access the 1080p/24.

More reports to follow.

Lee

Lee, could you please shut the Bland up and just plug a regular cable into another TV to see if it works????









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post #58 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 11:12 AM
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I edited post number four to incorporate a summary:

Let me know if you think this is accurate. I am trying to keep the thread short and eliminate the potential for repeat questions.

Here is a brief summary of key things potential owner would like to know:

Forced 1080p/24 output: Confirmed by RBFC
Forced YCbCr output: To be confirmed

DTS-HD Master Audio decoding: Confirmed by RBFC via the MCA interconnects
DTS-HD High Resolution Audio decoding: To be confirmed

Dolby True HD decoding: Confirmed by RBFC via the MCA interconnects
Doby Digital Plus decoding: To be confirmed
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post #59 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 11:18 AM
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Quote:
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Forced 1080p/24 output: Confirmed by RBFC

Technically we dont know if it was forced or not.
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post #60 of 6654 Old 03-06-2008, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
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Technically we dont know if it was forced or not.

That's right. Lee's plasma was advertised to support 1080p/24 whereas mine is not. Anyone want to chip in for a 3800 so I can "test" on my 6th gen Pioneer?

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