Pioneer Blu-ray players 2011 - BDP-140/BDP-440/BDP-LX55/BDP-53FD - Page 28 - AVS Forum
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post #811 of 1852 Old 11-06-2011, 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Supermestizo View Post

Hi

Does anyone here know if the European version, Pioneer BDP-LX55 comes with
the Marvel QDEO video/upscaling chip?

I do think so as all retailers advertise the BDP-LX55 having this chip...
http://www.avland.co.uk/aasp/pioneer...55/bdplx55.asp
for instance...

and also, if you open current 2011 Home Entertainment brochure, you`ll find that BDP-LX55 has QDEO video processor in its description...
http://docs.pioneer.eu/brochure/2011...rtainment2011/
nice brochure, though...especially the TAD speakers on page 29 (10k GBP for 5.1)
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post #812 of 1852 Old 11-06-2011, 03:58 PM
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Originally Posted by purdyd View Post

" It's interesting that other manufacturers who have implemented two HDMI outs don't make such a claim."

you mean like Denon

"The dual parallel HDMI outputs can also be assigned with HDMI Pure Direct Mode, with one HDMI output for audio and the other HDMI output for video with higher digital clocking accuracy and improved jitter control."

Ooooh jitter

Or maybe you ,mean oppo ?

"With the option of full audio and video output to 2 displays; or dedicate one HDMI for audio, the other for video, it promotes a high quality video and audio for both signal paths."

Two high quality paths, I must have that

Not quite as blatant as pioneer, non the less, others companies do claim magical properties for dual hdmi

Caveat emptor

Btw pioneer Europe press release now says this

"All 3 new models also double as a refined audio player, including support for Super Audio CD whereby the output over HDMI is automatically negotiated between the Blu-ray Disc player and the AV receiver depending on the latter's capabilities, and can either be the DSD 1-bit signal, or PCM up to hi-res 88.2 kHz / 24 bit."

No more 176.4

Mr. Walker was true to his word

If that was the first time I read the press release, I still would spring for one of these machines because of a one-player, all-disc-type, all-file-format, latest-generation MediaTek solution with PQLS. I'm still going to go with the BDP-53FD because of the design of the disc mechanism. From what I understand, it won't be susseptible to vibration from heavy bass coming from the speakers, and all that soundproofing might make the actual mechanism less audible. Btw, now that the manual has been posted for the BDP-53FD, I have a feeling that we won't have to wait until December. In fact, just so I don't have to keep bugging Pioneer's direct shop, I think I'm gonna pre-order mine tomorrow.
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post #813 of 1852 Old 11-06-2011, 04:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Big C View Post

If that was the first time I read the press release, I still would spring for one of these machines because of a one-player, all-disc-type, all-file-format, latest-generation MediaTek solution with PQLS. I'm still going to go with the BDP-53FD because of the design of the disc mechanism. From what I understand, it won't be susseptible to vibration from heavy bass coming from the speakers, and all that soundproofing might make the actual mechanism less audible. Btw, now that the manual has been posted for the BDP-53FD, I have a feeling that we won't have to wait until December. In fact, just so I don't have to keep bugging Pioneer's direct shop, I think I'm gonna pre-order mine tomorrow.

I certainly hope that your upcoming 53FD won`t turn off and on your receiver every now and then with LAN connected, nor will it have such weak remote sensor as BDP-440
I should have bought that damn iPhone so I could operate it with no such obstacles...
or at least the Web Control should have been implemented...
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post #814 of 1852 Old 11-06-2011, 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by jleholeho View Post


I certainly hope that your upcoming 53FD won`t turn off and on your receiver every now and then with LAN connected, nor will it have such weak remote sensor as BDP-440
I should have bought that damn iPhone so I could operate it with no such obstacles...
or at least the Web Control should have been implemented...

Did you ever turn off quick start and see if the problem went away with the player off?
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post #815 of 1852 Old 11-06-2011, 05:15 PM
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Originally Posted by purdyd View Post

Did you ever turn off quick start and see if the problem went away with the player off?

I was away from home over the weekend, def. will try it that way tmrw...
at the moment, it`s on for more than an hour with LAN connected as I was checking some pictures on TV over DLNA and no dropout so far...
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post #816 of 1852 Old 11-06-2011, 05:52 PM
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looks like at least one person we know has a new BDP-LX55.....

http://www.tedpublications.com/news/cars-2-3d-blu-ray/
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post #817 of 1852 Old 11-06-2011, 07:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bakerwi View Post

Chris,

Your understanding and my understanding of HDMI are the same. Also, there are some that believe the BDP-09 is getting a purer video and audio signal by splitting the audio and video. However, my research tells me otherwise. It's interesting that other manufacturers who have implemented two HDMI outs don't make such a claim.

