Official Sony BDP-S590 and BDP-390 Thread - Page 11 - AVS Forum
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post #301 of 4069 Old 03-24-2012, 08:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by michaeltscott View Post

As has been stated you don't have a choice, once new firmware is available. I played around with that yesterday and can confirm that none of the online services will start before applying an available new upgrade.
Having to use wireless is equally unacceptable. I don't have an N router and don't really want to abandon my venerable old Linksys WRT54G, on which I run some open source firmware (Tomato) that I really like.

I'm still debating sending the 390 back. On the positive side, I love the PS3-esque Netflix info overlay that I can get from the Sony, its Netflix player's browser UI is substantially more responsive than the Panasonic BD player and its Amazon player has 5.1 sound. Though I've never loved the XMB I find it to be a lot more convenient than the Panasonic's UI. On the negative side I've had these problems with the Netflix player and the Amazon player is probably the worst that I've used, the slowest (I just measured 38 seconds to start a stream, versus 8 seconds on the Roku) and least convenient. Lacking a queue, one of any Amazon player's most important functions for me is Search and on the Sony you have to enter text into it using a numeric keypad and i9 and it's not even an incremental search--it's an inexcusably poor design. (As a software engineer designs like this feel like the people who create it are giving me the finger--totally disrespectful to the user). I think that I may be better off just keeping the BDT220 and hoping that the upcoming Amazon update will add 5.1 sound (the Roku's recent Amazon player update is really beautiful--I hope that they're doing something similar).

What I really wish would happen is for Roku to add a VUDU player, but there's got to be something unknown standing in the way of that.

Yea. I can appreciate your concerns. The fact the iPhone app allows you to do text searching on Amazon and Hulu makes up for the numeric style on screen interface, so that doesnt really bother me.

I love this player, and I'm picky. It does everything I need it to do, checks all the boxes and some. I also like the native AVC MKV support too, from a DLNA server. Thats just the icing on the cake.
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post #302 of 4069 Old 03-24-2012, 08:23 PM - Thread Starter
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If you guys are looking for a good federated search facility on iOS, try out "can i stream it ?" app Its federated search across Netflix, Amazon VOD, iTunes, blockbuster, Hulu, vudu, crackle, youtube and Epix. Not affiliated in any way to the app. Just recommending since we're talking about federated searching across streaming services.

Its also a website too ... http://www.canistream.it/
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post #303 of 4069 Old 03-24-2012, 08:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Krutsch View Post

I hear you on the Amazon search stuff, but I do all of that on my iPad, frankly. It's just faster to get around with and to read reviews, et al. I search for what I want to see on that device, then switch to the Media Remote app to type it all in and run it on the streamer. I do this with Apple TV and the Blu-ray player, since none of them have a federate search function that will cross all of the streaming services.

I don't use the player's search function to find things--all of my devices and this computer are all connected to this 46" LCD panel and AVR and I just switch to it and use AVS Forum member Ranger One's (Gabe Gagliano's) TVandMoviesNow.com search engine (it only searches Netflix and Amazon, but it can be filtered on HD, 5.1 sound, a ton of genres, etc, and sorted by date added, expiration date and a few other things). I need the Amazon player's search function to find the title to play it, as an alternative to scrolling through a list of titles arranged in no discernible order (the Sony Amazon player doesn't even arrange the TV series episodes in numeric order ).
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Agreed. What has being describe here needs to be put into the right context. This isn't a repetitive common problem. It seems to just happen once in a while. I wouldn't worry about it.

It's quite possible Krutsch suggestion that the Netflix player works better over wireless networks is true. It may be like the "black flashes" problem of the 2011 Panasonic players, which many users never encounter.
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I love this player, and I'm picky.

Apparently no so much .
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It does everything I need it to do, checks all the boxes and some. I also like the native AVC MKV support too, from a DLNA server.

Meh. As I stated, this PC is connected to this panel and the AVR via optical S/PDIF, so I use it to play any AVC MKVs that I want to, with basic DD or basic DTS sound.

