DBP2011 & DBP-1611 owner's thread. All questions and comments go here. - Page 11 - AVS Forum
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post #301 of 1055 Old 07-27-2010, 05:29 AM
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Originally Posted by DenonLover View Post

I just got a back order notice from JR.com telling me they had no idea when it would ship? I should finally get my Emotiva XPA-2 that was back ordered by mid Aug and if this Denon does not arrive by then I will pick up the Oppo BDP-83. I am ready to be done with my HT room so I can set everything up and move on. I might even change my name to OppoLover.

HAHA you fair weather fan you. But I am starting to agree. PS your gonna love the XPA-2. Specifically if you listen to alot of 2 channel audio/music. I have that and the XPA-3. I just turn on the 2 for music. It is a sick set up. Light years more accurate and neutral compared to my 3808CI by itself.
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post #302 of 1055 Old 07-27-2010, 11:20 AM
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Originally Posted by DenonLover View Post

I just got a back order notice from JR.com telling me they had no idea when it would ship? I should finally get my Emotiva XPA-2 that was back ordered by mid Aug and if this Denon does not arrive by then I will pick up the Oppo BDP-83. I am ready to be done with my HT room so I can set everything up and move on. I might even change my name to OppoLover.

DenonLover,

In a previous posting you stated that you ordered the DBP-1611UD. Did it show the item as being in stock at the time you placed the order? If it did, then it seems like J&R may have misled you or got bad info from Denon or their distributor.

I thought the prerequisite for having an item on backorder is to 1st have it in stock? Vanns.com list it as Coming Soon, Amazon.com states This item has not yet been released. But you can pre-order it", J&R states Coming Soon and Notify me when available and OneCall states PRE-ORDER & Ship date uncertain. What the &$%#.

Why do manufacturers continue to announce launch dates that they have no intention of meeting? This really screws the consumer, because it effects some buyers purchase decisions.

I'm glad I have no brand loyalty. Hopefully, it will be shipped sooner rather than later.


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post #303 of 1055 Old 07-27-2010, 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted by bakerwi View Post

DenonLover,

In a previous posting you stated that you ordered the DBP-1611UD. Did it show the item as being in stock at the time you placed the order? If it did, then it seems like J&R may have misled you or got bad info from Denon or their distributor.

I thought the prerequisite for having an item on backorder is to 1st have it in stock? Vanns.com list it as Coming Soon, Amazon.com states This item has not yet been released. But you can pre-order it", J&R states Coming Soon and Notify me when available and OneCall states PRE-ORDER & Ship date uncertain. What the &$%#.

Why do manufacturers continue to announce launch dates that they have no intention of meeting? This really screws the consumer, because it effects some buyers purchase decisions.

I'm glad I have no brand loyalty. Hopefully, it will be shipped sooner rather than later.


Willie

I thought I remember it saying it would ship near the end of the month (had exact date) and so I was fine with it. I do tend to be pretty brand loyal once I find something that works but we are living in a different world right now. I work for a major trucking company in a management position and when I meet with customers now I keep hearing the same thing, we do not keep much if any inventory. Then the mnfg's ship it directly to the customer. After having order lots of different items over the last month or so very few items actually were in stock and shipped?
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post #304 of 1055 Old 07-30-2010, 07:23 AM
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Looking at Blu-Raystats.com I see most of the movies I want to watch are encoded with DTS-MA 24bit.

I'm planning on picking up a Denon AVR-4311ci when they become available.

Is the DBP-1611 able to send unmolested Video/Audio (including DTS-MA) to the 4311 for processing?

I don't see any reference to DTS-MA in the 1611 manual, or is DTS-HD the same thing as DTS-MA?
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post #305 of 1055 Old 07-30-2010, 07:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scamps View Post

Looking at Blu-Raystats.com I see most of the movies I want to watch are encoded with DTS-MA 24bit.

I'm planning on picking up a Denon AVR-4311ci when they become available.

Is the DBP-1611 able to send unmolested Video/Audio (including DTS-MA) to the 4311 for processing?

I don't see any reference to DTS-MA in the 1611 manual, or is DTS-HD the same thing as DTS-MA?

