Ayre DX-5 bluray player - Page 43 - AVS Forum
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post #1261 of 1445 Old 09-17-2013, 02:28 PM
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Charles,

You are correct. I want to change out all fuses including the rail fuses inside the MXRs.

Ne,
I will let you know which fuses I end up going with and if I hear the difference after all is said and done.
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post #1262 of 1445 Old 09-17-2013, 05:00 PM
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Hello All,
Here is a table of all of the fuses used in the Ayre product

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post #1263 of 1445 Old 09-17-2013, 06:49 PM
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Thank you so much. That is great information. You add so much value to your company being active on these boards.

Sword
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post #1264 of 1445 Old 09-17-2013, 10:58 PM
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I do have a question about a fuse in the mxr. On the iec side, would an 8a be fine to use instead of the 6.3? I have read that a small increase in dynamics could be achieved through this. I know you have said almost anything can alter the sound but would that be alright for the amp?
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post #1265 of 1445 Old 09-17-2013, 11:21 PM
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Helo Sword,

Going to an 8 amp AC line fuse will work fine for the MX-R power amp. The fuse will only blow in the case of drastic overload, for example if one of the transformers were to short circuit. In a case like that, either fuse will blow immediately. Just don't replace the fuse with a piece of solid copper rod or something silly like that. On the other hand I doubt that it will make much sonic difference. Let us know what you hear please! smile.gif

Best regards,
Charles Hansen
Ayre Acoustics, Inc.
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post #1266 of 1445 Old 09-27-2013, 01:18 AM
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I do have a question. Why are blu rays drastically quieter than CDs on the dx5? I have the kxr on 35 or maybe 40 and I have to hold my ears but a blu ray is so quiet. When the previews are over I turn it to 51 or so. I can't turn it up past 51 because then the MXRs go into dc offset protection. It just doesn't make sense. If I hook up a ps3 I don't have that issue. Just a curious thing.

Also, my kxr remote controls the dx5 but is there a way I can press enter on the kxr remote so that I can start playing a blu ray without the dx5 remote?
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post #1267 of 1445 Old 09-27-2013, 10:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sword of Levi View Post

I do have a question. Why are blu rays drastically quieter than CDs on the dx5?

Hello Sword,

Blu-ray discs are quieter than CD's on all players. It's a battle of two competing sources. CD's only have 16 bits and therefore have a much more restricted dynamic range -- 48 dB less!! Then there is a belief that a loud song on the radio station will attract the listener's attention, so pop-music CD's are mastered to be as loud as possible with very little dynamic range. For movies, the opposite is true. They think that the movie will be more "spectacular" if the explosions are REALLY LOUD!. So they put the normal dialog at a really low level. Then you jump out of your seat when a the LOUD EXPLOSION comes along.

There are two ways to address this -- adjust the volume manually when switching formats, or go into the setup menu, select "Audio Processiong - Dynamic Range Control" and then select "On". This will reduce the dynamic range on the movies so that they are more similar to music discs.
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I can't turn it up past 51 because then the MXRs go into dc offset protection.

There is excessive DC offset in one of your components. If you have a multi-meter and an assortment of hand tools, you can adjust this yourself. If not, see if one of your buddies can help you out. It's a pretty straightforward operation if you have a technical background. If you don't, you can always send the unit back to the factory, but that is a pain. Who is your local dealer? Sometimes dealer still actually have service departments. It sounds to me as though the DC offset is originating in the DX-5. All of the Ayre components are true DC amplifiers, with no servos or coupling caps. Michael can help you figure out which unit is the source of the problem and give some instruction on how to adjust the DC offset. 303-442-7300 x223.
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Also, my kxr remote controls the dx5 but is there a way I can press enter on the kxr remote so that I can start playing a blu ray without the dx5 remote?
The metal remote that comes with the KX-R has a section of buttons dedicated to playing audio discs. However, almost any video disc requires the "navigation keys" (left, right, up, down, enter). There simply isn't enough room on the metal remote to control all of the functions of a video player. Sorry. You should be able to play most audio discs on the DX-5 with the metal remote though.

Best,
Charles Hansen
Ayre Acoustics, Inc.
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post #1268 of 1445 Old 10-01-2013, 10:41 PM
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Hi Charles,

I have a question about the front USB input on the DX-5. I know the quality would be mediocre, but what would be the best video format that would play from it? I tried downloading a YouTube video as mp4, but the DX-5 doesn't recognize it.

