Official OPPO BDP-83 Owner's Thread [technical talk only] - Page 430 - AVS Forum
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post #12871 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 06:45 AM
 
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Originally Posted by offten View Post

You did not say which Sony rear projection TV you had but on mine (a KDF-42WE655), picture settings are saved individually for each input (i.e HDMI, cable, component, etc) so you can make adjustments to the TV for the HDMI input attached to the BDP-83 without messing up your other settings.

Alan

Unless you have several HDMI display devices connected by way of an AVR.
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post #12872 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 06:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Smarty-pants View Post

Most likely what you are experiencing is the result of the dynamic compression with sd dvd.
With Blu-ray, the soundtracks that are lossless (DTS-HD/MA, Dolby TrueHD), will not suffer from the compression that most sd-dvds do.
The Blu-ray discs allow for much more data to be placed on the discs, so they are able to put high resolution audio tracks that are close to, or identical with, the original master soundtrack. This means that the audio will be much more dynamic, having a broader spectrum of sound than a sd-dvd would have.
The louder sounds create a higher SPL (IE: explosions), while the softer sounds (IE: whispering) are at much lower volume.
Therefore, the overall sound will appear to be lower in volume, but in reality is just more dynamic.
You will have to turn that volume up a bit more to recognize the more quite sounds as a resonable volume level. However, be prepared for those loud explosions, and scary moments in horror flicks to blast you out, just like they do in the commercial theaters.
If this is UNdesirable to you, you can activate the Dynamic Range Control in either your player, receiver, or television.
That feature will compress the audio in a similar manner that mirrors the compression for sd-dvd.

I will certainly have to look into this, as I was watching the latest "Batman" BlueRay last night. My first move is to get an EAR exam, as I have always had difficulty HEARING softly spoken dialog in movies. So after 20 years, I put together a NEW system (Onkyo 906, new 7.1 speakers, and the Oppo-83). Having a decent "middle channel" speaker has helped, but when I set my master AVR volume to hear the dialog tracks on MID Channel from 9 feet away, soft dialog is better, but then when the music and SFX tracks play, the audio and bass is VERY loud. I would not mind this if I lived in a private home, but in an apartment building, I got a phone call from my neighbors about the BASS. I certainly don't suffer any subwoofer MINUS issues, I bitstream and am ALL HDMI, and my Audyssey setup is about as good as it gets. So the "range" is there, and it sounds like a movie house, but for LATE night movie viewing, I have to figure a way to reduce the BASS output without lowering the master volume, as I would then struggle to hear the dialog track on the MID Channel. I'll have to see if compressing the dynamic range can help in my situation. I am jealous of those that don't have NEIGHBORS to complain, but that's where I'm at.
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post #12873 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 07:15 AM
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Originally Posted by laserjock II View Post

Someone forgot to tell him he won't be getting PIP audio when bitstreaming.

Secondary audio to ON and the Oppo re-encodes the sound to DTS bitstream with TrueHD/DTS-MA so it's not bad especially if your optical or coaxial onlly.
Just missing the PCM track and then it will be up there with Samsung in this regard.
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post #12874 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 08:03 AM
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Originally Posted by kingfats View Post

Secondary audio to ON and the Oppo re-encodes the sound to DTS bitstream with TrueHD/DTS-MA so it's not bad especially if your optical or coaxial onlly.
Just missing the PCM track and then it will be up there with Samsung in this regard.

I stand corrected. Guess I meant the HD audio
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post #12875 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 08:50 AM
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Originally Posted by BinBash View Post

The possible dynamic range of the soundtrack has nothing to do with the media, audio codec or storage space used. You could have full dynamic range on SD DVDs, go ask LaserDisc folks. Around here, LaserDiscs are famous for their highly dynamic sound and they offer the exact same DD/dts bitrates SD DVDs could have*. The main reason why DVDs tend to have highly compressed dynamics is, because people complain about it. European DVDs tend to have more compression applied than US releases, just because europeans complain more.

Don't mix up danymic compression with data compression, two completly different things.

*) Well, DVDs even have higher DD bitrates available than LaserDisc: 448kbit/s (DVD) to 384kbit/s (LD), for dts, LDs musst have fullrate (1536kbit/s) while DVDs allow halfrate (768kbit/s), acording to german wikipedia.

