Official Pioneer Elite BDP-05FD & BDP-51FD Owners Thread / Vs 1.32 DTS-HD MA - Page 10 - AVS Forum
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post #271 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 06:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Pres2play View Post

Ok, but do I have to replace my 5080 now for a 1080p model? Is Dot by Dot that much better?

Oh boy, everyone was saying buy the 768p, you won't notice a difference between 768p and 1080p, expecially if you sit far enough away. Now I don't know if I'm happy with 768p.

set the player to auto or 1080i and be happy
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post #272 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 06:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by voltes View Post

I really wanted to know the xover for large speaker settings. I'm currently using that for my setup. Anybody know where I can get this info?

I would think "large" would not have a crossover, it would feed the full frequency range to the channel. "Small" on the other hand apparently is 100hz.

Vote with your wallet. Don't buy Cinavia-infected Blu-ray Discs! Why pay a premium for pseudo-lossless audio damaged by an intrusive watermark in the audible spectrum?
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post #273 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 06:40 AM
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Originally Posted by soldonandy View Post

I just pulled the trigger for a 51 from Pioneer's website, it came down to when BB was going to have it and the potential 12% savings. I had to weigh the 12% vs. all this wasted time checking in to see if and when they are coming in, I figured I'd get the thing in two days from Pioneer and then whatever happens with BB getting these won't be a concern.

I had the exact same thought as you. Unfortunately, I ordered from the Pio website early friday morning with two-day shipping. It's Wednesday, and it still hasn't shipped, and nobody will respond to my emails that I've sent inquiring about the status.

They specifically state on their website that they only list for sale things that they have in stock. Apparently, that's not true.

Pioneer has a lot of work to do in regards to customer service, it seems. It's amazing how botched every aspect of this player release seems to have been. It's disheartening that such a well respected company operates this way.

I'm done ranting now. Here's hoping they send it out today, and I get it by the weekend. (or at least they respond to email for once)

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post #274 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 06:40 AM
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Watched Semi Pro last night. Worked awesome.

Love this player!!!!!! Best Blu-ray player ever!

Vote with your wallet. Don't buy Cinavia-infected Blu-ray Discs! Why pay a premium for pseudo-lossless audio damaged by an intrusive watermark in the audible spectrum?
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post #275 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 06:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soldonandy View Post

I wonder..... this is something I read:

"D/A converters are frankly inexpensive and relatively easy to make extremely well, but MHz and bit resolution are the wrong specs to look at, dynamic linearity, missing codes, glitch energy/clock leakage are probably responsible for more of the visual quality differences, and they aren't listed on the DVD player specs."

I am not convinced that one player is capable of a discernable pq difference over the other, I think you are paying for the aesthetics and perhaps the longer warranty, both good reasons to want the 05 but at a cost.

I agree, which is why I ended up with the 51fd.

Also, I can see other pioneer elite owners who would want to make sure everything matches in their setup. Cost is just a small price to pay to make sure everything looks and blends perfectly
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post #276 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 06:55 AM
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This may be a stupid question, but I wonder why they don't make this a true universal player by making it compatible with DVD-A and SACD discs? As I understand it, the 51/05's have superior CD playback, would it really be that big of a jump for it to add that DVD-A/SACD functionality?

I guess for now I'll keep my HK DVD47 in my setup just for DVD-A and SACDs since it does at least have Wolfson DAC's, but it'd be nice to have an all in one player.

~kyle
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post #277 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 06:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thebland View Post

768P60 is difficult ot scale to compared to the easy, higher resolution 1080P24.

I have a 58" 768P plaasma and 720P looks as good as 1080P24 input (my plasma will not accept 1080P24 BUT my Lumagen Radiance does a masterful job of scaling 1080P24 to 720P (or even 768P).

That said, 720P straight from the player is equal to 1080P24 input. Perhaps better as 720P is an easier multiple of 1080P24 compared to the plasma morphing 1080P24 into 768P.

Bottom line, the best picture is with a 1080P plasma with 1080P24 input. Other than that, my experience is that 720P from a good player (being closest to 768P) is best.

Jeff,

When are you getting the 51fd? We will really appreciate your insights.. In particular, if you can compare it with the Denon 3800..

Cheers,

Christian

My DVD and Blu Ray collection

JVC RS65, ST 130, B&W 803 Diamonds mains, B&W HTM2 Diamond center channel,B&W 805 Diamond surrounds, B&W DB1 subwoofer, Anthem D2v, Parasound Halo A51+A21,Oppo BDP 103,PS Audio Power Plant Premier,Darbee Darblet
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post #278 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 06:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adrian ballard View Post

set the player to auto or 1080i and be happy


Shouldn't it be set to source direct and let the Kuro do the scaling? Otherwise the signal would be processed twice, wouldn't it?

~kyle
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post #279 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 07:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kemitchell View Post

This may be a stupid question, but I wonder why they don't make this a true universal player by making it compatible with DVD-A and SACD discs? As I understand it, the 51/05's have superior CD playback, would it really be that big of a jump for it to add that DVD-A/SACD functionality?