Thanks

Auraliti PK90-USB > Ayre DX-5 > Ayre KX-R > Ayre MX-R > YG Kipod II Signature Passive
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post #1269 of 1445 Old 10-02-2013, 12:34 AM
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Hello Tim,

There's always a couple of resources to use. The first is to go to the Ayre website, look under the DX-5 and then check "Manual and Support", then press the "FAQ" button. This FAQ was modified from the unofficial FAQ kept up by Bill McClain for the Oppo BDP-83, but with all of the changes necessary for all of the features of the Ayre player.

In this case, go down to the Media Files section. There is information that may or may not help you there. In this case I think you are out of luck. Most browsers have plug-ins to save YouTube videos as either MP4 or FLV (Flash Video). Neither one is supported. So you would have to find a transcoding program to convert the file type into something that is supported:

avi
divx
gif
jpg
mka
mkv
mp2
mp3
mpg
png
vob
wma

Sorry!

I was really hoping that with Blu-ray that the video formats would pretty much stabilize. But two months after we launched the DX-5 they released 3D. That was kind of silly so I wasn't too concerned (hey, nice glasses, dude!). But with all the streaming and now 4K and everything coming so quickly, I think that we are going to change our emphasis. Future products from Ayre will probably have the lowest possible priced transports, with the most money reserved for audio DACs. We may or may not do anything with video processing and/or switching. But even that is getting wacky.

I was thinking about making something like the DVDO Quick 6 HDMI switcher, but with an isolated audio output. Isolating the audio and video systems makes a HUGE difference in both sound and picture quality. All of our players do it, but when you start adding other video sources, it can defeat the isolation.

But I recently did an install for my sons' high school and found something that was brand new to me. It's probably old hat to you guys, but it is definitely going to replace HDMI. And that is HDBaseT. If you haven't seen it yet, it solves all of the problems of HDMI, specifically point-to-point only and very limited length cables. With HDBaseT, they add amplitude modulation to the signal to get more bandwidth without requiring any more bandwidth! It works best with Cat 6 cable, but it the current system can send HDMI (with HDCP), three more 100 Mbs ethernet connections, an IR repeater for controlling equipment that is hundreds of feet away, all on one ethernet cable and a length limit of 330 feet. I would say "DIE, HDMI, DIE" except that it sits on top of HDMI. So when you open up the box, there are actually two chipsets in there - the standard HDMI chipset and then the HDBaseT chipset on top of that.

But my prediction is that by next year most video devices (monitors and sources) will have both HDMI and HDBaseT connections. Then in 5 years HDMI will be gone completely. It is just too limited. They are just now releasing HDBaseT 2.0 and it allows all kinds of cool stuff so that you can have one source and send it to multiple receivers around the house and who knows what else. So it's just as hard as ever to design anything for video that will be state-of-the-art (at least in terms of features) for more than a year or two... But anybody who owns a DX-5 already knows that the picture is clearly better than any other Blu-ray player, and that the sound is in a different league altogether. But if you want one get it quick. Response to the DSD update has been stronger than anticipated and we are very nearly sold out of players. I've got mine, so I'm happy.

Cheers,
Charles Hansen
Ayre Acoustics, Inc.
www.ayre.com

PS -- You can get a bare-bones HDMI to HDBaseT extender kit on Amazon from Etekcity for $100. Monoprice is introducing some of the new 2.0 versions soon. They will be more expensive but have more features. Then there are a bunch of "pro" grade boxes for $500 and up. But we just got the $100 box set (transmitter and receiver) from Etekcity from Amazon and it works great. We have one killer "Cat7" cable inside the wall with 4 shielded pairs plus an overall shield. Then we bought a composite to HDMI converter and a VGA to HDMI converter. Then the teacher can have any source (even a USB microscope with composite output all the way up to a Blu-ray player) convert to HDMI, send it across as HDBaseT, and then convert it back to HDMI at the projector. There is no compression or loss in either the video or the audio. Pretty slick for high school. Who here remembers the 16 mm Bell & Howell movie projectors and the overhead slide thingy to draw on. Hah! Now they have high-res PowerPoint presentations with live USB microscopes and video presentation in high def.... Then on the weekends they can have movie night and charge admission and sell popcorn!
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post #1270 of 1445 Old 10-02-2013, 06:01 PM
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We use HDBaseT all the time, but not for critical applications. A high quality HDMI cable has yielded a considerably better picture. The caveat is that we have been using unshielded CAT6E.
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post #1271 of 1445 Old 10-02-2013, 10:36 PM
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Thanks for your help Charles. Using your list as a starting point I tried a few methods. Converting the 25 minute mp4 video clip took a very long time and a number of steps. After some research I learned that all one need do is "mux" it instead of converting formats. I found a free program Mkvtoolnix. Just add the file to the input, hit "start Muxing", and an mkv file appears a short time later. It played just fine on the DX-5. I'm completely out of my depth here, but this simple procedure is all I need.

