New Oppo BDP93 Blu-ray Player - Page 10 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #271 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 06:47 PM
Member
 
kc8apf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Campbell, CA
Posts: 182
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
[quote=Bill Mac;19253726]
Quote:
Originally Posted by scanspeak View Post


I would have to disagree that the 93 will use the same DACs as the 83SE. My thoughts are that Oppo puts a $400.00 premium on the 83SE over the 83 and for that reason will not offer the 93 at $499.00 with the 83SE's DACs. I also think Oppo would not want to anger those that just paid a premium for the 83SE (myself included) by offering the performance of the 83SE in the 93 for $499.00, no way.

Electronics tend to drop in value over time, but consumer electronics companies rarely change the prices on their products unless they have been superseded by a new product. Just because the 83SE hasn't dropped in price since its release doesn't imply that the equipment inside still has the same production cost. It is quite possible that the DACs and analog equipment in the 83SE can be included in the 93 and still hit the $499 price point.

As for angering customers, releasing a new product will _always_ anger some subset of customers. There is always someone who will buy the old model days before the new one is released that is bitter and complains. If the supply of the old model is depleted before the new one is release, someone will complain that the old model isn't available. There isn't a way to do a smooth transition to a new product without upsetting anyone. Imagine if they dropped the price on the 83SE to prepare for the 93. Someone would complain that they had _just_ bought an 83SE and should be entitled to the lower price.
kc8apf is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #272 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 06:59 PM
Member
 
scanspeak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 111
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 10
kc8apf, I agree.
Oppo have always provided performance far in excess of similar priced competition and to continue along this path, they will need to "up the ante".
A lot of current 83 owners won't bother upgrading to the 93 unless there's a significant performance improvement (3D isn't compelling enough in my opinion).
scanspeak is offline  
post #273 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 07:00 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Bill Mac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 11,553
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 152 Post(s)
Liked: 483
[quote=kc8apf;19254060]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post


Electronics tend to drop in value over time, but consumer electronics companies rarely change the prices on their products unless they have been superseded by a new product. Just because the 83SE hasn't dropped in price since its release doesn't imply that the equipment inside still has the same production cost. It is quite possible that the DACs and analog equipment in the 83SE can be included in the 93 and still hit the $499 price point.

As for angering customers, releasing a new product will _always_ anger some subset of customers. There is always someone who will buy the old model days before the new one is released that is bitter and complains. If the supply of the old model is depleted before the new one is release, someone will complain that the old model isn't available. There isn't a way to do a smooth transition to a new product without upsetting anyone. Imagine if they dropped the price on the 83SE to prepare for the 93. Someone would complain that they had _just_ bought an 83SE and should be entitled to the lower price.

I guess anger is not the correct word, more like disappointment of buying a product at a premium then seeing a similar product from the same company for less. I just do not see Oppo releasing the 93 with all the performance of the 83SE. I have seen some in this thread questioning if Oppo could keep the $499.00 price point with 1.4 HDMI/3D and streaming upgrades. Those questions without even mentioning having the DACs of the 83SE. If you think about what would Oppo then have to offer in the way of performance upgrades for the 93SE?

Bill

My SACD collection, watch it grow and my wallet shrink ;-).

 

Denon 4311 (in preamp mode), Parasound 2100, Boston Acoustics A7200 amp, Oppo BDP-103, Consonance CD120, Panasonic TC-P60GT50 plasma, Panamax 5100EX, Salk Song Towers, Song Center, ADS 300C (surrounds) and two Rythmik F12SEs.
Bill Mac is offline  
post #274 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 07:10 PM
AVS Special Member
 
drbonbi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Brunswick, ME
Posts: 5,700
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
From the first post:

Quote:
Carrying the same retail price ($499), Oppo's BDP-93 has upped
the bar by adding new networking/streaming features, increased
performance and improved build quality
. The Oppo BDP-93 will do
virtually everything the BDP-83 BD player did, plus have some major
feature upgrades like Netflix streaming and dual HDMI outputs.