I guess for now I'll keep my HK DVD47 in my setup just for DVD-A and SACDs since it does at least have Wolfson DAC's, but it'd be nice to have an all in one player.

This is likely because that will be left to the 09, which, according to a Canadian reseller, will be available in October for roughly 2 grand. According to said reseller, the 09 will be a higher-end 05 with bd-live, better SD upscaling, and SACD/DVD-A playback.
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post #280 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 07:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kemitchell View Post

Shouldn't it be set to source direct and let the Kuro do the scaling? Otherwise the signal would be processed twice, wouldn't it?

Yes, source direct would be the best choice and provide the cleanest path. The 5080 has to process everything to get to its 768p resolution. Luckily, it kicks ass at it.
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post #281 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 07:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kemitchell View Post

Shouldn't it be set to source direct and let the Kuro do the scaling? Otherwise the signal would be processed twice, wouldn't it?

Yes if your display will accept a 1080p24 signal. I've got an old 1110 and it won't. In such a case you'll have to use 1080i or auto mode. Again for any display that will accept 1080p24 - use source direct.
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post #282 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 07:30 AM
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i love Dot-By-Dot, even though it 'off-centers' the picture. in the dark you can't tell anyway. and you can see where the overscan would start - i love having 100% of the picture.

anyone in Chicago pick this up in the city yet? North Ave, Clark St., or Roosevelt Best Buys?

also, is there a reason no one has run a quick ISO rip on the firmware disc and posted it? seems like that'd be the quickest way to get it to the masses. can someone? you can zip it up and put it up on sendspace.com or something.
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post #283 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 07:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skywlkrsnd View Post

Yes, source direct would be the best choice and provide the cleanest path. The 5080 has to process everything to get to its 768p resolution. Luckily, it kicks ass at it.

Yes it does!!!! I too debated the 768p vs. 1080p thing and when I realized we'd be 9+ feet away I went with the 5080 and have not looked back since.

Cannot wait to get FM 1.0 disc this week.

Loving Source Direct mode. Have not tried any SD Discs yet with my 51FD but my plan is to use Source Direct sending 480i to my 5080 and let it work it's magic.
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post #284 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 07:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benjs View Post

This is likely because that will be left to the 09, which, according to a Canadian reseller, will be available in October for roughly 2 grand. According to said reseller, the 09 will be a higher-end 05 with bd-live, better SD upscaling, and SACD/DVD-A playback.

Ah...I see. That's good to know. I think I'll just have to keep my HK, since I doubt I'll be able to afford the 09 (or be patient enough).

~kyle
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post #285 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 07:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skywlkrsnd View Post

Yes, source direct would be the best choice and provide the cleanest path. The 5080 has to process everything to get to its 768p resolution. Luckily, it kicks ass at it.


Thanks!

~kyle
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post #286 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 07:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Ruined View Post

That's not weak audio. The reason why the optical is 10db louder is because with optical you are getting only DVD quality sound (Dolby Digital) which has less dynamic range (less distance between lowest and highest decibal sounds) and hence is recorded louder. With HDMI you are getting the full lossless Blu-ray tracks which are generally recorded at a lower volume to give you a larger dynamic range.

In other words, though the new codecs have to be cranked louder, by being recorded at a lower volume it actually provides more dynamic range as a result and because of this added dynamic range nextgen codecs sound better. Your setup is thus likely working fine and you should leave it as-is. Just get used to a different master volume level and dont be afraid to go into +1/+2/+3db etc if necessary...

Ruined, I tried it last night and couln't get the Integra 9.8 to identify the 51FD. I kept getting DVD "No Signal " with HDMI, then I was getting the component cable hookup through the HDMI. I'm going to take the Integra 9.8 back to the dealer, something's hosed with HDMI, everything else seems to work correctly.
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post #287 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 07:46 AM
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How does SD dvd- source direct from the 51 to the plasma (5080)
compare to using a Toshiba HD XA2?
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post #288 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 07:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benjs View Post

This is likely because that will be left to the 09, which, according to a Canadian reseller, will be available in October for roughly 2 grand. According to said reseller, the 09 will be a higher-end 05 with bd-live, better SD upscaling, and SACD/DVD-A playback.

I believe the SACD/DVD-A playback was dispelled a while ago, unless of course you have new information.
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post #289 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 07:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chip913 View Post

Ruined, I tried it last night and couln't get the Integra 9.8 to identify the 51FD. I kept getting DVD "No Signal " with HDMI, then I was getting the component cable hookup through the HDMI. I'm going to take the Integra 9.8 back to the dealer, something's hosed with HDMI, everything else seems to work correctly.

Take the Integra out of the loop for an initial sync with your display. After you've established a signal, then place the Intregra back into the loop and see if that helps.

I picked up a pioneer sunday. The first go through, I wasn't able to get a signal with the Intergra in the loop...did as I described above and was able to establish a connection between the units. My set up has the HDM source components running through the Integra (passthrough mode) then to my Lumagen Radiance scaler to the BenQ 5000.

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post #290 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 08:05 AM
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Please note this quote from Wikipedia.

