Official *Fast Loading* JVC XV-BP1 owner's thread - Page 19 - AVS Forum
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post #541 of 2547 Old 06-29-2009, 03:37 AM
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Originally Posted by levy07 View Post

Thanks Winston,

That JVC sounds like a winner. I am using a crt projector and about 7ft wide screen so the LG has proved really well on the big screen. I did have an Oppo BDP-83 to try out on my set up and it was to me a better upscaler than the LG. If the JVC is more similar to the Oppo or a poor mans version than I think I will have to buy this one. It really was nice to have the faster load times too with the Oppo.

Dear Levy,

i would be very interested to get your take of SD upconversion between the BDP-83 and the JVC. Winston's feedback seems quite positive on the whole.

I have been following the development of the Oppo over the past few months and it was my first choice, but the economy is shuffling my priorities a bit.

I have an AX-200 projecting on a 106" screen. Going through this thread, your CRT setup seems the closest to mine. SD upconversion is now my key decision criterion assuming BD playback is basically the same from one player to the next.

Thanks.
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post #542 of 2547 Old 06-29-2009, 04:54 AM
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Originally Posted by LMeister View Post

Dear Levy,

i would be very interested to get your take of SD upconversion between the BDP-83 and the JVC. Winston's feedback seems quite positive on the whole.

I have been following the development of the Oppo over the past few months and it was my first choice, but the economy is shuffling my priorities a bit.

I have an AX-200 projecting on a 106" screen. Going through this thread, your CRT setup seems the closest to mine. SD upconversion is now my key decision criterion assuming BD playback is basically the same from one player to the next.

Thanks.

Objectifying SD upscaling and deinterlacing is very difficult, but I can offer that the JVC offers nearly identical performance to the Oppo on S&M's synthetic tests using obscure and common film cadences in addition to video jaggie tests. This blew me away - to the pt where i have tested the second and third JVC I got as well. Real-world content is good - I would say 90% of the oppo - there are times when it is not as clean an image and that 10% might stand out on a screen of your size - it's largely hidden on my 50" plasma. The biggest concern I have for you with the JVC is the lack of tweaking to change NR settings and the like. Otherwise, this player is an incredible deal - the poor man's oppo.
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post #543 of 2547 Old 06-29-2009, 09:16 AM
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Winston,

Thanks very much for your feedback. I agree with you that subjective comparisons are of dubious benefit.

Have you found the de-interlacing of the JVC to be on par with the BDP-83? I have several discs that my current DVD player (XBOX 360) can not handle. The artifacts are horrible, nort surprising since the 360 is a known sub par player. Probably bad mastering from the get go. But I suspect that the BDP-83 would handle them fine.

Thanks.
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post #544 of 2547 Old 06-29-2009, 11:30 AM
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Originally Posted by LMeister View Post

Winston,

Thanks very much for your feedback. I agree with you that subjective comparisons are of dubious benefit.

Have you found the de-interlacing of the JVC to be on par with the BDP-83? I have several discs that my current DVD player (XBOX 360) can not handle. The artifacts are horrible, nort surprising since the 360 is a known sub par player. Probably bad mastering from the get go. But I suspect that the BDP-83 would handle them fine.

Thanks.

I have never seen a jaggie or moire on the jvc. artifacts are present on bad transfers, but they also exist on the oppo. I did see jaggies on my panny 55 frequently - its deinterlacing was questionable at times. Once again, this is on a 50" display.
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post #545 of 2547 Old 06-29-2009, 06:39 PM
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Hi all,

Got my JVC this afternoon (placed an order at Buy.com)...opened it up and connected it directly to my Sony 42w3100 - I also own a refurbished Samsung BDP 1500 - to be honest, I was really expecting to be blown away by the JVC - first BD I loaded - Pan's Labyrinth (its my fav movie) - the disc kept loading and loading...and gave me a disc error (my Samsung has played every disc I have without any issues)....Does anyone else have a problem with Pan's Labyrinth....next put in Black Hawk Down - played it without any issues (but I don't know...I just got the feeling the picture quality felt better with the Samsung - again this is my opinion with my untrained eyes)...next put in No Country for Old men...it froze after the Paramount symbol...I powered it off and powered it back on and it played it ....I then put 300 - SD DVD - again just my gut feeling (I am not a videophile or technical guy by any standard - its just my opinion)...I did not find the upscaling very good...my Sony NS700 - in my opinion, I felt did a better job...
Is there I am doing anything wrong...do I need to go in the setup and adjust anything? I have gone in the setup and adjusted the resolution to 1080 P and 24 Hz...