Dana

"If you think you can, or think you can't, you're probably right." Mark Twain
drbonbi is offline  
post #275 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 07:12 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Bill Mac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 11,553
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 152 Post(s)
Liked: 483
Quote:
Originally Posted by scanspeak View Post

kc8apf, I agree.
Oppo have always provided performance far in excess of similar priced competition and to continue along this path, they will need to "up the ante".
A lot of current 83 owners won't bother upgrading to the 93 unless there's a significant performance improvement (3D isn't compelling enough in my opinion).

Do you really think that Oppo is offering an updated 83 so current 83 owners will buy it? The reason Oppo is updating the 83 to the 93 is to stay current with features now available (HDMI 1.4/3D and streaming) with lower priced BR players. If current 83 owners buy the 93 then thats great for Oppo. But I highly doubt Oppo is updating the 83 to the 93 with the intention of enticing current 83 owners alone. I think Oppo is more concerned with enticing buyers who are looking at BR players from Denon, Panasonic, Pioneer and Sony.

I agree that Oppo has always offered outstanding performance for the cost. But it would not make sense for Oppo to offer the updates of the 93 over the 83 and the DACs of the 83SE. But one can always hope for it though.

Bill

My SACD collection, watch it grow and my wallet shrink ;-).

 

Denon 4311 (in preamp mode), Parasound 2100, Boston Acoustics A7200 amp, Oppo BDP-103, Consonance CD120, Panasonic TC-P60GT50 plasma, Panamax 5100EX, Salk Song Towers, Song Center, ADS 300C (surrounds) and two Rythmik F12SEs.
Bill Mac is offline  
post #276 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 07:36 PM
AVS Special Member
 
drbonbi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Brunswick, ME
Posts: 5,700
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
It has just come to my attention that the OPPO BDP-83 is sold out on OPPO's web site.

Quote:
Due to a shortage of major components, we have ceased production of this model.

It is sold out on Amazon too.

Dana

"If you think you can, or think you can't, you're probably right." Mark Twain
drbonbi is offline  
post #277 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 07:39 PM
AVS Special Member
 
tkbryant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Chicago
Posts: 1,594
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by drbonbi View Post

It has just come to my attention that the OPPO BDP-83 is sold out on OPPO's web site.



It is sold out on Amazon too.

Dana

Maybe they'll make that November release date afterall.
tkbryant is offline  
post #278 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 07:56 PM
AVS Special Member
 
drbonbi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Brunswick, ME
Posts: 5,700
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
The 83SE remains available but since that model shares components with the 83, OPPO will be limited to stock on hand. The projected wait for its replacement - apparently to be called the 95 - is much further away.

Dana

"If you think you can, or think you can't, you're probably right." Mark Twain
drbonbi is offline  
post #279 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 08:14 PM
Member
 
slipstream8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 19
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Methodical_1 View Post

I saw this thread. I literally had just hit the buy button on Oppo's site.
...

You, too, huh? Had to call them and Modwright both to postpone my intended order and mods until the new players come out.

Maybe I can be a Modwright beta-tester for the tubed BDP-95 in six months.

Thanks to ca1ore for the heads up!

. . . and I agree that 3D will be mostly garbage (PQ and content-wise) for some time, so I'm not waiting around because of that new feature. Two HDMI outputs can be used to completely separate the audio and video signals a la Ayre's impressive but expensive DX-5. This is very good news for those of us who can't spend $10k on a player.
slipstream8 is offline  
post #280 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 08:22 PM
AVS Special Member
 
progprog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: The Other Washington
Posts: 9,342
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by slipstream8 View Post

Two HDMI outputs can be used to completely separate the audio and video signals a la Ayre's impressive but expensive DX-5. This is very good news for those of us who can't spend $10k on a player.

Two HDMI outs is certainly a convenience, but it doesn't actually separate the audio and video. They are packaged together in HDMI streams, so they're both going out simultaneously to both outputs. It's just that the destination (display, processor, etc.) only uses one part of the stream.
progprog is offline  
post #281 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 08:28 PM
AVS Special Member
 
slimoli's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Miami area
Posts: 4,682
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Liked: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by progprog View Post

Two HDMI outs is certainly a convenience, but it doesn't actually separate the audio and video. They are packaged together in HDMI streams, so they're both going out simultaneously to both outputs. It's just that the destination (display, processor, etc.) only uses one part of the stream.

