joerod Blu ray Player Comparison Ratings Summer 2009 - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 220 Old 12-02-2009, 10:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Smarty-pants View Post

The analog output stage is greatly improved with the BDP-83SE.
I'm sure it's still not quite up to the quality of the analog output of the A1, but it most likely trumps the 3800.
I would think that it would also move up the ladder on your old list.
As for all things considered, when dealing with only HDMI, I think it's just as good or better than any player mentioned in this thread.

Second to one?... might make more sense than you realize. Can anyone say Freudian Slip?
With all features considered, there are only 2 players that have ALL the features a user needs. Those are the OPPO-83SE and the Denon-A1.
One cost just 25% of what the other does, and is almost as good.
Not that I've heard both together, or seen a review of both together, but based on the comparison of the -83/-A1, and knowing what the -83SE can do, it's an easy deduction to make.
Maybe the extra $3000 or so may be a worthwhile investment for some people, but for those without deep pockets and more common sense (j/k), the BDP-83SE is the cat's meow.

And that is where people confuse cheaper for better versus performance.

This thread was a Summer comparison. I am not planning any comparisons until a new gen hits. Not sure an 83SE will equal the big boys. I have been told by more than a few not to waste my time obtaining one. And the poster who revived it was asking about the Denon players... Not the Oppos... At the end of the day the 09FD is my overall "value" player. Two HDMI outs is better than one.

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post #182 of 220 Old 12-02-2009, 10:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Oh and I wouldn't say the 83SE will "trump" any player (like the 3800). It might reach it's level but trump is a strong word. And based on your last post the 3800 is the much better value player since it can be had for a few hundred less than the SE!

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post #183 of 220 Old 12-02-2009, 11:32 PM
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Originally Posted by joerod View Post

Oh and I wouldn't say the 83SE will "trump" any player (like the 3800). It might reach it's level but trump is a strong word. And based on your last post the 3800 is the much better value player since it can be had for a few hundred less than the SE!

That also depends on what features you need as well.
...and I was really comparing the standard -83 to the 3800.

Yes, the discussion got somewhat away from the OP's intention, but that doesn't mean we can't discuss further.

Once again though, we see what may be your choice over the BDP-83, does equate to literally 3 times the street price... $500 vs $1500.
So it depends on the end users goal, whether it be getting the best value of a player that meets their needs, or spend a lot more to get a little better performance.

What equals value in the BDP-83, is not just simply the 1/3 of the cost, because the player and manufacturer both excel in so many areas where others fall short... including the 09FD.
Yet some features are more important to certain individuals (IE: 2 hdmi outputs).

At the end of the day, we each have to decide what is best for ourselves. Everything else is just what someone else would chose.

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post #184 of 220 Old 12-03-2009, 03:55 AM
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Originally Posted by joerod View Post

Honestly, for the money they are going for these days it is the best bang for buck Blu ray player out there. The SD dvd upscaling is second to one and the Blu ray player playback is top notch. Good call.

Thanks Joe! Yeah i dont care about oppoop players.. used them before.. they make nice paper weights I have had Denon's before and there Burr-Browns are sweet!! I agree when it comes to pure video.. the 3800 is a step ahead of the oppoop.

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post #185 of 220 Old 12-03-2009, 04:24 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smarty-pants View Post

That also depends on what features you need as well.
...and I was really comparing the standard -83 to the 3800.

Yes, the discussion got somewhat away from the OP's intention, but that doesn't mean we can't discuss further.

Once again though, we see what may be your choice over the BDP-83, does equate to literally 3 times the street price... $500 vs $1500.
So it depends on the end users goal, whether it be getting the best value of a player that meets their needs, or spend a lot more to get a little better performance.

What equals value in the BDP-83, is not just simply the 1/3 of the cost, because the player and manufacturer both excel in so many areas where others fall short... including the 09FD.
Yet some features are more important to certain individuals (IE: 2 hdmi outputs).

At the end of the day, we each have to decide what is best for ourselves. Everything else is just what someone else would chose.

I read you.

I was just answering his question and not looking to have another oppo debate.

