Official Panasonic DMP-BDT 220/320/500 Owners Thread - Page 10 - AVS Forum
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post #271 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 08:20 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Kermit26.2 View Post

Teachsac,

Are you happy with the load times on the 320? Do you like the disc loading compared to the traditional tray?

Thanks.

I wonder if it would be harder to remove a stuck disk with the slot-in drive than with a traditional tray?

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post #272 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 08:51 AM
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So it looks like the X20 series has better file support over HDD. One person noted being able to view their mkv files from an NTFS formatted HDD.

Has anyone tried an exFAT formatted drive?

And is there any bitrate limit for files? My 110 seemed to choke on any files with bitrates above 5000 or so.

Looking forward to testing of the dvd over 24p function that, IIRC, was dropped in the Oppo 93. . .

Thanks to the early adopters for all of the info thus far!!
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post #273 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 08:58 AM
 
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It seems like the X20 is perfect: quiet, 1080 netflix, a ton of upgrades, better dvd upconversion, and so on.

Is this all too good to be true?!?
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post #274 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 09:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audio/videoman View Post

The Oppo's do have video processing circuitry to sweeten the signal. My guess is that once this circuitry is bypassed, I'm willing to bet that the pan. and oppo signals are essentially identical in a/b testing.

As far as sacd, you can get this on a sony blu ray player, a good one, for under $70.

The downside, at least with the 2011 pan. is build quality. They did not do a good job with noise suppression. As far as I can tell, it was not a design goal at all.

If pan. addressed and solved this issue for 2012, I'd say it's a superior value for PQ.

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Originally Posted by teachsac View Post

Honestly. We're getting kind of tired hearing this over and over and over in thread after thread after thread. My 210 is quiet. The only noise I hear is when I load a disc. Same thing I hear on a computer. My 320 with the slot drive is even quieter. As far as video processing.... The Oppo puts out a correct signal as does the Panasonic. No difference in BD PQ and virtually no difference in DVD scaling.

S~

I don't understand the noise thing. People want fast load times, so the faster the drive spins, the louder it's going to be. Once you're in playback mode, the disc spins at a normal slower rate and is virtually silent. If it's not, then you either have an unbalanced disc, which isn't the player's fault, or you have a defective drive, which is the player's fault and should be exchanged. If you have super hearing and notice normal drive noise all the time, then you just need to take some common sense steps to mitigate it, like adding pads on the bottom and/or top to dampen it, relocate the player, etc.

I've opened up every player I've ever owned and all of them have essentially the same dampening on the drive and the same generic chinese drive. I even discovered that my $80 Insignia player has exactly the same drive as a $500 Oppo and the same dampening. So unless you're talking about a $10K player, the build quality argument doesn't hold water.
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post #275 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 09:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audio/videoman View Post

It seems like the X20 is perfect: quiet, 1080 netflix, a ton of upgrades, better dvd upconversion, and so on.

Is this all too good to be true?!?

I've seen one post about better DVD upconversion. Do we have any more evidence than that?
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post #276 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 09:12 AM
 
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Originally Posted by mdavej View Post

I don't understand the noise thing. People want fast load times, so the faster the drive spins, the louder it's going to be. Once you're in playback mode, the disc spins at a normal slower rate and is virtually silent. If it's not, then you either have an unbalanced disc, which isn't the player's fault, or you have a defective drive, which is the player's fault and should be exchanged. If you have super hearing and notice normal drive noise all the time, then you just need to take some common sense steps to mitigate it, like adding pads on the bottom and/or top to dampen it, relocate the player, etc.

I've opened up every player I've ever owned and all of them have essentially the same dampening on the drive and the same generic chinese drive. I even discovered that my $80 Insignia player has exactly the same drive as a $500 Oppo and the same dampening. So unless you're talking about a $10K player, the build quality argument doesn't hold water.

Very interesting points. You're right, it's impossible to eliminate drive noise; the disc is spinning after all. It just reminds me how entranced I was by movie watching from ripped dvd's. I'm enjoying netflix and streaming in general for the same reason.
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post #277 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 09:29 AM
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Originally Posted by mdavej View Post

I've seen one post about better DVD upconversion. Do we have any more evidence than that?

Looks about the same to me. After all it's DVD. From SW: Ep. 2.



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post #278 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 10:11 AM
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Originally Posted by hobbes4444 View Post

And is there any bitrate limit for files? My 110 seemed to choke on any files with bitrates above 5000 or so.

