Official 2012 Sony BDP-S790 Thread - Page 11 - AVS Forum
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post #301 of 3619 Old 04-18-2012, 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by apw2607 View Post

Can you provide more info into what you believe is misleading?

He thinks the Sony 1000ES projector he has never saw before along with the 790 cannot possibly look as good as the display he is using. So to him it is misleading. Didn't people think the world was flat once upon a time too?

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post #302 of 3619 Old 04-18-2012, 03:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Talk2Me View Post

Oh contraire. I love 4K. It is just so many are living in the clouds if they think 4K is some how going to be in every home like indoor plumbing (unless you live in the deep south). And as I said I have a S590. Really, I am all for the S790. It is a remarkable player, especially for it price. But, I do not like to read misleading information. And yes, I have too much time on my hands.

Are you this active in the 590 thread then? For a player you don't even own you sure love to spend time debating it... With as much time as you spend over here I would think you were obsessed with it and 4K...

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post #303 of 3619 Old 04-18-2012, 03:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Charles R View Post

Heck today you can view everything in 4k. Sure upscaled isn't as good as native but it's certainly better. Not to mention you can't spot that oh so awful pixel grid nearly as easily. The iPad requires 2048x1536 to achieve retina resolution and to suggest displays x times larger can't benefit from increased resolution is beyond silly. To the point it's not worth going on about... bye.

Great post! Like I said on our 120" screen we can sit really close and see absolutely no screen door effect. That alone makes the 4K an awesome upgrade. Front row used to be like a huge plasma while back row had more of an "at the movies" effect. Now both front and back show the same awesome image. There truly is not a sweet spot anymore.

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post #304 of 3619 Old 04-18-2012, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by marctronixx View Post

agreed with talk. you cats on this forum are WAAAAY in the minority...

how many average people have a $20K projector?? the majority of you cats on here have tons of disposable cash for sure, so of course it makes sense for you to feel 4K is whats needed out there.

I am definitely not a big dog as many of you are and will stay on the porch and watch you guys handle the business. its cool, though, for me, a middle class american, reading how cool it is to have a 12ft screen in ones room and even for ones wife to notice 4K! well sure if her man is a purist and has the money to have a 4K setup then im sure your wife will eventually get it.

I am in the movie industry (work with the phantom camera, F900, f35, Arri, Panavision...) and i am a steadicam operator. my mom can NOTICE when a sequence is shot on Steadi vs. a dolly or jib, etc. i tell her to "look at the horizon". she knows what to look for in a frame to judge if its a steadicam. how many of you cats can differentiate between steadi and a dolly?

"whats your point marc???". ok ok ok.. my point is you guys know what higher resolution is because you know what to look for. you spend your time with the best of the best in toys so its natural for you to see slight differences in PQ from one player to the next.. from one display to the next... the average person (me) does not have access to the best toys money can by so those subtle differences get lost.

i love and enjoy this site and reading these discussions. keeps me balanced.

and sure the 790 may be a big difference from the 590, but what of the 780???

I get PMs and emails from my site almost everyday from a new owner of the 1000ES. There are a lot more out there than you think. I don't ever post in the above 20K area. Only in the thread (like most) in the 3K and up. I have only been married for 4 months so my Wife being into it because of me doesn't apply yet. The main projectors her (and my family and friends) were able to compare it to were the Sony 95ES, 30AES and JVC 55. Those were the ones I had in house when I did my Review. We didn't have to feel one was better than the other. We could clearly see it.

My last post here in the 790 thread. If anyone wants to ask me anything feel free to PM or email me.

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post #305 of 3619 Old 04-18-2012, 04:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

I get PMs and emails from my site almost everyday from a new owner of the 1000ES. There are a lot more out there than you think. I don't ever post in the above 20K area. Only in the thread (like most) in the 3K and up. I have only been married for 4 months so my Wife being into it because of me doesn't apply yet. The main projectors her (and my family and friends) were able to compare it to were the Sony 95ES, 30AES and JVC 55. Those were the ones I had in house when I did my Review. We didn't have to feel one was better than the other. We could clearly see it.