The panasonic 350 can send audio only on 1 of the HDMI outputs.

Standard Definition Causes Lung Cancer, Heart Disease, Emphysema, And May Complicate Pregnancy
slimoli is offline  
post #282 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 08:31 PM
gsr
Oppo Beta Group
 
gsr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Massachusetts, USA
Posts: 7,544
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 122 Post(s)
Liked: 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by slimoli View Post

The panasonic 350 can send audio only on 1 of the HDMI outputs.

It most likely has to package up at least a dummy, blank video signal in order to pull that off. The video on the 2 outputs doesn't have to be identical, but I believe ProgProg is correct in that there has to be some sort of video signal for audio to be present over HDMI.
gsr is online now  
post #283 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 08:36 PM
AVS Special Member
 
gonk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Memphis, TN
Posts: 3,308
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by gsr View Post

It most likely has to package up at least a dummy, blank video signal in order to pull that off. The video on the 2 outputs doesn't have to be identical, but I believe ProgProg is correct in that there has to be some sort of video signal for audio to be present over HDMI.

That's been my understanding for many years, as well. Thinking back to the OPPO DVD players, I recall that SACD and DVD-Audio multichannel output only worked when the output resolution was at least 720p because the video signal bandwidth determined the available audio signal bandwidth and a 480p signal didn't provide enough audio bandwidth for multichannel LPCM. Panasonic is most likely outputting an HD video signal with no useful content on the "audio" HDMI output.

gonk
Beta tester: BDP-83 / BDP-80
gonk is offline  
post #284 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 08:36 PM
AVS Special Member
 
mariob33's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Holbrook, Ma
Posts: 1,711
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Send a message via Skype™ to mariob33
I for one am excited to hear the streaming options oppo has decided to add. I was seriously considering the Denon units, but given this info and my base expectation that the core will be as solid as the 80/83 the new unit may become a no-brainer. I will def be one of the trade up consumers. I'm hoping they can squeeze out the same level of perfection from the Qdeo chip as they did for ABT. Do folks. Know if 3D will ship day one enabled or will it be a fw push?

In search of video bliss...
mariob33 is online now  
post #285 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 08:38 PM
AVS Special Member
 
progprog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: The Other Washington
Posts: 9,342
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by slimoli View Post

The panasonic 350 can send audio only on 1 of the HDMI outputs.

And how does it matter, even if it can? It's still the same digital data whether the video data is there or not, and whether the video is being processed or not. (I believe the video data IS there.)
progprog is offline  
post #286 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 08:45 PM
AVS Special Member
 
drbonbi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Brunswick, ME
Posts: 5,700
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by subavision212 View Post

The Roku units will pass through 5.1 (not all of them, though. I think the lowest priced units won't. All others have an optical audio output). Of course you need content with 5.1 which Netflix doesn't do right now (announced coming soon) and Amazon VOD has movies that do have it. sorry if OT. just answering the question.

I just checked the three Roku boxes. All three have HDMI. The lowest priced one is limited to 720p. The other two Roku claims to be capable of 1080p. All three do 5.1 audio pass through via HDMI.

Quote:
So if the 83 is out of stock and the new player is up and coming, where does that leave us 83 owners as far as firmware updates. Boy, I was so proud that I finally got my unit hooked up to my network (had to drill holes, buy cable etc.) for easy updates and may not be able to see it happen now. Hmmph!

OPPO has continued to support its products after the sale. If you have a fairly new 83, the firmware already may be up-to-date representing a lengthy development process over time.

I ought to know. I've owned five of its players.

Dana

"If you think you can, or think you can't, you're probably right." Mark Twain
drbonbi is offline  
post #287 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 08:47 PM
AVS Special Member
 
slimoli's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Miami area
Posts: 4,682
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Liked: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by progprog View Post

And how does it matter, even if it can? It's still the same digital data whether the video data is there or not, and whether or not the video is being processed or not. (I believe the video data IS there.)

