Official Pioneer Elite BDP-05FD & BDP-51FD Owners Thread / Vs 1.32 DTS-HD MA - Page 16 - AVS Forum
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post #451 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by mrjktcvs View Post

High speed is turned on with a 6' Monoprice cable. Never gave me a problem until last night.

I think I'll do the factory reset (hold down the stop button while hitting power) when I get home tonight

Power cycle the TV as well -- you may need to unplug it to do this fully. The HDMI circuits are little computers in their own right, and some HDMI handshake failures can leave the TV's HDMI circuit in a wedged state where it can't respond properly to new attempts to connect. This is not normal of course, but it does happen.

And double check that the HDMI plug is fully inserted straight into the socket at each end. HDMI is only a friction fit, and even just the weight of the cable can be enough to shift the plug the little bit that will make the connection fail. Try the "wiggle test" where you grab the HDMI about 1 inch from the socket, press it gently straight into the socket, and wiggle it slightly. Do this at both ends.
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post #452 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 09:08 AM
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FYI for my setup I'm using monoprice garden-hose cables (their thickest gauge) that are HDMI 1.3a certified. 3' to dtc-9.8 and 9' to kds-60a3000. They are probably a bit rough on the HDMI ports but i'm hoping the gear is made well enough to hold them

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post #453 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 09:14 AM
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Thanks Bob. I will unplug the TV first before trying anything else, then reconnect the HDMI cables.
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post #454 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 09:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Ruined View Post

FYI for my setup I'm using monoprice garden-hose cables (their thickest gauge) that are HDMI 1.3a certified. 3' to dtc-9.8 and 9' to kds-60a3000. They are probably a bit rough on the HDMI ports but i'm hoping the gear is made well enough to hold them

If you are using massive HDMI cables like that, you really should invest in some short HDMI dongle cables -- port savers -- check Monoprice. You plug the short dongle into the HDMI socket and attach the garden hose cable to the other end of that.

HDMI sockets are way too easy to damage, and the stress put on the plug by a heavy cable can cause just such damage.
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post #455 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 09:26 AM
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Looking at getting the 05 in a few days as a belated birthday gift from my wife. (i told her I was holding out for this thing) Anyway, I have a Samsung series 7 52 inch which is an AWESOME LCD. i do not have a modern HD receiver that does video and advanced codecs, it is an old trusty Denon 3300 (I will use the analogue out from the PIO to hold me over until I upgrade my receiver. That being said- for picture quality- I will be using HDMI to the TV (and analogue to the receiver). Should I be using source direct to the TV and have the TV do everything? Or is there a prefered setting when not using a stand alone processor or receiver to process video signals?

Thanks
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post #456 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 09:37 AM
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Originally Posted by audiolover718 View Post

Looking at getting the 05 in a few days as a belated birthday gift from my wife. (i told her I was holding out for this thing) Anyway, I have a Samsung series 7 52 inch which is an AWESOME LCD. i do not have a modern HD receiver that does video and advanced codecs, it is an old trusty Denon 3300 (I will use the analogue out from the PIO to hold me over until I upgrade my receiver. That being said- for picture quality- I will be using HDMI to the TV (and analogue to the receiver). Should I be using source direct to the TV and have the TV do everything? Or is there a prefered setting when not using a stand alone processor or receiver to process video signals?

Thanks

Man, I wish could give my wife an 05 as a birthday gift (belated or otherwise) and not get smacked in the face!

You might want to save some money and get a 51, though, since it is unclear that there will be any improved bass management with the 05. the upgraded component video dac's aren't going to be doing you any good if you are running an hdmi cable for video directly to your lcd. the only added benefit you might be paying an extra $200 for is capitance (versus mechanical?) buttons and an aluminum (versus plastic?) face -- you will probably get different color led's, too, which doesn't seem much of a differentiator, either.
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post #457 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 09:43 AM
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ha- actually- it is a gift for ME FROM my wife. She was researching them WITH me! Yes I am a lucky man. She accepts my expensive hobby. She thinks the PIO is a very nice machine to look at even when its off. would it be worth it to use the Componet over the HDMI if I get the 05? Why would anyone use the the component over the HDMI in the first place though? People who are getting this player 99% have a tv with dvi/hdmi, so the video DAC would more than likely have to be a pretty significant reason to use the component connection over the HDMI connection me thinks.
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post #458 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiolover718 View Post