I have had nearly every Blu ray player out there and the up converted 48 bit going straight (no detours) into my VW85 while sending the audio straight into my Receivers/pre-pro has yeilded the best results. That's with using HDMI and then the analog sound also is first rate. The image is better than the Oppo and right on par with the DVD A1. If the 83 was better to my eyes I would have kept it in my rack. I have had a few of the new players the past couple months and nothing has been better. Sure some come close but the flexibility of having two HDMI outputs helps. The 09FD is holding its value pretty good which is also another sign showing just how good it is. And if you really want to know the truth I like the BD390 almost as much as the 09FD since it offers all the streaming with a pretty good image to boot.

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post #186 of 220 Old 12-03-2009, 04:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by tn001d View Post

Thanks Joe! Yeah i dont care about oppoop players.. used them before.. they make nice paper weights I have had Denon's before and there Burr-Browns are sweet!! I agree when it comes to pure video.. the 3800 is a step ahead of the oppoop.

No problem.

Next time just send me a PM.

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post #187 of 220 Old 12-03-2009, 11:40 AM
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Very mature posting tn001d.
Just an FYI... In Joe's original comparison way back when, he scored the 3800 and the BDP-83 neck and neck with the 3800 scoring just one notch higher.
Since that time, OPPO has improved on a great player even more, and I have no doubt that it would equal or better the 3800 in all areas of performance and support.
I find it ironic, that you are seeking advice from the person that gave those ratings in the first place.
If you have zero appreciation for what the BDP-83 could do for you, then how do you even rationalize an actual purchase of the 3800.

______________


Don't worry Joe, I won't bother trying to discuss the actual topic of the thread any more.
If you had just let me know ahead of time that your opinion was the only one that counted, I wouldn't have bothered to begin with.

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post #188 of 220 Old 12-03-2009, 12:14 PM - Thread Starter
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I don't worry. I actually had ALL the players here at one time. Plus he did ASK me. Not an Oppo-Loyalist.

And the 499 model has not had its Analog section updated... Not sure how that would "best" the 3800 now.

Thanks for stopping by. I will be sure to alert you of other companies looking for Beta testers...

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post #189 of 220 Old 12-03-2009, 10:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

I don't worry. I actually had ALL the players here at one time. Plus he did ASK me. Not an Oppo-Loyalist.

And the 499 model has not had its Analog section updated... Not sure how that would "best" the 3800 now.

Thanks for stopping by. I will be sure to alert you of other companies looking for Beta testers...

OPPO-Loyalist. I actually like that. I am always loyal to whatever serves me well, which the BDP-83 does VERY nicely, and Oppo Digital is just the complete package of consumer 'candy' for those in the market for their features and service.

Oh, were we ONLY talking about analog audio? I didn't realize that.
Besting one player in an overall comparison against another is one thing... however if the user is ONLY interested in MCH analog output, then that's another I guess.

I look forward to your generous offer. I'll try not to hold my breath too long.

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post #190 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 02:32 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Smarty-pants View Post

OPPO-Loyalist. I actually like that. I am always loyal to whatever serves me well, which the BDP-83 does VERY nicely, and Oppo Digital is just the complete package of consumer 'candy' for those in the market for their features and service.


Oh, were we ONLY talking about analog audio? I didn't realize that.
Besting one player in an overall comparison against another is one thing... however if the user is ONLY interested in MCH analog output, then that's another I guess.

I look forward to your generous offer. I'll try not to hold my breath too long.

You typed it. Not me. Just realize that there is a fine line from being Loyal and being annoying. Nobody likes 'drive by' posters. The original post was asking ME about the Denons and YOU jumped in with oppo. We all get it. You love your oppo. That's fine. Just realize there are other brands out there that others prefer. I still have 9 players from 7 different companies. That is why people usually send me PMs asking advice. I am pretty sure if he wanted to know about the oppo he would have posted a question in one of the many oppo threads.

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post #191 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 07:05 AM
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Just realize that there is a fine line from being Loyal and being annoying.

One of the best lines in a long time. I guess it's not too bad for the casual visitor but for a frequent one you can only read the same stuff so many times before you start to ignore them.
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post #192 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 07:54 AM
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Loyalists? I thought they were opponuts.

A Christmas Carol. A tale of a right-thinking man driven insane by do-gooders.

"Most people would die sooner than think, in fact they do so."  Bertrand Russell The ABC of Relativity, 1925

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post #193 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 09:28 AM
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Originally Posted by joerod View Post

You typed it. Not me. Just realize that there is a fine line from being Loyal and being annoying. Nobody likes 'drive by' posters. The original post was asking ME about the Denons and YOU jumped in with oppo. We all get it. You love your oppo. That's fine. Just realize there are other brands out there that others prefer. I still have 9 players from 7 different companies. That is why people usually send me PMs asking advice. I am pretty sure if he wanted to know about the oppo he would have posted a question in one of the many oppo threads.