Do you know how does it work on the Pioneer 09 ? I am curious about the FULL video/audio HDMI outputs at the same time and what can be done with 2 HDMI 1.4 . The Panasonic has 1 1.4 and 1 1.3. The Pioneer has 2 1.3.

Standard Definition Causes Lung Cancer, Heart Disease, Emphysema, And May Complicate Pregnancy
slimoli is offline  
post #288 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 09:18 PM
AVS Special Member
 
ca1ore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Stamford, CT
Posts: 1,798
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I much prefer the styling of the 93 over the 83, which I have always found to look a bit 'cheesy'. It would be nice to get a confirmation that the 93 retains the same functionality for SACD and DVD-A - although, I'd assume it would.

It will be interesting to see what the 95 ends up looking like. I have no use for improved analog output, but an upgraded powers supply , etc. would be nice.

Certainty and conviction are a sure sign you don't know what you're talking about! The world is not black and white, rather shades of grey!
ca1ore is offline  
post #289 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 09:32 PM
Member
 
slipstream8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 19
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by progprog View Post

And how does it matter, even if it can? It's still the same digital data whether the video data is there or not, and whether the video is being processed or not. (I believe the video data IS there.)

Take a look at Charles Hansen's explanations over on the DX-5 thread. He explains it much better than me, but the [simplified] idea is you can create constant signal for the video portion. Then by separating the power supplies that support the two different HDMI output jacks you can obtain a lower noise floor for both the audio and video signals.

I'm just learning this stuff, but it's all very interesting.

Cheers.
slipstream8 is offline  
post #290 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 10:53 PM
Advanced Member
 
Charles Hansen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Boulder, Colorado USA (that's actually my Doppelgänger)
Posts: 952
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by dazzerxxx View Post

This may be of interest. It's not an assessment but it does provide some visual simulations of what the various processing options are supposed to do - http://www.sidchapters.org/ba/Archiv...ID%20Mar09.pdf

I've observed the Marvell 88DE2710 in the Pio LX91 (09FD). With DVD it appeared to same similar scaling to the VRS. PAL film deinterlacing was better than the VRS in auto mode.

Did anybody look at the PDF?

Doesn't seem like the best way to promote a product. The before and after shots from the "Fifth Element" were completely unimpressive. The General look like he had spotted fever.

Then the first "Intelligent Color Management" showed three young women on a picnic blanket. The most obvious differences were that the sky was change to a shade of blue never before seen on this planet, and the grass was a perfect rendition of plastic AstroTurf.

The grey-scale was a mixed bag. The outer edges looked slightly smoother, but the large steps in the center ended up with annoying artifacts.

If Oppo switches to Marvell, I hope that the real-life performance is better than their brochure.

Charles Hansen
Ayre Acoustics, Inc.
Charles Hansen is offline  
post #291 of 1323 Old 09-27-2010, 11:17 PM
Member
 
Methodical_1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 53
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Welp, guess I will be waiting for the new player after all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by drbonbi View Post

It has just come to my attention that the OPPO BDP-83 is sold out on OPPO's web site.



It is sold out on Amazon too.

Dana

Methodical_1 is offline  
post #292 of 1323 Old 09-28-2010, 12:07 AM
cwt
AVS Special Member
 
cwt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: nsw australia
Posts: 1,229
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked: 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by slipstream8 View Post

Take a look at Charles Hansen's explanations over on the DX-5 thread. He explains it much better than me, but the [simplified] idea is you can create constant signal for the video portion. Then by separating the power supplies that support the two different HDMI output jacks you can obtain a lower noise floor for both the audio and video signals.

I'm just learning this stuff, but it's all very interesting.

Cheers.

It certainly is . We can only hope but something tells me the 93 will have the standard switch mode psu and not an electrically isolated one decoupled one like you pay for with the ayre . To partially quote Mr Hansen;
Quote:
There is a separate power transformer that runs all of the audio circuitry, which is separated from the video side by a bank of opto-isolators. So the audio and video "sides" have separate grounds that are completely galvanically isolated.

