Official OPPO BDP-93 Owner's Thread - Page 22 - AVS Forum

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nathan_h's Avatar nathan_h
02:09 PM Liked: 101
post #631 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 5,144
Joined: Mar 2001
Quote:
Originally Posted by rwinner View Post

I'm glad this came up again since I'm feeling dense about what's the best option in this situation. I, too, have a Nova with a 93 on the way, and I understand that there are licensing restrictions in the output from SACD's. Am I right that I can get the 93 to output (96K?) PCM derived from the SACD stereo layer through the s/pdif output? If that is the case, then what are the options for Nova/93 owners playing SACD? I can think of several:
(1) output the SACD's CD layer via (1a) s/pdif PCM or (1b) FR/FL analog
(2) output the SACD stereo layer converted via (2a) s/pdif PCM or (2b) FR/FL analog
(3) output the downmixed-to-stereo multi-channel layer, but I'm not sure via (3a) s/pdif but probably allowed via (3b) FR/FL
(4) output the FR/FL tracks only from the multi-channel layer via FR/FL analog.
Here's what I understand and please correct my errors:
(A) (1) is no different from playing a regular CD
(B) (2) may be better than (1) but this is controversial. I assume it is true; otherwise, this discussion is moot.
(C) not sure if (3) differs from (2), and if so if it's better or worse
(D) (4) is not desirable.
(E) If my assumption that the 93 can convert the SACD stereo track to PCM is incorrect, I might need to get an HDMI audio decoupler that can do the conversion. I have found the Atlona AT-HD570 and the Kramer FC-46, which are respectively expensive and more expensive potential solutions. I really prefer not to have to do this on the chance of a slight improvement in sacd sound.

I am guessing (F) 2a > 2b > 1a > 1b where ">" means "is better than". I've no idea about (G) ?: 3a > 2a.

I hope for someone to inform me if all these are allowed and possible with the 93 and to opine which of the allowed options is likely to produce the best result, that is, whether (F) is correct and all are allowed and similarly (G). You can assume no interest in multichannel (>2) audio and that I have SACD's. Most of the music I listen to classical, but that may not be relevant.

No way to get any output from any SACD layer (stereo or surround) directly from the optical or coax output.

You may want to compare analog output of the stereo SACD layer using the Oppo's analog outputs versus the PCM output from the CD layer using your receiver/converter.

I would not recommend downmixing, but you could try that via analog outputs on the Oppo, as well.

The cheapest solution I have see to taking the HDMI SACD internally concerted to LPCM output and pulling the PCM off of it is the Monoprice splitter. It's not made for this purpose, but some people report that it works well, and maintains the high rez PCM output from the HDMI output of a SACD converted to LPCM in the Oppo. (Cost is c. $50 I think.) I have not tried this myself.
Ted99's Avatar Ted99
02:10 PM Liked: 39
post #632 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 699
Joined: Jul 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

Yes, although they cannot guarantee support because there are too many variables in media, burners and software. But it works for me. I use Verbatim for dual layer.

-Bill

Thanks.
chs4000's Avatar chs4000
02:14 PM Liked: 12
post #633 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 562
Joined: Jul 2010
I'm fascinated by the number of air vents on this player. There are zero, which tells me they probably turned the whole unit, body & all, into one big heatsink. As far as I can tell that's pretty unorthodox amongst high-end blu-ray players -- my commendation to Oppo if this design really works and helps contribute to long-term player reliability beyond the warranty period.
gsr's Avatar gsr
02:15 PM Liked: 215
post #634 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 7,654
Joined: Apr 2001
Quote:
Originally Posted by rwinner View Post

