Official OPPO BDP-83 Owner's Thread [technical talk only] - Page 102 - AVS Forum
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post #3031 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by James W. Johnson View Post

I will mostly likely find out soon enough how the Oppo compares to my 51FD, heck its only $500 , the combined cost of the Oppo and 51fd is still far less than what a Pioneer 09FD can be had for. BTW I really want to see an 09FD in action too but there are no stores in my town who would have one.

Perhaps you'll get lucky and get selected for EAP 300 so you can actually compare the two and provide us with your opinion of the BDP-83 vs Pioneer 51FD.

Oppo Beta Group
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post #3032 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 11:37 AM
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Originally Posted by James W. Johnson View Post

While I do not totally agree with you I cannot disagree with you on the fact that the 51FD is buggy.
There is no question that I expect Pioneer to address some of these issues with the next firmware.
Its certainly not the worst player though, my BD30 had its share of bugs. However IMO the 51FD outperforms my old Panasonic BD30 for SD by a solid 300-400%.

I will mostly likely find out soon enough how the Oppo compares to my 51FD, heck its only $500 , the combined cost of the Oppo and 51fd is still far less than what a Pioneer 09FD can be had for. BTW I really want to see an 09FD in action too but there are no stores in my town who would have one.

At 1080p/24 on BD, the differences between the 51FD and BDP-83 should be very slight. However, I had one insider tell me that Pioneer is boosting certain levels just a bit - even in default mode - to give the appearance of more "pop." Purists may object to such. Now, I used to own the 51FD and did prefer its image slightly to the Panasonic BD30 and Sony S350 at the time (but certainly not 300-400% better...more like a few percent). However, the 51FD just had WAY too many issues and I returned it; it's unfortunate they are STILL having so many problems with it today. I currently own the BDP-83 and BD35. While I was never able to A/B compare the BDP-83 to the 51FD, I do prefer the Oppo all the way around - it's image looks as natural and authentic as anything I've seen - or even more so. It's by far the best standalone unit I've used in terms of speed, operation, etc.

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post #3033 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 11:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Bronco70 View Post

0.000546%. Quite a dramatic and seemingly definitive statement. Your source for that stat?

Based on the last estimate of US population and plugging in your % only 1670 might feel the need for this product, of the entire population.I will stop at this point.Joe

Please........

R

P.S. Would all members of this forum with a good sense of humor, please raise your hands.

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post #3034 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 11:48 AM
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Originally Posted by robertazimmerman View Post

Please........

R

P.S. Would all members of this forum with a good sense of humor, please raise your hands.


I guess you'll have to actually open the horses mouth and count the teeth before everyone acquires a sense of humor.

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post #3035 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by narkspud View Post

Not disagreeing with your recommendation at all, but is it really worth it to buy an -83 solely for audio?

At this price, probably yes. At $1,500+, probably not.

R
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post #3036 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 11:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by narkspud View Post

Not disagreeing with your recommendation at all, but is it really worth it to buy an -83 solely for audio?

It is to me. Because I am a "cheap" audiophile, I plan ahead. I also realize that neither SACD nor DVD-Audio are the future formats for MCH audio. Plans for this player include:

1) Have it modded to improve the audio (and video by default) performance. I did this to my Sony SACD player and it was the best money I've ever spent in terms of bang for buck audio improvement.

2) DVDs will start to disappear. I want a real universal player that will play everything 5+ years from now. This includes lossless BD audio formats. I know it won't play future standards like BR++ or HD-DVDv9, but I'm not an early adopter any more. Also possible everything I listen to/watch will be streamed by then anyway. That could make this my last disc player...

3) Buying a pre/pro. I'll eventually do it. I'm sure it will be a HDMI/analog combo unit so I can still leverage the RCA connections.

4) Move this unit to watch BlueRay on one of my TV systems. This will happen if I get a great deal on a true audiophile quality MCH SACD CDP. It could happen!

In the world of audiophiles, where people (OK morons) pay $1000+ per meter of cable, this players is a super screaming bargain! Just like my HD-970 was for DVD viewing and an audio transport. And I am buying one... once I can change SACD layers from the remote.

Unfortunately, it is a deal killer for me
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post #3037 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 11:56 AM
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Guys,

Having a problem. When I go from watching tv to watching a movie on the player I am having handshake problems.