Looking at getting the 05 in a few days as a belated birthday gift from my wife. (i told her I was holding out for this thing) Anyway, I have a Samsung series 7 52 inch which is an AWESOME LCD. i do not have a modern HD receiver that does video and advanced codecs, it is an old trusty Denon 3300 (I will use the analogue out from the PIO to hold me over until I upgrade my receiver. That being said- for picture quality- I will be using HDMI to the TV (and analogue to the receiver). Should I be using source direct to the TV and have the TV do everything? Or is there a prefered setting when not using a stand alone processor or receiver to process video signals?

Thanks

After a few weeks, I'm still very happy with multi-channel analog. Excellent birthday present!
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post #459 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 10:15 AM
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my BDP-05 will be here tomorrow, can't wait.

I have simple needs, just looking for direct source -> Mitsubishi HC5500 projector with the Reon HQV processor. I want to breathe some new life in this DVD library sitting here.
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post #460 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 10:19 AM
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my BD is coming up too , and i think this will be a gift to myself
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post #461 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

The initial report above says the "PDP" preset adds "red push" which is never a good sign. That alone would make the "Pioneer PDP" preset look better. This still needs to be confirmed by other testers.

Bob, how did you come to the conclusion that Aetherole's initial report indicated the player had a tendency toward red push with the PDP preset? It seems to me without seeing his set prior to the input device, we really have no definitive idea what the color balance of his plasma was prior to the player. Having two Kuros, each preset on the display itself has a color push of some type (blue, very blue, red, very red). Of course using Pure mode and a calibrated gray scale, will render the Kuro neutral. At that point the determination can be made as to what, if any 'push' is being applied.

I'm not sure if the player, while using the 'mating' option, can be used with a setting of your own choice that's been ISF'd or at least calibrated beyond the presets of the display. But if the display started off neutral & calibrated, and the player added red push, that would not make the picture look better.
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post #462 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

my BDP-05 will be here tomorrow, can't wait.

I have simple needs, just looking for direct source -> Mitsubishi HC5500 projector with the Reon HQV processor. I want to breathe some new life in this DVD library sitting here.

Well, if it truly does come in tomorrow, would you mind checking whether there are any BM settings, and whether it has dts-HD MA decoding? Thanks in advance!
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post #463 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 10:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Ruined View Post

By default I'm pretty sure HDMI output is disabled on 51FD, so perhaps it defaulted back to that. Even a composite cable would work. On the other hand, maybe your 51FD has a hardware issue. Strange nonetheless.

Since my display is only 1080i, I can use component cables for picture; any BR 1080P source will display as 1080i. By setting the 51FD as source direct, will this also bitstream the sound to the Integra 9.8, including the better codecs? I am just to the point where I am fed up with HDMI and am trying to go around it, and still have the Integra 9.8 do the decoding for picture and sound.
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post #464 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 10:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

If you are using massive HDMI cables like that, you really should invest in some short HDMI dongle cables -- port savers -- check Monoprice. You plug the short dongle into the HDMI socket and attach the garden hose cable to the other end of that.

HDMI sockets are way too easy to damage, and the stress put on the plug by a heavy cable can cause just such damage.
--Bob

Thanks for the heads-up on this, Bob. My Monoprice HDMI cable running from the receiver to the TV is huge - and I'd hate to damage that jack.

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post #465 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 10:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

If you are using massive HDMI cables like that, you really should invest in some short HDMI dongle cables -- port savers -- check Monoprice. You plug the short dongle into the HDMI socket and attach the garden hose cable to the other end of that.

HDMI sockets are way too easy to damage, and the stress put on the plug by a heavy cable can cause just such damage.
--Bob

Yeah, I actually did get some of those. but I figure they will put just as much stress on the port unless I start velcroing the cables to the stand or something. I'm not sure all of that is really necessary. While I'm sure HDMI ports can get bent, to be bent to the point of no longer making contact probably takes a lot of effort assuming that the port is attached to the board securely. I guess it is taking a risk, but I expect with the amount this gear costs that the port should be able to hold the weight of the cable. Worse comes to worse I'd have to get it repaired I guess.