I'm glad this came up again since I'm feeling dense about what's the best option in this situation. I, too, have a Nova with a 93 on the way, and I understand that there are licensing restrictions in the output from SACD's. Am I right that I can get the 93 to output (96K?) PCM derived from the SACD stereo layer through the s/pdif output? If that is the case, then what are the options for Nova/93 owners playing SACD? I can think of several:
(1) output the SACD's CD layer via (1a) s/pdif PCM or (1b) FR/FL analog
(2) output the SACD stereo layer converted via (2a) s/pdif PCM or (2b) FR/FL analog
(3) output the downmixed-to-stereo multi-channel layer, but I'm not sure via (3a) s/pdif but probably allowed via (3b) FR/FL
(4) output the FR/FL tracks only from the multi-channel layer via FR/FL analog.
Here's what I understand and please correct my errors:
(A) (1) is no different from playing a regular CD
(B) (2) may be better than (1) but this is controversial. I assume it is true; otherwise, this discussion is moot.
(C) not sure if (3) differs from (2), and if so if it's better or worse
(D) (4) is not desirable.
(E) If my assumption that the 93 can convert the SACD stereo track to PCM is incorrect, I might need to get an HDMI audio decoupler that can do the conversion. I have found the Atlona AT-HD570 and the Kramer FC-46, which are respectively expensive and more expensive potential solutions. I really prefer not to have to do this on the chance of a slight improvement in sacd sound.

I am guessing (F) 2a > 2b > 1a > 1b where ">" means "is better than". I've no idea about (G) ?: 3a > 2a.

I hope for someone to inform me if all these are allowed and possible with the 93 and to opine which of the allowed options is likely to produce the best result, that is, whether (F) is correct and all are allowed and similarly (G). You can assume no interest in multichannel (>2) audio and that I have SACD's. Most of the music I listen to classical, but that may not be relevant.

From the manual:

Quote:


Due to copyright restrictions, SACD audio cannot be sent through the coaxial or optical digital audio output. To listen to SACD, please use the HDMI or analog audio connections.

Your option 1 will work, but at that point you're really listening to a CD, not a SACD.

Option 2a is not possible, option 2b is.
Option 3a is not possible, option 3b is.
Option 4 is not desirable as, depending on the specific SACD, you'll be missing quite a bit of the content.

(A) Correct
(B) 2b can be better than 1 because you're working with a better quality source signal. But the end result will depend on the exact equipment being used.
(C) IMO, 2b is better than 3b in most cases. But this is a try it both ways, pick what you prefer sort of thing.
(D) Correct - you'd be potentially throwing a way a lot of important content.
(E) The 93 can convert DSD to PCM, but it will only send it out over HDMI (or analog after the PCM is passed through the DAC). It can also convert DSD direct to analog through the internal DAC.

But the bottom line is that you can't get SACD in any form over the coax or toslink digital outputs on the 93 due to licensing restrictions.
wzh2hz's Avatar wzh2hz
02:17 PM Liked: 10
post #635 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 18
Joined: Nov 2010
First of all, thanks for all the great info in this thread. It's been very helpful. I'm having a problem connecting the 93 to my PC for media sharing. The 93 is wireless to the network. That works fine. I'm running Vista on the PC and thought I would use WMP 11 to connect. I'm probably doing something stupid, but I don't see the 93 through WMP. Can someone point me in the right direction?
rdgrimes's Avatar rdgrimes
02:23 PM Liked: 257
post #636 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 16,476
Joined: Mar 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by captcraig View Post

I tired the workaround and did the same. Only with the Pioneer VSX-92...no dice. Same issue, the Oppo shuts my receiver off every time. Frustrating!
Guess I'll have to wait till Monday to speak to a customer service rep.

A few more troubleshooting steps that might be helpful to Oppo if you have done them when you call:

Tripple-check to be sure that HDMI-CEC functions are turned OFF in all components, (TV, AVR, player). This may also be called "HDMI-Control", "AnyNet+", "VieraLink", etc.
Rule out the possibility that the Oppo remote might be triggering the AVR to shut down.
Turn OFF the screen saver in the Oppo. Turn off any similar power-saving or auto-standby functions in ALL components.
Disconnect the AVR from your TV, run Oppo HDMI-2 to the AVR and HDMI-1 to the TV.
rdgrimes's Avatar rdgrimes
02:26 PM Liked: 257
post #637 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 16,476
Joined: Mar 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by chs4000 View Post

I'm fascinated by the number of air vents on this player. There are zero, which tells me they probably turned the whole unit, body & all, into one big heatsink. As far as I can tell that's pretty unorthodox amongst high-end blu-ray players -- my commendation to Oppo if this design really works and helps contribute to long-term player reliability beyond the warranty period.