Let me explain. TV, comcast box, and receiver is on. I turn off the comcast box and switch the receiver input to the oppo and then turn on the player. I don't get any picture.

I have to turn everything off and then turn the tv on first, the receiver next, and then the oppo. I then get the oppo screen.

So the problem is from watching tv to watching a movie.

Any suggestions?

thanks,
jimi
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post #3038 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 11:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Styln View Post

In the world of audiophiles, where people (OK morons) pay $1000+ per meter of cable.....(

If You can't hear it, don't knock it.

R
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post #3039 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 12:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimim View Post

Guys,

Having a problem. When I go from watching tv to watching a movie on the player I am having handshake problems.

Let me explain. TV, comcast box, and receiver is on. I turn off the comcast box and switch the receiver input to the oppo and then turn on the player. I don't get any picture.

I have to turn everything off and then turn the tv on first, the receiver next, and then the oppo. I then get the oppo screen.

So the problem is from watching tv to watching a movie.

Any suggestions?

thanks,
jimi

That sounds like typical HDMI misbehavior, although different combinations of gear may work better or worse.

You should write this up, including the model and firmware numbers and send it to OPPO.

-Bill


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post #3040 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 12:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Styln View Post

1) Have it modded to improve the audio (and video by default) performance. I did this to my Sony SACD player and it was the best money I've ever spent in terms of bang for buck audio improvement.

Who will be doing the mods?
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post #3041 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 12:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bakerwi View Post

I own both the BDP-83 and a Pioneer BDP-51FD and I'dhave to give the nod to the Oppo for SD-DVD playback and the 2 are close in blu-ray playback. If you need the additional features (MUCH faster load times, GREAT customer service, SACD and DVD-A (once implemented)) support just to name a few; then the Oppo is that much better. If your only criteria is PQ for SD-DVD and BD, then the Pioneers will serve this purpose and serve it well. Presently, I plan on keeping both machines.

Willie

Willie, I'm unsure how to read your evaluation comparison of the Oppo 83 vs the Pio 51FD. You gave the nod to the Oppo of PQ for sd-dvd yet you suggested if your need is sd-dvd and BD then you suggested the Pio would serve the need. Unsure which device you are recommending if PQ of SD-dvd and BD is the primary criteria for selecting a new combo disk player. Can you provide more insight into your thinking?

OPPO BDP-83 EAP (second group)
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post #3042 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 12:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Decoding of the lossless HD audio formats is an unusual case.

Blu-Ray (and HD DVD) were designed around the concept of in-player decoding. This meant studios could assume all players would implement in-player audio mixing of secondary audio.

In-receiver decoding happened largely because the implementation of DTS-HD MA decoders for players was late (and for that matter in-player audio mixing was late) and because companies making receivers wanted to get their hands on some of the cash early adopters were spending on Blu-Ray. I.e., buy our receiver because it decodes this stuff, despite the fact that decoding players will be here real soon now and thus you will be paying out twice for the same feature.

What makes in-player decoding work well today is that there is a way to get the results of the lossless decoder into the receiver without loss of quality -- digital HDMI LPCM audio. This didn't exist back when the SD-DVD feature set got nailed down. Back when SD-DVDs happened there was no way to get the full quality of decoded audio into the receiver. So the preferred approach was to send the bitstream to the receiver (via optical or coax digital audio) and let the receiver take it from there. And thus no audio mixing in SD-DVDs.

Fast forward to today and now we have two ways of handling this audio: In-player or in-receiver decoding. The results of the decoding are the same either way -- that's what it means when you say these formats are "lossless". The decoder produces identical LPCM to what went into the encoder in the studio -- bit for bit identical.

So we win in that we can do it either way, and the companies win in that they get our cash twice (player and receiver). Nevertheless, in-player decoding is still preferable because that's what's needed for proper in-player mixing of secondary audio.