Maybe not "purer" out, but maybe purer to the display on the video side. I can think of a number of receivers by various manufacturers that have bad reports both substantiated and unsubstantiated of video degradation. A dedicated hdmi pathway to the display would theoretically avoid a layer of repeating and an oppounity for problems
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post #818 of 1852 Old 11-06-2011, 07:40 PM
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Originally Posted by purdyd View Post

Did you ever turn off quick start and see if the problem went away with the player off?

As I was already in my bed, I left both devices ON with quick start OFF and LAN connected with intention to see what happened when I wake up in the morning (I have set the Auto Volume Level on VSX-1120 and left the volume at another level so I could see if there was or wasn`t any dropout, as if there was, it would return to my specified level when turned back on) and in less than 20 minutes drop-out occured again....I wasn`t asleep yet...
so Quick start OFF is not an option...
there must be some serious issue going on in the LAN connection/ethernet port and unless Pioneer is able to duly sort this out I can only suggest anyone NOT to buy Pioneer product...nobody can be sure this nonsense won`t be occuring with 53FD/LX55, too.....
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post #819 of 1852 Old 11-06-2011, 09:12 PM
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Originally Posted by jleholeho View Post


As I was already in my bed, I left both devices ON with quick start OFF and LAN connected with intention to see what happened when I wake up in the morning (I have set the Auto Volume Level on VSX-1120 and left the volume at another level so I could see if there was or wasn`t any dropout, as if there was, it would return to my specified level when turned back on) and in less than 20 minutes drop-out occured again....I wasn`t asleep yet...
so Quick start OFF is not an option...
there must be some serious issue going on in the LAN connection/ethernet port and unless Pioneer is able to duly sort this out I can only suggest anyone NOT to buy Pioneer product...nobody can be sure this nonsense won`t be occuring with 53FD/LX55, too.....

I suggested both quick start off and the power off on the blu ray player

Why because from the ip programming manual it appears that if quick start is on, you can still wake it up on the lan and power it up

And thus I figure it is still sending Ethernet packets when it is off, and quick start is on

Yes both off does you absolutely no good but it might help moving forward with a solution since it appears pio is having issues duplicating the problem and unfortunately, you have the golden units

Your volume trick is also a good bit of information
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post #820 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 02:21 AM
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Originally Posted by purdyd View Post

I suggested both quick start off and the power off on the blu ray player

Why because from the ip programming manual it appears that if quick start is on, you can still wake it up on the lan and power it up

And thus I figure it is still sending Ethernet packets when it is off, and quick start is on

Yes both off does you absolutely no good but it might help moving forward with a solution since it appears pio is having issues duplicating the problem and unfortunately, you have the golden units

Your volume trick is also a good bit of information

Ok, I see...
I´ll do the thing today...
you´re right, simple volume level setting like mine would certainly help Pioneer to force the issue to come up as they could let the devices ON for a few days and then see if the dropout occured in the meantime...they wouldn´t need to stare at it for 5+ hours
though I´m not sure if just knowing it did happen would solve anything...they probably need to grab it as it is appearing and check what´s the ethernet port doing at the time...
thanks a lot, though...
Chris Walker, are you there somewhere???
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post #821 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 02:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by purdyd View Post

looks like at least one person we know has a new BDP-LX55.....

http://www.tedpublications.com/news/cars-2-3d-blu-ray/

I think I'm going to pay for faster shipping so I can have more evaluation time. I'm also going to get the AS-WL300 wireless network adapter for faster internet speed.
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post #822 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 02:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Big C View Post

I think I'm going to pay for faster shipping so I can have more evaluation time. I'm also going to get the AS-WL300 wireless network adapter for faster internet speed.


speaking of which, do you think simple wifi USB adapter would work instead of overpriced AS-WL300?
I don´t understand why there are connections to both USB and Ethernet from AS-WL300, on previous BDPs it was only to USB...
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post #823 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 06:01 AM
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Originally Posted by jleholeho View Post



speaking of which, do you think simple wifi USB adapter would work instead of overpriced AS-WL300?
I don´t understand why there are connections to both USB and Ethernet from AS-WL300, on previous BDPs it was only to USB...

Power would be my guess
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post #824 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 06:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Big C View Post

The BDP-09FD had two HDMI outputs. Pioneer's intent was to use one for video, connecting it directly to the display, and the other for audio, for use with your receiver. So what does that tell you?

