Oppo BDP-83 or 83SE versus other blu ray players thread - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 02:09 PM - Thread Starter
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In the interest of creating a single thread for all of the "how does the oppo compare to the..." questions, I thought we could create a single thread to help filter out the buzz and interest regarding the performance of the Oppo blu ray player compared to others.

I am a participant in the 2nd eap and have had an oppo for nearly two weeks. I also own the following: Panasonic dmp bd55K, Samsung bd p2550, pioneer BDP 51FD, and an LG BH200.
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post #2 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 02:18 PM
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Winston9332: thank you for starting this thread. Personally I would like to think that it will help others (such as myself who are ''sitting on the fence'') between the Oppo and other players. I would ask the same queston of you as I have for other observers: what is your screen size and how far back do you sit?
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post #3 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 04:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by winston9332 View Post

In the interest of creating a single thread for all of the "how does the oppo compare to the..." questions, I thought we could create a single thread to help filter out the buzz and interest regarding the performance of the Oppo blu ray player compared to others.

I am a participant in the 2nd eap and have had an oppo for nearly two weeks. I also own the following: Panasonic dmp bd55K, Samsung bd p2550, pioneer BDP 51FD, and an LG BH200.



Winston,

So, how does the BD55 compare with the BDP-83 in your opinion?


...Glenn
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post #4 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 04:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abba1 View Post

Winston9332: thank you for starting this thread. Personally I would like to think that it will help others (such as myself who are ''sitting on the fence'') between the Oppo and other players. I would ask the same queston of you as I have for other observers: what is your screen size and how far back do you sit?

I have a 52" 120hz Sony LCD. I am roughly ten feet from the screen with two couches in a 90 degree angle (one facing, one to the side).

Here are my observations on the Oppo thus far:

1. Load times are the fastest I have encountered in a standalone blu ray player. They are as fast or nearly as fast as the PS3 I sold recently. Load times are incredibly fast and the menus are quite responsive. Someone posted a time chart on the oppo forum that measures load times compared to the PS3.

2. SD DVD upscaling is excellent. In my humble opinion, it exceeds the quality of the reon chip in my samsung and Onkyo hd dvd player and my pioneer 51. Prior to the oppo, I was torn between the reon and the pioneer for sd dvd playback. The Samsung was more responsive and loaded much more quickly. The Pioneer was slow, but offered excellent color accuracy and smoother moition. The reon was sharp, but not as smooth if that makes any sense. For the sake of full comparison, I found the 55 a solid upscaler, but often introduced annoying jaggies intermittently.

3. Blu Ray playback is great - then again at 1080p 24fps it's also great on my panasonic and pioneer. I had previously preferred those two to my samsung for bd playback.

4. In respects of menus, the oppo is very well laid out. The panasonic is as well. The Pioneer takes some getting used to, but has some great features.
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post #5 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 04:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenn Baumann View Post

Winston,

So, how does the BD55 compare with the BDP-83 in your opinion?


...Glenn

BD playback at 1080p 24 fps is very similar. the oppo is faster to load and offers a cool tweaking menu that allows you to split screen. The oppo can also allow setting changes on the fly. the panasonic allows you to do some via the display menu i believe - similar to pioneers picture adjustment button.

SD DVD playback is better on the oppo. not that the panny is bad, it's just the oppo really excels in this area. both can force 24fps on sd dvd, which is a feature i really enjoyed on the panasonic.

The panny 80 is now roughly $325 and will likely dip below $300 over the next few months. When the oppo becomes available, it will be at least $525 shipped. I think you need to consider the tradeoff of sd upconversion, playback of dvd-a and sacd, and load times to the price delta.
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post #6 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 04:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by winston9332 View Post

I found the 55 a solid upscaler, but often introduced annoying jaggies intermittently.

That is a de-interlacing error. That's where the Oppo blows them all away, the de-interlacing. Run the de-interlacing tests from DVE or the S&M disc and you'll see how they all stack up.
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post #7 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 04:41 PM
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Winston: You mentioned ''color accuracy.'' In your opinion, how does the Oppo & Pioneer score in this category? Thanx in advance
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post #8 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 05:51 PM
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Does the Oppo have a noticeable layer change on SD DVD?
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post #9 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 06:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abba1 View Post

Winston: You mentioned ''color accuracy.'' In your opinion, how does the Oppo & Pioneer score in this category? Thanx in advance

similar, slight nod to oppo.
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post #10 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 06:30 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillP View Post

Does the Oppo have a noticeable layer change on SD DVD?

bill, not that i have encountered.
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post #11 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 06:48 PM
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Can you comment on the 83's analog vs 55k's?