My last post here in the 790 thread. If anyone wants to ask me anything feel free to PM or email me.

Thank you for your review, it was most helpful in my making a decision to sell my Oppo 93 and go with the Sony 790.
Good to know we can PM you.
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post #306 of 3619 Old 04-18-2012, 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted by joerod View Post

I love how he likes to take shots at me. We all had a smile on our faces from ear to ear and I couldn't help but laugh to myself when I thought we don't need this equipment to achieve this amazing eye candy. It would look just as good on a 60" 1080p TV...

Joerod, I am not taking shots at you, believe me. I was under the impression we both have a good sense of humor. Not harm intended. But, I think some members forget you have a $25K Sony projector, and think if they buy a S790 with (cough-cough) 4K resolution, they will get the same pq on their 46+" screen. You know what I mean, and once again sorry if you think I am taking shots at you.
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post #307 of 3619 Old 04-18-2012, 06:50 PM
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Originally Posted by dreaux View Post

??? What on earth are you talking about?

I think he was adding comments to JOERODs answer to TALK2ME
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post #308 of 3619 Old 04-18-2012, 07:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Talk2Me View Post

No, my point is unless you have a $25K "4K-ish" projector, a S790 is not the Holy Grail. You can up concert up the wazoo, it is not 4k unless it is native. So, let's call it "faux 4K"

I don't think all your points have been off the mark (even if your tone has been a bit negative!). E.g., the 790's ability to upscale 1080p to 4K should have little effect on improving the pic on a 1080p display. It will, in fact, have little improvement on the VW1000 4K display, since the 1000 already upscales 1080p input to display 4K, and by most reports does this as well as (or likely better than) the 790. Upscaling 1080p to 4K for display on the VW1000--done either by the 790 or the VW1000 itself--will certainly give a better pic than 1080p, but not one as good as a true 4K pic, but I think everyone understands that.

Still, the 790 sounds like an excellent 1080p BD player, and at a very good price compared to the Oppo's, which are also very good 1080p BD players.
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post #309 of 3619 Old 04-18-2012, 08:03 PM
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Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

E.g., the 790's ability to upscale 1080p to 4K should have little effect on improving the pic on a 1080p display.

Ok, to be completely clear here ... it will have no effect, since, you can't even enable 4K scaling unless the S790 "sees" a 4K display device. I'm not sure where this perception is that the S790 is some kind of miracle device because its got 4K scaling. From reading folks comments about experiences with the player (and I think there's like 5 for us currently here), what we have discussed is the additional video settings the S790 has (beyond the settings available in the S390/S590) that for many "improve" the overall picture quality. Mileage may vary for different people though. If you don't want to use them, don't and turn them off. No biggie.

Again, I stand by my comment about streaming though .... that the S790 (and many other 2012 BD players including the Panasonic's) are significantly better (yes better, talk2me) than the current Oppo players, because they are able to playback the higher quality streams and take advantage of the DD+ audio, as well as offering the primary streaming services.
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post #310 of 3619 Old 04-18-2012, 08:57 PM
 
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Originally Posted by apw2607 View Post

Ok, to be completely clear here ... it will have no effect, since, you can't even enable 4K scaling unless the S790 "sees" a 4K display device. I'm not sure where this perception is that the S790 is some kind of miracle device because its got 4K scaling. From reading folks comments about experiences with the player (and I think there's like 5 for us currently here), what we have discussed is the additional video settings the S790 has (beyond the settings available in the S390/S590) that for many "improve" the overall picture quality. Mileage may vary for different people though. If you don't want to use them, don't and turn them off. No biggie.

Again, I stand by my comment about streaming though .... that the S790 (and many other 2012 BD players including the Panasonic's) are significantly better (yes better, talk2me) than the current Oppo players, because they are able to playback the higher quality streams and take advantage of the DD+ audio, as well as offering the primary streaming services.

I'm just baffled that oppo players are able to support their current pricing structure. The video processing they offer is available with relatively inexpensive receivers in the $300 range. You could get the same processing from a receiver plus an outstanding blu ray player (such as sony which supports sacd) for well under $500 total; yet, people opt to buy an oppo instead, only they don't get a receiver!