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post #304 of 4069 Old 03-24-2012, 08:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Michael - Do you have the player in quick start up mode? I ask, because I've recently switched that off and since I have, I've yet to encounter the Netflix problem. Its a long shot .. but figured it might not be a bad thing to start the player each time on a clean normal boot / start up, just in case some odd behavior is taking place in quick start mode.
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post #305 of 4069 Old 03-24-2012, 09:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apw2607 View Post

Michael - Do you have the player in quick start up mode? I ask, because I've recently switched that off and since I have, I've yet to encounter the Netflix problem. Its a long shot .. but figured it might not be a bad thing to start the player each time on a clean normal boot / start up, just in case some odd behavior is taking place in quick start mode.

I do have it on. I'll try switching it off.

Actually, I wish that there was a way to defeat the automatic turn off feature. The Panasonic's don't turn off until you tell them too.

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post #306 of 4069 Old 03-24-2012, 09:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Actually, I wish that there was a way to defeat the automatic turn off feature. The Panasonic's don't turn off until you tell them too.

Yes. Agreed. A odd feature that.
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post #307 of 4069 Old 03-24-2012, 10:18 PM
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There was only one left when I finally reached Target. Now in my bedroom. Thanks for the tip.

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post #308 of 4069 Old 03-24-2012, 11:32 PM
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Originally Posted by joerod View Post

There was only one left when I finally reached Target. Now in my bedroom. Thanks for the tip.

We went to our local Target and they only had the 580 there. I asked the sales clerk and she couldn't even pull anything up on the 590. Oh well! Went up the street to BB and they price matched Amazon for the $134. Hooked it up via wireless, had some initial problems because we are not computer savy. Finally figured it all out and we are amazed at what we can get!

I have had the SACD Hybrid of Pink Floyds "Dark Side Of The Moon" now for who knows how long and FINALLY got to hear it in SACD. WOW Just awesome! Beautiful clarity and surround matrix! We get to try Netflix tomorrow. Ahhhhh, the joy of new toys!

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post #309 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 05:36 AM
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I really can't wait for the 790!

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post #310 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 09:07 AM
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Originally Posted by joerod View Post

There was only one left when I finally reached Target. Now in my bedroom. Thanks for the tip.

I went to two Targets and there was only one left. I got it for $119. Thanks for the tip Joerod

I went to Fry's and got a 4GB USB drive for $6.

http://www.amazon.com/v165-USB-Flash...2687797&sr=1-3

Nice low profile, fits fine.

Haven't connected it up yet. It is sitting next to my S580 which was in the bedroom.

Ironically I had to move it from the bedroom when two discs with that new Cinavia would not play in my old 1Gen Sony BR player. They played fine in the S580.
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post #311 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 09:24 AM
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Thanks to Krutsch for the Target tip, got the 590 last night. I called first to see what model they had in stock and to verify the price. They only had 1 left, so I asked them to hold it for me until I was able to pick it (same day) and they happily obliged. Everything worked out great and if you use their credit card you get an extra 5% off.
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post #312 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 09:24 AM
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Originally Posted by SpeedracerII View Post

I went to two Targets and there was only one left. I got it for $119. Thanks for the tip Joerod

I went to Fry's and got a 4GB USB drive for $6.

http://www.amazon.com/v165-USB-Flash...2687797&sr=1-3

Nice low profile, fits fine.

Haven't connected it up yet. It is sitting next to my S580 which was in the bedroom.

Ironically I had to move it from the bedroom when two discs with that new Cinavia would not play in my old 1Gen Sony BR player. They played fine in the S580.

Can someone explain this Cinavia to me in laymans terms please. And what discs are affected.

Jeff
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post #313 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 09:43 AM
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Originally Posted by pronghorn/az View Post

Can someone explain this Cinavia to me in laymans terms please. And what discs are affected.

Jeff

It is yet another type of copy protection. This one puts a spread spectrum audio signal in the audio channels. It claims to not be detectable to humans.