Dynamic compression,... data compression..., whatever. I'm not a tech head and don't always use the absolute correct terminology. Other than the technical verbage, my post is still correct in it's assessment.

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post #12876 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 08:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Mactavish View Post

for LATE night movie viewing, I have to figure a way to reduce the BASS output without lowering the master volume, as I would then struggle to hear the dialog track on the MID Channel. I'll have to see if compressing the dynamic range can help in my situation. I am jealous of those that don't have NEIGHBORS to complain, but that's where I'm at.

DRC is designed for precisely your situation. But, it is usually only available with Dolby sources. Check your Onkyo manual. DRC needs to be engaged in the device doing the decoding.

For DTS and PCM tracks, you can try turning down the master volume and increasing the output level for the center channel. You might also need to turn down the sub a bit.
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post #12877 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 09:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Fuzzy761210 View Post

I don't know if Oppo can even do this but I wish that blu-ray picture adjustments could be saved independently from dvd.

Yes, I agree - this would be a nice feature for sure.


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Originally Posted by Fuzzy761210 View Post

I am happy with the machine, I guess my expectations/hopes on the dvd PQ would have been better then the ps3 I was using.


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Originally Posted by animalsrush View Post

Your experience seems to mimic mine. I didn't have that WOW factor. The picture using SD DVD was same on my Panny PZ800u using my 8 year old Denon 2800 MkII . I tried messing with color space and setting it to 4:4:4 but no dice. Having said that it is a good replacement as i moved my denon to the bedroom.
PC

Same here. No WOW factor. The Oppo may offer the best upconversion available, but 480 lines of resolution is still 480 lines of resolution. I think people (myself included) expect too much after all the raving about the Oppo's upconversion.

That said, the Oppo DOES do a better job of upconversion on my 106" screen (sending 1080p from the Oppo) than my Sony VW40 projector does on it's own if I send Source Direct (480i) from the Oppo and let the projector upconvert. If I use the 1/2x zoom on the Oppo to yield a 75" diagonal picture (which I prefer when watching SD DVD), the Oppo's upconversion advantages become less noticeable than when at 106". The difference is definitely noticeable, but it may not be night & day better than other competing players - particularly on smaller screens. The differences are there, but they're subtle. I'm not surprised that you guys aren't noticing significant improvements on direct-view sized displays (<70") after my experience.
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post #12878 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 09:14 AM
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Originally Posted by jkozlow3 View Post

Same here. No WOW factor. The Oppo may offer the best upconversion available, but 480 lines of resolution is still 480 lines of resolution. I think people (myself included) expect too much after all the raving about the Oppo's upconversion.

That and I think a lot of us are simply spoiled by REAL high definition.

Great ISF Job by Chad B.
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post #12879 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 09:24 AM
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Originally Posted by David_AD View Post

My remote was flakey too and Oppo emailed me the following suggestion and it worked for me.


"Remove the batteries from the remote control:

1. Press and hold the Power button on the remote control for 3 seconds. Release.
2. Press and hold the Source button on the remote control for 3 seconds. Release.
3. Repeat until all the buttons on the remote control have been pressed and held, individually, for 3 seconds each.
4. Replace the batteries with new ones (note: we do not recommend using Lithium batteries with the OPPO Remote).

If the remote control still does not work, then the remote will need to be replaced. In this case, please respond with your shipping information so we can send out a new remote control.

Best Regards,

Customer Service
OPPO Digital, Inc.
2629B Terminal Blvd.
Mountain View, CA 94043
Service@oppodigital.com
Tel: 650-961-1118
Fax: 650-961-1119 "

Cool! Thanks, I'll definitely try that.

If more of us valued food and cheer above hoarded gold, it would be a much merrier world.

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post #12880 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 10:07 AM
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Is the main Oppo 83 screen (like when you power on and no disc) supposed to change from Blue to orange/red under certain conditions? The glow/color around the bluray logo and even the little menu with "music, Movies, etc.." changed colors.

Powering down and back up changed things back to Blue. The orange looked intentional (not a video processor issue) so I'm just wondering if it indicates something (in setup maybe)?
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post #12881 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 10:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Beaker1024 View Post

Is the main Oppo 83 screen (like when you power on and no disc) supposed to change from Blue to orange/red under certain conditions? The glow/color around the bluray logo and even the little menu with "music, Movies, etc.." changed colors.