Auraliti PK90-USB > Ayre DX-5 > Ayre KX-R > Ayre MX-R > YG Kipod II Signature Passive
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post #1272 of 1445 Old 10-02-2013, 11:18 PM
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Hi Tim,

That is a great solution! Thanks very much for sharing with the other DX-5 owners! There are some very amazing things on YouTube. My current favorite channel is an Italian musician who analyzes all of the Beatle vocal harmonies EXACTLY!

http://www.youtube.com/user/imcarrying

If you like the Beatles or singing or incredible vocal harmonies, you will love this. The newer clips are in high-def and stereo.

Cheers,
Charlie Hansen
Ayre
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post #1273 of 1445 Old 10-02-2013, 11:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottsol View Post

We use HDBaseT all the time, but not for critical applications. A high quality HDMI cable has yielded a considerably better picture. The caveat is that we have been using unshielded CAT6E.

Hello Scott,

Thanks for the input. Theoretically there should be no degradation. But as I am fond of saying, "Everything matters."

We bought the cheapest one there is. The chips were invented by Valens of Israel -- www.valens.com. I would be willing to bet that the $100 transmitter/receiver pair we have uses some Chinese chips. Also at each end the box is powered by a switching wall-wart. So there are definitely some variables here. What if you get the $500 "pro" level boxes that use the real Valens chipset and also replace the switching wall-warts with linear supplies? The ethernet cable we are using is the AudioQuest CAT700 Pearl. Each twisted pair is individually shielded, plus there is an overall shield around all 8 conductors.

It's tough to do a truly fair comparison. We have good ethernet cable, but cheap HDBaseT boxes and HDMI connector cables (Monoprice). Even our projector is far from state-of-the-art. I got the cheapest ones that had full 1080p, three chips (no rainbows), optical zoom (preserves resolution), and mechanical lens offset (not electronic keystone correction). $1300 Epson 8350's not bad, but not state-of-the-art. I've heard from a cable manufacturer that a good HDMI cable make much more improvement to the sound than it does to the picture quality. But when we experimented with the fiber-optic DVI cables from Sumitomo, the picture quality improvement was not subtle. Time will tell. One thing I know for sure is that HDMI is the absolute worst digital audio connection ever devised.

Keep us posted!

Cheers,
Charlie
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post #1274 of 1445 Old 10-03-2013, 01:45 PM
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Dear Charles,

 

I'm a newbie on this forum, but not a newbie to Ayre products. I currently use MX-R and DX-5 in my system (before DX-5 came about, I owned C-5xeMP). Recently Brent put me in the line for the DSD update, so I look forward to that. I have a few questions, but I'd rather ask them one at a time.

 

You've mentioned earlier that you are running out of (Oppo) parts for DX-5 and that the machine has almost reached the end of its life cycle. So what's going to happen to DX-5 next year? Are we to expect a new reincarnation based on a different transport (other than Oppo) or will it be farewell for good and never to be manufactured again? If the latter is true, what's going to happen if next year my laser dies on me? Do you have a mountain of new lasers stashed away to keep us-DX-5 lovers-supplied and happy until ripe old age?;) 

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post #1275 of 1445 Old 10-03-2013, 08:55 PM
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Hello Ukrainian.

There will be no DX-5 next year. That much we know for sure. Instead we will probably make a Q-5 multi-input DAC and a T-5 transport. Past that, I'm not really too sure what features these products will have. But one thing is for sure - just as with USB DACs, we will have a way to completely non-proprietary way to eliminate jitter originating from the interface between the two boxes. That is why we have never built a two box machine. We will probably end up with several transports -- one for Redbook CD only, one for all audio formats, and another for all audio and all video formats. We may make some other goodies that will eliminate the jitter problem that is part of HDMI when used to transport digital audio. I doubt that all of these will be in the 5 series. Some may be in the 9 series, some in the 5 series, and some in the R-series. But they all have a similar cosmetic "feel" so they can be mixed-and-matched for your particular needs.