What really bugs me is the JVC not playing Pan's Labyrinth...

Also if I return this player - I just saw on Buy.com's website that will have to pay 15% restocking fees plus shipping....I was holding put on buying the Oppo but since I read so many good reviews - I decided to go for this....do I have a faulty unit?

Max
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post #546 of 2547 Old 06-29-2009, 08:53 PM
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Originally Posted by maximus1971 View Post

Hi all,

Got my JVC this afternoon (placed an order at Buy.com)...opened it up and connected it directly to my Sony 42w3100 - I also own a refurbished Samsung BDP 1500 - to be honest, I was really expecting to be blown away by the JVC - first BD I loaded - Pan's Labyrinth (its my fav movie) - the disc kept loading and loading...and gave me a disc error (my Samsung has played every disc I have without any issues)....Does anyone else have a problem with Pan's Labyrinth....next put in Black Hawk Down - played it without any issues (but I don't know...I just got the feeling the picture quality felt better with the Samsung - again this is my opinion with my untrained eyes)...next put in No Country for Old men...it froze after the Paramount symbol...I powered it off and powered it back on and it played it ....I then put 300 - SD DVD - again just my gut feeling (I am not a videophile or technical guy by any standard - its just my opinion)...I did not find the upscaling very good...my Sony NS700 - in my opinion, I felt did a better job...
Is there I am doing anything wrong...do I need to go in the setup and adjust anything? I have gone in the setup and adjusted the resolution to 1080 P and 24 Hz...

What really bugs me is the JVC not playing Pan's Labyrinth...

Also if I return this player - I just saw on Buy.com's website that will have to pay 15% restocking fees plus shipping....I was holding put on buying the Oppo but since I read so many good reviews - I decided to go for this....do I have a faulty unit?

Max

Max,

Sorry to hear about what sounds like some issues with your player. I do not have Pan's Labrynth, but do have No Country for Old Men. I just tested it on two of my JVCs and no issue whatsoever following the cityscape of the Miramax logo - flows into Paramount Vintage and then into Tommy Lee Jone's gravely monologue. I worry you might have either a defective player or one the FedEx man was not too careful with.

As for the picture quality, I presume you set it up to match your display - 1080p and YCbCr (i think your display can handle that colorspace). I would try it with RGB and see if the image quality improves. From recollection, the device does default to 1080i. I would also put the device to output 60hz. Although I think your display can accept 24hz signals, it is still a 60hz set and the difference will be minimal with 3:2 pull down.

I can't speak to your display and what kind of image the device is outputting, but it SHOULD look better than a Samsung 1500 for sd dvds. I am of the school of the thought that 1080p 24 fps from a BD looks nearly identical on most players. I recommend you contact Buy.com and explain the device has had playback issues on two discs. I would also mention that you do not want to contact your credit card company, but you have received a defective device. I can confirm that both of my JVC players handle the opening sequence of NCFOM without issue. Irepeated it twice on both and no issue.

and ps on the oppo - and do not take this as a display condescending comment, but unless your sitting about four feet from your display, i think you would struggle to see PQ differences between it, the Pio 320 or the JVC.
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post #547 of 2547 Old 06-29-2009, 08:57 PM
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Originally Posted by maximus1971 View Post