Wow. I try and ease the tension with a friendly post, and you come back with this???
Yes Joe, you DID type it. I was just trying to be nice and roll with it.

What is so annying btw? That I mention one player in your comparison over the other?
Who's a "drive by poster"??? I've been subscribed to this thread for a very long time.

Yes, the OP asked you a question. However my original post was addressed to you, not him.
Last time I checked, this was not a specific Denon or Pioneer thread.
The original topic includes OPPO.
If you don't like the opinions of others in contrast to your own, then don't have the discussion in a public forum.

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post #194 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 09:48 AM
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What is so annying btw?

It's not what but WHO.
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post #195 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 09:54 AM
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It's not what but WHO.

Oh, by all means, enlighten me.

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post #196 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 11:10 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by moxie1617 View Post

It's not what but WHO.


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post #197 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 11:17 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Smarty-pants View Post

Wow. I try and ease the tension with a friendly post, and you come back with this???
Yes Joe, you DID type it. I was just trying to be nice and roll with it.

What is so annying btw? That I mention one player in your comparison over the other?
Who's a "drive by poster"??? I've been subscribed to this thread for a very long time.

Yes, the OP asked you a question. However my original post was addressed to you, not him.
Last time I checked, this was not a specific Denon or Pioneer thread.
The original topic includes OPPO.
If you don't like the opinions of others in contrast to your own, then don't have the discussion in a public forum.

I did my comparison in the Summer. I am not about to debate my findings now. You asked me about the oppo (even though it was a Denon specific question) in response to the original poster's question. Yes, I know about the oppo and how awesome it is. He asked about the Denons. Didn't think I needed to bring up the oppo with every post (like you obviously). Let it go and go enjoy your oppo...

I now know why I average 10 to 15 PMs every day. Thanks for reminding me...

You could do your own comparison study... Maybe call it oppo verus other players? Oh wait, there already is a thread for that...

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post #198 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 11:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Charles R View Post

One of the best lines in a long time. I guess it's not too bad for the casual visitor but for a frequent one you can only read the same stuff so many times before you start to ignore them.

I may put that in my signature.

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post #199 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 11:32 AM - Thread Starter
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For the record I do like Smarty-Pants. I sincerely do. I just get tired of the opponuts (I do like that) jumping in whenever I give an opinion about a certain player or brand. I like my oppo and use it in our Family Room. It is the perfect community player. Never fails. I would love for them to make one with Dual HDMI outs.

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post #200 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 11:49 AM
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Your response was about the best player for your money, and the OPPO qualified as well. That was all I was pointing out.

Ok, maybe I like my BDP-83 a lot, and yes, other players are better, but for the price point of the OPPO it can not be beat.
I don't mention OPPO in every post, and I am not a "fanboy", I know the player is not perfect.
However it works well for most owners, and me as well, and when I own a product like that, then I tend to make sure everyone knows about it.
Many people buy things everyday without knowing they may be buying a product that is inferior or doesn't fill their needs properly.
Informing otherwise is my intention when boasting about the BDP-83.
If that appears to be over_championing in some people's eyes, then so be it.
I also boast about other equipment that I have that I really like. It's just not mentioned here because it is not the TOPIC OF DISCUSSION.
I digress...

BTW Joe, I like you too. Nothing wrong with a little debate now and again.
I can understand how you get frustrated with 'constant OPPO comparisons".
I don't follow all your threads, so I don't see all those posts, but it does go to show how good the player really is with so many fans out there.
Of course there are other fish in the sea, and it's a good thing we do have guys like you to help us see all of our options.

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post #201 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by tn001d View Post

Thanks Joe! Yeah i dont care about oppoop players.. used them before.. they make nice paper weights I have had Denon's before and there Burr-Browns are sweet!! I agree when it comes to pure video.. the 3800 is a step ahead of the oppoop.

But of course! Weight = sound and picture quality and Price = sound and picture quality, and science be damned! Our eyes and ears are so much better than any objective measurements.
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post #202 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 02:13 PM - Thread Starter
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But of course! Weight = sound and picture quality and Price = sound and picture quality, and science be damned! Our eyes and ears are so much better than any objective measurements.

And those are what I used for my comparison report... Those and test patterns to.