Powering down and back up changed things back to Blue. The orange looked intentional (not a video processor issue) so I'm just wondering if it indicates something (in setup maybe)?

That sounds like an HDMI color space confusion. You might try initiating a new handshake, say by changing the resolution to something else and back again.

You might experiment with determining a best order to turn on the devices: usually its display first, receiver or video processor (if any) second, player last.

-Bill


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post #12882 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 10:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Beaker1024 View Post

Is the main Oppo 83 screen (like when you power on and no disc) supposed to change from Blue to orange/red under certain conditions? The glow/color around the bluray logo and even the little menu with "music, Movies, etc.." changed colors.

Powering down and back up changed things back to Blue. The orange looked intentional (not a video processor issue) so I'm just wondering if it indicates something (in setup maybe)?

This happens to me fairly often. It has something to do with a bad HDMI handshake (as Bill already posted), and it goes away with a new handshake. You'll notice that if the Oppo screen does this, and you play a movie that does not require a new handshake, all the colors will be messed up.

Sometimes, instead of the "red" glow, I get a completely blank screen, even though the front panel of the 83 says something is playing. I think this is a just a different result from a bad HDMI handshake. I still have hopes that this particular issue will be fixed or at least get better with new firmware. I've never seen this HDMI handshake problem with my 983.

Dave Barnhart
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post #12883 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 10:58 AM
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Hi All. I've been using my BDP-83 now for a few weeks and am trying to determine whether a couple of problems I'm having are related to the player or to my display. Before sending anything to Oppo, I thought I would check in here to see if anyone could help out. I have not seen any posts in this (or the other) BDP-83 threads related to my issues. Besides these two concerns, the player has been fantastic.

I have the BDP-83 hooked connected to my Mitsubishi LT37132 via HDMI, with the Oppo sending 1080P. The 24p options are turned off and I'm using Wide/Auto. I'm experiencing two main issues/concerns.

1. I'm getting what looks to be some image tearing that occurs intermittently and randomly only when watching DVDs (The Incredibles and Band of Brothers). The tearing occurs somewhere between halfway down the screen and the bottom of the screen on the horizontal. The frequency of occurance is low, but it's damn annoying when it happens. Data below the tear appears to be older than the data presented above (which is current).

2. This is subjective, surely, but it looks to me like the results of the deinterlacing tests on the S&M disc (jaggie tests with the rotating arm) are poor. I have not seen a visual frame of reference for what I should be seeeing coming out of the BDP-83, but there is definitely some heavy aliasing occuring along the rotating arm. Also, on the bridge video, I'm getting aliasing radiating down the big wires and moire occuring inside the tight, close wires. This is tough to explain, but let's just say it's all bad enough that I can obviously spot these symptoms 8 feet from a 37 inch 1080p lcd.

I've tried different resolutions and formats, but 1080p/standard (or underscan) offers the best result. My TV accepts 1080p 60 over HDMI (which worked fine from my 981) but it does overscan a bit. The only thing I can think of to help differentiate whether the BD player is bad or the TV is causing these problems is to send the signal through the TV's DVI which does do 1:1 pixel mapping. I'm currently waiting on an adapter to come in the mail so I can try this out.

Anyone else run into similar concerns? Any ideas, thoughts or insight into why I may be experiencing these? Any reccomendations on what else I can try out?

Thank you!

-bob
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post #12884 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 11:02 AM
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Originally Posted by RMetz1 View Post

1. I'm getting what looks to be some image tearing that occurs intermittently and randomly only when watching DVDs (The Incredibles and Band of Brothers). The tearing occurs somewhere between halfway down the screen and the bottom of the screen on the horizontal. The frequency of occurance is low, but it's damn annoying when it happens. Data below the tear appears to be older than the data presented above (which is current).

This is typical of DVD-24p playback.
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post #12885 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 11:05 AM
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Originally Posted by RMetz1 View Post

Anyone else run into similar concerns? Any ideas, thoughts or insight into why I may be experiencing these? Any reccomendations on what else I can try out?

In the absence of 24p, the DVD tearing is unusual. I can't explain that.

I would definitely try DVI and 1:1 pixel mapping to see if that changes the jaggies and moire. Rescaling the video may cause strange effects.