This year, the oppos offer similar blu ray playback quality with markedly inferior streaming PQ, at a $250 to $750 price premium. I can't see oppo staying in business offering less value for double or quadruple the price, regardless of "build quality."
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post #311 of 3619 Old 04-18-2012, 09:18 PM
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Originally Posted by apw2607 View Post


Again, I stand by my comment about streaming though .... that the S790 (and many other 2012 BD players including the Panasonic's) are significantly better (yes better, talk2me) than the current Oppo players, because they are able to playback the higher quality streams and take advantage of the DD+ audio, as well as offering the primary streaming services.

Well said, I understand completely. But, I have a S590 and it does not stream an better than my 93. But then, for $119, it is a steal, and I am sure the S790 for $250 is a great bargain. But, in many ways, such as audio and build quality, and the reason why I got a 93 (secret is out!), the 93 is awesome. I had my 93 heavily modified. I just received the upgraded linear power supply for the video and audio processing, with 3 prong power connection, and they need to break in. I know many do not believe in modding players, and I understand that. I will shortly buy a S790, and see for myself, if it can benefit my curiosity. I appreciate everyone's opinion, but my nature is a little more confrontational, but never disrespectful. I played linebacker for 12 years, so I might have taken too many hits to the head.
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post #312 of 3619 Old 04-18-2012, 09:31 PM
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I ordered 7th April.but I didn't received shipping email from SONY STORE. Shipping delay?
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post #313 of 3619 Old 04-18-2012, 11:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apw2607 View Post

Ok, to be completely clear here ... it will have no effect, since, you can't even enable 4K scaling unless the S790 "sees" a 4K display device. I'm not sure where this perception is that the S790 is some kind of miracle device because its got 4K scaling. From reading folks comments about experiences with the player (and I think there's like 5 for us currently here), what we have discussed is the additional video settings the S790 has (beyond the settings available in the S390/S590) that for many "improve" the overall picture quality. Mileage may vary for different people though. If you don't want to use them, don't and turn them off. No biggie.

Again, I stand by my comment about streaming though .... that the S790 (and many other 2012 BD players including the Panasonic's) are significantly better (yes better, talk2me) than the current Oppo players, because they are able to playback the higher quality streams and take advantage of the DD+ audio, as well as offering the primary streaming services.

"Significantly better than the current Oppo players" I notice you only mention streaming here, I for one use my Oppo 95 for much ,much more! And the fact they haven't even tapped the 93/95's full potential leaves this as an open ended debate on capabilities(streaming included). The 93/95 are class leaders and are the reason you have the S790 and not a firmware update to better the 2010 and 2011 models. Don't get me wrong as I think this is a good thing for all of us in the end, but for now and the foreseeable future Oppo will reign supreme
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post #314 of 3619 Old 04-19-2012, 12:48 AM
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i watch shows all the time that dont even use steadicam so sure i have no issues with viewing material not being shot with a Steadicam.

my issue is making sure Steadicam is the RIGHT tool for the job. thats a different topic though...


Quote:
Originally Posted by RapalloAV View Post

I wouldn't know the difference even after being a projectionist for over 35+ years, but would you rather look at images without the steadicam now you know the difference and "see it"?

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post #315 of 3619 Old 04-19-2012, 06:42 AM
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Got an email from Sony last night saying the have shipped my 790 so they are shipping now.
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post #316 of 3619 Old 04-19-2012, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post

"Significantly better than the current Oppo players" I notice you only mention streaming here

Yes. Because the statement about it being significantly better was in relation to the streaming ability. If you read up through the thread I make that very clear.

For someone that is paying for Netflix each month, not utilizing the 1080p stream and Dolby Digital Plus audio that they provide is silly. If you are going to pay for a service each month, at least get the best out of it, as you can.

With the Oppo, you wont see the 1080p streams or hear the Dolby Digital Plus audio bitstream.