I don't think bitrate was the reason if your player choked on a 5Mbps file. Panny incompatibilities with the MKV container or the encode (or both) are more likely causes.

Most MKVs I play on my 110 are 19Mbps OTA/cable recordings and they're always smooth. I also tried a BD rip (though not a full movie). And this is over network drive which should be more sensitive than USB.

In any case do I hope Panasonic improved their file support with the new players. NTFS is already one.

Nice post, BTW :-)
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post #279 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 10:22 AM
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new member ... i was referred here from someone on the HTF as I have a question on the 220.

I see on Amazon's page that it also plays movie from a NTFS formatted HDD. Any idea if this would have to be an external one hooked up through USB to the player or it can read off of a internal PC drive on the home network wired/wireless?

Also ... IF i hook it up to the TV direct via HDMI ... can I still hook it via traditional RCA l/r audio connections to a 2 channel receiver for cd listening?

thanks for the help!
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post #280 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 11:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdavej View Post

I've seen one post about better DVD upconversion. Do we have any more evidence than that?

I have the Pan. 220 and DVD upscaling looks the same as my BD65. But without a side to side comparison, I can't tell for sure.
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post #281 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 11:27 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teachsac View Post

Looks about the same to me. After all it's DVD. From SW: Ep. 2.

S~

Yeah, I don't think they will have better DVD upconversion. Just like you said, there is only so much you can do with DVD. The last time I saw what actually looked like better DVD upconversion was the Toshiba EX500 which I still have.

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post #282 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 11:39 AM
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People raved about the DVD upconversion of the x10s. I personally have never been impressed by DVD upconversion, even Oppo's, but I have no investment in discs .

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post #283 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 11:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lurch70 View Post

new member ... i was referred here from someone on the HTF as I have a question on the 220.

I see on Amazon's page that it also plays movie from a NTFS formatted HDD. Any idea if this would have to be an external one hooked up through USB to the player or it can read off of a internal PC drive on the home network wired/wireless?

All of the above. You can use USB, network shares or DLNA via wired or wireless. The problem is your files have to meet panasonic's extremely narrow file format requirements. For example, it won't do AVI (in the US) and many other common formats without transcoding, so you probably want to look elsewhere if file streaming is important.
Quote:


Also ... IF i hook it up to the TV direct via HDMI ... can I still hook it via traditional RCA l/r audio connections to a 2 channel receiver for cd listening?

thanks for the help!

Sure.

But even for CD playback, Panny isn't the best choice. Others like Sony or LG with Gracenote service are much better because you automatically get titles and cover art that you don't get on panasonic.
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post #284 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 11:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lujan View Post

Yeah, I don't think they will have better DVD upconversion. Just like you said, there is only so much you can do with DVD. The last time I saw what actually looked like better DVD upconversion was the Toshiba EX500 which I still have.

Quote:
Originally Posted by michaeltscott View Post

People raved about the DVD upconversion of the x10s. I personally have never been impressed by DVD upconversion, even Oppo's, but I have no investment in discs .

Yep. No amount of upconversion magic is going to make DVD look like BD. Does panny look marginally better than some others? Yes, but it's definitely not night and day, and probably not noticeable at all to some. Like lujan says, old Toshibas do better. But many people are willing to spend hundreds extra on Oppos and external video processors for miniscule gains in DVD PQ. Given my imperfect TV and my imperfect eyesight, I could care less about such minor differences.
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post #285 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 12:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandenborg View Post

I don't think bitrate was the reason if your player choked on a 5Mbps file. Panny incompatibilities with the MKV container or the encode (or both) are more likely causes.

Most MKVs I play on my 110 are 19Mbps OTA/cable recordings and they're always smooth. I also tried a BD rip (though not a full movie). And this is over network drive which should be more sensitive than USB.

In any case do I hope Panasonic improved their file support with the new players. NTFS is already one.

Nice post, BTW :-)

In thinking back and reading a bit more on the x10 thread, you're probably right. I didn't do much testing after the initial couple of tries (I posted my initial results here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...2#post20180032)

Maybe it was the L4.0 that was causing problems rather than the 9000+Mbps bitrate since L4.1 seemed fine. Either way, I'm certainly hoping that the x20's will be enough of an improvement, and consistent performers, so the x10 can find a new home ;-)
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post #286 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 12:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdavej View Post

Yep. No amount of upconversion magic is going to make DVD look like BD. Does panny look marginally better than some others? Yes, but it's definitely not night and day, and probably not noticeable at all to some. Like lujan says, old Toshibas do better. But many people are willing to spend hundreds extra on Oppos and external video processors for miniscule gains in DVD PQ. Given my imperfect TV and my imperfect eyesight, I could care less about such minor differences.