Scamps,

They are the same. DTS-HD Master Audio


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post #306 of 1055 Old 07-30-2010, 02:27 PM
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Re "is DTS-HD the same thing as DTS-MA?": The confusion on this IMO comes from using "DTS-HD" as a shorthand way to refer to DTS' lossless codec. It's not accurate. Technically, no they are not the same because there is no such thing as "DTS-HD" if we fully comport with DTS' nomenclature. There is DTS-HD High Resolution (high bitrate lossy) and DTS-HD Master Audio (lossless).
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post #307 of 1055 Old 07-30-2010, 02:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Paul.R.S View Post

Re "is DTS-HD the same thing as DTS-MA?": The confusion on this IMO comes from using "DTS-HD" as a shorthand way to refer to DTS' lossless codec. It's not accurate. Technically, no they are not the same because there is no such thing as "DTS-HD" if we fully comport with DTS' nomenclature. There is DTS-HD High Resolution (high bitrate lossy) and DTS-HD Master Audio (lossless).

According to the manual the 1611 streams "DTS-HD"
So where does that leave us? Does it do DTS-HD-HR or DTS-HD-MA or both or neither or do we just have to wait until someone has one?
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post #308 of 1055 Old 07-30-2010, 02:59 PM
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I think the manual is just sloppily continuing the shorthand. I'm of course speculating but at this stage in player development I'd be very surprised if a Denon deck didn't stream both.
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post #309 of 1055 Old 07-30-2010, 03:03 PM
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DTS-HD/MA and DTS-HD/HR are both components of the the Blu-ray DTS Essentials component pack.
Every new BD player to market should bitstream both codecs.

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post #310 of 1055 Old 07-31-2010, 07:27 AM
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Is the major difference between these two units is one has legacy multichannel analog out and the other doesn't?
Any other significant differences besides just price?
Has anybody found out if these units will play SACD via HDMI at full audio resolution?
Would really like to get a player that will do all blu-ray, SACD and DVD-A but want full audio resolution of all of these formats.
Wish these had Denon link as well, but if it will pass full audio via HDMI then that will still work.
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post #311 of 1055 Old 07-31-2010, 08:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JJHXBR View Post

Is the major difference between these two units is one has legacy multichannel analog out and the other doesn't?
Any other significant differences besides just price?
Has anybody found out if these units will play SACD via HDMI at full audio resolution?
Would really like to get a player that will do all blu-ray, SACD and DVD-A but want full audio resolution of all of these formats.
Wish these had Denon link as well, but if it will pass full audio via HDMI then that will still work.

Biggest difference is the 2011 uses the new ABT chip. Someone earlier in the thread said DenonJeff told him yes to SACD.

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post #312 of 1055 Old 07-31-2010, 10:32 AM
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Originally Posted by teachsac View Post

Biggest difference is the 2011 uses the new ABT chip. Someone earlier in the thread said DenonJeff told him yes to SACD.

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Thanks teachsac for the info.
I tried to download the 1611 owner's manual from the Denon website but it won't download.
All I can get is the 1611 product sheet which really doesn't tell you much.
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post #313 of 1055 Old 08-01-2010, 08:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scamps View Post

I'm planning on picking up a Denon AVR-4311ci when they become available.

Is the DBP-1611 able to send unmolested Video/Audio (including DTS-MA) to the 4311 for processing?

There is a pure/direct mode on the 1611. I'm planning the same setup, using the AVR-3311ci for video processing. Not sure how the AVR decodes the audio.

Batpig?
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post #314 of 1055 Old 08-02-2010, 05:22 PM
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Crutchfield is taking pre-orders on the 1611. They also have free shipping till Sept 15 on all orders.
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post #315 of 1055 Old 08-03-2010, 04:39 AM
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Historically speaking, do brick and mortar dealers receive new Denon products before online retailers or do they all get it at about the same time?
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post #316 of 1055 Old 08-03-2010, 07:53 PM
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Saw my first 1611 today at my local Denon dealer.
It was still sealed in the box and ready to go out for install.
This means somebody should be able to have some feedback on this soon.
I'm still waiting to find out if the 1611 will output FULL sacd audio resolution over HDMI.
I couldn't find anything in the operating manual that tells you about this.
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post #317 of 1055 Old 08-03-2010, 07:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scamps View Post

Historically speaking, do brick and mortar dealers receive new Denon products before online retailers or do they all get it at about the same time?