I hope thats accurate Charles btw I gather from your comments that the video chip is a reason you may not develop a dx5 mk2 ?

On the price debate; The $499 price point may conceivably be possible with the ess dacs when you consider the upmarket 4 stacked stereo dacs arent on it and the lesser multichannel es9006 is . Thats got to save a packet and is similar to what pio did with the 51fd etc ; switched l/r dacs depending on stereo or multichannel needs
cwt is offline  
post #293 of 1323 Old 09-28-2010, 12:13 AM
AVS Special Member
 
progprog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: The Other Washington
Posts: 9,342
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by slipstream8 View Post

Take a look at Charles Hansen's explanations over on the DX-5 thread. He explains it much better than me, but the [simplified] idea is you can create constant signal for the video portion. Then by separating the power supplies that support the two different HDMI output jacks you can obtain a lower noise floor for both the audio and video signals.

I'm just learning this stuff, but it's all very interesting.

Cheers.

We're all constantly learning.

It's important to understand that much of the traditional conversation about analog audio transmission....interference, noise, etc.....does not apply, or at least not in the same way, to digital audio data and its transmission. A player cannot introduce "noise" into the HDMI bitstream any more than, say, a hard drive can somehow add "fuzziness" to the fonts in a pdf file. Font fuzziness can only be "added" by a monitor, the actual output device, and noise can only be added after the digital data has been decoded and converted to analog, when it's manipulated by the components in the "output" chain: typically receiver/processors, amps, speakers, and the cables between them. But before that, it's like that pdf file....data packets containing 1s and 0s.
progprog is offline  
post #294 of 1323 Old 09-28-2010, 12:50 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Neuromancer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Navigating the Black IC
Posts: 10,974
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles Hansen View Post

I sure hope Oppo stays with Anchor Bay. They've been playing this game a lot longer than Marvell and they understand true quality, not silly edge enhancement algorithms that mess the picture up.

And if you follow OPPO's history, they have always had all these enhancers disengaged out of box. It is up to the user to determine if, and how much, enhancement they want to add to the image.

The ABT VRS had Edge and Detail Enhancements. By default, they are turned off. I do not see OPPO changing this trend, as they are well known for their quality, and precise, attention to visual detail.

However, with that said, when it comes to user created content and streaming technologies, there is a need for block and noise reduction. Having a chipset which can actually perform real noise reduction is a major plus for OPPO for this generation of player.
Neuromancer is offline  
post #295 of 1323 Old 09-28-2010, 12:52 AM
Advanced Member
 
Charles Hansen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Boulder, Colorado USA (that's actually my Doppelgänger)
Posts: 952
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by cwt View Post

I hope thats accurate Charles btw I gather from your comments that the video chip is a reason you may not develop a dx5 mk2 ?

The speed at which the BDP-93 has taken off has caught us a bit off guard. The main driver behind the new model appears to be the 3-D chipset. As several people pointed out earlier in this thread, I am unsure if 3-D will have a shelf-life longer than six months.

Our customers are more interested in the ultimate audio and video quality than "gee-whiz" features. So the network streaming (with its extreme compression and subsequent loss of quality) is not very compelling either.

It appears that the BDP-83 is now out of production without warning, so we will have to evaluate our options. We chose the BDP-83 because of its combination of audiophile features (SACD and DVD-Audio support) and superb performance (the outstanding loading times from the system processor and superb video Anchor Bay Technology scaling chips).

Any significant changes from the above recipe will require a careful re-evaluation. It's just not like Ayre to go backwards in performance with new models. And I am somewhat leery of what I saw in the Marvell Qdeo PDF. The best case is if all of those processing "enhancements" can simply be turned off. But one is still left with the deinterlacing performance, including odd cadences and 2:2 pulldown for European titles, along with the scaling performance, ability to work with 24 Hz sources, et cetera, et cetera. I am comfortable with and confident of the ABT chips. The Marvell chips are a completely unknown entity to me.

