Official Pioneer Elite BDP-05FD & BDP-51FD Owners Thread / Vs 1.32 DTS-HD MA - Page 99 - AVS Forum
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post #2941 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 05:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles R View Post

I don't think there is any more detail rather the player is altering contrast levels (on the fly). At least they clearly are with the Detail option and I'm guessing this option is enabled (to some extent) by default.

The other day I tested two images from the Blu-ray movie Crank. One scene had the hero out in the bright sunshine and as you increased the Detail setting (110 inch 1080p image) you could clearly see the existing edge enhancement (which is in the source) get stronger.

Not from the Detail option adding EE by changing the pixels displayed rather by simply lightening the light pixels and darkening the dark pixels. The higher the setting the greater the affect. By doing this the image appears sharper by making the existing details stand out more.

The other image didn't have any large changes in contrast and I was surprised to see no changes to the image as I changed the Detail option (or very little as I only watched it from viewing distance versus staring at each pixel ). It appeared the player was smart enough not to mess with the image or at least not to any degree.

So I believe its magic secret is the player "pumps" the contrast levels based on the logic many displays use for applying edge enhancement. In this case however the player doesn't change which pixels are displayed rather as you suggest their brightness level.

I was also looking at the behavior of the detail control and came to a similar conclusion that it was doing some sort of localized contrast enhancement. (The sharpness control on the Pioneer plasma appears to work in a similar manner) I am leaning to the opinion that there is some enhancement going on even with the default settings.
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post #2942 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 05:48 PM
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Originally Posted by sillysally View Post

D-Nice settings are "Reference Settings" and yes his settings are a very good starting point. And also understand that with any plasma TV just because one set of settings work for your display does not mean they will work, even through you have the same TV those settings will work for your TV.

sillysally:

I have a Pro 150 such as yourself with a Panny BD30 at the moment (soon to be a 51 or 05). I also have Cinemaquest backlighting as my only light source when watching movies or just satellite. What are you using to calibrate the RGB's Hi/Low etc, as I,m looking to wanting to do it myself just from an enthusiast point of view. Ive read up on Calman,etc. and they seem reasonably priced for not getting into it too seriously?

Thanks
Bob
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post #2943 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 06:26 PM
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Well no one replied to my first question so I"ll ask again. I was using component and switched to HDMI video.

PROBLEM: When I insert a DVD/BD and click PLAY, after it starts playing and I see the DO NOT COPY warning, a spinning disc icon shows up on the screen for 50-60 seconds before the movie actually starts.

#1 - Is this normal for this player on all discs? Is everyone else seeing this and just accepting it?

#2 - This is supposed to be a "fast" BD player. Is this actually faster then most of the other players out there?

Like I said in my first post, I'm new to BD having come from HDDVD land and I thought my HD-XA2 was slow but it's actually a lot faster to start a movie then this is. I just figured for $800, it would be "FAST" i.e. almost SD DVD player speeds. Thanks a lot guys.

Steve
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post #2944 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 06:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blacks4 View Post

Well no one replied to my first question so I"ll ask again. I was using component and switched to HDMI video.

PROBLEM: When I insert a DVD/BD and click PLAY, after it starts playing and I see the DO NOT COPY warning, a spinning disc icon shows up on the screen for 50-60 seconds before the movie actually starts.

#1 - Is this normal for this player on all discs? Is everyone else seeing this and just accepting it?

#2 - This is supposed to be a "fast" BD player. Is this actually faster then most of the other players out there?

Like I said in my first post, I'm new to BD having come from HDDVD land and I thought my HD-XA2 was slow but it's actually a lot faster to start a movie then this is. I just figured for $800, it would be "FAST" i.e. almost SD DVD player speeds. Thanks a lot guys.

Steve

Sounds like you are trying to play a Warner BD-J disc like Batman begins. Unfortunately BD-J is not as fast as HD DVD's HDi... Discs without BD-J will load faster. Hopefully there will be some optimizations for BD-J in future firmware updates, but for now you are experiencing normal behavior.

Also, note that though the discs take longer to load the 51FD is much quicker to boot up than the XA2.
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post #2945 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 06:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BLT View Post

sillysally:

I have a Pro 150 such as yourself with a Panny BD30 at the moment (soon to be a 51 or 05). I also have Cinemaquest backlighting as my only light source when watching movies or just satellite. What are you using to calibrate the RGB's Hi/Low etc, as I,m looking to wanting to do it myself just from an enthusiast point of view. Ive read up on Calman,etc. and they seem reasonably priced for not getting into it too seriously?