The bottom plate of the chassis radiates a lot of heat. I think that like any player one should exercise caution with ventilation for the player. But so far we haven't seen any real heat issues. Discs will come out warm but not hot. I've had my -93 running for 12+ hrs with no noticeable increase in heat. My hunch is that the real secret is to use components that don't generate the heat to begin with.
wmcclain's Avatar wmcclain
02:28 PM Liked: 377
post #638 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 17,701
Joined: May 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by wzh2hz View Post

First of all, thanks for all the great info in this thread. It's been very helpful. I'm having a problem connecting the 93 to my PC for media sharing. The 93 is wireless to the network. That works fine. I'm running Vista on the PC and thought I would use WMP 11 to connect. I'm probably doing something stupid, but I don't see the 93 through WMP. Can someone point me in the right direction?

Our DLNA knowledge resides in the Oppo BDP-83 DLNA/UPnP thread. This was established for an earlier player but getting DLNA working should be the same.

The BDP-83 FAQ also has some links on DLNA issues, specifically some for Windows: How do I get DLNA working?

-Bill
Bob Pariseau's Avatar Bob Pariseau
02:29 PM Liked: 981
post #639 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 27,957
Joined: Jul 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by ebrabaek View Post

Bob...... I follow your sister thread on the d2v side.......even it`s running faster than myself........... I got my 93 Yesterday.....but won`t have a chance to set it up until Tuesday. I have the d2v as well....... Any particular settings on the 93 with the d2v setup that you recommend????? I just though that you have`em all down.......

Erling

For the moment I recommend HDMI 1 physical connection with HDMI 1 output priority, explicit 1080p output resolution, 1080p/24 Auto, 3D OFF, TV System Multi, "16:9 Wide/Auto", HDMI YCbCr 4:4:4, HDMI Deep Color OFF, Secondary Audio ON, HDMI Audio LPCM, SACD Output PCM, HDCD Decoding ON, HDMI CEC OFF.

Some of these recommendations may change as the firmware evolves.
--Bob
rdgrimes's Avatar rdgrimes
02:30 PM Liked: 257
post #640 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 16,476
Joined: Mar 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by wzh2hz View Post

First of all, thanks for all the great info in this thread. It's been very helpful. I'm having a problem connecting the 93 to my PC for media sharing. The 93 is wireless to the network. That works fine. I'm running Vista on the PC and thought I would use WMP 11 to connect. I'm probably doing something stupid, but I don't see the 93 through WMP. Can someone point me in the right direction?

You might get better info from the streaming forum. WMP-11 is infamous for problems even if you do get it to work. But as I recall you need to go into WMP and enable the Oppo for playback. There's a dedicated Oppo thread in the streaming forum that might get you started. there's also a setup option in the Oppo to enable "my network", but that usually defaults to "on".
slimoli's Avatar slimoli
02:33 PM Liked: 31
post #641 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 4,685
Joined: Nov 2001
May I suggest captcraig to also change the HDMI cable from the player to the Pio ?
mezman's Avatar mezman
02:38 PM Liked: 10
post #642 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 89
Joined: Mar 2005
Does anyone in the know have any idea if Oppo plans to implement search for Netflix? That was a disappointment for me to find that there's no search now that the XBOX can do it.

Also, I have a question regarding "Demo" mode. Has that been implemented yet? It doesn't seem to do anything on my player when enabled whether playing BDs or DVDs. It's not critical, but I'd like a way to be able to easily compare the processing done by the QDEO to source direct. I can't really tell any difference between the two when cycling though my options using the resolution button on the remote.
egreen1976's Avatar egreen1976
02:43 PM Liked: 10
post #643 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 9
Joined: Mar 2010
Can the Oppo be used to decode audio streaming from my Mac?
rdgrimes's Avatar rdgrimes
02:43 PM Liked: 257
post #644 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 16,476
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mezman View Post

Does anyone in the know have any idea if Oppo plans to implement search for Netflix? That was a disappointment for me to find that there's no search now that the XBOX can do it.

Again, this is not up to Oppo. Netflix decides what UI is loaded into any device when it connects to the server. The device is certified by NF for use with a specific UI.
wmcclain's Avatar wmcclain
02:45 PM Liked: 377
post #645 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 17,701
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mezman View Post


Also, I have a question regarding "Demo" mode. Has that been implemented yet?

No, not working yet.

-Bill
Bob Pariseau's Avatar Bob Pariseau
02:45 PM Liked: 981
post #646 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 27,957
Joined: Jul 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by mezman View Post

Does anyone in the know have any idea if Oppo plans to implement search for Netflix? That was a disappointment for me to find that there's no search now that the XBOX can do it.

