Official Panasonic DMP-BD60/80 Owners Thread - Page 13 - AVS Forum
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post #361 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 09:11 AM
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the screensaver is what is making the sides gray.. turn off the screensaver and then you should be fine. I had this problem with the panasonic 30.

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post #362 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 09:54 AM
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The only thing that makes me hesitate on getting a BD60 (I have an Onk 805 AVR) is the question about its dvd upconversion capability. Does anyone have a direct evaluation of this relative to that given by the HQV of various Sammies?
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post #363 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 10:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

The only thing that makes me hesitate on getting a BD60 (I have an Onk 805 AVR) is the question about its dvd upconversion capability. Does anyone have a direct evaluation of this relative to that given by the HQV of various Sammies?

DVD upconversion is good, but not as good as HQV.
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post #364 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 10:50 AM
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Hello folks! I just received a BD80 last week and have been impressed with it, although still getting used to the slower response times than my Sony 999ES but, as has been said here, the BD format is still evolving.
One question I have is that I have an older Sony CRT which has a maximum resolution of 1080i. If I play a regular DVD, does it upconvert to 1080i or does that only occur when the TV set is 1080p?
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post #365 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 10:55 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kage View Post

DVD upconversion is good, but not as good as HQV.

Hello? Time changes.
Lets hear what Kris Deering states for the DB-35 which uses the same UniPhier chip:
"These new players did outstanding in our new video processing test set. They support full deinterlacing of high-definition and standard DVD playback with great results. (See page 26 for more info on our video processing tests.) These players have definitely set the bar for video playback performance at these price points, and it will be interesting to see how the competition responds.

The DMP-BD35 and DMP-BD55 did a spectacular job in our video tests. These are the first Panasonic players that pass all of our video processing tests for deinterlacing. The UniPhier also did a great job with our resolution tests. It passed information to the very limits of what’s available from the Blu-ray format in pristine fashion. You would truly be hard-pressed to find better video performance with Blu-ray and DVD playback at any price."

I agree. Why spend more than $300MSRP? Hope this helps!
http://hometheatermag.com/discplayer...u-ray_players/
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post #366 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 12:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boylan13 View Post

The BD80 amplifies DTS-HD 5.1 and 6.1 to 7.1 PCM or analog output just as the BD55 did. "It's a feature." Does not affect bitstream output of course.

-CB

Well that could be the nail in the coffin. I don't like that "feature" myself. I have receivers with HDMI but no HD codec decoding in the receiver. I'd rather be able to send native 5.1 over HDMI and be able to decide for myself whether I want 5.1 or whether I perform DPL IIx to it. I admit it's not the end of the world, as you can always restrict your player and/or receiver to 5.1, but it's still weird behaviour in my books. It amazes me that you can't tell the Panasonic player that you have a 5.1 receiver, at least for analog. I suppose the way around that is if your receiver can accept 5.1 over analog multi-channel inputs and perform DPL IIx to it. I can't recall if my receiver will do that. Anyways, the price difference vs the Sony S550 is a bit much when I can't tell if it will be better or not. I can't tell if they have any plans to change the way the Sony handles audio (have to switch between HDMIand SPDIF for Blu-Ray to DVD) and I don't know if the Sony S550 does 1080p24 for dvd.
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post #367 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 01:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug G View Post

Yes, I've done all that, no joy. I get stretched picture with every 4:3 DVD title I try (and with young kids I've got plenty of those!) I confirmed with IFOedit that these titles were properly flagged in the VTS as 4:3.

One thing that just occurred to me is that I was using the component outputs to my Elite RPTV when checking this (not the HDMI connection to my PJ) I wonder if that has anything to do with it? That would be surprising but possible, I guess.

I'm curious to hear how this comes out for you.. the settings recommended earlier are the same as mine, and it was over an HDMI connection.
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post #368 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpc View Post

It amazes me that you can't tell the Panasonic player that you have a 5.1 receiver, at least for analog.