Regarding the transports, we have nearly 20% as many spares as total players ever built. So far they have been very reliable. I think we have replaced two, and this was for mechanical noise issues, and not actual failures. If they stay at this failure rate, I don't think we will run out before 5" optical discs are completely replaced by some other storage medium. The worst case would be that they would all last ten years and then all die at the same time. Then about the only thing you could do would be to receive some sort of credit from Ayre to be used to be used toward the purchase of a new product. Ideally all of our products would have a minimum of a 10-year life span., and 20 years would be better. One thing you could try would be to call up Oppo and ask to purchase a spare drive for your own use. They said that if we had one defective one that we could return it and they would replace it for $60, which is a ridiculous bargain. So I said, "great, I'll take 20 of them". The CS rep said "Please hold a moment." Actually the failure rate had been lower than expected so they would sell us 10 at a time. The only problem was that hey had to raise the price.They actually sell the single units for less than their OEM cost. He said that we could purchase s many of them as we wanted for $120 each.

The bottom line is that if I were a DX-5 owner, I would contact Oppo and ask to purchase a replacement drive. Tell them that it is starting to skip occasionally and that you would like to have a replacement on hand for when it fails. $120 is pretty cheap insurance. I've heard horror stories about expensive players from other companies that used Philips transports. They were incredibly set on changing them every year because they could figure out how to make them for $0.03 less. So some poor customer would buy a fancy two box system with a $10,000 outboard transport using a mechanism supplied by Philips. After a few years the laser would die and no replacements were available at any price. So they would end up with a $10,000 paperweight instead of a disc player. That would be a bummer.

I would guess that we have enough replacement transports to last at least another ten years. But we have no way of knowing if they will all die after seven years, or if they will all last for 30 years. We can't afford to inventory four transport mechanisms for every player every made by us. So probably the best compromise is that we keep a reasonable stock on hand and that the real customers who plan to keep these things for a while should plan on purchasing replacement transports as an extra "layer" of insurance.

Features like the ability to stream Mog, Spotify, and YouTube will come on go, but actually achieving superior video and audio quality never goes out of style!

Best regards,
Charles Hansen
Ayre Acoustics, Inc.
www.ayre.com
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post #1276 of 1445 Old 10-05-2013, 02:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles Hansen View Post

Hello Sword,
Quote:
Blu-ray discs are quieter than CD's on all players. It's a battle of two competing sources. CD's only have 16 bits and therefore have a much more restricted dynamic range -- 48 dB less!! Then there is a belief that a loud song on the radio station will attract the listener's attention, so pop-music CD's are mastered to be as loud as possible with very little dynamic range. For movies, the opposite is true. They think that the movie will be more "spectacular" if the explosions are REALLY LOUD!. So they put the normal dialog at a really low level. Then you jump out of your seat when a the LOUD EXPLOSION comes along.

There are two ways to address this -- adjust the volume manually when switching formats, or go into the setup menu, select "Audio Processiong - Dynamic Range Control" and then select "On". This will reduce the dynamic range on the movies so that they are more similar to music discs.

Everything that you mentioned above I have understood from your past posts and the internet and from past conversations with various people in the industry for years. The reason I brought it up again is because I have never seen anything that had such a large gap. The fact that the gap is not that large between CDs and Blu-Rays when played back on a PS3 (of course Dynamic Range Control is disabled on that as well) versus the DX-5. I will respond to your option 2 because I think that is the issue.

Quote:
There is excessive DC offset in one of your components. If you have a multi-meter and an assortment of hand tools, you can adjust this yourself. If not, see if one of your buddies can help you out. It's a pretty straightforward operation if you have a technical background. If you don't, you can always send the unit back to the factory, but that is a pain. Who is your local dealer? Sometimes dealer still actually have service departments. It sounds to me as though the DC offset is originating in the DX-5. All of the Ayre components are true DC amplifiers, with no servos or coupling caps. Michael can help you figure out which unit is the source of the problem and give some instruction on how to adjust the DC offset. 303-442-7300 x223.

I do have a meter and I would love to adjust this myself. Would you post the information for all to read or would you rather not let people know publicly as a whole because it might add a service nightmare for people that love to play with their own equipment. I am very electrically and mechanically minded so that would not be a problem. I actually don't have a local dealer where I live. I actually don't have one in my state. If you could post how to change it on the DX-5 I can isolate the problem. I have gone through most of the steps regarding the isolation of the problem and the DX-5 does seem to be the problem.
Quote:
The metal remote that comes with the KX-R has a section of buttons dedicated to playing audio discs. However, almost any video disc requires the "navigation keys" (left, right, up, down, enter). There simply isn't enough room on the metal remote to control all of the functions of a video player. Sorry. You should be able to play most audio discs on the DX-5 with the metal remote though.