I have oppo 983 and panny 55k. I'm thinking of selling the combo for 83.

My thinking is the 83 vs 55k has:

more user friendly
faster load times
better bass man in analog
better dac's and analog output stage in general
sd dvd playback would be a wash because of 983

Would this be worth it IYO?

ps - I really prefer higher bitrate DD/DTS via spdif coax with 55k to arcam 350for BR audio than HD audio via 55k's analog. I'm hoping the 83 could significantly improve HD audio expierence. Otherwise, I think I could live with 55k if BR video is pretty similar.
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post #12 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 07:07 PM
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Other functionality that is currently being left out of this thread is the fact that it can will fully play (upon final release) DVD-A, SACD and HDCD and none of the other players featured for a comparison will play those. Meaningless to some, while also being a make it or break it deal to others. The Oppo will be the first true Universal Blu-Ray player that will play everything under the sun.

Also MKV files over USB which is a massive selling point for me
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post #13 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 07:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillP View Post

Does the Oppo have a noticeable layer change on SD DVD?

See: How fast are the layer changes?

-Bill
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post #14 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 07:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rebellion View Post

Other functionality that is currently being left out of this thread is the fact that it can will fully play (upon final release) DVD-A, SACD and HDCD and none of the other players featured for a comparison will play those. Meaningless to some, while also being a make it or break it deal to others. The Oppo will be the first true Universal Blu-Ray player that will play everything under the sun.

Also MKV files over USB which is a massive selling point for me

Great point...realize 75% of us if not more are only worried about BD and SD DVD and neglected to mention.
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post #15 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 08:05 PM
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Somebody contacted me and offered to send me a BDP-83 for review.
They read here at AVS and knew that I had a Pioneer BDP-51FD.
Please do not ask for any details as ive promised this person 100% confidentiality and I will say no more.

My HT consists of:
Pioneer Elite PRO-151FD professionally calibrated plasma HDTV
Pioneer BDP-51FD blu-ray player
Comcast HD cable /1080i is the resolution
Onkyo 805 receiver
AV123 ELT525 5.1 system in rosewood veneer & a MFW-15 subwoofer.

My eye to screen distance is 9' (measured with a tape measure)


Being that the 51 is only my second player I am somewhat of a BD newb
My first BD player was a Panasonic BD-30.
However I am far from being an HT newb as my first HT went together in
the mid 90s.

Here is a quick BD-30 vs BDP-51FD , they are both slow. For some discs the BD-30 is slower and on a some the 51FD is slower. But overall I would say the BD-30 is a tad slower. Being that every BD player ive ever owned up until now (yes just 2) was slow I have learned to live with it and its really not a big deal.
For 1080/24p BD discs both are great performers, however on SD upconversion the 51FD blows the BD-30 away, I am talking night and day difference, that is IMO of course.
There is one area of performance on the 51FD that I have grown to love , it is a fantastic CD player! And I am not using the analog outs on it, I bitstream via HDMI for everything.

My Onkyo 805 has excellent Burr-Brown 192/24-bit DACs.


I was sent a BDP-83 for review free of charge, and a few days ago it
arrived. I am not running the BDP-83 and 51FD at the same time, rather I am just noting which discs and scenes I run on the 83 and how they perform then I will run them again on the 51FD after ive run all that I want to run on the 83. No I am not finished just yet.

I have primarily been focusing on its SD upconversion performance , I ran a few BDs and they looked fantastic as they look on the 51FD.

#1 the BDP-83 is very, very fast. No I have not gone as far as timing the speed , let me just say this , it is way , way faster at everything than both my 51FD and my old BD-30.
At first I told myself, speed alone will not get me to buy an Oppo, but after having it a few days its kind of growing on me and now I will take that back.
So on the SD upconversion, again I am not done but I am sure the Oppo does a better job but its not alot, the 51FD does a good job too but the Oppo is a tad better.
Now vs my old BD-30 the Oppo kills it but so does the 51FD.

Well , I am sorry I don't have more to add as far as SD performance goes, being that both players are good makes this kind of testing difficult.
And remember what I said about the 51FD and CDs above? Well the Oppo is every bit as good.

I will update you all if I come across any performance issues as I finish up my SD testing and comparison against my 51FD.

Thanks guys.