Also, I have a question regarding "Demo" mode. Has that been implemented yet? It doesn't seem to do anything on my player when enabled whether playing BDs or DVDs. It's not critical, but I'd like a way to be able to easily compare the processing done by the QDEO to source direct. I can't really tell any difference between the two when cycling though my options using the resolution button on the remote.

I don't believe "Demo" mode is enabled yet in the 1108 firmware.
--Bob
rwinner's Avatar rwinner
02:56 PM Liked: 10
post #647 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 155
Joined: Feb 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by nathan_h View Post

No way to get any output from any SACD layer (stereo or surround) directly from the optical or coax output.
...You may want to compare analog output of the stereo SACD layer using the Oppo's analog outputs versus the PCM output from the CD layer using your receiver/converter.
...
The cheapest solution I have see to taking the HDMI SACD internally concerted to LPCM output and pulling the PCM off of it is the Monoprice splitter. ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by gsr View Post

From the manual:

...
Option 2a is not possible, option 2b is.
Option 3a is not possible, option 3b is.
Option 4 is not desirable as, depending on the specific SACD, you'll be missing quite a bit of the content.

(A) Correct
(B) 2b can be better than 1 because you're working with a better quality source signal. But the end result will depend on the exact equipment being used.
(C) IMO, 2b is better than 3b in most cases. But this is a try it both ways, pick what you prefer sort of thing.
(D) Correct - you'd be potentially throwing a way a lot of important content.
(E) The 93 can convert DSD to PCM, but it will only send it out over HDMI (or analog after the PCM is passed through the DAC). It can also convert DSD direct to analog through the internal DAC.

But the bottom line is that you can't get SACD in any form over the coax or toslink digital outputs on the 93 due to licensing restrictions.

Thank you both for replying in the spirit of the question. Of course, it is not entirely clear that the NOVA DAC will be distinguishable from that of the 93, but it will be interesting to find out. I had not heard of the monoprice solution ($74), but that, while overkill on the hdmi outputs, isn't completely out of range as an experiment, especially since they'll take it back. It is annoying that Sony's paranoia about SACD-copying prevents honest people from having a simple, highest-quality solution.
Bluvette's Avatar Bluvette
02:57 PM Liked: 20
post #648 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 963
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Just got my 93 this morning FEDEX. Nice unit been doing some tweeking so far so good. Much more to do.
wmcclain's Avatar wmcclain
02:57 PM Liked: 377
post #649 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 17,701
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Quote:
Originally Posted by egreen1976 View Post

Can the Oppo be used to decode audio streaming from my Mac?

The audio would have to be provided by a DLNA server on your Mac.

-Bill
slimoli's Avatar slimoli
02:59 PM Liked: 31
post #650 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 4,685
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captcraig View Post

I tired the workaround and did the same. Only with the Pioneer VSX-92...no dice. Same issue, the Oppo shuts my receiver off every time. Frustrating!
Guess I'll have to wait till Monday to speak to a customer service rep.

I did some research about the Pioneer VSX92 shutting off , since I have the 94 and expect my 93 soon. Here are some more suggestions based on what I found :

-Turn off "deep color" on the player.
-Turn off "phase control on the receiver"
-Check if your speakers are perfectly connected , no bad wiring.
-Check if your speakers match the impedance setting on the receiver. (see the manual).

BTW, are you using speaker with low impedance, 4 or lower ?

Do a search on the 92THX thread , you will find few people with similar shut-off problems. There is a guy there who knows everything about the receiver, "lagairre".
captcraig's Avatar captcraig
03:05 PM Liked: 10
post #651 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 43
Joined: Nov 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by slimoli View Post

May I suggest captcraig to also change the HDMI cable from the player to the Pio ?

Thanks. I'll try switching cables.
ElwayLite's Avatar ElwayLite
03:06 PM Liked: 10
post #652 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 5,559
Joined: Sep 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdgrimes View Post

The bottom plate of the chassis radiates a lot of heat. I think that like any player one should exercise caution with ventilation for the player. But so far we haven't seen any real heat issues. Discs will come out warm but not hot. I've had my -93 running for 12+ hrs with no noticeable increase in heat. My hunch is that the real secret is to use components that don't generate the heat to begin with.