Here is a list of BR that have them... Moneyball was the first one that would not play on my old BR player. It played fine on the S580. Well at least i assumed it was due to the Cinavia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cinavia...a_watermarking
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post #314 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 09:53 AM
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Originally Posted by SpeedracerII View Post

It is yet another type of copy protection. This one puts a spread spectrum audio signal in the audio channels. It claims to not be detectable to humans.

Here is a list of BR that have them... Moneyball was the first one that would not play on my old BR player. It played fine on the S580. Well at least i assumed it was due to the Cinavia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cinavia...a_watermarking

Disks authored with Cinavia should play on any player without Cinavia support. That's why the studios are pushing the manufactures to implement Cinavia through a firmware update. Players made after February 2012 must have Cinavia. There are many other reasons why a Bluray disk doesn't play on some players, mostly because they mess with Java.

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post #315 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 09:58 AM
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Disks authored with Cinavia should play on any player without Cinavia support. That's why the studios are pushing the manufactures to implement Cinavia through a firmware update. Players made after February 2012 must have Cinavia. There are many other reasons why a Bluray disk doesn't play on some players, mostly because they mess with Java.

That could be. But two BR's not playing on the old player was enough. It had to go.

I have the S590 connected and for $119, it is a bargain. Cinavia or not. Not going to have a choice afterall. I needed a new player.
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post #316 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedracerII View Post

It is yet another type of copy protection. This one puts a spread spectrum audio signal in the audio channels. It claims to not be detectable to humans.

Here is a list of BR that have them... Moneyball was the first one that would not play on my old BR player. It played fine on the S580. Well at least i assumed it was due to the Cinavia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cinavia...a_watermarking

Thanks for the link. It looks like I have one disc on the list, The Karate Kid. Will have to play it and see what if anything happens. I was tired of driving 13 miles to return a rental disc to get a $3. credit for the next rental. That's one reason why we bought our first network player. Did I mention how awesome SACD is!!??

Jeff
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post #317 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 11:48 AM
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I have the S590 connected via HDMI through my AVR. I use a Harmony One to switch between the DirecTV reciever and the S590 when I want to watch a BR. As soon as the S590 starts up it sends a loud audio sound through the left front channel. It is a loud noise, nothing that should be there. Lasts half a second.

Any ideas what this is???
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post #318 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 12:23 PM
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Can someone explain this Cinavia to me in laymans terms please. And what discs are affected.

As far as I understand, it's an audio watermark which identifies the origin of the sound. It might say something like, "this audio is from an AACS protected Blu-ray disc". The player, detecting that, is supposed to refuse to play it if it's not getting it from an AACS protected Blu-ray disc. There are four different responses and I'm not quite sure what elicits each. The player may simply mute the audio, which allows playback of video in which only sections of the audio are marked; in other circumstances it will stop playing altogether.

The watermark is supposedly entirely inaudible and impossible to filter out of the sound, but there's already a product on the market which claims to be able to make a disc copy of a Cinavia marked BD which will play on PS3s (only to disc and only for playback on PS3s).

The AACS licensing agreement requires that licensed devices sold after 12 February this year have Cinavia detection built in. I think that Sony was actually in violation of that license agreement by shipping these things without Cinavia in place.

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post #319 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 12:31 PM
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Has anyone tried playing a backed-up BD-R Cinavia disc that is listed on the Wiki Cinavia page on the BDP-S590/390 units and what is the outcome? I know Sony is now disabling the services (Netflix,Amazon,etc) on their players unless you upgrade to the latest firmware which includes this sw.

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post #320 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 01:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedracerII View Post

I went to two Targets and there was only one left. I got it for $119. Thanks for the tip Joerod

I went to Fry's and got a 4GB USB drive for $6.

http://www.amazon.com/v165-USB-Flash...2687797&sr=1-3

Nice low profile, fits fine.

Haven't connected it up yet. It is sitting next to my S580 which was in the bedroom.

Ironically I had to move it from the bedroom when two discs with that new Cinavia would not play in my old 1Gen Sony BR player. They played fine in the S580.