MY HT......
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post #16 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 08:05 PM
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I'm in the majority that is only concerned about BD performance, quality of dvd upconversion, and bitstreaming and decoding of hi def audio (all via HDMI since I have a modern AVR)--and reliability and support. The Panny BD60 seems to do all of this essentially as well as the Oppo except for dvd upconversion. The question for me will thus be how much I notice the difference in performance in this area, and whether it's worth a factor of 2 in price.
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post #17 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 08:10 PM
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You see the leftmost DVD rack by the door, its 2 top shelfs are all the BDs I have , about 27 of em (I forget)
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post #18 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 08:41 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

I'm in the majority that is only concerned about BD performance, quality of dvd upconversion, and bitstreaming and decoding of hi def audio (all via HDMI since I have a modern AVR)--and reliability and support. The Panny BD60 seems to do all of this essentially as well as the Oppo except for dvd upconversion. The question for me will thus be how much I notice the difference in performance in this area, and whether it's worth a factor of 2 in price.

While i have not compared the 60 or 80, I did spend a lot of time comparing the 55, which i understand to be identical save more internet based content/access. Performance at 1080P 24fps is about the same. If there is a differential, the oppo might have a very slight lead (>5%).

That said, sd dvd upconversion is significantly better with the oppo. Right now, the oppo does have some issues with lipsynch on sd dvds. I have had to pause and play on certain discs to get the synch right. The oppo is in a preproduction stage and I trust that this issue will be resolved with firmware.

If I had to subjectively quantify the difference in sd dvd upscaling quality, i would peg it at 25 to 40%, but this hinges on the size and quality of callibration of display. Even my wife noticed the jaggies noticed on poor deinterlacing done by the panny 55 on a reasonably good transfer of "zack and miri" on sd dvd.
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post #19 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 08:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

I'm in the majority that is only concerned about BD performance, quality of dvd upconversion, and bitstreaming and decoding of hi def audio (all via HDMI since I have a modern AVR)--and reliability and support. The Panny BD60 seems to do all of this essentially as well as the Oppo except for dvd upconversion. The question for me will thus be how much I notice the difference in performance in this area, and whether it's worth a factor of 2 in price.

here's my unsolicited two cents - if you're bitstreaming and are not overly fussed about getting exceptional sd dvd playback, I would give real consideration to saving $250 and get a pioneer 51 for under $300 or a panny 60 which should be under $250 in the next few weeks.

The Pioneer is a very solid player with great PQ, but can be painfully slow at times.

The Panny 60 is quicker and also offers BD Live content and prompted firmware upgrades via ethernet connection...it's a bit more user friendly.
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post #20 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 08:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by winston9332 View Post

While i have not compared the 60 or 80, I did spend a lot of time comparing the 55, which i understand to be identical save more internet based content/access. Performance at 1080P 24fps is about the same. If there is a differential, the oppo might have a very slight lead (>5%).

That said, sd dvd upconversion is significantly better with the oppo. Right now, the oppo does have some issues with lipsynch on sd dvds. I have had to pause and play on certain discs to get the synch right. The oppo is in a preproduction stage and I trust that this issue will be resolved with firmware.

If I had to subjectively quantify the difference in sd dvd upscaling quality, i would peg it at 25 to 40%, but this hinges on the size and quality of callibration of display. Even my wife noticed the jaggies noticed on poor deinterlacing done by the panny 55 on a reasonably good transfer of "zack and miri" on sd dvd.

Yes, good dvd upconversion is imp to me since I sit ~ 12 ft from a 126" diag HP screen. BD looks glorious from my RS20 pj, and dvd is also quite good with my present BD player, a Sammy 1200 (and its Reon upconversion chip). The 1200 is unreliabable, though, and doesn't bitstream or decode hidef audio, so I'm interested in replacing it. But I would not like to go 'backward' in the quality of dvd upconversion.
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post #21 of 3869 Old 04-05-2009, 09:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

Yes, good dvd upconversion is imp to me since I sit ~ 12 ft from a 126" diag HP screen. BD looks glorious from my RS20 pj, and dvd is also quite good with my present BD player, a Sammy 1200 (and its Reon upconversion chip). The 1200 is unreliabable, though, and doesn't bitstream or decode hidef audio, so I'm interested in replacing it. But I would not like to go 'backward' in the quality of dvd upconversion.