NOTE: You can't do the audio mixing in the receiver because (1) mixing can't happen until the audio is decoded, and (2) there's no way to get the secondary audio track into the receiver.
--Bob

i dont want to start at debat.BUT
i got a audiolab 8000ap with a 8000x7.i take lpcm over hdmi,and my sony bdp 550 can decode the audio.
to month a go,there was a shoot out ,bitstream vs PCM.there were 10 person and 6 bd player and a denon reciever 3808 with internal decoding.when the player outputtet bitstream ,there was no difference in sound.but pcm there was what i will call a big difference from bad to very god
(panasonic bdp 50 bad .pioneer lx91 very god)the third was the reciever.
can that be becurse of bugs on some of the players?the denon bd 1800 sounded like there was dynamic compresion on.but tthere wasent
the sound difference was in detail and dynamic.(celine dion blu-ray)
no i got to replase my cheap sony whit the Oppo,but i hope it dosent have a bug in the decoding ,like some of the player wi used for the test.
the difference was not small

Peter
Denmark
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post #3043 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 12:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimim View Post

Guys,

Having a problem. When I go from watching tv to watching a movie on the player I am having handshake problems.

Let me explain. TV, comcast box, and receiver is on. I turn off the comcast box and switch the receiver input to the oppo and then turn on the player. I don't get any picture.

I have to turn everything off and then turn the tv on first, the receiver next, and then the oppo. I then get the oppo screen.

So the problem is from watching tv to watching a movie.

Any suggestions?

thanks,
jimi

I presume you have the Comcast, Oppo and receiver all connected via HDMI correct?

Leave the Oppo powered on and the Comcast powered off. Switch your receiver to the Comcast input and back to the Oppo. This forces a new HDMI handshake. Do you get a picture now from the Oppo?

If so then this is an HDMI handshake problem. Send the details to Oppo as suggested in the post above.

With the Oppo powered on are you seeing text or numbers in its Front Panel display? If not then you may have accidentally engaged "Pure Audio" mode which turns off the video output and the front panel. The Oppo remote has a "P" button on the upper left that toggles Pure mode.

Leave the receiver on the Oppo input. Power cycle the Oppo. Do you get a picture now? If not then check your HDMI cables (both ends) to make sure they haven't come loose in the socket perhaps due to the weight of the cable. It only takes a little shift to break the connection.
--Bob


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post #3044 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 12:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Styln View Post

It is to me. Because I am a "cheap" audiophile, I plan ahead. I also realize that neither SACD nor DVD-Audio are the future formats for MCH audio. Plans for this player include:

1) Have it modded to improve the audio (and video by default) performance. I did this to my Sony SACD player and it was the best money I've ever spent in terms of bang for buck audio improvement.

2) DVDs will start to disappear. I want a real universal player that will play everything 5+ years from now. This includes lossless BD audio formats. I know it won't play future standards like BR++ or HD-DVDv9, but I'm not an early adopter any more. Also possible everything I listen to/watch will be streamed by then anyway. That could make this my last disc player...

3) Buying to a pre/pro. I'll eventually do it. I'm sure it will be a HDMI/analog combo unit so I can still leverage the RCA connections.

4) Move this unit to watch BlueRay on one of my TV systems. This will happen if I get a great deal on a true audiophile quality MCH SACD CDP. It could happen!

In the world of audiophiles, where people (OK morons) pay $1000+ per meter of cable, this players is a super screaming bargain! Just like my HD-970 was for DVD viewing and an audio transport. And I am buying one... once I can change SACD layers from the remote.

Unfortunately, it is a deal killer for me

I never met an audiophile that thought they had all their bases covered and didn't end up with a pile of electronics passed down to their kids or their family members. Of course this does take time.

I am not a technically qualified person but I do have common sense and street smarts, and I do read reviews by the ones that know. That said I can almost guarantee you Oppo makes an excellent product for a very high price to quality ratio. I've owned the 983 for 11 months and not once has it malfunctioned.

I will definitely buy the new 83 and I have no doubts it will give me the same or even better satisfaction than the 983.

I've read this entire post and believe me except for the few people on this forum who REALLY know this business, everyone else will or should be satisfied by the oppo 83 especially with the equipment they use.

Of course we have to factor in human nature and this throws another wrench at the problem being Too many people don't really know what they want except for what Johnny next store has.

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post #3045 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 12:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p.las View Post

i dont want to start at debat.BUT
i got a audiolab 8000ap with a 8000x7.i take lpcm over hdmi,and my sony bdp 550 can decode the audio.
to month a go,there was a shoot out ,bitstream vs PCM.there were 10 person and 6 bd player and a denon reciever 3808 with internal decoding.when the player outputtet bitstream ,there was no difference in sound.but pcm there was what i will call a big difference from bad to very god
(panasonic bdp 50 bad .pioneer lx91 very god)the third was the reciever.
can that be becurse of bugs on some of the players?the denon bd 1800 sounded like there was dynamic compresion on.but tthere wasent
the sound difference was in detail and dynamic.(celine dion blu-ray)
no i got to replase my cheap sony whit the Oppo,but i hope it dosent have a bug in the decoding ,like some of the player wi used for the test.
the difference was not small

Yes it was most likely due to bugs.