Similarly, if you are a amazon prime member, and a hulu+ subscriber, you are out of luck completely on the Oppo.

If you like to watch the odd Seinfeld episode on crackle, don't bother with the Oppo, because its not supported.

My statement about it being better was in regards to streaming. OK?

Oppo owners can wait for a firmware update hoping they will upgrade their netflix client, or add additional services .... of course they can. But what does a user do, between now and then ... whenever then is? Wait, keep paying for the services that are crippled or not offered at all? That doesn't sound very sensible to me.

No, get a new 2012 BD player from Sony or Panasonic, and enjoy a great "all rounder". Great disk playback, and awesome streaming capabilities today.

I actually owned a Oppo-93 back in December 2010 when they were first made available. Back then, streaming wasn't like it is today, so it really didn't matter. 2 Years on, and its all changed. Streaming and instant is the future. Either embrace it, or don't. No matter.

Ok ... next.
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post #317 of 3619 Old 04-19-2012, 09:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Talk2Me View Post

Well said, I understand completely. But, I have a S590 and it does not stream an better than my 93. But then, for $119, it is a steal, and I am sure the S790 for $250 is a great bargain. But, in many ways, such as audio and build quality, and the reason why I got a 93 (secret is out!), the 93 is awesome. I had my 93 heavily modified. I just received the upgraded linear power supply for the video and audio processing, with 3 prong power connection, and they need to break in. I know many do not believe in modding players, and I understand that. I will shortly buy a S790, and see for myself, if it can benefit my curiosity. I appreciate everyone's opinion, but my nature is a little more confrontational, but never disrespectful. I played linebacker for 12 years, so I might have taken too many hits to the head.

I'm thick skinned. No matter to me.
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post #318 of 3619 Old 04-19-2012, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by apw2607 View Post

Yes. Because the statement about it being significantly better was in relation to the streaming ability. If you read up through the thread I make that very clear.

For someone that is paying for Netflix each month, not utilizing the 1080p stream and Dolby Digital Plus audio that they provide is silly. If you are going to pay for a service each month, at least get the best out of it, as you can.

With the Oppo, you wont see the 1080p streams or hear the Dolby Digital Plus audio bitstream.

Similarly, if you are a amazon prime member, and a hulu+ subscriber, you are out of luck completely on the Oppo.

If you like to watch the odd Seinfeld episode on crackle, don't bother with the Oppo, because its not supported.

My statement about it being better was in regards to streaming. OK?

Oppo owners can wait for a firmware update hoping they will upgrade their netflix client, or add additional services .... of course they can. But what does a user do, between now and then ... whenever then is? Wait, keep paying for the services that are crippled or not offered at all? That doesn't sound very sensible to me.

No, get a new 2012 BD player from Sony or Panasonic, and enjoy a great "all rounder". Great disk playback, and awesome streaming capabilities today.

I actually owned a Oppo-93 back in December 2010 when they were first made available. Back then, streaming wasn't like it is today, so it really didn't matter. 2 Years on, and its all changed. Streaming and instant is the future. Either embrace it, or don't. No matter.

Ok ... next.

Yeah, and this is the reason I'll likely be replacing the Oppo with the 790. I REALLY want to try out the streaming capabilities first though, just to make sure that the 790 will support everything I'm looking for (and is at least almost comparable to the PS3... which it sounds like it is).

To that end, I'm tempted to "try out" the 390 from Target briefly. It is my understanding that the streaming services are essentially identical between the x90 series... is that correct?
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post #319 of 3619 Old 04-19-2012, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by tmeader View Post

Yeah, and this is the reason I'll likely be replacing the Oppo with the 790. I REALLY want to try out the streaming capabilities first though, just to make sure that the 790 will support everything I'm looking for (and is at least almost comparable to the PS3... which it sounds like it is).

To that end, I'm tempted to "try out" the 390 from Target briefly. It is my understanding that the streaming services are essentially identical between the x90 series... is that correct?

Yes, they are the same, however there is one difference between the S390/S590 and the S790.