Nothing proofing your claim, that if one of the two HDMI outs would be "only audio" would increase the chance of SACD being output as PCM at 176.4 kHz/24 bit and the second HDMI terminal might have special functions for audio the first HDMI terminal has not.
I still see no relation/association/connection between them.
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post #825 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 07:01 AM
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Originally Posted by drSeehas View Post

Nothing proofing your claim, that if one of the two HDMI outs would be "only audio" would increase the chance of SACD being output as PCM at 176.4 kHz/24 bit and the second HDMI terminal might have special functions for audio the first HDMI terminal has not.
I still see no relation/association/connection between them.

As i mentioned a few posts above, I think the "magic" behind the dual hdmi outs with the 09 pre 3d was the ability to connect the player directly to the display, theoretically avoiding any picture degradation caused by the avr (ie onkyo 805/905, denon avr-2112, yamaha rx-a3010, and others that have reportedly had picture issues).
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post #826 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 07:03 AM
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Originally Posted by jleholeho View Post

one more thing, what really annoys me:
how come a IR control jack is not there, on none of the new players (no matter EU/US model)???
in addition to our dropouts problem, the WEAK remote sensor responsiveness drives me really crazy, too...
if I point a remote directly to the player, there`s no problem...once I change the angle a TINY BIT, player won`t respond...
on other side, when I`m pressing receiver volume on player`s remote, I can literally point it to the wall anywhere in the room and my VSX-1120 responds...so the remote itself is strong enough...the sensor on the player is just horrible...
I returned my first, week old BDP-440, as I thought the sensor was broken...another brand new piece acts just like that...insane...
Chris, is there any option to debug this??? Fellow Pio EU have stopped responding, strangely...

Agreed - the drop of the rear IR input is stupid. unsure of the cost, but a $400 or $500 player should have this even if we know 50% of the IR kits will not be compatible.
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post #827 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 07:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by winston9332 View Post

As i mentioned a few posts above, I think the "magic" behind the dual hdmi outs with the 09 pre 3d was the ability to connect the player directly to the display, theoretically avoiding any picture degradation caused by the avr (ie onkyo 805/905, denon avr-2112, yamaha rx-a3010, and others that have reportedly had picture issues).

bingo!

as noted in my "hint" to the other posters, it was a videophile, not an audiophile issue...

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post #828 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 07:13 AM
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+1 re: the dual HDMI output

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post #829 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 07:32 AM
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Originally Posted by purdyd View Post

Power would be my guess

which would mean if I connect traditional self-powered usb wifi adapter, it should work...?
just ordered some for about 10 euros, we`ll see...
I`m aiming to avoid dropouts issue until Pio have sorted the LAN bug out...if ever
and I could use net services on the player...
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post #830 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 07:45 AM
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Originally Posted by jleholeho View Post

Ok, I see...
I´ll do the thing today...
you´re right, simple volume level setting like mine would certainly help Pioneer to force the issue to come up as they could let the devices ON for a few days and then see if the dropout occured in the meantime...they wouldn´t need to stare at it for 5+ hours
though I´m not sure if just knowing it did happen would solve anything...they probably need to grab it as it is appearing and check what´s the ethernet port doing at the time...
thanks a lot, though...

another thought, try putting the player only on the ethernet network and disconnect the HDMI cable

if that works, try disabling control with HDMI in both the player and the receiver and reconnect the HDMI cable

there are only two ways for the player and receiver to communicate - HDMI or ethernet

otherwise it could be an electrical issue, where is your player in relation to your receiver? Are they stacked on top of each other? same outlet?

is it specific to which input you use, i.e usb, hdmi, optical or does it matter?

i can think of several methods of time tagging this event without having to stare at it for 5+ hours

the sound level change as a way to see if it reset occured is very ingenious
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post #831 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 07:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Susilo View Post

+1 re: the dual HDMI output

i assume this is you and you have the BDP-LX55

http://www.tedpublications.com/news/cars-2-3d-blu-ray/
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post #832 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 10:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by purdyd View Post

another thought, try putting the player only on the ethernet network and disconnect the HDMI cable

if that works, try disabling control with HDMI in both the player and the receiver and reconnect the HDMI cable

there are only two ways for the player and receiver to communicate - HDMI or ethernet

otherwise it could be an electrical issue, where is your player in relation to your receiver? Are they stacked on top of each other? same outlet?

is it specific to which input you use, i.e usb, hdmi, optical or does it matter?

i can think of several methods of time tagging this event without having to stare at it for 5+ hours

the sound level change as a way to see if it reset occured is very ingenious

allright, starting now with 1st application (AVR ON, Player OFF, Quick start OFF)
I`ll leave it like that for about 3 hours as it has been the overall maximum time for dropout occurence in pretty much all cases...
then I`ll change the application as above for another 3 hours, we`ll see what`s happening...

no, the devices are absolutely out of any potential electrical issue as they are neither stacked upon each other, nor connected to the same outlet...

and it has pretty much happened while on any given input on the VSX-1120: BD (HDMI), TV (optical), cable box (optical), Int. radio...which is advantagous in this case as I can leave it on any input to figure out if annything happened in the meantime...once the LAN is disconnected from the BDP-440, the problem has always completely disappeared...matter of fact I haven`t tried front HDMI as PC input but I don`t think it`d be any different...

thanks so much, though, for your valuable posts...I do appreciate that...wish that Pioneer themselves helped at least like that...
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post #833 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 02:22 PM
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ok, 3 continuous hours have passed now and NO drop-out at all...