The 10dB and 5dB low LFE bugs are rife for example and easily explain the report of poor dynamics.

This is not really the thread to go into such details, so I'll keep it simple.

If you are hearing a difference in audio quality between HDMI Bitstream and HDMI LPCM then the odds are very high you are either hearing:

1) The result of faulty setup by the user,

2) A bug in the player or the receiver (either in the decoding or in the proper handling of the resulting LPCM), AND/OR

3) Misleading results due to not properly matching the volume levels both ways.

Listener bias (i.e., hearing what you expect to hear) is another factor here, but the above are the big 3.
--Bob


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post #3046 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Understand that you can't get the full quality of the new, high def Blu-Ray audio formats on optical coax or digital audio connections. This is due to copy protection.

You will get the lossy "core" or "associated" compatibility DD or DTS track which is on Blu-Ray discs for just such compatibility purposes if you select bitstream output. You will get a 2 channel stereo down mix if you select LPCM output. See the audio signal reference chart in the player manual.
--Bob


I know. My point is legacy DD/DTS sounds better than lossless analog in my system.

I have the 983 and 55k. I'm thinking of combining the two with the 83. The analog output of the 83 looks right for my system. Crossover at 80 (why nobody else does this is beyond my understanding) and setup look right. The only question is the quality of the analog output stage. Is lossless via analog going to be an improvement over legacy via spdif to my Arcam AVR350? I guess I won't know until I try. My feeling is maybe!

The 83 apears to be a big improvement in load times etc.... concerning BR.

Does it add better noise reduction etc...for SD than the 983 or exact same performance?

I have one other reservation:

Does anyone feel it would be wise to keep your BR/SD players seperated into two machines because of BR's unsteady place in the market? Buying an Oppo seems like a no brainer just for this concern alone because of their customer service.
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post #3047 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 12:46 PM
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I know. My point is legacy DD/DTS sounds better than lossless analog in my system.

Are you sure your analog connections are configured correctly? At a maximum bitrate of 384kbps, DD encoding is only marginally better than 320kbps MP3s. At 768kbps, DTS cannot match lossless WAVs recorded at 1411kbps.

R
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post #3048 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 01:04 PM
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Bob,
Since I am in the pool for the next round of bdp-83 ea's there are a few questions that I need answered before considering actually joining.
One question was answered by you a few post ago. That was can the bdp-83 decode and output HD audio formats to pcm and send over hdmi. It can, if I understand right. I would be interested in how you would compare the oppo's onboard decoding to the decoding done in the pre/pro or receivers? Bob, how do you rate the decoded pcm sent to the D2 vs bitsteam sent to D2v?
Since the BluRay movie companies (WB, Paramount, NewLine) all seem to default to different audio (lossy vs Lossless HD) when a disc is played, is there an easy way to identify and change the audio track on the fly?
If I understood the review I read on the bdp-83, you can set it to send out the video in its native format- 480i for SDVD, and 1080i/60 or 1080p/24 for BR. Since I will be doing my video processing in the D2 it would be nice to be able to have this done automatically, or be able to choose to send SDVD at 480i by way of a menu setting in the Oppo. Is this possible?
Bob, do you use DVD1, DVD2, etc. to view sdvd and BR or just one for all?
Does the Oppo send SACD (and DVD-A when available) pcm via hdmi?
Forgive me for singling out Bob P. for these questions, but I know he used the bdp-83 with the D2, so he is qualified to answer these questions. If any one else can answer, please feel free to do so. Thanks,
Tom

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I've been out of the player forum for sometime but took a glance in here.... I must say the player sounds very interesting.

Forgive me if this has been covered (read the manual and FAQ).

-The 4:2:2 signal sounds interesting but the manual says 4:2:0 would be native. Any reason why it can't output that?
-What was the verdict on the duel HDMI cables (one for audio, one for video), that the new Pioneer used?