Hi all,

Got my JVC this afternoon (placed an order at Buy.com)...opened it up and connected it directly to my Sony 42w3100 - I also own a refurbished Samsung BDP 1500 - to be honest, I was really expecting to be blown away by the JVC - first BD I loaded - Pan's Labyrinth (its my fav movie) - the disc kept loading and loading...and gave me a disc error (my Samsung has played every disc I have without any issues)....Does anyone else have a problem with Pan's Labyrinth....next put in Black Hawk Down - played it without any issues (but I don't know...I just got the feeling the picture quality felt better with the Samsung - again this is my opinion with my untrained eyes)...next put in No Country for Old men...it froze after the Paramount symbol...I powered it off and powered it back on and it played it ....I then put 300 - SD DVD - again just my gut feeling (I am not a videophile or technical guy by any standard - its just my opinion)...I did not find the upscaling very good...my Sony NS700 - in my opinion, I felt did a better job...
Is there I am doing anything wrong...do I need to go in the setup and adjust anything? I have gone in the setup and adjusted the resolution to 1080 P and 24 Hz...

What really bugs me is the JVC not playing Pan's Labyrinth...

Also if I return this player - I just saw on Buy.com's website that will have to pay 15% restocking fees plus shipping....I was holding put on buying the Oppo but since I read so many good reviews - I decided to go for this....do I have a faulty unit?

Max

oh and black hawk down might not be the best disc for comparing players - it;s a decent transfer but has a lot of grain, faded film coloring and is not quite reference quality. dark knight, pirates of c and casino royale are great films to do some comparing to...lots of shadows and colors.
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post #548 of 2547 Old 06-29-2009, 09:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maximus1971 View Post

Hi all,

Got my JVC this afternoon (placed an order at Buy.com)...opened it up and connected it directly to my Sony 42w3100 - I also own a refurbished Samsung BDP 1500 - to be honest, I was really expecting to be blown away by the JVC - first BD I loaded - Pan's Labyrinth (its my fav movie) - the disc kept loading and loading...and gave me a disc error (my Samsung has played every disc I have without any issues)....Does anyone else have a problem with Pan's Labyrinth....next put in Black Hawk Down - played it without any issues (but I don't know...I just got the feeling the picture quality felt better with the Samsung - again this is my opinion with my untrained eyes)...next put in No Country for Old men...it froze after the Paramount symbol...I powered it off and powered it back on and it played it ....I then put 300 - SD DVD - again just my gut feeling (I am not a videophile or technical guy by any standard - its just my opinion)...I did not find the upscaling very good...my Sony NS700 - in my opinion, I felt did a better job...
Is there I am doing anything wrong...do I need to go in the setup and adjust anything? I have gone in the setup and adjusted the resolution to 1080 P and 24 Hz...

What really bugs me is the JVC not playing Pan's Labyrinth...

Also if I return this player - I just saw on Buy.com's website that will have to pay 15% restocking fees plus shipping....I was holding put on buying the Oppo but since I read so many good reviews - I decided to go for this....do I have a faulty unit?

Max

max,

i've got a 40" sony WL135 in our bedroom (can't find a plasma small enough to fit in our armoire). it's 120 hz and 10 bit panel, but similar to yours. I did a quick side by side of a sd dvd (breaking bad season 1) on my jvc and on my samsung 2550 with the reon chip. The two are almost identical on the 40" screen. The reon has some noise reduction features that can clean up bad transfers at the cost of other parts of the image.
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post #549 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 12:00 AM
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The JVC XV-BP1 seems very attractive at its price level. Does it have the same "pause/resume" problems due to Java Code that most other BD-Live players have?

- Henry
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post #550 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 04:58 AM
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Originally Posted by HenryPercy View Post

The JVC XV-BP1 seems very attractive at its price level. Does it have the same "pause/resume" problems due to Java Code that most other BD-Live players have?

- Henry

Yes, it cannot resume on Java discs. This is true for ALL blu ray players to the best of my knowledge. My Oppo, Pioneer, and Samsung players all CANNOT resume on Java discs - the nature of the Java coding makes you load from the beginning. Resume function on Java discs is not here yet and may NEVER be here. I would defer to someone with a software background to explain if it's possible.
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post #551 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 07:23 AM
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winston9332,