Not sure what you mean here. You can set the player to 5.1-channel output over analog, just use the 2+5.1-ch setting or use the 7.1 channel setting and turn off the rear speakers in the set-up menu. Either of these options will send a 5.1-channel analog output to your receiver.

Quote:


I suppose the way around that is if your receiver can accept 5.1 over analog multi-channel inputs and perform DPL IIx to it. I can't recall if my receiver will do that. Anyways, the price difference vs the Sony S550 is a bit much when I can't tell if it will be better or not. I can't tell if they have any plans to change the way the Sony handles audio (have to switch between HDMIand SPDIF for Blu-Ray to DVD) and I don't know if the Sony S550 does 1080p24 for dvd.

The Sony does not do 24p for DVD.

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post #369 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 02:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kage View Post

DVD upconversion is good, but not as good as HQV.

Having tested the BD55, BD-P2500 and BD80, I would agree. The BD60/BD80 are just a little bit slow to pick up cadence settings, and slightly inferior to the HQV-based BD-P2500 in diagonal filtering. For example, the "Super Speedway" test on the HQV DVD takes a little under a second for the BD80 to lock to, with a slight glitch after it detects the cadence, then it's stable. The BD-P2500 locks to this 3:2 cadence immediately with no delay. The mixed content test, where video titles are scrolling over a film-based background also takes the Panasonic players a little bit of time to decode which leads to some tearing and combing artifacts to be visible briefly. The HQV-based Samsung does not exhibit this problem.

I could live with the BD80 as my main player though. It's not a huge difference.

I haven't tested the new Samsung players yet, but none of them offers the HQV processor. They're doing their own thing now.

-CB

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post #370 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 02:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vconqwst View Post

I'm curious to hear how this comes out for you.. the settings recommended earlier are the same as mine, and it was over an HDMI connection.

Are you saying you're also not getting 4:3 discs to appear in their proper aspect ratio on the BD60? The stretch of 4:3 material to 16:9 should never happen unless you have set the display to 16:9 full or you're doing some stretch processing in the TV or in the player's sub-menu aspect ratio control.

I've only tested on a couple of different displays but have never seen this stretching of 4:3 DVDs on the BD80.

-CB

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post #371 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 03:21 PM
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Originally Posted by boylan13 View Post

Not sure what you mean here. You can set the player to 5.1-channel output over analog, just use the 2+5.1-ch setting or use the 7.1 channel setting and turn off the rear speakers in the set-up menu. Either of these options will send a 5.1-channel analog output to your receiver.

Opps. I meant for HDMI. Sorry, I'm just whining. I don't want to start up that again, but, I was hoping they had 'fixed' it, or changed it on the BD80 so you could 'turn-off' the duplicated rear surrounds in the player when playing 5.1 DTS and outputting PCM over HDMI. My receiver has HDMI but no modern codecs. Prefer to send 5.1 and perform DPL IIx. At least worth a try. Other option is to live with the duped side surrounds into the rears, or, reduce receiver setting to 5.1 for those titles.

Quote:
Originally Posted by boylan13 View Post

The Sony does not do 24p for DVD.

Shame the Sony does not do 24p for dvd. I guess we may have to wait for the S760 for that.
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post #372 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 03:37 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boylan13 View Post

Having tested the BD55, BD-P2500 and BD80, I would agree. The BD60/BD80 are just a little bit slow to pick up cadence settings, and slightly inferior to the HQV-based BD-P2500 in diagonal filtering. For example, the "Super Speedway" test on the HQV DVD takes a little under a second for the BD80 to lock to, with a slight glitch after it detects the cadence, then it's stable. The BD-P2500 locks to this 3:2 cadence immediately with no delay. The mixed content test, where video titles are scrolling over a film-based background also takes the Panasonic players a little bit of time to decode which leads to some tearing and combing artifacts to be visible briefly. The HQV-based Samsung does not exhibit this problem.

I could live with the BD80 as my main player though. It's not a huge difference.

I haven't tested the new Samsung players yet, but none of them offers the HQV processor. They're doing their own thing now.