I love the reon chip - have it in my samsung 2550 and my onkyo hd dv805. I will say you will not be disappointed with the pioneer 51 or oppo in comparison. The oppo is superior in my humble opinion, but not $250 better if dvd upscaling were the only variable. When you factor in speed, customer support, universal capability, and DTS HD MA decoding, the $500 price pt makes more sense.
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post #22 of 3869 Old 04-06-2009, 07:15 AM
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Winston 9332, James Johnson, et al.: Someone on another thread assigned numerical values to his evaluation of the Oppo vs the 51 and (I believe) the PS3. If I remember correctly he assigned the PS3 ''7'', the 51 ''8'', and the Oppo ''9.5'' with ''10'' being as best as it gets. Would any or all of you agree? Thank you in advance.
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post #23 of 3869 Old 04-06-2009, 08:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abba1 View Post

Winston 9332, James Johnson, et al.: Someone on another thread assigned numerical values to his evaluation of the Oppo vs the 51 and (I believe) the PS3. If I remember correctly he assigned the PS3 ''7'', the 51 ''8'', and the Oppo ''9.5'' with ''10'' being as best as it gets. Would any or all of you agree? Thank you in advance.

While I do not own a PS3 a friend of mine has one and I have used it and seen it in action and my numbers would be close to the ones you posted.......>

I would say; PS3 "7" , BDP-51FD "8" , BDP-83 "9" . And based on what is out there now I will take a guess and say that a perfect 10 comes in the 2010 or 2011 generations.
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post #24 of 3869 Old 04-06-2009, 09:02 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James W. Johnson View Post

While I do not own a PS3 a friend of mine has one and I have used it and seen it in action and my numbers would be close to the ones you posted.......>

I would say; PS3 "7" , BDP-51FD "8" , BDP-83 "9" . And based on what is out there now I will take a guess and say that a perfect 10 comes in the 2010 or 2011 generations.

I would be inclined to pick them in that successive order as well. I would put the PS3 a 7 as well, but the Pioneer a 7.5 and the Oppo at an 8 at current stage of the unit. If Pioneer gets DTS HD MA, I would bump it up to James' level. If the Oppo gets its lipsynch issues sorted out, I would bump it to a 9 as well. The PS3 is up to date and is a solid 7. Its dvd upconversion is not terrific, lacks tweaking menus, and cannot output via analogues. These issues prevent me from giving it a higher grade despite its lightning speed, nice price pt when you consider it doubles as a gaming system, and dedicated support by sony.
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post #25 of 3869 Old 04-06-2009, 09:51 AM
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I am getting the Panasonic 54G10 when it comes out in a few weeks. I'll also be getting a Blu-Ray player. I want quality. However, I am not an audiophile, nor am I a videophile. I want a good Blu-Ray player that plays BR well and upscales well. My question then is which player should I go with? I am prepared to spend $500 on the Oppo if it's worth it. If I can get the performance that I need out of another player, I wouldn't be opposed to that either (and use the money I saved on new speakers, receiver, etc). Should I purchase the Oppo or look at something else? And if something else, what do you suggest?
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post #26 of 3869 Old 04-06-2009, 10:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RYANtheTIGER View Post

I am getting the Panasonic 54G10 when it comes out in a few weeks. I'll also be getting a Blu-Ray player. I want quality. However, I am not an audiophile, nor am I a videophile. I want a good Blu-Ray player that plays BR well and upscales well. My question then is which player should I go with? I am prepared to spend $500 on the Oppo if it's worth it. If I can get the performance that I need out of another player, I wouldn't be opposed to that either (and use the money I saved on new speakers, receiver, etc). Should I purchase the Oppo or look at something else? And if something else, what do you suggest?

Check out the help me choose a player thread.

Let's try to keep this thread on comparing the oppo to other players if possible. I know it will stray into is this the right player for me, but would love to hear folks with other players in the EAP offer some comparables.
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post #27 of 3869 Old 04-06-2009, 10:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by winston9332 View Post

I would be inclined to pick them in that successive order as well. I would put the PS3 a 7 as well, but the Pioneer a 7.5 and the Oppo at an 8 at current stage of the unit. If Pioneer gets DTS HD MA, I would bump it up to James' level. If the Oppo gets its lipsynch issues sorted out, I would bump it to a 9 as well. The PS3 is up to date and is a solid 7. Its dvd upconversion is not terrific, lacks tweaking menus, and cannot output via analogues. These issues prevent me from giving it a higher grade despite its lightning speed, nice price pt when you consider it doubles as a gaming system, and dedicated support by sony.

Great thread.

Have you done any comparisons using interlaced BluRay disc sources?

Thanks
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post #28 of 3869 Old 04-06-2009, 11:26 AM
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Guys;

Let's keep this thread as a comparison thread between the OPPO vs X only. Specific questions about the OPPO, please take that to the OPPO owner's thread. Want suggestions on which player to buy for your set up? Please take those questions to the sticky "Help me pick a BR player"

let's try to keep the cross talk out of the thread and focus on comparisons only.