Wow, thank you so much for all the work you've put into testing this player out! I am on the lookout for my 1st Blu-Ray player, and this one sounds like just the ticket. We're on a limited budget right now, so as soon as I can scrounge up the cash, this will be my newest addition to my modest theater room. I don't have any Blu-Rays yet, and have a decent DVD collection, so it'll be nice to get some good upconversion (currently playing DVDs on a Xbox 360). I had been leaning towards the Panny 60, but it sounds like this one will upconvert better, and load faster, both big pluses. My Yamaha 663 should pair nicely with it, since it has HDMI ins/out. I am looking forward to the day I can bring one home, thanks again for all your input.
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post #552 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 07:41 AM
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Originally Posted by ahwood23 View Post

winston9332,

Wow, thank you so much for all the work you've put into testing this player out! I am on the lookout for my 1st Blu-Ray player, and this one sounds like just the ticket. We're on a limited budget right now, so as soon as I can scrounge up the cash, this will be my newest addition to my modest theater room. I don't have any Blu-Rays yet, and have a decent DVD collection, so it'll be nice to get some good upconversion (currently playing DVDs on a Xbox 360). I had been leaning towards the Panny 60, but it sounds like this one will upconvert better, and load faster, both big pluses. My Yamaha 663 should pair nicely with it, since it has HDMI ins/out. I am looking forward to the day I can bring one home, thanks again for all your input.

To keep objective and subjective clearly delineated, I can say that the JVC is objectively better at deinterlacing synthetic tests of film and video than the Panasonic 55, which allegedly offers identical video performance to the 60/80. The Panasonic does have tweaking menus - the JVC has one image outside of changing colorspace. The JVC is accurate in colors and does not crush blacks (pioneer 51/320 appear to slightly) according to my tests using the DVE callibration disc. The Panasonic 55 shows jaggies in real world content of sd dvds, confirming the less than ideal deinterlacing. Color is realistic on both, but I like the ability to zoom on the JVC

The JVC is noticeably faster than the Panasonic 60, but does not allow streaming via vieracast (i personally think Netflix and Pandora streaming have value, unsure of vieracast).

I think the JVC is a great budget option - I personally would recommend it over the Panasonic 60, but that's just one guy's opinion.
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post #553 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 09:56 AM
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Thanks a ton...I was hoping you would answer Winston (and you did!!)......I really was pretty excited when I got the JVC after reading good reviews on it....anyways...I am gonna try and call buy.com today and see what they say...

Max
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post #554 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by ***********3 View Post

...The only processor of any kind is a rather large IC labeled ARM with a M on it. I'm assuming it's an ARM processor of the Matsushita brand, but I could be completely off base...

It looks like it's a Mediatek all-in-one blue ray chip, could you or somebody else post a picture of this module? As far as I know Mediatek is producing only one blu ray processor that's currently used on LG BD370 and HR400, plus I saw the pictures winston9332 posted on page 16 and the internal JVC layout looks identical to the BD370 one in every detail. I strongly believe these two players are almost the same machine (don't know about firmware differences, if any). Has some of you had the opportunity to compare side by side the LG and JVC players' performance?
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post #555 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 10:11 AM
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Originally Posted by maximus1971 View Post

Thanks a ton...I was hoping you would answer Winston (and you did!!)......I really was pretty excited when I got the JVC after reading good reviews on it....anyways...I am gonna try and call buy.com today and see what they say...

Max

I would push Buy.com that you took delivery of a defective item and would like an exchange for the same model. they should offer to pay for shipping to return it to them (it's not like you want to simply return it). I would politely threaten to get the credit card company involved to fight the transaction if they're not helpful.
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post #556 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 10:26 AM
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To bad I jumped the gun and bought a Panasonic DMP-BD60 a few weeks ago when you and others were recommending it, Winston, as the best bet for somebody with an HDMI receiver. I have gone through the manual for the JVC and seen some features that are not present on the Panasonic, subtitle and secondary audio buttons on the remote, for example. Secondary audio is a pain to turn on and off on the Panny, and you want it off to hear lossless audio. Also the JVC can set mutiple markers on non BD-Java discs. One thing which I think is better on the BD60 is determining disc time remaining. With two taps of the status button on the remote, I can see a bar chart showing total time and time elapsed. As far as I can see from the manual, you only get time elapsed with the JVC. The manual says the JVC handles DTS-HD audio. Is that the same thing as DTS-HDMA?
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post #557 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 11:17 AM
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Winston, you have been great about providing information. I do have a quick question though. Right now amazon has the panasonic 60 for 199 and seems like a great deal. The JVC is about 50 bucks more. I see in all the testing that you did, you used the pana 55. Is the 60 improved in anyway over the 55, or do they have the same video processing?
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post #558 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marcellone View Post