The S790 includes IP Noise Reduction Pro. The S390/590 includes IP Noise Reduction

The difference is IP NR Pro includes 6 different settings. Video 3,2,1 and Film 3, 2, 1

IP NR includes just 3 settings, 1,2,3

I've found the S790 Film 2 mode (default), improved over what is offered on the S390/S590 "2" mode. Pic seemed to just look overall better ... better colors, blacks, etc.
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post #320 of 3619 Old 04-19-2012, 10:52 AM
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Originally Posted by apw2607 View Post

Yes, they are the same, however there is one difference between the S390/S590 and the S790.

The S790 includes IP Noise Reduction Pro. The S390/590 includes IP Noise Reduction

The difference is IP NR Pro includes 6 different settings. Video 3,2,1 and Film 3, 2, 1

IP NR includes just 3 settings, 1,2,3

I've found the S790 Film 2 mode (default), improved over what is offered on the S390/S590 "2" mode. Pic seemed to just look overall better ... better colors, blacks, etc.

Good to know.
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post #321 of 3619 Old 04-19-2012, 03:35 PM
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Does anyone know if the 790 will be able to do Netflix 1080p, 5.1 audio?
There is a list of those supported now but of course the 790 is too new to be listed.

http://www.techofthehub.com/2011/10/...ing-to-my.html
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post #322 of 3619 Old 04-19-2012, 04:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dreaux View Post

Does anyone know if the 790 will be able to do Netflix 1080p, 5.1 audio?
There is a list of those supported now but of course the 790 is too new to be listed.

http://www.techofthehub.com/2011/10/...ing-to-my.html


Yes. 1080p/dd+ and cc is supported on NF.
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post #323 of 3619 Old 04-19-2012, 07:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Talk2Me View Post

Joerod, I am not taking shots at you, believe me. I was under the impression we both have a good sense of humor. Not harm intended. But, I think some members forget you have a $25K Sony projector, and think if they buy a S790 with (cough-cough) 4K resolution, they will get the same pq on their 46+" screen. You know what I mean, and once again sorry if you think I am taking shots at you.

Seriously just STFU, you're getting annoying. The 'I have a small unit (Blu ray and otherwise) so I have to knock everything else' stick is OLD. By the way, you haven't 'taken too many hits to the head', you have the classic personality flaw common amongst humans without the rational ability to realize they are doing it. You need to justify your own worth, or the perception of lack thereof, by trying to criticize something in an owner's thread of that something in order to make yourself feel better about your purchases. It won't work, you're still inferior. Now let the big boys talk about what they actually own, the point of this.

By the way, I don't own either a 4K projector or a S790 either, but you don't see me coming into the forum filled with jealousy and ranting and raving like a lunatic about something the thread isn't about, such as the worth of the existance of 4K (it exists, get over it). This is an owner's thread for the S790, this isn't a 'I am an insecure Oppo owner' thread. Some of us want to read these and learn about the features and reviews to decide if we're going to buy one.

Reading your post history: how many times are you going to bounce back and forth between the Oppo BD thread and this thread trying to stoke some kind of rivalry, ALL in order to appease your deep feelings of inadequacy and insecurity? You are over there telling people one thing about the Sony, you're back over here ranting. Where are the moderators in these forums? If you notice a pattern like this of increasing instability and jealousy, bouncing between threads, cut it off. I want to read about this player in this thread. That would be much appreciated in coming to a decision of buying one. Not sifting through pages of somebody trying to justify their own worth.
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post #324 of 3619 Old 04-20-2012, 01:11 AM
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Got my S790 today and just set it up on the fly so might have over looked something. In utilizing the dual hdmi is it supposed to disable the on screen display of my receiver?
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post #325 of 3619 Old 04-20-2012, 04:17 PM
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Originally Posted by gpmbc View Post

Got my S790 today and just set it up on the fly so might have over looked something. In utilizing the dual hdmi is it supposed to disable the on screen display of my receiver?

Only audio from HDMI 2 goes into your receiver and the 790s HDMI 1 sends only the image to your display. The receivers OSD does not transfer over to the 790's HDMI 2. If you need to make Receiver adjustments do it first using the HDMI out from your receiver first then switch to dual with the 790. Congrats btw!