They apparently have gotten some design wins with some prominent Japanese players, but I don't know what those were based on.
Charles Hansen is offline  
post #296 of 1323 Old 09-28-2010, 12:54 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Highlander_AVS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Italy
Posts: 1,016
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post


I would have to disagree that the 93 will use the same DACs as the 83SE. My thoughts are that Oppo puts a $400.00 premium on the 83SE over the 83 and for that reason will not offer the 93 at $499.00 with the 83SE's DACs. I also think Oppo would not want to anger those that just paid a premium for the 83SE (myself included) by offering the performance of the 83SE in the 93 for $499.00, no way.

......
Bill

Bill

At now specs are not out ...

I believe it depends from the project ....
If they "will kill" the stereo outs and use the LR of the 7.1 analog outs for stereo pourpose it can be possible !
Consider that 1 Sabre 9006 DAC ( used by the SE for 7.1 ) didn't costs too much or at last more than the 2 Cirrus used in the regular version for Stereo + 7.1 outs. The major cost in 83SE is primary for the Sabre32 9016 !

Imho, Stereo path is redondant .... I wonder to see a Flagship with a 7.1 path by a Sabre32 9016 quad configs 8ch.
Stereo path and it's downmix must be implemented via software through the L and R of the 7.1 path

My 2 cents
Highlander_AVS is offline  
post #297 of 1323 Old 09-28-2010, 12:55 AM
Advanced Member
 
Charles Hansen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Boulder, Colorado USA (that's actually my Doppelgänger)
Posts: 952
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by progprog View Post

It's important to understand that much of the traditional conversation about analog audio transmission....interference, noise, etc.....does not apply, or at least not in the same way, to digital audio data and its transmission. A player cannot introduce "noise" into the HDMI bitstream any more than, say, a hard drive can somehow add "fuzziness" to the fonts in a pdf file. Font fuzziness can only be "added" by a monitor, the actual output device, and noise can only be added after the digital data has been decoded and converted to analog, when it's manipulated by the components in the "output" chain: typically receiver/processors, amps, speakers, and the cables between them. But before that, it's like that pdf file....data packets containing 1s and 0s.

That's what one would think. It all makes sense. But for some reason the reality is slightly different....
Charles Hansen is offline  
post #298 of 1323 Old 09-28-2010, 12:57 AM
AVS Special Member
 
progprog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: The Other Washington
Posts: 9,342
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles Hansen View Post

That's what one would think. It all makes sense. But for some reason the reality is slightly different....

'Kay....
progprog is offline  
post #299 of 1323 Old 09-28-2010, 01:05 AM
Advanced Member
 
Charles Hansen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Boulder, Colorado USA (that's actually my Doppelgänger)
Posts: 952
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuromancer View Post

And if you follow OPPO's history, they have always had all these enhancers disengaged out of box. It is up to the user to determine if, and how much, enhancement they want to add to the image.

The ABT VRS had Edge and Detail Enhancements. By default, they are turned off. I do not see OPPO changing this trend, as they are well known for their quality, and precise, attention to visual detail.

However, with that said, when it comes to user created content and streaming technologies, there is a need for block and noise reduction. Having a chipset which can actually perform real noise reduction is a major plus for OPPO for this generation of player.

I personally am not happy to trade off block and noise reduction on poor quality sources for the ultimate performance on high quality sources.

At this point all we have is anecdotal evidence. Several Sony and Pioneer players are now using the Marvell chipset. The BDP-83 and all of the new Denons use the ABT chips. While there are other factors that affect PQ (yes, Virginia, even in this day of HDMI!) I wonder if there is any consensus yet as to whether one group of players bests the other....
Charles Hansen is offline  
post #300 of 1323 Old 09-28-2010, 02:17 AM
Member
 
scanspeak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 111
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 10
If you look at all the latest Sony, Pioneer, and Panasonic models, it appears that there is a race to the bottom in terms of build quality.
Sacrifices in outright performance are being made, and all in the name of more features (who actually watches Youtube on their 1080p TV?) and lower production costs.
I sincerely hope that Oppo isn't following the same path.
scanspeak is offline  
Closed Thread Blu-ray Players

Tags
Oppo Bdp 93 Blu Ray Player

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off