I understand the dilemma, but 99% of discs actually don't need the navigation keys to play the video, only if you want to see the special features and such. I don't want buttons for all of that. I believe I would not be in the minority to actually want just an "enter" button on the remote. That way the disc would load and come to the menu screen where "Play" is always highlighted on the disc menu. It would just need to press "enter". If the remote just had an "enter" button then it would be complete on playing any disc format with the KXR remote. If somehow you could program the remote's "play" button to become an "enter" button when a "play" button doesn't work on a Blu Ray menu screen that would be awesome. If not have it send a "play" command and an "enter" command at the same time so it works with all discs; that would solve the problem. It was a thought that I believe many customers would like. Then again, maybe most at this level has a Crestron or other remote system and doesn't actually use the factory supplied remotes.

Thanks for at least listening.

Jeff


Best,
Charles Hansen
Ayre Acoustics, Inc.
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post #1277 of 1445 Old 10-05-2013, 02:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles Hansen View Post

Helo Sword,
Quote:
Going to an 8 amp AC line fuse will work fine for the MX-R power amp. The fuse will only blow in the case of drastic overload, for example if one of the transformers were to short circuit. In a case like that, either fuse will blow immediately. Just don't replace the fuse with a piece of solid copper rod or something silly like that. On the other hand I doubt that it will make much sonic difference. Let us know what you hear please! smile.gif

Best regards,
Charles Hansen
Ayre Acoustics, Inc.

Charles,

I would never believed fuses made that big of a difference. Here are some of my experiences so far with the new fuses. I replaced the following fuses thus far.

I replaced the IEC fuse on the DX-5
IEC fuse on the KX-R
IEC fuse on both MX-Rs.

I have not replaced the PCB fuses as of yet because they were out of stock on those sizes but I will soon.

I replaced them one at a time and listened over the course of 24 hours to the differences. I replaced the DX-5 fuse first. I listen with the new fuse and then listened with the factory fuse and then switched back and forth. It was confirmed. The bass response was deeper and richer. All string instruments sounded more real and the bass frequencies were deeper and more pronounced. The higher frequencies sounded muddied. I listened for a few days and decided to call because I didn't like the sound of the higher frequencies. I loved acoustic music or baritone male voices (and even explosions in movies) but something was missing from before and I didn't know what. I had just replaced a fuse.

The supplier told me that because more energy was released into the room the higher frequencies were being affected and that I needed to move my speakers around until the higher frequencies came into the clarity that was needed. With more energy being released, it changed the reflections off of walls, panels, etc... It made sense so I did that. I spent 4 hours moving my speakers inches at a time. I must admit, at one point I got frustrated. I almost took the fuses out and went back to where my speakers were originally and just live without the better midrange and bass. None the less, I endured and got rewarded. Those fuses were an amazing investment on the overall completeness of the sound. I bought full range speakers because I wanted bass down to 20-22 Hz without a subwoofer and these fuses helped me to realize the potential of that bass. I guess that is what makes this hobby addicting. Very small things really change the sound of the system. Is that change good or bad is the hard part to figure out by hours of listening to material you know is good. I spent hours listening to test discs and reference recordings to come to my conclusions. Good sound is a moving target because when you are blown away you can't imagine things sounding better (the way I felt after getting the upgrade on the DX-5) but then they do and you are left wondering how much better can it really get if you are happy now? For the first time in 13 years, I am happy with my system and now I am even happier because of a very little fuse. LIfe has a sense of humor.

Either way, I actually recommend this upgrade. Charles, I believe you should listen to the difference because I would love to hear your thoughts on it. As I replaced the remaining fuses in the system, the dynamic range improved and the magical midrange really opened up. Every fuse produced a noticeable difference. I must admit the differences were smaller with more fuses I added. The biggest differences was replacing the DX-5 fuse and the MX-R fuses. If you do the upgrade then don't get discouraged with your system sounding darker. Play with speaker placement like you are setting up a system for the first time. It might take you days to get it right, but it is worth it.

Jeff
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post #1278 of 1445 Old 10-06-2013, 12:04 PM
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Dear Jeff,

 

Thank you very much for sharing with us your findings about the new fuses! As both MX-R and DX-5 user, I find this really important info. I look forward to Charles's response and, with his blessing, would put my Ayre gear thru the "refusing" surgery myself. But, Jeff, you forgot to tell us all the vital piece of information: what fuses did you end up buying and installing into DX-5 and MX-R?

 

Also, Jeff, we look forward to your report after you've replaced and properly auditioned the PCB fuses inside your MX-R. Would you oblige?;)

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post #1279 of 1445 Old 10-07-2013, 12:18 AM
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Hello Sword,
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Originally Posted by Sword of Levi View Post

Everything that you mentioned above I have understood from your past posts and the internet and from past conversations with various people in the industry for years. The reason I brought it up again is because I have never seen anything that had such a large gap. The fact that the gap is not that large between CDs and Blu-Rays when played back on a PS3 (of course Dynamic Range Control is disabled on that as well) versus the DX-5.