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post #466 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 11:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Bob, how did you come to the conclusion that Aetherole's initial report indicated the player had a tendency toward red push with the PDP preset? It seems to me without seeing his set prior to the input device, we really have no definitive idea what the color balance of his plasma was prior to the player. Having two Kuros, each preset on the display itself has a color push of some type (blue, very blue, red, very red). Of course using Pure mode and a calibrated gray scale, will render the Kuro neutral. At that point the determination can be made as to what, if any 'push' is being applied.

I'm not sure if the player, while using the 'mating' option, can be used with a setting of your own choice that's been ISF'd or at least calibrated beyond the presets of the display. But if the display started off neutral & calibrated, and the player added red push, that would not make the picture look better.

It wasn't Aetherole's report. It was an earlier report some posts further up -- I forget the poster -- that stated the "PDP" preset in the player exhibited red push where the "Pioneer PDP" preset did not. This was also the post talking about gray scale clipping exhibited by some of the presets. The poster was apparently using a calibration DVD to detect this.
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post #467 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Ruined View Post

Yeah, I actually did get some of those. but I figure they will put just as much stress on the port unless I start velcroing the cables to the stand or something. I'm not sure all of that is really necessary. While I'm sure HDMI ports can get bent, to be bent to the point of no longer making contact probably takes a lot of effort assuming that the port is attached to the board securely. I guess it is taking a risk, but I expect with the amount this gear costs that the port should be able to hold the weight of the cable. Worse comes to worse I'd have to get it repaired I guess.

The HDMI sockets are typically soldered directly to a PC board. If they are put under too much stress those solder points can break. The pins in the connection itself can also get bent to the point that they don't make proper electrical contact any more.
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post #468 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

The HDMI sockets are typically soldered directly to a PC board. If they are put under too much stress those solder points can break. The pins in the connection itself can also get bent to the point that they don't make proper electrical contact any more.
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I know, all I'm saying is if the joint is soldered well it should be very, very difficult to accomplish what you are describing.

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post #469 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 11:13 AM
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i can't for the life of me figure out why they couldn't have added some sort of locking mechanism to the HDMI port spec. why make cabling that slips out so easily? space saving is one thing, but they could've built in clips or something with a push release.
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post #470 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 11:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Ruined View Post

Yeah, I actually did get some of those. but I figure they will put just as much stress on the port unless I start velcroing the cables to the stand or something. I'm not sure all of that is really necessary. While I'm sure HDMI ports can get bent, to be bent to the point of no longer making contact probably takes a lot of effort assuming that the port is attached to the board securely. I guess it is taking a risk, but I expect with the amount this gear costs that the port should be able to hold the weight of the cable. Worse comes to worse I'd have to get it repaired I guess.

Some people have solved HDMI problems by replacing their big fat cables with skinny cheap ones.

You don't need to bend or break the connection. I had one cable setup where each time I touched anything on the back of my receiver, the HDMI connection would stop working.
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post #471 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 11:15 AM
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Originally Posted by briansemerick View Post

i can't for the life of me figure out why they couldn't have added some sort of locking mechanism to the HDMI port spec. why make cabling that slips out so easily? space saving is one thing, but they could've built in clips or something with a push release.

Yeah. You'd think they would have learned something from the "S-video" fiasco. The worst case seems to be displays that have their HDMI sockets mounted vertically.
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post #472 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by briansemerick View Post

i can't for the life of me figure out why they couldn't have added some sort of locking mechanism to the HDMI port spec. why make cabling that slips out so easily? space saving is one thing, but they could've built in clips or something with a push release.

True.

DVI, coming from the computer world, has positive locks.
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post #473 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 11:27 AM
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Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

Some people have solved HDMI problems by replacing their big fat cables with skinny cheap ones.

You don't need to bend or break the connection. I had one cable setup where each time I touched anything on the back of my receiver, the HDMI connection would stop working.

In my case though my HDMI cables have worked great. Yes they are heavy and probably bending the ports, but on the other hand I haven't run into any major HDMI issues. Also we've seen from recent tests on HDMI cables that larger gauge cables actually do have an impact on runs longer than 3'; while some of the smaller gauge cables do transmit a signal over longer distances, that signal is not always accurate and often fails the benchmark test. Its not just "works or doesn't work" as some people assume. I'm not talking about cables that just have larger jackets, I'm talking about cables that actually have more wire inside; I would venture that longer runs benefit from thicker gauge and better shielding.