It looks like it's a Mediatek all-in-one blue ray chip, could you or somebody else post a picture of this module? As far as I know Mediatek is producing only one blu ray processor that's currently used on LG BD370 and HR400, plus I saw the pictures winston9332 posted on page 16 and the internal JVC layout looks identical to the BD370 one in every detail. I strongly believe these two players are almost the same machine (don't know about firmware differences, if any). Has some of you had the opportunity to compare side by side the LG and JVC players' performance?

There is no doubt that the JVC has many common hardware and software with the LG. The GUI is identical.

That said, there are some hardware differences between the LG 370 and the JVC - look at the Video DACs:

JVC XV-BP1:148Mhz / 12-bit
LG BD370: 108Mhz / 10-bit

That said, the rear output layout and remotes are identical. Then again, this player also shares a lot of bones with the $1,500 NAD player.
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post #559 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by marcellone View Post

It looks like it's a Mediatek all-in-one blue ray chip, could you or somebody else post a picture of this module? As far as I know Mediatek is producing only one blu ray processor that's currently used on LG BD370 and HR400, plus I saw the pictures winston9332 posted on page 16 and the internal JVC layout looks identical to the BD370 one in every detail. I strongly believe these two players are almost the same machine (don't know about firmware differences, if any). Has some of you had the opportunity to compare side by side the LG and JVC players' performance?

I would love to see some load times compared...might shed some light on how the jvc compares to the lg390 and lg370.
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post #560 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 11:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Ben Franklin View Post

To bad I jumped the gun and bought a Panasonic DMP-BD60 a few weeks ago when you and others were recommending it, Winston, as the best bet for somebody with an HDMI receiver. I have gone through the manual for the JVC and seen some features that are not present on the Panasonic, subtitle and secondary audio buttons on the remote, for example. Secondary audio is a pain to turn on and off on the Panny, and you want it off to hear lossless audio. Also the JVC can set mutiple markers on non BD-Java discs. One thing which I think is better on the BD60 is determining disc time remaining. With two taps of the status button on the remote, I can see a bar chart showing total time and time elapsed. As far as I can see from the manual, you only get time elapsed with the JVC. The manual says the JVC handles DTS-HD audio. Is that the same thing as DTS-HDMA?

It will decode DTS HD MA and bitstream it as well. I need to check on menu display again and will confirm.
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post #561 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 11:30 AM
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Originally Posted by rsway View Post

Winston, you have been great about providing information. I do have a quick question though. Right now amazon has the panasonic 60 for 199 and seems like a great deal. The JVC is about 50 bucks more. I see in all the testing that you did, you used the pana 55. Is the 60 improved in anyway over the 55, or do they have the same video processing?

JVC is available for $225. Check bountii.

My understanding is that the Panny 35/55/60/80 offer identical performance for SD and BD. I have only owned the 35 and 55 and have run the 55 through the test discs.
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post #562 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 11:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rsway View Post

Winston, you have been great about providing information. I do have a quick question though. Right now amazon has the panasonic 60 for 199 and seems like a great deal. The JVC is about 50 bucks more. I see in all the testing that you did, you used the pana 55. Is the 60 improved in anyway over the 55, or do they have the same video processing?

Check out the recent review of the BD60 at Hometheatermag.com, it's great. As are most of the pro. reviews I read. It was given their "top pick" award. They also reviewed the Samsung 3600 and Sony 360, and said the BD60 was clearly better. I haven't bought it yet because of the reported freezeups.
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post #563 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by winston9332 View Post

...That said, there are some hardware differences between the LG 370 and the JVC - look at the Video DACs:

JVC XV-BP1:148Mhz / 12-bit
LG BD370: 108Mhz / 10-bit

....