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post #326 of 3619 Old 04-20-2012, 09:58 PM
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Decided to watch the new Muppet Movie on my OPPO93 - great PQ, nice Music - why can't I hear the people talking? Restarted the Blu-ray - still, everything but voices, except the odd excerpt. Removed, reved up the Sony BDPS770 - great PQ, music, and voila voices! Chalk one up for the Sony again! Have had several Blu-rays do this to me by stop working, or never work at all on the OPPO93 - put it into the Sony and they work. I think a BDPS790 will soon replace the OPPO93. (Once they're available in Canada.) The OPPO will replace the 770, which will bump the inconsistent Samsung 3D Blu-ray player.
(PS. The Muppet Movie has a movie within a movie - push the pause button, and you'll be entertained for a half hour Intermission sequence)
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post #327 of 3619 Old 04-21-2012, 07:41 AM
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For $250 replacing the 93, maybe I should get one.
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post #328 of 3619 Old 04-21-2012, 07:43 AM
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Some guy on the Oppo 95's thread says that PQ on the 95 will better than the Sony S790 with Blu rays.

lol
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post #329 of 3619 Old 04-21-2012, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by p5browne View Post

Decided to watch the new Muppet Movie on my OPPO93 - great PQ, nice Music - why can't I hear the people talking? Restarted the Blu-ray - still, everything but voices, except the odd excerpt. Removed, reved up the Sony BDPS770 - great PQ, music, and voila voices! Chalk one up for the Sony again! Have had several Blu-rays do this to me by stop working, or never work at all on the OPPO93 - put it into the Sony and they work. I think a BDPS790 will soon replace the OPPO93. (Once they're available in Canada.) The OPPO will replace the 770, which will bump the inconsistent Samsung 3D Blu-ray player.
(PS. The Muppet Movie has a movie within a movie - push the pause button, and you'll be entertained for a half hour Intermission sequence)

Your post is unclear of BDP-S770 retention.

I find my S770 an irreplaceable addition to my system, As such, it will remain as my main SA-CD player even after installation of S790 later this year.

BTW, I considered Oppo 93 at one point, but with it's SA-CD playback inconsistencies it seemed an unwise purchase decision.
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post #330 of 3619 Old 04-21-2012, 09:39 AM
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I'm just baffled that oppo players are able to support their current pricing structure. The video processing they offer is available with relatively inexpensive receivers in the $300 range. You could get the same processing from a receiver plus an outstanding blu ray player (such as sony which supports sacd) for well under $500 total; yet, people opt to buy an oppo instead, only they don't get a receiver!

This year, the oppos offer similar blu ray playback quality with markedly inferior streaming PQ, at a $250 to $750 price premium. I can't see oppo staying in business offering less value for double or quadruple the price, regardless of "build quality."

Hi_Def_Boss,

Most who are buying the Oppo are not buying it for just blu-ray, DVD and/or SACD playback or for its limited streaming. They are buying it for everything else that it does that players in the sub $400 market don't provide. Also, "build quality" to some is just as important as "streaming" is to others as an example. If competent blu-ray, DVD playback and streaming are the only buying criteria then the S790 as well as offerings from Panasonic, Samsung and LG can provide this.

Last, Oppo is not targeting the streaming crowd which is evident by the limited streaming partners. Oppo operates from a different business model which has served them well over the years. Their DVD and blu-ray players hold their value better than any transport that I have come across in my many years in this hobby.

Also, if anyone is wondering I do own a couple of Oppo products in addition to the Sony BDP-S790.

Pioneer Elite PRO-151FD

Zektor MAS7.1

Classé CA-2200/CA-5200

Oppo BDP-105, Denon DVD-5910CI, Cambridge 752BD, Cambridge 640C V2

Paradigm Signature S8, Paradigm Signature ADP1

Paradigm Signature ADP3, Paradigm Signature C5

REL R-505 Sub (2)

Oppo BDP-93, BDP-103D, Pioneer BDP-320

Sony BDP-S790

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