Thanks for the comment. I've always been an open air ent center guy, just for cooling reasons, and Im glad this one will be out in the open.

I also wonder about the external wireless, but I guess they did that for improved SS.
captcraig's Avatar captcraig
03:08 PM Liked: 10
post #653 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 43
Joined: Nov 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by slimoli View Post

I did some research about the Pioneer VSX92 shutting off , since I have the 94 and expect my 93 soon. Here are some more suggestions based on what I found :

-Turn off "deep color" on the player.
-Turn off "phase control on the receiver"
-Check if your speakers are perfectly connected , no bad wiring.
-Check if your speakers match the impedance setting on the receiver. (see the manual).

BTW, are you using speaker with low impedance, 4 or lower ?

Do a search on the 92THX thread , you will find few people with similar shut-off problems. There is a guy there who knows everything about the receiver, "lagairre".

I will check out that thread as well, as checking the settings. Thanks. I'm using Gallos speakers that I've used for years with this receiver.
kdavison007's Avatar kdavison007
03:22 PM Liked: 10
post #654 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 10
Joined: Mar 2008
Has anyone had problems streaming using My Network and DLNA/UPnP? My BDP-83 streamed .mkv without issues, but I keep getting the "format not supported" error when trying to stream files the 83 would stream.
wmcclain's Avatar wmcclain
03:28 PM Liked: 377
post #655 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 17,701
Joined: May 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by kdavison007 View Post

Has anyone had problems streaming using My Network and DLNA/UPnP? My BDP-83 streamed .mkv without issues, but I keep getting the "format not supported" error when trying to stream files the 83 would stream.

Is that the exact message?

Do the files play when you put them on a disc or USB stick?

Do you have any details on the audio and video codecs inside the mkv container?

-Bill
ElwayLite's Avatar ElwayLite
03:40 PM Liked: 10
post #656 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 5,559
Joined: Sep 2005
One of my buds over at HighDfJunkies emailed Oppo about the external antenna, and got a response in like 2 minutes (it's scary how fast they respond). The all metal chassis would cause SS issues, so they moved it to external. Another quality move.
Craven More's Avatar Craven More
04:22 PM Liked: 10
post #657 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 159
Joined: Jan 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by adidino View Post

Strange.. I have a very similar setup (MX5000 + MSC400) works fine for me using mono-mono cable.

I read in the owners manual that if the 93 is used in IR mode with incompatible equipment it can lead to damage to either of the units. I will contact Oppo to see what they say.
captcraig's Avatar captcraig
04:29 PM Liked: 10
post #658 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 43
Joined: Nov 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by slimoli View Post

I did some research about the Pioneer VSX92 shutting off , since I have the 94 and expect my 93 soon. Here are some more suggestions based on what I found :

-Turn off "deep color" on the player.
-Turn off "phase control on the receiver"
-Check if your speakers are perfectly connected , no bad wiring.
-Check if your speakers match the impedance setting on the receiver. (see the manual).

BTW, are you using speaker with low impedance, 4 or lower ?

Do a search on the 92THX thread , you will find few people with similar shut-off problems. There is a guy there who knows everything about the receiver, "lagairre".

Also the Receiver doesn't shut off while watching cable or streaming Netflix only when playing Blu-rays, so if the wiring was bad wouldn't it effect any of the other options? Just a thought.
captcraig's Avatar captcraig
04:30 PM Liked: 10
post #659 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 43
Joined: Nov 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by captcraig View Post

Also the Receiver doesn't shut off while watching cable or streaming Netflix only when playing Blu-rays, so if the wiring was bad wouldn't it effect any of the other options? Just a thought.

Also I checked all of the above as far as the setting and they were all set correctly as stated.
PHX HD's Avatar PHX HD
04:34 PM Liked: 10
post #660 of 27278
11-27-2010 | Posts: 30
Joined: Aug 2001
Quote:
Originally Posted by captcraig View Post

Also the Receiver doesn't shut off while watching cable or streaming Netflix only when playing Blu-rays, so if the wiring was bad wouldn't it effect any of the other options? Just a thought.

So you're able to stream Netflix through the 93 without your AVR shutting down? I'll give that a try tomorrow.

Mine will shut down with no disc and nothing but the screen saver running.
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