Thanks to the OP for a very informative thread.
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post #3050 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 01:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robertazimmerman View Post

Are you sure your analog connections are configured correctly? At a maximum bitrate of 384kbps, DD encoding is only marginally better than 320kbps MP3s. At 768kbps, DTS cannot match lossless WAVs recorded at 1411kbps.

R

Yup, I was thinking along those same lines. There must be something wrong with his set-up, I suspect. My point is that implicit in including SACD in the 83 is like saying, "I'm serious about high bit rate recorded, lossless audio-only media!" (Or is, [sigh], just an OPPO marketing issue? You know, "We can throw it cheap." After all, I suspect that the majority of users will be satisfied with CD only playback) Nevertheless, my grandfather used to always tell me "Do things right the first time or don't do it at all."

There is a generation of people who will only know music delivered at marginal bit rates. What happens when they first hear a live performance of music previously known only as an MP3?

BTW, hand raised for sense of humor.
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post #3051 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 01:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tngiloy View Post

Bob,
Since I am in the pool for the next round of bdp-83 ea's there are a few questions that I need answered before considering actually joining.

Some of your questions are answered in the FAQ. Bob supplied the text for Should I perform audio decoding in the player or in the receiver?.

See also: Source Direct

The online manual is also worth studying.

-Bill


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post #3052 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 01:15 PM
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Originally Posted by shamus View Post

-The 4:2:2 signal sounds interesting but the manual says 4:2:0 would be native. Any reason why it can't output that?

All decoder chips read 4:2:0 from the disc and produce 4:2:2. HDMI will not even carry a 4:2:0 signal.

-Bill


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post #3053 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 01:24 PM
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Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

All decoder chips read 4:2:0 from the disc and produce 4:2:2. HDMI will not even carry a 4:2:0 signal.

-Bill

Thanks... is there any benefit to using a separate HDMI cable for video and audio (like Pioneer), or was that debunked?
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post #3054 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by shamus View Post

Thanks... is there any benefit to using a separate HDMI cable for video and audio (like Pioneer), or was that debunked?

I don't know anything about it. Why would there be a benefit? (I don't really need to know; the BDP-83 has only one HDMI output, discussions of what Pioneer has should go in those threads).

-Bill


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post #3055 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by narkspud View Post

Not disagreeing with your recommendation at all, but is it really worth it to buy an -83 solely for audio?

What is there more than audio...?
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post #3056 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 01:30 PM
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Originally Posted by tngiloy View Post

Bob,
Since I am in the pool for the next round of bdp-83 ea's there are a few questions that I need answered before considering actually joining.
One question was answered by you a few post ago. That was can the bdp-83 decode and output HD audio formats to pcm and send over hdmi. It can, if I understand right. I would be interested in how you would compare the oppo's onboard decoding to the decoding done in the pre/pro or receivers? Bob, how do you rate the decoded pcm sent to the D2 vs bitsteam sent to D2v?
Since the BluRay movie companies (WB, Paramount, NewLine) all seem to default to different audio (lossy vs Lossless HD) when a disc is played, is there an easy way to identify and change the audio track on the fly?
If I understood the review I read on the bdp-83, you can set it to send out the video in its native format- 480i for SDVD, and 1080i/60 or 1080p/24 for BR. Since I will be doing my video processing in the D2 it would be nice to be able to have this done automatically, or be able to choose to send SDVD at 480i by way of a menu setting in the Oppo. Is this possible?
Bob, do you use DVD1, DVD2, etc. to view sdvd and BR or just one for all?
Does the Oppo send SACD (and DVD-A when available) pcm via hdmi?
Forgive me for singling out Bob P. for these questions, but I know he used the bdp-83 with the D2, so he is qualified to answer these questions. If any one else can answer, please feel free to do so. Thanks,
Tom

Tom, be sure to check out the resources linked in the first post of this thread.

A lot of your questions have easy to find answers in the FAQ and the Manual for example.

But in brief, yes decoding to LPCM in the player works fine with the D2. As you know the D2 doesn't decode, and I didn't have a chance to do side by side between the D2 and the D2v. But using the D2v I find no difference between decoding in the Oppo and decoding in the D2v (given the latest D2v firmware which fixed a few crucial bugs).

The Oppo when set to Source Direct output will send HDMI 480i for SD-DVDs and 1080i/59.94 or 1080p/23.976 for Blu-Ray discs (according to the content on the disc). That's all automatic, and it all works just fine with the D2.