Is anybody else having this problem? Sword, do you have another Blu-ray player that you can use to compare this issue with? Just any old Blu-ray player will do. I know that many of the other DX-5 owners have a second player for watching 3D and nobody has ever said that there is a difference in this. If there really is, we can fix it, but if it just how the discs are made, there is nothing we can do.
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Also, my kxr remote controls the dx5 but is there a way I can press enter on the kxr remote so that I can start playing a blu ray without the dx5 remote?

I have an idea that might work. Some of the keys have dual functions. Perhaps we can make the remote such that if you press the "Play" button for a short press that it will send the "Play" command, but if you hold the "Play" button for two seconds, when you let go it will send the "Enter" command.

As far as the DC offset instruction go, let me work on that. It would be better to make a detailed set of instructions that you could refer to and I don't have the time right now.

Thanks,
Charles Hansen
Ayre Acoustics, Inc.
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post #1280 of 1445 Old 10-07-2013, 12:38 AM
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Dear Jeff,

Thank you very much for sharing with us your findings about the new fuses! As both MX-R and DX-5 user, I find this really important info. I look forward to Charles's response and, with his blessing, would put my Ayre gear thru the "refusing" surgery myself. But, Jeff, you forgot to tell us all the vital piece of information: what fuses did you end up buying and installing into DX-5 and MX-R?

Also, Jeff, we look forward to your report after you've replaced and properly auditioned the PCB fuses inside your MX-R. Would you oblige?wink.gif

Hello All,

There is no problem with replacing the fuses with some of the "high performance" types being offered on the market now. I have never tried them, simply because the price is so high!. We pay only about $0.25 for a standard industrial grade fuse in large quantities that is made in Germany (Wickmann). We always like to use top-quality parts, simply for reliability reasons. There are typically around 1000 different parts in something as complex as a Blu-ray player and if just one of them fails, then the machine needs to be repaired. But when you are talking about a fuse that costs us 100x (!!!) as much as a standard fuse, that is something that we simply cannot afford to do. It is far less expensive to do it yourself.

When you do it yourself, you have to pay normally three or four markups: Actual Manufacturer => "Advertised" Manufacturer => Distributor => Dealer => Customer. If Ayre put them in there would at least one extra mark up. And just as with power cables, there is no way that we could send the correct brand of fuse that would make everybody happy. There are at least four or five brands (if not eight or ten) by now, and some of them even offer different levels of products. And where do we draw the line? With the one AC mains fuse? Or should we replace the four internal fuses as well? As you can see, just as with cables or footers, or things like that, it is better to leave it as an accessory.

We offer our wooden block footers and they are the best I have ever heard (but only for electronics and cables -- they are terrible for loudspeakers!) and they are only $5 each. So if we ever find a way to make better fuses for a price that isn't so silly, we would just offer it as a separate item to sell. Thanks for your understanding.

Best regards,
Charles Hansen
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post #1281 of 1445 Old 10-07-2013, 05:53 AM
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Dear Charles,

Your explanation about why you don't use fancy fuses in your gear makes perfect sense to me. That's what aftermarket tweaks are for!:)

 

While I'm waiting for Jeff's response, let me ask you this. On a previous page you mentioned  solid silver fuses. That raised my interest. You see, that's exactly the kind of cables I use in my system with your (and ARC) gear: Wild range from AQ. Using solid silver fuses sounds like a perfect path forward in my situation. Could you, please, recommend one or two manufacturers that you respect for their work in this field? Kinda like you respect Cardas & AQ in cables department...

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post #1282 of 1445 Old 10-07-2013, 05:33 PM
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Hello All,

There is no problem with replacing the fuses with some of the "high performance" types being offered on the market now. I have never tried them, simply because the price is so high!. We pay only about $0.25 for a standard industrial grade fuse in large quantities that is made in Germany (Wickmann). We always like to use top-quality parts, simply for reliability reasons. There are typically around 1000 different parts in something as complex as a Blu-ray player and if just one of them fails, then the machine needs to be repaired. But when you are talking about a fuse that costs us 100x (!!!) as much as a standard fuse, that is something that we simply cannot afford to do. It is far less expensive to do it yourself.

When you do it yourself, you have to pay normally three or four markups: Actual Manufacturer => "Advertised" Manufacturer => Distributor => Dealer => Customer. If Ayre put them in there would at least one extra mark up. And just as with power cables, there is no way that we could send the correct brand of fuse that would make everybody happy. There are at least four or five brands (if not eight or ten) by now, and some of them even offer different levels of products. And where do we draw the line? With the one AC mains fuse? Or should we replace the four internal fuses as well? As you can see, just as with cables or footers, or things like that, it is better to leave it as an accessory.