-CB

From Home Theater mag:
1) Unfortunately, the BD-P2500 does not offer (24p with DVD) frame-rate conversion of DVD material like the recently reviewed Panasonic DMP-BD35 and DMP-BD55. Those players allow for 1080p/24 playback of DVD material.

2) For now, the player will only decode the core 1.5-Mbps DTS soundtrack, which is similar to the DTS soundtracks on DVD today.

3) it lacks a coaxial digital output

4) The BD-P2500 isn’t a sluggish player, but I would call it average for the market today. It was a tad slower than the recent Panasonic players that I reviewed.

5) The HD decoder does have an issue with chroma upsampling with HD material mastered with a 2:2 cadence (not shown in our chart). This content represents a tiny segment of the market, but the player revealed obvious banding with our 2:2 Chroma Upsampling Error (CUE) test pattern.

6) The Reon is at the lower end of Silicon Optix’s HQV solutions, which include the flagship Realta.

I've tried the Silicon Optix’s most expensive chip, the Realta and it was too soft.

Further I've even purchased the highly recommended $1200 Lumagen stand-alone video processor. Terrible high frequencey flashing as with the HQV stadium chairs. Words cannot describe the expensive lesson learned.

With 24p displays common, a player which outputs the films native capture rate is essential for optimal (1920*1080@24p) DVD picture quality. I won't even go into its unique processing of progressive sources. The Panasonic player puts all this substandard performance by yesterdays technology behind us.

I forgot: the BD-60 is $100 less than the Samsung too!

http://hometheatermag.com/discplayer...er/index1.html
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post #373 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 03:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HiFiFun View Post

From Home Theater mag:
1) Unfortunately, the BD-P2500 does not offer (24p with DVD) frame-rate conversion of DVD material like the recently reviewed Panasonic DMP-BD35 and DMP-BD55. Those players allow for 1080p/24 playback of DVD material.

That's true for all Samsung players. But don't forget this is a BD player. 24fps with BD is supported.

Quote:


2) For now, the player will only decode the core 1.5-Mbps DTS soundtrack, which is similar to the DTS soundtracks on DVD today.

Old news. DTS-HD MA decoding is added late last year. It even decodes DTS-HD MA when mixing secondary audio, unlike Pansonic.

Quote:


3) it lacks a coaxial digital output

HDMI is all that counts. Can I complain Panasonic doesn't even include a RF output
Quote:


I forgot: the BD-60 is $100 less than the Samsung too!

Wrong. 2500 should be compared to BD80, not 60 as both have 7.1 analog output. BD-60 should be compared to Samsung BD-P1500 or 1600.

Current full retail price for 25x0 is around $350. And Best Buy is clearing it out for $315. Not sure where your $100 less comes from. Last time I checked, BD-60 is still $299 which is the same as BD-P1600. And I would say BD80 will probably be $100 more than 25x0.
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post #374 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 04:02 PM
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Foxbat and HiFiFun, I'm interested in this comparison as an uncommitted shopper:

1) don't need the BD80 for I (and I imagine most) have a modern AVR (the Onk 805) that takes HDMI. So the BD60 is the item of interest, compared to any of the Sammies.

2) I presume that all new BD players to BD very well. But re dvd upconversion: is the Reon of the Sammy 2500 more or less important than the 24p capability of the BD60? I don't know, but would love to.

Anybody know?
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post #375 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 05:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Some Random Guy View Post

Has anyone tested any Blu-ray backups (BD-R) in this machine?

1:1 backups (AnyDVD HD + IMGBurn) play flawlessly for me.

The movies I converted from HD-DVD to Blu-ray with Clown BD, however, don't play in the BD-60 (they just spend 2 minutes trying to load, and you have to hold the power button on the unit until power goes out, then restart it and eject the disc immediately).

Which may seem like an unreasonable complaint. However, those same movies load quickly and play flawlessly (fast-forwarding, rewinding, and chapter changes can be choppy, however) in my BD-30. Firmware is the latest 1.5. I wasn't expecting a downgrade.