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Originally Posted by JJHXBR View Post

Saw my first 1611 today at my local Denon dealer.

I guess that answers that.
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post #318 of 1055 Old 08-03-2010, 08:19 PM
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Well I hope mine gets shipped this week (no later than next week)! My Emotiva XPA-2 gets shipped on the 9th and I hope my 1611 will arrive about the same time so I can install them both in my cabinet at the same time. Then I will run Audyssey and be done with all of my upgrades for another 8 years or so. Not kidding, I love to hyper focus on something and then once it is set up, forget about it.
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post #319 of 1055 Old 08-04-2010, 02:11 PM
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After spending more than an hour going from department to department I got the answer I didn't want to hear.
The 1611 Super Audio CD audio signals are output at 44.1 kHz/16-bit when the HDMI output is used.
This is the answer I got and is essentially the same as the Denon 4010 and really defeats most of the purpose of SACD.
If this is indeed the case with the 1611 and 2011 models, Denon has really really dropped the ball, IMO.
At least with most of the other Denon players you can get FULL SACD resolution using Denon Link 3.
Since the 1611 & 2011 don't have Denon Link you are pretty much screwed when it comes to SACD playback.
Still waiting for an actual owner to confirm this, but my info was straight from Denon.
Had high hopes of getting an affordable player that will do it all, but now looks like I may have to use 2 players after all.
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post #320 of 1055 Old 08-04-2010, 02:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JJHXBR View Post

. . . The 1611 Super Audio CD audio signals are output at 44.1 kHz/16-bit when the HDMI output is used. This . . . really defeats most of the purpose of SACD. . . . At least with most of the other Denon players you can get FULL SACD resolution using Denon Link 3. Since the 1611 & 2011 don't have Denon Link you are pretty much screwed when it comes to SACD playback.

Be mindful of hyperbole please. It's my surmise/understanding that full rez will be available via the analog outs of the 2011. So it's not accurate to say we're "screwed" on SA-CD playback on the 2011.

Be that as it may, it's an odd, vexing choice Denon has made for at least the 1611 HDMI out for SA-CD.
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post #321 of 1055 Old 08-04-2010, 02:23 PM
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Originally Posted by JJHXBR View Post

Still waiting for an actual owner to confirm this, but my info was straight from Denon. (

Strange. I got the opposite answer from Denon. Of course, as soon as someone actually uses one of these, we will know.

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post #322 of 1055 Old 08-04-2010, 02:49 PM
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Strange. I got the opposite answer from Denon. Of course, as soon as someone actually uses one of these, we will know.

How sad is it that you can't get a consistent answer about such a feature.
x100

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post #323 of 1055 Old 08-04-2010, 03:30 PM
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How sad is it that you can't get a consistent answer about such a feature.
x100

Doesn't surprise me. New product. CSRs are not yet up to speed on "obscure" issues.

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post #324 of 1055 Old 08-04-2010, 08:38 PM
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Doesn't surprise me. New product. CSRs are not yet up to speed on "obscure" issues.

CSRs are never up to date on just about anything it seems anymore.
Other than the most menial things like, "why won't my BD play on this HD DVD player".
They just read what ever is in the CSR handbook.
Knowing how SACD playback is handled in a universal player that specifically includes SACD as a feature, is not "obscure" IMO.
I can certainly understand how someone may come by some misinformation at some point, but for the other poster to have been transferred around all over the place to later FINALLY get an answer to his question, only with the ultimate outcome just being confusion due to the conflicting information that you had received from them as well.
I just don't get it. How frickin hard is it for the engineers to take a few hours to write all the specs down, make some photo copies of it, and give one to every CSR?
We can just assume the question is rhetorical, since I don't think anyone knows the answer.