We offer our wooden block footers and they are the best I have ever heard (but only for electronics and cables -- they are terrible for loudspeakers!) and they are only $5 each. So if we ever find a way to make better fuses for a price that isn't so silly, we would just offer it as a separate item to sell. Thanks for your understanding.

Best regards,
Charles Hansen
Ayre Acoustics, Inc.

Charles,

I hope that you didn't think that I meant that Ayre should include the fuses. I totally believe it should be left up to the customer which fuses they would like the sound of. I have read that some manufacturers design their equipment to tame the circuit distortions of their products by overdamping. I am not sure every inch of that technical description but I do understand that and it seems sad to me when you have designers such as yourself that doesn't hide things blatantly wrong. I understand audio is a list of compromises but some things are just wrong.

Either way, fuses should be supplied by the customer and not really for the expense of the fuses. It is mainly because fuses can affect the sound so differently, why make everyone pay for fuses they are going to change either way?

Again, thanks for your comments.
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post #1283 of 1445 Old 10-10-2013, 06:59 PM
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Hey Charles,
Any word on when current DX-5 owners can expect to get the DSD upgrade? I am fairly high on the list, but still no word from Ayre about it. I'm sure they are swamped, but on the other hand, the upgrade was announced many months ago and the waiting is painful-especially as we begin to get reports about how substantial the improvement in SQ, not to mention DSD capability.
Thanks,
Rick
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post #1284 of 1445 Old 10-18-2013, 08:12 AM
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Instead we will probably make a Q-5 multi-input DAC and a T-5 transport.

 

This is very interesting. I'm thinking of retiring my standalone players and moving to a DAC-centric setup and I'd love to have an Ayre multi-input DAC on the shortlist. Since the jitter reduction will be 'non-proprietary', I take that to mean your approach will work (hypothetically) with *any* transport and not just a T-5?

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post #1285 of 1445 Old 10-18-2013, 01:43 PM
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This is very interesting. I'm thinking of retiring my standalone players and moving to a DAC-centric setup and I'd love to have an Ayre multi-input DAC on the shortlist. Since the jitter reduction will be 'non-proprietary', I take that to mean your approach will work (hypothetically) with *any* transport and not just a T-5?
Hello Yage,

Thanks for the interesting question. There are two common digital audio connections - S/PDIF and HDMI.

S/PDIF is terrible. It was literally developed not as a way to transport digital audio, but rather as a way to plug one analyzer into each machine coming off of the production line, just to make sure that it worked before it was boxed up and shipped. There was no thought given whatsoever to performance.

The only thing worse for transmitting digital audio is HDMI. As bad as S/PDIF is, HDMI has literally around 100x as much jitter as S/PDIF.

As a manufacturer, you are not in a good place. In order to take a jittery signal and de-jitter it requires money. And there is no way to eliminate the jitter -- only reduce the jitter. So what happens is that the more money you throw at the problem, the less jitter there will be. But there will always be some jitter added by going across either interface, no matter how much money you throw at it.

On the other hand, something like asynchronous USB (a terrible choice of words, as it leads to all kinds of confusion and misleading marketing because of people deliberately taking a unit with an asynchronous sample rate converter (ASRC) and trying to deceive the prospective customer that it is "asynchronous USB". As George Bush used to say, "Nothing could be more further from the truth.")

ASRC chips can measure wonderfully. They are used more and more in all kinds of equipment. The problem is that they kill the music. The way that they work is by literally throwing away all of the original audio data and replacing it with a "best guess" (depending on the algorithm used) of what the data would have been if there had been no jitter in it to begin with. I would never use one in a piece of equipment that had the Ayre brand name on it. Ever.

Since everybody knows that this is a huge problem for digital audio, there has been a solution out in the open for well over a decade now. It is on virtually every piece of professional equipment made since the new millennium. It is called a word clock input. In consumer audio, the only company of which I am aware of that uses this solution is dCS. And of course they make some lovely boxes but one of the problems with them is that they tend to be ungodly expensive...

However, it is an industry standard, and there is a brief mention of it in Annex B of AES Standard 11. So everything we make in the future (when it is appropriate) will have a word clock input and/or output. We can even put an SPDIF receiver on it to extract the word clock from the S/PDIF signal and then the transport will lock to the clock in the DAC rather than the other way around. This will solve a lot of problems.