Otherwise, nice playback, good DVD upconversion, and much sleeker design than the clunky BD-30.


I have the bd60 (fw 1.5) and I tested a 50gb (dual layer) bd-re with this player. The movie was burned with a sony bwu-100a at 2x. Media was tdk 50gb bd-re dl. The whole movie played 99.9% flawlessly. There were only about 3 or 4, 1-millisecond hiccups throughout the movie, which produced a crackling noise, but didnt freeze up the video (that I could see anyways). The disc had never been written to before. I also tested some 25gb memorex bd-r's, and they played, but i only watched the first couple minutes. I see no reason why they wouldn't work, as I was more concerned with bd-re 50gb working.

I noticed that, as was the case with the previous panasonic models, movies ripped with older versions of anydvd hd, and had the region coding removed, would not play.
(There is a way to fix this. Simply take the app.discroot.crt and id.bdmv files from the backups in the CERTIFICATE\\BACKUPS folder and replaced them with the main ones. Also replace the modified jar file(s) with the backup(s) from BDMV\\BACKUP\\JAR. The disc should now play fine, but this will reintroduce region coding. Worked for me anyways).

I'm hoping I get the same results with my other 50gb bd-re's which I have written to many times.
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post #376 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 05:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boylan13 View Post

Are you saying you're also not getting 4:3 discs to appear in their proper aspect ratio on the BD60? The stretch of 4:3 material to 16:9 should never happen unless you have set the display to 16:9 full or you're doing some stretch processing in the TV or in the player's sub-menu aspect ratio control.

I've only tested on a couple of different displays but have never seen this stretching of 4:3 DVDs on the BD80.

-CB

No... I was getting gray pillar-boxing due to the screensaver being turned on... the image was correctly located and displayed.

I was just interested in what it takes to rectify his situation as well... never know when I'm gonna screw up another menu setting
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post #377 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 06:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Foxbat121 View Post

Old news. DTS-HD MA decoding is added late last year. It even decodes DTS-HD MA when mixing secondary audio, unlike Pansonic.

Not the first time that guy got the facts wrong. One of the reasons I don't even bother to reply to his posts.

He also "forgot" to mention that in that very same review, Kris rated the Samsung player a "Top Pick" with 4.5 stars out of 5 for performance. But clearly those *facts* didn't support his argument.

-CB

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post #378 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 06:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

2) I presume that all new BD players to BD very well. But re dvd upconversion: is the Reon of the Sammy 2500 more or less important than the 24p capability of the BD60? I don't know, but would love to.

Anybody know?

Two different matters. You will need first to correctly de-interlace the SD movie before convert to 24p signal. Both Reon and Panny are close but boylan13 just gave us his review on the comparison a few posts above.

24p is for remove slight judder in the motion which you may not may not notice it depending on what TV do you have (have to support true 24p) and whether or not you know how to spot the difference.

I think you will be fine with either one (2500/2550 has been discountinued and may not be easy to find one). Just don't pay attention to marketing hypes on either side.
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post #379 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 06:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug G View Post

Yes, I've done all that, no joy. I get stretched picture with every 4:3 DVD title I try (and with young kids I've got plenty of those!) I confirmed with IFOedit that these titles were properly flagged in the VTS as 4:3.

One thing that just occurred to me is that I was using the component outputs to my Elite RPTV when checking this (not the HDMI connection to my PJ) I wonder if that has anything to do with it? That would be surprising but possible, I guess.

Well considering no one else has mentioned this yet on the BD60 or BD80 that I've seen (stretched 4:3 DVDs), then it may be something specific to your Pioneer TV. By the way, you realize that if you use both HDMI and component video connections at the same time then the player outputs 480i over component, right? If there is an HDMI cable plugged into your player then you need to set HDMI video to OFF if you want the component video output to get 480p, 720p or 1080i.

So, if you disconnect the component cables from the player, verify the settings in the set-up and sub-menu and test this just on the projector with the HDMI connection, do you still get the stretch?