I was not able to identify the DAC modules on the pictures but LG specs show 148Mhz / 12-bit for the BD370 as well.
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post #564 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by rsway View Post

Winston, you have been great about providing information. I do have a quick question though. Right now amazon has the panasonic 60 for 199 and seems like a great deal. The JVC is about 50 bucks more. I see in all the testing that you did, you used the pana 55. Is the 60 improved in anyway over the 55, or do they have the same video processing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by winston9332 View Post

JVC is available for $225. Check bountii.

My understanding is that the Panny 35/55/60/80 offer identical performance for SD and BD. I have only owned the 35 and 55 and have run the 55 through the test discs.

Yeah, I'm seeing the JVC for $226 after shipping ($21 - ugh!) at Electronic Express. Not super familiar with them. But Buy.com has it for only $230, and you can always find those $10 off $200 (or use EBillme, etc.) for an even better deal from Buy.com (no tax or shipping here to TX). Just hoping I get at least a little cash for my upcoming birthday so I can snag one of these! winston's got me drooling for one...
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post #565 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by marcellone View Post

I was not able to identify the DAC modules on the pictures but LG specs show 148Mhz / 12-bit for the BD370 as well.

Cnet says the LG's 10 bit. Guess you can't always trust "professional" reviews!
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post #566 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 02:04 PM
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1. I am definitely curious if an LG 370 owners can run a few load tests on the discs I have tested - Pirates 1, Dark Knight, and Casino Royale. Cnet did not brag on the LG 370's speed, which leads me to believe that load times might not be identical (they did praise the LG 390 for its speed, which was very similar to the JVC).

2. I think it is safe to say that this player shares a lot of bones with the LG players - probably the body of the 370. It also appears to share the body of the NAD player. IR codes are similar, but the LG IR codes do NOT control the JVC.

3. My synthetic testing showed this player performs better than the LG 390 at deinterlacing both film and video sources. Real world quality is way too subjective a test to really make much commentary worth putting stock in. That said, JoeRod, BakerWi and I all agreed this player is a real dark horse and we all own or have owned a nice medley of medium to high end components. There is no other player that performs as well as the JVC than the Oppo on synthetic deinterlacing tests. I tested color accuracy with the DVE callibration disc and the player is accurate in colors and does not clip whites and blacks.

4. PQ of both BD and SD are better on other players - the Pioneer 320/51 for example. That said, I think most folks will find this player delivers incredible speed, function and performance for a very economical price. To me, it's the perfect player for first time BD adopters or folks who want a good picture, quick load times, and reliable playback and need to keep the pennies in the piggie jar. It is not for true videophiles - the lack of tweaking menus and the undimmable blue lights alone disqualify this player from really serious usage.

5. I believe it's a better value than the Panasonic DMP BD60K, but only in that it offers faster operation, freeze-less operation, and excellent deinterlacing. The panasonic has some distinct advantages over the JVC and was my previous top pick for budget players. I think most folks would have to look for differences between with two in image quality, save the jaggies I experienced with my 55 and 35.
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post #567 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 06:32 PM
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Cnet says the LG's 10 bit. Guess you can't always trust "professional" reviews!

Cnet is far from professional.
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post #568 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 07:18 PM
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Cnet is far from professional.

yet there are scores on this thread that will make decisions solely based upon their rankings.
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post #569 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 07:32 PM
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Watching the movie 12 rounds on blu ray (great transfer, medium movie)...if you try to select a scene in the movie, the menu for scene selection remains on the screnn once the player starts. I am encountering numerous issues with this disc. Going to try another JVC to see if this is repeatable.
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post #570 of 2547 Old 06-30-2009, 07:44 PM
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Originally Posted by winston9332 View Post

Watching the movie 12 rounds on blu ray (great transfer, medium movie)...if you try to select a scene in the movie, the menu for scene selection remains on the screnn once the player starts. I am encountering numerous issues with this disc. Going to try another JVC to see if this is repeatable.

Think we got our first confirmed bug - both of my JVC's freeze on the unrated version of 12 Rounds at 7 seconds following the FBI warning screen. Both freeze exactly in the same fashion.

Can anyone else confirm this bug? I will report to JVC tomorrow am.
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