VSX-1120 On
BDP-440 Off
Quick Search Off
LAN in BDP-440 connected
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post #834 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by jleholeho View Post

ok, 3 continuous hours have passed now and NO drop-out at all...

VSX-1120 On
BDP-440 Off
Quick Search Off
LAN in BDP-440 connected

ok, that is some progress

next step would be disconnect the hdmi cable and turn on the player with ethernet cable connected

the theory being there is something more to this than just a message sent from the player to the receiver over the ethernet network because pioneer would have caught that by now
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post #835 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 03:14 PM
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Originally Posted by purdyd View Post

ok, that is some progress

next step would be disconnect the hdmi cable and turn on the player with ethernet cable connected

the theory being there is something more to this than just a message sent from the player to the receiver over the ethernet network because pioneer would have caught that by now

Fair enough,
I`m gonna watch now a 1080p mkv The Departed movie I just downloaded and will leave it as you say for the rest of the night...
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post #836 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 04:59 PM
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It has to be some sort of wake on LAN feature that is enabled on the actual network card in the player itself. Just like on a PC, if wake up LAN is enabled on a NIC then you can remotely wake up a PC without being actually at the PC. In a Windows environment you can actually disabled the wake on LAN feature, so I assume in the firmware of the player there is an option to disable that feature. It makes no sense at all to have the NIC in the player be able to "wake up" a receiver, so it seems to me like it would be a simple firmware fix on Pioneers part.

Go Celtics!
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post #837 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by HTMan34 View Post

It has to be some sort of wake on LAN feature that is enabled on the actual network card in the player itself. Just like on a PC, if wake up LAN is enabled on a NIC then you can remotely wake up a PC without being actually at the PC. In a Windows environment you can actually disabled the wake on LAN feature, so I assume in the firmware of the player there is an option to disable that feature. It makes no sense at all to have the NIC in the player be able to "wake up" a receiver, so it seems to me like it would be a simple firmware fix on Pioneers part.

I doubt it is that simple and it was already tried that is network standby on the receiver was already turned off
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post #838 of 1852 Old 11-07-2011, 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by HTMan34 View Post

It has to be some sort of wake on LAN feature that is enabled on the actual network card in the player itself. Just like on a PC, if wake up LAN is enabled on a NIC then you can remotely wake up a PC without being actually at the PC. In a Windows environment you can actually disabled the wake on LAN feature, so I assume in the firmware of the player there is an option to disable that feature. It makes no sense at all to have the NIC in the player be able to "wake up" a receiver, so it seems to me like it would be a simple firmware fix on Pioneers part.

actually, it does make sense, otherwise you wouldn't be able to turn the avr on by using an app from a smartphone or via a web interface...

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post #839 of 1852 Old 11-08-2011, 01:12 AM
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Ok then,

VSX-1120 ON
BDP-440 ON
Quick Search ON
LAN connected
HDMI disconnected

dropout occured within 1 hour
(before I went to sleep)

then I left it for the night, m. volume at -60db:
VSX-1120 ON
BDP-440 ON
Quick Search OFF
LAN connected
HDMI disconnected

I woke up and m. vol was at -55db (my designated level)
so dropout AGAIN

also, I have noticed that another good way to see what happened if I´m away or at night is to initially set full FL DIMMER, because once the VSX-1120 shuts off and then turns back on it stays on default full display...

so it pretty much seems HDMI is allright...
only LAN is our bad boy...
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post #840 of 1852 Old 11-08-2011, 05:45 AM
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Originally Posted by jleholeho View Post

also, I have noticed that another good way to see what happened if I´m away or at night is to initially set full FL DIMMER, because once the VSX-1120 shuts off and then turns back on it stays on default full dis

so it pretty much seems HDMI is allright...
only LAN is our bad boy...

Well yes that does suck

It sounds like the system is going thru a reset sequence

I guess the next step would be a packet sniffer to log all the Ethernet traffic

If I were pio Europe and was struggling to reproduce this issue I would be banging on your door

It has been pretty quiet from phxdsrtrat, wonder what he found out?
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