Up scaling is a trade off. What someone might perceive as an improvement, because has less noise and artifacts in the picture, someone else may say the same image looks less sharp and smooth with no depth ... so looks worse.

There's no magic here folks, despite what manufactures will claim. Crap in ... is crap out.
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post #287 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by mdavej View Post

All of the above. You can use USB, network shares or DLNA via wired or wireless. The problem is your files have to meet panasonic's extremely narrow file format requirements. For example, it won't do AVI (in the US) and many other common formats without transcoding, so you probably want to look elsewhere if file streaming is important.
Sure.

But even for CD playback, Panny isn't the best choice. Others like Sony or LG with Gracenote service are much better because you automatically get titles and cover art that you don't get on panasonic.

Thanks a lot!

I am not worried about cover art and the like ... I wont even have the TV on ... as long as it can play through a reciever.

How's the audio quality for music listening typically through these players?
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post #288 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 02:15 PM
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Yep - I am the one that enjoys over 10GB MKV movies through the USB drive with my Go Flex HDD. Loving this upgrade over the 210.

I still have the Netflix audio delay issue though. It sounds like I am the only one. Anyone care to comment? Does your audio have delay watching Netflix? It is hard to imagine this is a player issue. I would think internet connection speed, but i have no problems with 210
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post #289 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 04:43 PM
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FLAC support works. Played Tom Petty: Damn the Torpedoes off my USB Drive. Sounded terrific.

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post #290 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 05:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hobbes4444 View Post

In thinking back and reading a bit more on the x10 thread, you're probably right. I didn't do much testing after the initial couple of tries (I posted my initial results here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...2#post20180032)

Maybe it was the L4.0 that was causing problems rather than the 9000+Mbps bitrate since L4.1 seemed fine. Either way, I'm certainly hoping that the x20's will be enough of an improvement, and consistent performers, so the x10 can find a new home ;-)

I have not seen anything from Panasonic saying which level it supports for file playback. One would assume 4.1 since that's required for BD (is it higher for 3D?). But in the 2011 players we've seen some evidence that decoding and scaling acts differently for files (MKV) compared to discs. Maybe it uses some memory for file buffering that would be used for DBP buffer on disc playback.

If it DOES support level 4.1 for files, it should also support any lower levels for the same profile.
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post #291 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 06:35 PM
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Can you access and stream your amazon cloud mp3's from this player?

Thanks
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post #292 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 06:57 PM
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That's a great idea. It would be nice to have the option. I have a 310 and just ordered the 320.
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post #293 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 08:31 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apw2607 View Post

Up scaling is a trade off. What someone might perceive as an improvement, because has less noise and artifacts in the picture, someone else may say the same image looks less sharp and smooth with no depth ... so looks worse.

There's no magic here folks, despite what manufactures will claim. Crap in ... is crap out.

Exactly.
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post #294 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 09:07 PM
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Originally Posted by jmoakk View Post

Can you access and stream your amazon cloud mp3's from this player?

No. The only online music that you can play is Pandora and Shoutcast.

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post #295 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 09:48 PM
 
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So how many of us inquiring are actually going to buy one of these players after all of this discussion?
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post #296 of 4212 Old 03-05-2012, 10:25 PM
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Am I missing something, or are the signal quality bars gone on the 220?
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post #297 of 4212 Old 03-06-2012, 04:09 AM
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has anyone tried streaming an mkv file which has a lossless DTS-MA or TrueHD soundtrack?

Does it play the HD soundtrack ok?

I will have mine linked to Denon AVR-3312 via HDMI (once it is released)

Thanks,
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post #298 of 4212 Old 03-06-2012, 05:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audio/videoman View Post

So how many of us inquiring are actually going to buy one of these players after all of this discussion?

I plan on picking up a 320 by the end of the week. It will replace my Panny BD-55. Just waiting to see where the prices settle out to. Cheapest I have seen so far is 168 shipped.

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post #299 of 4212 Old 03-06-2012, 05:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by audio/videoman View Post

So how many of us inquiring are actually going to buy one of these players after all of this discussion?

I'm still waiting on the DMP-BDT500 which is supposed to be out in May.

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post #300 of 4212 Old 03-06-2012, 05:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lujan View Post

i'm still waiting on the dmp-bdt500 which is supposed to be out in may.

same here
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