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post #203 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 02:20 PM
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And those are what I used for my comparison report... Those and test patterns to.

Well, I would disagree with you there. When I mentioned eyes and ears I was being sarcastic (should have used one of those faces). Most of your comparisons are quite subjective and mostly not very useful to me personally. Your opinions also don't agree with some of the reviews that do use very objective measurements (like Kris Deering's). Plus, I have experienced many of these players myself and my subjective opinion is quite different from yours.
Either way, most participants here are more likely to be convinced by "common sense" like heavier is better and more expensive is always better, than by any objective data.
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post #204 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 04:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Well, I would disagree with you there. When I mentioned eyes and ears I was being sarcastic (should have used one of those faces). Most of your comparisons are quite subjective and mostly not very useful to me personally. Your opinions also don't agree with some of the reviews that do use very objective measurements (like Kris Deering's). Plus, I have experienced many of these players myself and my subjective opinion is quite different from yours.
Either way, most participants here are more likely to be convinced by "common sense" like heavier is better and more expensive is always better, than by any objective data.

Most "reviewers" here (and magazine folks) don't have three projectors going at once with three Blu ray players. Do you? And I have never read one of your "reviews" before. Just because I didn't pick the oppo as the "top dog" some people are still upset...

Oh and I was being sarcastic to.

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post #205 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 04:41 PM
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Originally Posted by joerod View Post

Most "reviewers" here (and magazine folks) don't have three projectors going at once with three Blu ray players. Do you? And I have never read one of your "reviews" before. Just because I didn't pick the oppo as the "top dog" some people are still upset...

Oh and I was being sarcastic to.

I don't care if you have 10 or 30 projectors. You are still using sighted biased comparisons using your eyes and ears. The best review folks use precise measurements to test how the bluray players perform and that is way better than your method (for video). I don't publish my "reviews" as I don't see any point in doing it. Just because you constantly keep publishing yours does not make your reviews any more useful to anybody who understands how the brain works (and I hope I know how the brain works a bit better then you as this is my specialty) and anybody who can separate science from fiction (sadly many people on this forum have problems doing it). That is why I said that to me your reviews are useless, sorry.

Also, I don't really care what you pick as your 'top' player as your choices are so predictable and not based on any objective criteria.
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post #206 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 04:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Also, I don't really care what you pick as your 'top' player as your choices are so predictable and not based on any objective criteria.[/quote]

Yet you still felt compelled to post in my Summer Comparison Thread?

Search or copy and paste-> Joe Rod Home Theater .Com <-to check out my latest Reviews.

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post #207 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 05:10 PM
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Originally Posted by joerod View Post

Also, I don't really care what you pick as your 'top' player as your choices are so predictable and not based on any objective criteria.

Yet you still felt compelled to post in my Summer Comparison Thread? [/quote]

I do read your thread for pure amusement and I could not resist when I saw a silly statement about players weight related to performance - that was the only reason I posted, sorry.
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post #208 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 05:10 PM
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Originally Posted by joerod View Post

Also, I don't really care what you pick as your 'top' player as your choices are so predictable and not based on any objective criteria.

Yet you still felt compelled to post in my Summer Comparison Thread? [/quote]

Joe,

Your reviews are your opinion and it does matter how many players you have. It is still ONLY you opinion. You are just an end user just like the rest of us. And this "End User Clinician" is not base of facts.
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post #209 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 05:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Brian-HD View Post

Yet you still felt compelled to post in my Summer Comparison Thread?

Joe,

Your reviews are your opinion and it does matter how many players you have. It is still ONLY you opinion. You are just an end user just like the rest of us. And this "End User Clinician" is not base of facts.[/quote]

Of course it is my opinion. That is why it is so funny when others take offense to them. What "facts" should qualify my End User title? That's the best comment yet...

Search or copy and paste-> Joe Rod Home Theater .Com <-to check out my latest Reviews.

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post #210 of 220 Old 12-04-2009, 05:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by VladP View Post

Yet you still felt compelled to post in my Summer Comparison Thread?

I do read your thread for pure amusement and I could not resist when I saw a silly statement about players weight related to performance - that was the only reason I posted, sorry.[/quote]

ANd that's exactly what it was. Silly. Thanks for stopping by.

Search or copy and paste-> Joe Rod Home Theater .Com <-to check out my latest Reviews.

Check out these new Lighted Cup Holders:
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