I agree that "port savers" are a good idea, I'm just trying to figure out how I'd install them properly and not put the same amount of stress on the port. If I just install them as-is, the whole assembly will hang down and stress the port just as much. So I'd need to start velcroing or taping the cables to my stand in some creative fashion, and I'm just wondering if its worth the time and effort to do that (plus possible signal loss the insertion of port savers could incur) when the port should be soldered well enough to hold the cable in the first place!

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post #474 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 11:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Pres2play View Post

After a few weeks, I'm still very happy with multi-channel analog. Excellent birthday present!

So I can imagine the dacs and output circuitry are top notch and will send a very clean signal for HD format to my old but trusty receiver. I also use a tube pre before my outboard amps
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post #475 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Ruined View Post

In my case though my HDMI cables have worked great. Yes they are heavy and probably bending the ports, but on the other hand I haven't run into any major HDMI issues. Also we've seen from recent tests on HDMI cables that larger gauge cables actually do have an impact on runs longer than 3'; while some of the smaller gauge cables do transmit a signal over longer distances, that signal is not always accurate and often fails the benchmark test. Its not just "works or doesn't work" as some people assume. I'm not talking about cables that just have larger jackets, I'm talking about cables that actually have more wire inside; I would venture that longer runs benefit from thicker gauge and better shielding.

I agree that "port savers" are a good idea, I'm just trying to figure out how I'd install them properly and not put the same amount of stress on the port. If I just install them as-is, the whole assembly will hang down and stress the port just as much. So I'd need to start velcroing or taping the cables to my stand in some creative fashion, and I'm just wondering if its worth the time and effort to do that (plus possible signal loss the insertion of port savers could incur) when the port should be soldered well enough to hold the cable in the first place!

I agree. I see no advantage in the port savers that Bob mentioned. IMO I think they would only increase the amount of stress on the port. I believe the laws of physics come into play when you increase the length of a rigid assembly such as the connections that house the ports.

Here's an example of a currently available locking HDMI cable. Although it's a bit expensive it might solve the problem of the cable coming loose and loosing its connection. Granted, it won't do anything to eliminate port stress. I believe another poster tried these but don't remember what the verdict was on their performance.

I think a few of us have gotten off topic here so I will apologize for adding to the off topic comments.

So... anyone have any idea on a firm shipping date for the 51 from VE? I'm really getting a bit impatient.
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post #476 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 11:56 AM
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Originally Posted by D_B_0673 View Post

where are you going to do the bass management. The 05 reportedly won't do much either

I do it outboard. There is a bass management device inthe sub woofer path. There are of course analog equalizers in th eLCR as well to flatten out the room.

I don't want the player to do any "management" just decode the audio as is and sent it out.

Now I do have a potential problem. Delay. Currently I have an old broadcast AES delay unit that trims my 5.1 digital paths depending on the source selected. Going straight analog will not give me any delay compensation. My projector is a frame.

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post #477 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 11:57 AM
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So... anyone have any idea on a firm shipping date for the 51 from VE? I'm really getting a bit impatient.

For what it's worth - I called VE yesterday, and I was told "the end of the month."

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post #478 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 11:59 AM
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A properly designed portsaver would allow for rotation between the 2 sockets, saving the target's port from torque stress induced by those thick cables.
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post #479 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 12:02 PM
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The connection is something to deal with, but I hate the thought of adding more cables. I think plastic wire ties are ideal for this. Just loop the cable and suspend it from the wall mount or stand, or latch it to the back of the tv cabinet.
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post #480 of 30742 Old 08-14-2008, 12:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glimmie View Post

Look up Shawn Fog on SMR forums. I think he is mentioned in AVS forum as well. He makes a good quality kit that does this. I also think he will mod the unit for you as well if you want.

I am going to do my own mod as I have a service manual and full shop at home. His mod is just fine but takes away all the analog inputs as re-uses them for the 7.1 input. I still want the all standard analog inputs. I plan to install a DB25 connector and use a fanout cable. My DC1 is already heavily modified anyway. I installed a limited RS232 interface and a pre-volume control 7.1 out to drive metering and an old Lexicon CP1 to get a rear center channel.

Thanks. Don't know if I want to cannibalize the connections just yet.
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