In addition the Oppo has a dedicated video resolution button on the remote which makes it trivially easy to switch from Source Direct to any explicit output resolution if you want to.

The choice of default audio track from any given disc is under the control of the studio. There is no way to change that behavior.

I have found no need to use a different setup for SD-DVD and Blu-Ray from the Oppo, so I have just the one input definition set up in the Anthem.

Yes the Oppo can output SACD audio as HDMI LPCM. That too works fine with the D2. Since DVD-Audio uses the same audio compression scheme as Dolby TrueHD, it too will decode to HDMI LPCM.
--Bob


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post #3057 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 01:32 PM
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Your earlier post on where and how the audio decoding takes place is the key for me and the main reason (besides my first BD player purchase) why this -83 player is so attractive.

With my older Denon (non-HDMI and non DDTHD and DTSMA capable) AVR, the 7.1 analog out of the OPPO into the 7.1 analog on the Denon seems to be a great way "avoiding" a new AVR purchase - especially given the statement about the "mixing" for content that the player can do and that LPCM to the AVRs (at the least the ones out there now) can not do.

If the OPPO can perform adequate delays and bass management duties (using the player's setup screens) via the 7.1 analogs out than having to have an AVR that can decode the lossless codecs may not be needed (or even desired in some cases)???

Of course, I realize this is subject to many opinions and individual gear performance (not to mention the users tastes and levels of demand for audio perfection) but your opinion and others on this topic of analog out versus HDMI to the AVR is appreciated. (I am not convinced I have to upgrade to a new AVR.)

My other main goal, which from all of the beta and EAP user reports is certainly documented, is to have the best "all around" video player (SD DVD and BD) as the main "player" in my HT rig. HDMI to the Kuro display from the OPPO and analog 7.1 to the Denon seems to be the way it will be installed.

Many thanks.
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post #3058 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shamus View Post

I've been out of the player forum for sometime but took a glance in here.... I must say the player sounds very interesting.

Forgive me if this has been covered (read the manual and FAQ).

-The 4:2:2 signal sounds interesting but the manual says 4:2:0 would be native. Any reason why it can't output that?
-What was the verdict on the duel HDMI cables (one for audio, one for video), that the new Pioneer used?

Thanks to the OP for a very informative thread.

No player (SD-DVD or Blu-Ray) outputs 4:2:0. Color upsampling to at least 4:2:2 is a core function of the player -- just like decoding the video stream in the first place.
--Bob


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post #3059 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 01:34 PM
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Originally Posted by bakerwi
I own both the BDP-83 and a Pioneer BDP-51FD and I'dhave to give the nod to the Oppo for SD-DVD playback and the 2 are close in blu-ray playback. If you need the additional features (MUCH faster load times, GREAT customer service, SACD and DVD-A (once implemented)) support just to name a few; then the Oppo is that much better. If your only criteria is PQ for SD-DVD and BD, then the Pioneers will serve this purpose and serve it well. Presently, I plan on keeping both machines.

Willie


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Originally Posted by heatwave3 View Post

Willie, I'm unsure how to read your evaluation comparison of the Oppo 83 vs the Pio 51FD. You gave the nod to the Oppo of PQ for sd-dvd yet you suggested if your need is sd-dvd and BD then you suggested the Pio would serve the need. Unsure which device you are recommending if PQ of SD-dvd and BD is the primary criteria for selecting a new combo disk player. Can you provide more insight into your thinking?

What Willie meant looks pretty clear to me.......

Get an Oppo if this fits.........
Quote:


If you need the additional features (MUCH faster load times, GREAT customer service, SACD and DVD-A (once implemented)) support just to name a few; then the Oppo is that much better.

If you don't need any of that then stick with the 51FD........
Quote:


If your only criteria is PQ for SD-DVD and BD, then the Pioneers will serve this purpose and serve it well. Presently, I plan on keeping both machines.

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post #3060 of 39473 Old 03-15-2009, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by shamus View Post

Thanks... is there any benefit to using a separate HDMI cable for video and audio (like Pioneer), or was that debunked?

The advantage of two outputs is solely so that you don't have to use an HDMI splitter to run one output to a display for video and the other to your AVR for audio.

HDMI audio is not a separate signal. It is embedded in the blanking intervals of the HDMI video. So even a cable used for "just audio" still has a video signal on it -- even if only a constant black frame.
--Bob


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