And if you disconnect the HDMI cable, re-attached the component cables to your Pioneer TV, confirm the settings above and set component video output to 1080i, do you still get the stretch?

-CB

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post #380 of 8256 Old 04-05-2009, 06:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxbat121 View Post

Two different matters. You will need first to correctly de-interlace the SD movie before convert to 24p signal. Both Reon and Panny are close but boylan13 just gave us his review on the comparison a few posts above.

24p is for remove slight judder in the motion which you may not may not notice it depending on what TV do you have (have to support true 24p) and whether or not you know how to spot the difference.

I think you will be fine with either one (2500/2550 has been discountinued and may not be easy to find one). Just don't pay attention to marketing hypes on either side.

Tx much. I have a RS20, so can display 24p, and on BD I definitely notice the diff when setting my BD player (Sammy 1200 at present) to do 1080p/24 versus 1080p/60. So I think being able to upconvert dvd's to 1080p/24 would be very nice. (I gather that the Oppo 83 will also do this, right?)
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post #381 of 8256 Old 04-06-2009, 04:58 AM
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Originally Posted by boylan13 View Post

Well considering no one else has mentioned this yet on the BD60 or BD80 that I've seen (stretched 4:3 DVDs), then it may be something specific to your Pioneer TV. By the way, you realize that if you use both HDMI and component video connections at the same time then the player outputs 480i over component, right? If there is an HDMI cable plugged into your player then you need to set HDMI video to OFF if you want the component video output to get 480p, 720p or 1080i.

So, if you disconnect the component cables from the player, verify the settings in the set-up and sub-menu and test this just on the projector with the HDMI connection, do you still get the stretch?

And if you disconnect the HDMI cable, re-attached the component cables to your Pioneer TV, confirm the settings above and set component video output to 1080i, do you still get the stretch?

-CB

Had the PJ on last night and was able to confirm the 4:3 handling works properly there, so this function doesn't work over component, only HDMI.

There's no need to disable the HDMI setting in my case since the PJ is in standby except when in use and the HDMI port isn't active in this state. I've already confirmed that I can get 480p/1080i over component. I was actually quite surprised to see that BDs would output 1080i over component. Seems a little silly when regular DVDs are strapped to 480p mode.

I had hoped to be able to leave the component output set to 1080i and just let it fall back to 480p, but with improper 4:3 handling by the player over the components and lack of aspect ratio control in my set at 480p (many early HD sets such as mine incorrectly "lock" into full mode for anything other than 480i) means I'll have to just leave it in 480i mode. This isn't that big a deal, only DVDs are generally viewed on the RPTV 98% of the time, any BDs or HD I tend to use the PJ.
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post #382 of 8256 Old 04-06-2009, 06:46 AM
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Originally Posted by XxYuroxX View Post

I have the bd60 (fw 1.5) and I tested a 50gb (dual layer) bd-re with this player. The movie was burned with a sony bwu-100a at 2x. Media was tdk 50gb bd-re dl. The whole movie played 99.9% flawlessly. There were only about 3 or 4, 1-millisecond hiccups throughout the movie, which produced a crackling noise, but didnt freeze up the video (that I could see anyways). The disc had never been written to before. I also tested some 25gb memorex bd-r's, and they played, but i only watched the first couple minutes. I see no reason why they wouldn't work, as I was more concerned with bd-re 50gb working.

I noticed that, as was the case with the previous panasonic models, movies ripped with older versions of anydvd hd, and had the region coding removed, would not play.
(There is a way to fix this. Simply take the app.discroot.crt and id.bdmv files from the backups in the CERTIFICATE\\BACKUPS folder and replaced them with the main ones. Also replace the modified jar file(s) with the backup(s) from BDMV\\BACKUP\\JAR. The disc should now play fine, but this will reintroduce region coding. Worked for me anyways).

I'm hoping I get the same results with my other 50gb bd-re's which I have written to many times.

Thank you, XxYuroxX. I actually came here to post that I burned a bd-50 and an HD-DVD converted bd-25 with version 2.4.3.0 of IMGburn, and both played flawlessly.