Thanks
Ron

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post #29 of 3869 Old 04-06-2009, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James W. Johnson View Post

Somebody contacted me and offered to send me a BDP-83 for review.
They read here at AVS and knew that I had a Pioneer BDP-51FD.
Please do not ask for any details as ive promised this person 100% confidentiality and I will say no more.

My HT consists of:
Pioneer Elite PRO-151FD professionally calibrated plasma HDTV
Pioneer BDP-51FD blu-ray player
Comcast HD cable /1080i is the resolution
Onkyo 805 receiver
AV123 ELT525 5.1 system in rosewood veneer & a MFW-15 subwoofer.

My eye to screen distance is 9' (measured with a tape measure)


Being that the 51 is only my second player I am somewhat of a BD newb
My first BD player was a Panasonic BD-30.
However I am far from being an HT newb as my first HT went together in
the mid 90s.

Here is a quick BD-30 vs BDP-51FD , they are both slow. For some discs the BD-30 is slower and on a some the 51FD is slower. But overall I would say the BD-30 is a tad slower. Being that every BD player ive ever owned up until now (yes just 2) was slow I have learned to live with it and its really not a big deal.
For 1080/24p BD discs both are great performers, however on SD upconversion the 51FD blows the BD-30 away, I am talking night and day difference, that is IMO of course.
There is one area of performance on the 51FD that I have grown to love , it is a fantastic CD player! And I am not using the analog outs on it, I bitstream via HDMI for everything.

My Onkyo 805 has excellent Burr-Brown 192/24-bit DACs.


I was sent a BDP-83 for review free of charge, and a few days ago it
arrived. I am not running the BDP-83 and 51FD at the same time, rather I am just noting which discs and scenes I run on the 83 and how they perform then I will run them again on the 51FD after ive run all that I want to run on the 83. No I am not finished just yet.

I have primarily been focusing on its SD upconversion performance , I ran a few BDs and they looked fantastic as they look on the 51FD.

#1 the BDP-83 is very, very fast. No I have not gone as far as timing the speed , let me just say this , it is way , way faster at everything than both my 51FD and my old BD-30.
At first I told myself, speed alone will not get me to buy an Oppo, but after having it a few days its kind of growing on me and now I will take that back.
So on the SD upconversion, again I am not done but I am sure the Oppo does a better job but its not alot, the 51FD does a good job too but the Oppo is a tad better.
Now vs my old BD-30 the Oppo kills it but so does the 51FD.

Well , I am sorry I don't have more to add as far as SD performance goes, being that both players are good makes this kind of testing difficult.
And remember what I said about the 51FD and CDs above? Well the Oppo is every bit as good.

I will update you all if I come across any performance issues as I finish up my SD testing and comparison against my 51FD.

Thanks guys.




MY HT......

James,

In my initial comparison between the Oppo BDP-83 and the Pioneer BDP-51FD; I stated that speed would not be a determining factor effecting which player I would keep. However, once I began my testing (I have one monitor) and having to switch between the 2 players; the SPEED of the Oppo quickly moved up the food chain. I only recently sold the Pioneer, because once it became the wife and kids primary player they couldn't tolerate the speed or lack of speed of the Pioneer. You can read my comments on the Oppo BDP-83 owner's thread at the following posts: #1521 & #1978


My Setup:

- Denon AVR-3802, using 7.1 analog connection
- Pioneer Elite 950-HD 42
- I sit about 8 feet from the monitor



Willie

Pioneer Elite PRO-151FD

Zektor MAS7.1

Classé CA-2200/CA-5200

Oppo BDP-105, Denon DVD-5910CI, Cambridge 752BD, Cambridge 640C V2

Paradigm Signature S8, Paradigm Signature ADP1

Paradigm Signature ADP3, Paradigm Signature C5

REL R-505 Sub (2)

Oppo BDP-93, BDP-103D, Pioneer BDP-320

Sony BDP-S790

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post #30 of 3869 Old 04-06-2009, 02:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rboster View Post

Guys;

Let's keep this thread as a comparison thread between the OPPO vs X only. Specific questions about the OPPO, please take that to the OPPO owner's thread. Want suggestions on which player to buy for your set up? Please take those questions to the sticky "Help me pick a BR player"

let's try to keep the cross talk out of the thread and focus on comparisons only.

Thanks
Ron

Totally agree - anyone compare it to the denon 1800/2500/3800s?
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