Thanks
Bob

Hi Bob,

I use Calman and I1pro. I think they have a deal for both $700. I am like you I do calibrating from a enthusiast point of view also. Also If you do get calman and I1pro bundled deal please feel free to PM me about how to use this. I also use DVE HD for my 11 point gray scale and for my colors I use AVCHD RC1. imo if you go this route you will never regret it. Plus the fact that your Kuro has all the user controls you will need to do a full NTSC. calibration.
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post #2946 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 06:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sillysally View Post

Hi Bob,

I use Calman and I1pro. I think they have a deal for both $700. I am like you I do calibrating from a enthusiast point of view also. Also If you do get calman and I1pro bundled deal please feel free to PM me about how to use this. I also use DVE HD for my 11 point gray scale and for my colors I use AVCHD RC1. imo if you go this route you will never regret it. Plus the fact that your Kuro has all the user controls you will need to do a full NTSC. calibration.

Thanks for the info. and if I get it and need any help I'll get in touch

Bob
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post #2947 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 07:03 PM
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I recently got the Pioneer 51 at bb & havent had time to play with,what is wrong with this player.Im sorry, too lazy to read 100 pages about this player. Mine has a June 08 built date.thanks
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post #2948 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 07:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajkjr View Post

Why would you find no LAN port appealing? From other posts it sounds like its no big deal as you can get updates via CD (from the web) I assume. Also, SC-07 has a LAN port. Does that help?

Thanks

Because it will never be hooked up to the internet...

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post #2949 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 07:10 PM
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Originally Posted by vader424242 View Post

because it will never be hooked up to the internet...

+1
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post #2950 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 07:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wsfanatic View Post

Does the 51 have any kind of zoom option? For instance, to minimize the black bars in a movie that is 2.35:1. I know that this would alter the original aspect ratio but for this instance it is not that important.

You know that zooming reduces the resolution (really not recommended).
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post #2951 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 07:24 PM
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for those with the 05 and the 92txh, is it better to send audio via HDMI LPCM or bitstream and let the receiver decode?
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post #2952 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 07:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruined View Post

Sounds like you are trying to play a Warner BD-J disc like Batman begins. Unfortunately BD-J is not as fast as HD DVD's HDi... Discs without BD-J will load faster. Hopefully there will be some optimizations for BD-J in future firmware updates, but for now you are experiencing normal behavior.

Also, note that though the discs take longer to load the 51FD is much quicker to boot up than the XA2.

LOL, thanks Ruined. Yep, Batman Begins! I'll get some non-Java BDs and try them. Should there be any speed difference between a 51 and an 05?
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post #2953 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 07:39 PM
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Originally Posted by blacks4 View Post

LOL, thanks Ruined. Yep, Batman Begins! I'll get some non-Java BDs and try them. Should there be any speed difference between a 51 and an 05?

The 51FD and 05FD are internally identical aside from the analog component video DAC, so the answer would be no.

The fastest players right now are the Samsungs & Panasonics, but IMO you will find the quality lacking in most other areas compared to the 51FD/05FD.
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post #2954 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 08:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyGood View Post

That was the first I heard of the "deal" and I wanted to let this go but my gosh Bill, I found a better deal locally from two vendors without even pushing the envelope. Believe me, you can PM me and I will let you know what I easily found because I think we are both from PA. I don't want to start any trouble and for sure, the deal you mentioned is certainly fair. I guess I just have to assume that it makes sense for some people depending on where you are in the country and what your local options are.

For many of us, it's not always about finding the best deal. This isn't fatwallet. It's about giving our business to forum sponsors. Giving our business to individuals that help out the community. Giving our business to individuals that have stood behind the products they sell. Giving our business to individuals that treat their customers fairly and offer a fair price.

Understand?

"The dream never dies, just the dreamer."

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post #2955 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by stew4msu View Post

for many of us, it's not always about finding the best deal. This isn't fatwallet. It's about giving our business to forum sponsors. Giving our business to individuals that help out the community. Giving our business to individuals that have stood behind the products they sell. Giving our business to individuals that treat their customers fairly and offer a fair price.

Understand?


+1

INSANITY: Doing the same thing again and
again and expecting different results each time. (AE)
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post #2956 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 08:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Stew4msu View Post

For many of us, it's not always about finding the best deal. This isn't fatwallet. It's about giving our business to forum sponsors. Giving our business to individuals that help out the community. Giving our business to individuals that have stood behind the products they sell. Giving our business to individuals that treat their customers fairly and offer a fair price.

Understand?