The ones I couldn't get to work were burned with version 2.4.1.0. All bd-25s that were just straight 1:1 Blu-ray copies with version 2.4.1.0 still play.

I guess now I have to ask myself if I want to redo all of them (1 BD-R DL and about 15 HD-DVD to BD-25 transfers).
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post #383 of 8256 Old 04-06-2009, 09:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ejolson View Post

The Panasonic website www2.panasonic.com for DMP-BD60/70 lists

DVD-R/-RW/-R(DL) 1 Playback DVD Video, DVD-VR, AVCHD, DivX® (DVD-R/-R DL only)
+R/+R(DL)/+RW Playback DVD-VR, AVCHD
CD, CD-R/-RW 2 Playback CD-DA, DivX® (CD-R/-RW only), MP3 3 (CD-R/-RW only), JPEG (HD) (CD-R/-RW only)
USB MP3, JPEG (HD), DivX®

Guys, FYI, I reported the inaccurate listing for Divx on the BD60 product page to Panasonic and they have removed it from the web description:

http://www2.panasonic.com/consumer-e...702#tabsection

Now I just need to contact Amazon to do the same... ah the life of an editor...

-CB

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post #384 of 8256 Old 04-06-2009, 10:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Doug G View Post

Had the PJ on last night and was able to confirm the 4:3 handling works properly there, so this function doesn't work over component, only HDMI.

There's no need to disable the HDMI setting in my case since the PJ is in standby except when in use and the HDMI port isn't active in this state. I've already confirmed that I can get 480p/1080i over component. I was actually quite surprised to see that BDs would output 1080i over component. Seems a little silly when regular DVDs are strapped to 480p mode.

I had hoped to be able to leave the component output set to 1080i and just let it fall back to 480p, but with improper 4:3 handling by the player over the components and lack of aspect ratio control in my set at 480p (many early HD sets such as mine incorrectly "lock" into full mode for anything other than 480i) means I'll have to just leave it in 480i mode. This isn't that big a deal, only DVDs are generally viewed on the RPTV 98% of the time, any BDs or HD I tend to use the PJ.

OK, but that still seems pretty major that 4:3 DVDs would always be stretched over component video with no way to fix it. I still suspect something unique about your TV. I used to own a Loewe 38" CRT TV which required a 16:9 FULL setting in order to correctly display widescreen content. It also only had component inputs (no DVI or HDMI). What model Elite are you using?

It's possible that the correct setting for your FPJ and your RPTV are different. I'll see what happens with my BD80 and a 4:3 DVD if I connect it via component. If anyone else has the BD60 or BD80 connected via component video, it would be nice to hear from you guys as well how it handles 4:3 DVD material.

-CB

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post #385 of 8256 Old 04-06-2009, 10:19 AM
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I believe for SD DVD, component output is maxed out at 480p. It seems that his TV is the culprit which will lock the aspect ratio even for 480p.

FYI, 480p full or 4:3 over component is the exact same signal with the exception of ID-1 flag embedded in the signal. They have the exact same horizontal scan frequency and vertical scan frequency. That is in the case of 480i and 480p, the aspect ratio control is purely done by TV with the help of ID-1 flag (for automatic aspect ratio switching). But not all the TVs recognize ID-1 flags.

On the other hand, HD signals only have one aspect ratio: 16x9 full. The player needs to pillar-box the video in order to display 4x3 correctly.

TVs should be able to freely switch aspect ratio in 480p mode(manully or automatically). Locking aspect ratio in 480p is a design flaw of (very early) TVs. New TVs now even allow you to adjust aspect ratio in HD resolution.
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post #386 of 8256 Old 04-06-2009, 11:17 AM
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While looking for info on the ID-1 flag I found a thread where there were comments that possibly only newer HDTV sets recognized this flag, and that even some of those may still ignore it for 480p, only using it to set aspect for 480i. My Pioneer Elite PRO-510HD is of the 2000 vintage, so its pretty old (but still looks great!) I'll have to check again with the component resolution set to 480i and see if that changes things.
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post #387 of 8256 Old 04-06-2009, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Foxbat121 View Post

I believe for SD DVD, component output is maxed out at 480p. It seems that his TV is the culprit which will lock the aspect ratio even for 480p.