-Bill


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post #12886 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 11:14 AM
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Thanks for the quick responses! I'll check/toggle the 24p settings and see if that makes a difference, then try the DVI route when my adapter gets here.
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post #12887 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by RMetz1 View Post

Thanks for the quick responses! I'll check/toggle the 24p settings and see if that makes a difference, then try the DVI route when my adapter gets here.

Looking at reviews for that display, I don't know what these things do, but if there are any defeatable video processing options, you might try turning them off to see if it makes a difference:
  • High Contrast Picture creates a picture with deeper blacks and richer dark scene details by dynamically matching the brightness of the TV backlight to that of the on-screen image.
  • Mitsubishi's all-new digital signal processing system includes Plush1080p for precise de-interlacing and upconversion to 1080p,
  • 4D Video Noise Reduction for smooth yet detailed images

Let us know how the DVI connection looks. I use HDMI->DVI sometimes myself.

-Bill


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post #12888 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 11:44 AM
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Received my 83 the other day, very pleased with it, but disappointed with the way it plays AVCHD discs. I have quite a few of these made from my HDV camcorder. Lots of stuttering, in both audio, and video. Have been through all the settings, but nothing changes. Have HDMI going through my Sony AVR.
Everything else plays well. Sure hope OPPO has a fix for AVCHD soon.

Paddy
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post #12889 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by paddy1 View Post

Received my 83 the other day, very pleased with it, but disappointed with the way it plays AVCHD discs. I have quite a few of these made from my HDV camcorder. Lots of stuttering, in both audio, and video. Have been through all the settings, but nothing changes. Have HDMI going through my Sony AVR.
Everything else plays well. Sure hope OPPO has a fix for AVCHD soon.

Paddy

AVCHD on disc issues should be addressed in the next firmware. You should be able to play the same content from USB with no trouble.

-Bill


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post #12890 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by BinBash View Post

The possible dynamic range of the soundtrack has nothing to do with the media, audio codec or storage space used. You could have full dynamic range on SD DVDs, go ask LaserDisc folks. Around here, LaserDiscs are famous for their highly dynamic sound and they offer the exact same DD/dts bitrates SD DVDs could have*. The main reason why DVDs tend to have highly compressed dynamics is, because people complain about it. European DVDs tend to have more compression applied than US releases, just because europeans complain more.

Don't mix up danymic compression with data compression, two completly different things.

*) Well, DVDs even have higher DD bitrates available than LaserDisc: 448kbit/s (DVD) to 384kbit/s (LD), for dts, LDs musst have fullrate (1536kbit/s) while DVDs allow halfrate (768kbit/s), acording to german wikipedia.

I don't understand what you mean about people complaining about compression on DVDs. Are you saying they complain that there is too much of it, or not enough of it?

(By the way, whoever posted pictures of pet rocks on here earlier, they weren't the originals. It took a couple days to track down an expert, and they verified that my memory was correct. The originals didn't have eyes: http://creditcardpundit.com/wp-conte...4/pet-rock.jpg)
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post #12891 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by jkozlow3 View Post

Yes, I agree - this would be a nice feature for sure.







Same here. No WOW factor. The Oppo may offer the best upconversion available, but 480 lines of resolution is still 480 lines of resolution. I think people (myself included) expect too much after all the raving about the Oppo's upconversion.

That said, the Oppo DOES do a better job of upconversion on my 106" screen (sending 1080p from the Oppo) than my Sony VW40 projector does on it's own if I send Source Direct (480i) from the Oppo and let the projector upconvert. If I use the 1/2x zoom on the Oppo to yield a 76" diagonal picture (which I prefer when watching SD DVD), the Oppo's upconversion advantages become less noticeable than when at 106". The difference is definitely noticeable, but it may not be night & day better than other competing players - particularly on smaller screens. The differences are there, but they're subtle. I'm not surprised that you guys aren't noticing significant improvements on direct-view sized displays (<70") after my experience.

I think what you're seeing is simply that 480i as a source, jacked up to 106", isn't going to look all that good no matter what. There aren't enough pixels, and at that screen size you'll see upconversion artifacts that would blend into the overall signal on a smaller screen and/or farther away. With a 106" screen, you're on the cusp of even 1080p not looking good.

http://www.engadgethd.com/2006/12/09...to-screen-size
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post #12892 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 12:23 PM
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With a 106" screen, you're on the cusp of even 1080p not looking good.