Actually, it is a little of both for me. I am buying a SC-07 and 05fd from Value Electronics and there is no way I could get the deal Robert is giving me from a local store. He even gave me a quote for a 60" 151fd Elite and it is way better than what I could get in a local store. I'm getting last years 150fd for near what he is selling the 151fd after the taxes I pay. Money aside, the first time I ever called him this past week, he talked to me for a half hour about what I was considering buying and was the nicest, least pushiest sales person I have dealt with over the last two months trying to decide what to buy. Unfortunately I already ordered my 150fd or else I would have bought all three pieces from him. He is a standup guy and although some of the dates promised had passed, it was mostly Pioneer's fault.
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post #2957 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 08:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruined View Post

The 51FD and 05FD are internally identical aside from the analog component video DAC, so the answer would be no.

The fastest players right now are the Samsungs & Panasonics, but IMO you will find the quality lacking in most other areas compared to the 51FD/05FD.

coming from a Samsung 1400 I can tell you that the 51 is MUCH faster.
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post #2958 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 08:43 PM
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Originally Posted by briansemerick View Post

coming from a Samsung 1400 I can tell you that the 51 is MUCH faster.

I was referring to the newer Samsung 1500/2550 which use the Broadcom BCM7440, totally different than the Samsung 1400.
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post #2959 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 08:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dholmes54 View Post

I recently got the Pioneer 51 at bb & havent had time to play with,what is wrong with this player.Im sorry, too lazy to read 100 pages about this player. Mine has a June 08 built date.thanks

Can you help us out a bit here to understand what you want to know? Such as it is your question seems to indicate that you've bought a player you haven't researched...haven't yet 'played with'...and apparently haven't even read the manual. And yet, without all that, you, for some reason, think there's something wrong with it?

I'm sure many of us would love to help, but we're lazy too...we don't want to retype all the great information that's there in those "100 pages" to address a wholly unspecific question. If you want to simply get a sense of what this player is about, it might be good to scan through the last 10 pages or so. If you have a specific question about any issues with the player, you might want to try the search engine or perhaps rephrase your question to be more specific.
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post #2960 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 09:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patgilm View Post

Actually, it is a little of both for me. I am buying a SC-07 and 05fd from Value Electronics and there is no way I could get the deal Robert is giving me from a local store. He even gave me a quote for a 60" 151fd Elite and it is way better than what I could get in a local store. I'm getting last years 150fd for near what he is selling the 151fd after the taxes I pay. Money aside, the first time I ever called him this past week, he talked to me for a half hour about what I was considering buying and was the nicest, least pushiest sales person I have dealt with over the last two months trying to decide what to buy. Unfortunately I already ordered my 150fd or else I would have bought all three pieces from him. He is a standup guy and although some of the dates promised had passed, it was mostly Pioneer's fault.

+1

Same story here. I ordered the 51 from VE, and this is the first time I've purchased from VE as well. Spoke with Robert several times. Best experience I've ever had with a purchase. I'll buy from them again.
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post #2961 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 09:41 PM
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Happy to report my upgrade to v1.02 (from v.08a) went without a hitch. Seemed to solve a lot of glitches---when I use the remote now, the player response is immediate, no more splash screen about a "Non-final" demo unit, and the hanging I reported on a few movies are gone.

Thanks Chris, and thanks Pioneer!
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post #2962 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 09:47 PM
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Has anyone tried Dragons Layer or Space Ace to see it they work now!!!

Dana
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post #2963 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 09:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dholmes54 View Post

I recently got the Pioneer 51 at bb & havent had time to play with,what is wrong with this player.Im sorry, too lazy to read 100 pages about this player. Mine has a June 08 built date.thanks

Check out Ruined's post on page one. He has done extensive testing on the 51 and has outlined issues he found with firmware version 1.00.

Keep in mind version 1.02 is available now and so far reports indicate the issues with 1.00 have been fixed.

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post #2964 of 30790 Old 08-29-2008, 11:28 PM
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Originally Posted by petmic10 View Post

Mine is an 8G non-elite Kuro. You should be able to get the same info.

Yep it works so will be able to check it f it is passing through Yamaha 1800 ok or not.

Thanks again.

Bryan
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post #2965 of 30790 Old 08-30-2008, 12:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruined View Post

The 51FD and 05FD are internally identical aside from the analog component video DAC, so the answer would be no.

The fastest players right now are the Samsungs & Panasonics, but IMO you will find the quality lacking in most other areas compared to the 51FD/05FD.

I look forward to purchasing the 51, as I have several Pio products, inc. a Kuro, and love them all. If you, Ken and others are impressed, I'm impressed. However, the recent BD50 is no slouch. Mine has performed flawlessly thus far and the DTS-HD MA decoding is appreciated by those of us with older receivers. The video quality on BRDs is quite good, per Kris:

(Home Theater Magazine (September 2008) )

The DMP-BD50 offers full 1080p/24 support with Blu-ray and upconverted DVD playback. The player uses Panasonic's proprietary video processing. I was surprised at how well this player performed during my video testing.