Any transport we make with an HDMI output will include Audio Rate Control (ARC, not to be confused with Audio Return Channel, which lets the audio from your TV set be piped through your stereo system. But HDMI is going to be replaced by HDBaseT anyway and the one thing missing from HDBaseT is Audio Return Channel, so no big loss.) The only problem here is that the only SSP on the market that has ARC is a Pioneer receiver, that (while excellent for the money) is far from a state-of-the-art unit. However, for those of you with big budgets, we are collaborating with DataSat so that their next generation of SSP's will have Audio Rate Control built in. But that is at least a year away.

The only other way to totally eliminate jitter with just any old transport (which is really quite trivial) unfortunately will not work for video as it de-synchronizes the audio and the video. So we could easily add that feature to an audio-only DAC, but it would be useless for video as that feature would have to be disabled when watching a movie...

So the answer to your question is "eventually". As time goes on, more and more people will add either word clock inputs to their transports and be usable that way, or they will include Audio Rate Control in their SSP's. But today the only other consumer transport that will be compatible will be the dCS products.

The other option is to use a computer as your transport. If you don't care about surround sound, you can purchase a QB-9-DSD and watch movies in "HT 2.0" with no jitter. I've no idea what the picture quality is like from a computer, but I doubt that it is as good as with something like the DX-5-DSD. Well, that is an unfair comparison as the PQ of the DX-5 (DSD or not) is far beyond anything else on the market. So I guess what I meant was whether the PQ of a computer is comparable to an ordinary Blu-ray player. Opinions from those with direct experience would be welcomed. If that is a viable option, it would be quite trivial to make a multi-channel asynchronous USB DAC. But there would be no reason to make one unless a computer is actually capable of delivering high PQ.

Thanks,
Charles Hansen
Ayre Acoustics, Inc.
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post #1286 of 1445 Old 10-19-2013, 08:27 AM
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Hi Charles,

 

Wow, thanks for the explanation of the shortcomings of S/PDIF. It seems that Benchmark's DAC's use ASRCs in their 'UltraLock' jitter reduction system. I think there are a few DACs out there that output the word clock as well - Mytek Digital's Stereo192 comes to mind, though their background is in pro audio. Fewer still are any transports that accept a word clock input. Do you think some sort of data buffer on the receiver end would obviate the need for word clock distribution, at least for consumer applications?

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post #1287 of 1445 Old 10-19-2013, 04:39 PM
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Hello Yage,

Yes, the ultimate "buffer" is to rip the CD to your computer and then play it on an asynchronous USB DAC. smile.gif

We can put smaller buffers into a DAC + Transport combo, but as I said, it is useless for video as you lose all sync between the audio and the video.

The best solution (which will take years to become prevalent) is to put a word clock output on the DACs and a word clock input on the transports. Then the transport will lock to the DAC in a completely non-proprietary way. That is what we will be doing down the road, and I think a lot of people will follow suit. But you will also notice that hardly anybody makes transports any more...

I am sure that a good mod guy like Ric Schulz at Electronic Visionary Systems could easily add a word-clock input to just about any transport ever made for somewhere between $200 and $800. It's mostly a question of supply and demand. If a very popular product comes out, he can make 100 kits at a time and it is very easy for him to do. If it is some weird one-off project, he would have to do all of the work just to modify one unit and it would cost a lot more as he couldn't amortize any of the development costs.

www.tweakaudio.com

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Charles Hansen
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post #1288 of 1445 Old 10-20-2013, 03:06 PM
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Charles,

Did you ever have time to post the DC offset instructions? If so that would be great. Thank you.

Sword
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post #1289 of 1445 Old 10-20-2013, 11:39 PM
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Dear Sword,

Sorry, not yet. Let me see if I can get our Chief Technician to get to that this week.

Thanks,
Charles Hansen
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post #1290 of 1445 Old 10-21-2013, 10:59 AM
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Charles, I missed you at RMAF, but I did enjoy visiting with your guys at the "Charlie's Record Shop" room. There was a lot of buzz at the show around DSD. I spoke with Mark Waldrep of AIX Records who, like you wasn't enthused. If I understand correctly, his reasons had something to do with the dynamic range for DSD being limited to the first 20 kHz as opposed to PCM. Are your reasons similar, or more to do with the fact that a properly designed filter allows PCM to perform as well as DSD? In other words, do you feel DSD is just unnecessary or actually inferior?

Also, will the Full Glide Tone be available for high res download soon, or am I remembering incorrectly?

Auraliti PK90-USB > Ayre DX-5 > Ayre KX-R > Ayre MX-R > YG Kipod II Signature Passive
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