I don't have 1080p, and my screen that is 105"WIDE. From 12' back looks pretty damn awesome with Blu-ray, and pretty good with most dvds too.

~Dave

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post #12893 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Smarty-pants View Post

I don't have 1080p, and my screen that is 105"WIDE. From 12' back looks pretty damn awesome with Blu-ray, and pretty good with most dvds too.

what he said! and i don't even have an oppo yet. (see 'about me' for gear list)
i recently went from a 108" screen to a temporary 82"er. dvds do look good on either one, not to mention blu rays which of course look even better.

10' from 84" screen.


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post #12894 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 01:10 PM
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I'm not saying that well-mastered DVDs look BAD at 106", but artifacts are present for sure and the lack of resolution is very apparent when compared to Blu-Ray. My subjective PQ ranking would go something like:

Well-mastered BD (i.e. Pirates of the Caribbean) at 106": 10
Well-mastered SD DVD upconverted to 1080p by Oppo at 1/2x zoom (75"): 7
Well-mastered SD DVD upconverted to 1080p by Oppo at 106" (softer pic and more visible artifacts when going from 75" > 106"): 6
Well-mastered SD DVD upconverted by Sony VW40 projector (480i out from Oppo) at 106": 4

I don't understand the discrepencies between our experiences. I don't think my LASIK corrected eyesight is any better than average. Using the best BD material as a baseline for as good as material can currently look ("10" rating), there is no way I would give an SD DVD picture a rating of more than "6" at the same size. This is a big enough difference for me to wish that all material was available in BD for sure.
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post #12895 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 01:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

AVCHD on disc issues should be addressed in the next firmware. You should be able to play the same content from USB with no trouble.

-Bill

Yeah, I guess the keyword here is should. I have made some AVCHD templated files in Sony's Vegas Pro 9 editing software and while they play fine thru USB on my PS3, I can't even get my BDP-83 to recognize them. Ouch. Also, it is ashame the Oppo won't play VC1 (or WMV) files on USB either.

Otherwise, I am often very happy with the units performance and build quality is excellent for the price.
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post #12896 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 01:22 PM
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I got my -83 just a few days ago and am really impressed with all aspects of it. I do have a question-on some discs, you are FORCED to watch "Previews" before you can watch the film. You cannot call up the main menu until these stupid previews have finished. Is there any way to bypass this stupidity? I have paid for the disc. Why should I be forced to watch these idiotic trailers? Any button combo or other means to defeat this on the -83? Thanks for any help.
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post #12897 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 01:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sk20 View Post

I think what you're seeing is simply that 480i as a source, jacked up to 106", isn't going to look all that good no matter what. There aren't enough pixels, and at that screen size you'll see upconversion artifacts that would blend into the overall signal on a smaller screen and/or farther away. With a 106" screen, you're on the cusp of even 1080p not looking good.

http://www.engadgethd.com/2006/12/09...to-screen-size

Yes, and according to that chart, I am smack-dab in the middle of the 1440p range at my 12ft viewing distance - well past being able to fully resolve 1080p (let alone 480i/p)
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post #12898 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 01:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vidop View Post

I got my -83 just a few days ago and am really impressed with all aspects of it. I do have a question-on some discs, you are FORCED to watch "Previews" before you can watch the film. You cannot call up the main menu until these stupid previews have finished. Is there any way to bypass this stupidity? I have paid for the disc. Why should I be forced to watch these idiotic trailers? Any button combo or other means to defeat this on the -83? Thanks for any help.

I use the chapter skip to jump through them when locked-out from the main menu. I could be wrong, but I don't think the Oppo is different than any other player in this regard.
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post #12899 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 01:30 PM
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Originally Posted by DigVid View Post

Yeah, I guess the keyword here is should. I have made some AVCHD templated files in Sony's Vegas Pro 9 editing software and while they play fine thru USB on my PS3, I can't even get my BDP-83 to recognize them.

Is the BDMV folder in a top-level AVCHD directory?

-Bill


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post #12900 of 39473 Old 05-30-2009, 01:31 PM
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Thanks for the tip! I'll give it a try. This is my first BR player and I am VERY pleased with it.
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