Blu-ray playback looked excellent and in line with the best players I've seen. The notable exception to this is the Denon DVD-3800BDCI, which looked a tad crisper than the Panasonic. However, the DMP-BD50 resolves 1080p content's full resolution with no obvious softening or chroma filtering. The DMP-BD50 wonderfully preserved fine object details. Thanks to the new chroma processing, color fidelity is noticeably better than Panasonic's first-generation player. Additionally, this is one of the only players that performs proper deinterlacing of 1080i signals with both 3:2 and 2:2 cadences. Even the higher-priced Denon and Pioneer Elite models can't make that claim. Regardless of what Blu-ray mate¬rial you play, you'll see excellent resolution.

[He goes on to describe the mediocre upscaling of SD-DVDs]

Nevertheless, the Panasonic DMP-BD50 is the strongest standalone player I've used to date. With full support for Blu-ray's advanced audio and interactivity, it's the current standalone to beat. Anyone shopping for a standalone Blu-ray player should put this one on their short list.


I have an XA2, so upscaling isn't really a priority. The 51/05 perhaps is the best performer out there but I wouldn't sell the 50 short, at least re BRDs.

Go Duke !
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post #2966 of 30790 Old 08-30-2008, 04:08 AM
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Well, no 05 for me this weekend. FedEx seems to be giving it the scenic tour and now predicts Wednesday delivery.

What does it say about me that I woke up from a bad dream this morning where a huge crate arrived from VE and I found, after undoing multiple levels of packaging, that it contained an ordinary CD player and a Maxell (?!) remote control?

Steve
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post #2967 of 30790 Old 08-30-2008, 04:35 AM
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Anyone using HDMI LPCM with the 51? Is there any LFE issues with that setup that we have seen with the analogs. Could someone please compare HDMI bitstream with HDMI LPCM

I don't have an HDMI prepro yet but do have the Radiance that currently will pass HDMI LPCM but not bitstream

Any Radiance owners with the 51 out there

Dan
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post #2968 of 30790 Old 08-30-2008, 05:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevel View Post

Well, no 05 for me this weekend. FedEx seems to be giving it the scenic tour and now predicts Wednesday delivery.

What does it say about me that I woke up from a bad dream this morning where a huge crate arrived from VE and I found, after undoing multiple levels of packaging, that it contained an ordinary CD player and a Maxell (?!) remote control?

Steve, I've had one hell of a time with FedEx lately. I had four items shipped, only to check tracking the day they ship or the day after they all said one delivery date, and then a couple of days later, show a delivery date two to three days later than the original posted delivery date. They use to do a good job, but lately UPS has bee kicking their ass. The USPS has been tearing all of them a new one. Man are they doing a good job lately.

Nothing's Perfect So Stop Expecting It ! Glenee

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post #2969 of 30790 Old 08-30-2008, 06:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stew4msu View Post

For many of us, it's not always about finding the best deal. This isn't fatwallet. It's about giving our business to forum sponsors. Giving our business to individuals that help out the community. Giving our business to individuals that have stood behind the products they sell. Giving our business to individuals that treat their customers fairly and offer a fair price.

Understand?

Come on guys, let's give Andy a break. If he found a better deal locally, all the power to him. I have bought many pieces of electronics locally, and many other pieces through dealers like VE (I have the 51 preordered with VE). Each purchase is an individual decision, and there is no right or wrong. Whatever works best for the buyer is best for him/her. As long as you have the facts (for example, yes, VE is an authorized Pioneer dealer), it's up to each person to decide for himself.
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post #2970 of 30790 Old 08-30-2008, 06:22 AM
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Just got back from a business trip only to find a brand new 05FD sitting in my office (I love my wife). She just picked it up from BB, paid $715.00 + tax.

Looks sooooooooo nice sitting on top of my 92 THX. The first thing I did was check the firmware which was at 1.00 so I install the update and popped in my first BD with much anticipation only to get the can't play disc message, I thought I was going to have a cow so I ejected the disc only to find my God daughters finger prints all over the back, cleaned the disc and it worked great!

We watched 3 movies last night with not one problem. I can honestly say with out making any changes in the settings the picture quality is better then my PS3. Seeing DTS-Master HD on my 92 display was pretty cool. So in short, thanks to Pioneer for the quick update and for making such a nice BLU-Ray player. Also thanks for those of you who helped my wife make her decision in my absence to buy the 05 only because of the Elite badge on the front, well worth the extra $200 if you ask me, and thanks in advance for the 05 settings which I'm sure somebody will post in the near future (hint).

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Excellent Pioneer Bdp 05fd Blu Ray Player , Pioneer Bdp 51fd Bonusview Blu Ray Player , Blu Ray Players

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