Not my tip but thanks for your tip on amazon.

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post #321 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 01:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Krutsch View Post

Well, you should head on over to Target. I picked my S590 up last night - off the shelf - for $119.00. It was stacked on the shelf with a collection of the older model (BDP-S580) which was also priced at 119.00; I couldn't believe that price, so I grabbed one and headed for the checkout. And, it rang up at $119.00 so I took it home.

I am loving this player at that price...

It is not even on the Target website.
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post #322 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 03:02 PM
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I just did a test with The Karate Kid and Dances With Wolves. KK is 2:35 aspect ratio and DWW is 2:40. I measured the bar size on both movies. It came to 4.5". I then switched the wiring around and plugged in the Panny 110. The screen size is 1/2" less on the Panny. Is there a setting I'm not putting in correctly? Or is this the norm??

Jeff
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post #323 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 03:07 PM
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It is not even on the Target website.

Correct, not on their website yet, but some stores do have them in stock, just call to check.
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post #324 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 04:21 PM
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Correct, not on their website yet, but some stores do have them in stock, just call to check.

Thanks.
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post #325 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 04:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michaeltscott View Post

The watermark is supposedly entirely inaudible and impossible to filter out of the sound, but there's already a product on the market which claims to be able to make a disc copy of a Cinavia marked BD which will play on PS3s (only to disc and only for playback on PS3s)

Sony has disabled playback of BDMV-REC optical media as a "trusted source" (DRM word) with a recent firmware update to the PS3. This negates the type of disc copy referenced above.
Sony has obviously decided they will have their way and will with their customers regarding their obsession with cinavia by doing their best to force firmware modifications onto us even if it eliminates functionality.
So - pay attention to what firmware updates do in total - and make intelligent decisions about whether to install it or not.

A long-time audio/video addict!
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post #326 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 05:17 PM
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So - pay attention to what firmware updates do in total - and make intelligent decisions about whether to install it or not.

Which of course will be decisions about whether or not to use networked streaming services on your player, which will disabled until you do install the latest update.

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post #327 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 05:22 PM
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Which of course will be decisions about whether or not to use networked streaming services on your player, which will disabled until you do install the latest update.

In the case of Sony standalone blu-ray players that Sony has targeted for cinavia infection - that appears to be true. You either accept the cinavia infection - or you sacrifice streaming functionality you paid for when you bought the player.

A long-time audio/video addict!
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post #328 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 05:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Rich86 View Post

In the case of Sony standalone blu-ray players that Sony has targeted for cinavia infection - that appears to be true. You either accept the cinavia infection - or you sacrifice streaming functionality you paid for when you bought the player.

Again, if you're really worried about it I wouldn't accept any firmware update even on older players. Who knows whether they'll add Cinavia detection? They don't have to advertise it and probably won't.

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post #329 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 05:51 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pronghorn/az View Post

I just did a test with The Karate Kid and Dances With Wolves. KK is 2:35 aspect ratio and DWW is 2:40. I measured the bar size on both movies. It came to 4.5". I then switched the wiring around and plugged in the Panny 110. The screen size is 1/2" less on the Panny. Is there a setting I'm not putting in correctly? Or is this the norm??

Jeff

Same inputs used between the two. On your display did you check the overscan settings ?
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post #330 of 4069 Old 03-25-2012, 08:37 PM
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Same inputs used between the two. On your display did you check the overscan settings ?

I checked and rechecked all the settings in both Blu Ray players, the receiver and the TV. Sony support (is that what they call it?!) is saying to (like i'm 2 yrs old) check the input to make sure it's on 16X9 and that black bars are normal on some movies. And if that doesn't work try the picture settings on the tv. I should add that 1:85 movies on Blu Ray and reg. TV are fine. I'm watching the original Planet of the Apes on HDNM and the aspect ratio is 2:40 and I measured the bars and it's 4" compared to the 4.5" on the Sony. I'll check my settings again in the player. Has anyone else had this problem with the Sony??

Jeff
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