The Panny players can do 1080i for DVD over component but only on non-copyright protected material, e.g., home recorded DVD-Rs or DVD-RAMs. You're absolutely right about copy-protected DVDs being capped at 480p though, which is the vast majority of store-bought titles.

Quote:


FYI, 480p full or 4:3 over component is the exact same signal with the exception of ID-1 flag embedded in the signal. They have the exact same horizontal scan frequency and vertical scan frequency. That is in the case of 480i and 480p, the aspect ratio control is purely done by TV with the help of ID-1 flag (for automatic aspect ratio switching). But not all the TVs recognize ID-1 flags.

I don't doubt this but then wouldn't the OP have had the same problem on other DVD players? Seems like this was new behavior to the BD60. Maybe his previous player was 480i output only (or was set to interlaced output), in which case the aspect ratio control on the TV probably still worked. This is the way it worked on the Loewe at least. Aspect ratio control on the TV for 480i but not for 1080i or 480p.

And that is actually a viable workaround for the BD60 on the Pioneer RPTV - set the component video output to 480i just for 4:3 discs. Only bummer is having to get into the set-up menu for every affected title. From what Doug said in his last post, it looks like he's already aware of how to work around the problem and from what you're saying, it sounds like it's the TV at fault and not the player.

Quote:


On the other hand, HD signals only have one aspect ratio: 16x9 full. The player needs to pillar-box the video in order to display 4x3 correctly.

TVs should be able to freely switch aspect ratio in 480p mode(manully or automatically). Locking aspect ratio in 480p is a design flaw of (very early) TVs. New TVs now even allow you to adjust aspect ratio in HD resolution.

Actually we have a VIZIO HD plasma from the 2008/2009 model line that doesn't allow aspect ratio control of anything above 480i coming in via HDMI. It also doesn't allow aspect ratio control of most channels tuned in via its on-board ATSC tuner. Complete throw back. This means you can't get proper geometry on any channel that broadcasts digitally in 4:3 aspect ratio. It stretches with no ability to un-stretch. This would have factored negatively into the review had VIZIO not pulled the plug on plasma before we completed reviewing the set. Now there's no point even publishing it since you can't buy the TV anywhere.

Anyway... thanks for the assist.

-CB

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post #388 of 8256 Old 04-06-2009, 02:44 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Not the first time that guy got the facts wrong. One of the reasons I don't even bother to reply to his posts.
-CB

I read your comprehensive review which covered most everything I had posted here. Thank you for the complement!

While all Blu-ray players support DVD playback, only 1.5 (citation needed) support DVD playback at 24p. Just as you want hands-free Blu-tooth integrated into your car's stereo, you should also want to eliminate the judder/jerkiness generated by 60Hz playback. Native 24p playback rules!

The lack of 24p is exactly the reason why I dropped the Samsung from consideration. It’s a surprise that Sumsung didn’t catch up with Panasonic this year with DVD 24p output. Instead they source from third party vendors, where Panasonic designs and manufactures their own SOTA chip. Obviously Panasonic is more responsive to marketplace demands. I praise true technical leadership, not cost cutting or marketing fluff.

Over in the Blu-ray savings thread it was mentioned one-call had a good deal on the BD-60
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post #389 of 8256 Old 04-06-2009, 07:11 PM
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I read your comprehensive review which covered most everything I had posted here. Thank you for the complement!

OK, I admit. That was kinda funny. But learn how to spell "compliment."

-CB

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post #390 of 8256 Old 04-06-2009, 07:45 PM
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I have an SDI dvd player and VP50 for dvd anyways, at least in one system. I bought the S550 since it's selling for a decent price. I'll probably try the BD80 too when it comes out, since I'll probably need another Blu-Ray player by then anyways.
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