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post #325 of 1055 Old 08-05-2010, 01:47 AM
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Checking the 1611 manual, I see that supports MPEG2 files through network connection (.mpg/.mpeg extensions), and I'm wondering if this means that it's able to read also .vob files, some (original!) DVD’s that I store on Qnap NAS for my daughter. I know that the extensions are different, but the content is MPEG2... or not?

Thanks!
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post #326 of 1055 Old 08-05-2010, 11:55 AM
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My Denon 3910 stopped playing CDs (oddly enough DVDs work fine), so I started looking into replacing it. I figure getting 3D functionality now isn't a bad idea so I don't have to buy new components later if I go with a 3D TV and/or receiver.

For right now though, I'll be hooking this up to an AVR-3806 and am wondering which player would work for me - the 1611 or the 2011. If the receiver does a better job with the processing than either of the players I figure I can go with the 1611, but I wanted to double check with somebody more knowledgable. Thanks!
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My Denon 3910 stopped playing CDs (oddly enough DVDs work fine), so I started looking into replacing it. I figure getting 3D functionality now isn't a bad idea so I don't have to buy new components later if I go with a 3D TV and/or receiver.

For right now though, I'll be hooking this up to an AVR-3806 and am wondering which player would work for me - the 1611 or the 2011. If the receiver does a better job with the processing than either of the players I figure I can go with the 1611, but I wanted to double check with somebody more knowledgable. Thanks!

For the price difference, I'd go with the 1611. I play all my stuff direct and let the AV receiver handle the scaling or non scaling.
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post #328 of 1055 Old 08-05-2010, 09:43 PM
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When I hook up my DBP-1611 to my Denon 4308 is it going to show Multi-Channel In or is it going to show Master Audio when I play a disk in Master Audio. Right now I have a PS3 and when I am in the PS3 forum they say this is normal. Will it finally read Master Audio?
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post #329 of 1055 Old 08-05-2010, 11:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JJHXBR View Post

The 1611 Super Audio CD audio signals are output at 44.1 kHz/16-bit
...

At least with most of the other Denon players you can get FULL SACD resolution using Denon Link 3.
Since the 1611 & 2011 don't have Denon Link you are pretty much screwed when it comes to SACD playback.

The manual says it does DSD bitstream via HDMI so not having DL isn't a big deal. In any case do you know exactly what the Denon AVRs do to the DSD-PCM decoding inside (at what resolution) if you don't choose DSD direct decoding?

If what you were told is true, it's incredible when some CDPs and external DACs have done upsampling to CDs for a long time and in this day and age Denon chooses to downsample SACD to CD resolution.

Audiosceptics accept audio trials using 25 people. A recent Oxford study with over 353,000 patient records from 639 separate clinical trials shows for every 1,000 people taking diclofenac or ibuprofen there would be 3 additional heart attacks, 4 more cases of heart failure and 1 death every year.

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post #330 of 1055 Old 08-06-2010, 04:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Evil-Rage View Post

My Denon 3910 stopped playing CDs (oddly enough DVDs work fine), so I started looking into replacing it. I figure getting 3D functionality now isn't a bad idea so I don't have to buy new components later if I go with a 3D TV and/or receiver.

I had this happen with my Denon DVD-1920. That is, CDs would not work, but DVDs worked perfectly. Indeed, it could read SACD layers but not the CD layers of an SACD. There's probably a little dust on the laser head unit that is preventing the CD laser from focusing properly. You can probably fix it easily.

1. Unplug it.
2. Take off the cover.
3. Thoroughly swab the laser pickup with a cotton swab soaked in rubbing alcohol. Then wipe it off with the dry end of the swab.
4. Repeat step 3 several times (Important!).
5. Put the cover back on.
6. Plug it back in.

CDs should work after that. I did this a few months ago, and have had no problems since. I recommend doing it several times in one go because I had to go through the hassle of opening up the unit several times as I apparently did not clean it thoroughly and properly the first couple of times. The third time was the charm.

I'm a bit dismayed about the bad news regarding SACD through HDMI. We could really use verification on that. If I have to buy the 2011 and use the analog outs for 5.1 SACD, then I'm not buying. My DVD-1920 is still working perfectly, and I can run Blu-ray through my computer.
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