"Most movies on Blu-ray discs have preserved the original non interlaced 24fps motion film rate and allow output in this non interlaced format directly to HDTV's. No conversions are necessary".

So why load interlaced and then have your equipment deinterlace when it is already done?

Can someone shed some light on this.
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post #291 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 08:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony Costanza View Post

Please note this quote from Wikipedia.

"Most movies on Blu-ray discs have preserved the original non interlaced 24fps motion film rate and allow output in this non interlaced format directly to HDTV's. No conversions are necessary".

So why load interlaced and then have your equipment deinterlace when it is already done?

Can someone shed some light on this.

i think they're talking about DVD's, not Blu-ray. DVD's are interlaced by nature, so 480i is the pure signal.
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post #292 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 08:17 AM
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Originally Posted by briansemerick View Post

i think they're talking about DVD's, not Blu-ray. DVD's are interlaced by nature, so 480i is the pure signal.

Aha, I thought they were talking about both.
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post #293 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 08:20 AM
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The 5080 does not disappoint, and we all know that it outperformed several 1080p sets in a flat panel shootout earlier this year, in one popular mag.

However, Blu-ray is 1080p and a display that can match that without any scaling makes sense, also. So a 1080p Kuro might make a better choice.

Hasn't Pioneer discontinued 768p models?

Sorry. Let's get back to pioneer 51.
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post #294 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 08:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chip913 View Post

Ruined, I tried it last night and couln't get the Integra 9.8 to identify the 51FD. I kept getting DVD "No Signal " with HDMI, then I was getting the component cable hookup through the HDMI. I'm going to take the Integra 9.8 back to the dealer, something's hosed with HDMI, everything else seems to work correctly.


As the owner of an Onkyo 875, I'm not surprised. Actually, my 51 doesn't have much of an issue with making the handshake to the AVR, it is on the opposite end with the AVR connecting to the 5010 Kuro. I consistently have to cycle the power on the receiver 3 times before the splash screen shows.
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post #295 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 08:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chip913 View Post

Ruined, I tried it last night and couln't get the Integra 9.8 to identify the 51FD. I kept getting DVD "No Signal " with HDMI, then I was getting the component cable hookup through the HDMI. I'm going to take the Integra 9.8 back to the dealer, something's hosed with HDMI, everything else seems to work correctly.

Sounds like something may be broken with your 9.8, it has worked flawlessly w/ BDP51FD v1.0 with me using HDMI video/audio for Blu-ray and DVD using Source Direct. I'd try a replacement. Also make sure you have MAIN firmware 1.07 or later installed on the 9.8.

Vote with your wallet. Don't buy Cinavia-infected Blu-ray Discs! Why pay a premium for pseudo-lossless audio damaged by an intrusive watermark in the audible spectrum?
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post #296 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 08:33 AM
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Source direct question, are you guys using source direct from the 51 to your displays or source direct to your avr than to your set?
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post #297 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 08:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mongoose View Post

I've been puzzling over the B&K manual and it seems that the receiver will convert the 5.1 DVD Audio analog signal back into the digital domain. I understand that there must be some inherent loss in this additional A to D step. My first question is will the AVR 317 automatically compensate for the reduced signal level of the LFE track? My second question is does anyone know if this connection scenario would tend to offer better or worse sound that just listening to the Dolby Digital track from a Blu-Ray disc through a single digital or optical cable to my receiver?

If you're connected via the analog outs, the BD player, not the AVR, should be dictating the LFE. If the BD player doesn't have the LFE bug (and the 51FD appears to NOT have it), then you're fine.

I don't know whether the 317 redigitizes or not. I've asked a similar question about the Ref50 and I'm getting conflicting information. By my "experiments", it does not. But that may or may not also be true for the 317.

Hard to say what will sound best with your setup. Best thing to do is just mess with the settings and see what works best. FWIW, I honestly don't know what would sound better...a properly bass managed DD core 5.1 or a 5.1 lossless with inadequate bass management.


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post #298 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 08:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony Costanza View Post

Aha, I thought they were talking about both.

although there are some interlaced blu-ray discs, some concerts are shot in 60fps i think.
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post #299 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 08:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jake Ironshirt View Post

Source direct question, are you guys using source direct from the 51 to your displays or source direct to your avr than to your set?

AVR's will passthrough HDMI untouched, so you do Source Direct from the 51 and it's the same thing as straight to your panel.
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post #300 of 30744 Old 08-13-2008, 08:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by briansemerick View Post

although there are some interlaced blu-ray discs, some concerts are shot in 60fps i think.

In terms of 1920x1080 (1080i/p) presentations you have only two options to be in compliance with current Blu-ray specifications:

1. 1080p24 - 24fps/film
2. 1080i60 - 24fps/film or 30fps/HD video

Most concerts are 30fps/HD video and are hence encoded 1080i60 (60 fields per second, 30 frames per second)

Vote with your wallet. Don't buy Cinavia-infected Blu-ray Discs! Why pay a premium for pseudo-lossless audio damaged by an intrusive watermark in the audible spectrum?
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