Official Sony BDP-S590 and BDP-390 Thread - Page 29 - AVS Forum
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post #841 of 4022 Old 04-27-2012, 08:24 PM
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There is no inherent problem with Auto, the problem is that Auto is usually defendant on the EDID sent back by your display, and many times that can be incorrect, or you might get back the EDID for a receiver in between the two devices, and that will be different. The reason to avoid Auto is that it might incorrectly select RGB, which you don't want.

For picking between 4:2:2 and 4:4:4, the easiest way is with a copy of Spears and Munsil. They have a nice write-up about it here:

http://www.spearsandmunsil.com/artic...olorspace.html

I also use the chroma plate and multiburst patterns to select one. With the plate, you will see the edges get darker and it should be bright all the way to the edges. With the multiburst, the fine vertical line pattern will be too dark if it is incorrect usually. I wouldn't worry about it really, since if your display handles 4:2:2 or 4:4:4 worse than RGB, the usual issue is a loss of fine chroma detail. When using RGB with this Sony, the issue is that you're losing a ton of contrast range as colors will be blown out (for example) and you won't have as much dynamic range to the image, which is much worse than a slight loss of chroma detail.

So pick 4:2:2 or 4:4:4, not RGB and not Auto, at least until this is fixed. Those two are correct, any other setting from the player is wrong.

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post #842 of 4022 Old 04-27-2012, 09:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roscoejackson View Post

2) I'm getting AV sync issues on some Netflix movies. On Religulous (5.1), it is unwatchable.

I believe this to be an artifact of the fact that they're set things up to allow multiple selectable soundtracks (for devices like this which support 5.1 sound, which use a different set of encodings than older devices). They don't always get it 100% right. Sometimes if I use the LEFT button to go back a little when I start up again it will be in sync; if not, generally going back and choosing the stereo version of the soundtrack instead of 5.1 will do it (works for Religulous).

It's an occasional problem which, if its present in a title, will be present for it on all devices which support 5.1 sound.

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post #843 of 4022 Old 04-28-2012, 12:04 AM
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Originally Posted by apw2607 View Post

If it says it's updated, then it's fine

Is update 320 supposed to stop the Screen Format setting from affecting Netflix? If i set it to Full, it changes the output in Netflix. I read in an earlier post that this update would prevent this setting from affecting Netflix. This is why I'm thinking maybe my update didn't take.
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post #844 of 4022 Old 04-28-2012, 05:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smackrabbit View Post

There is no inherent problem with Auto, the problem is that Auto is usually defendant on the EDID sent back by your display, and many times that can be incorrect, or you might get back the EDID for a receiver in between the two devices, and that will be different. The reason to avoid Auto is that it might incorrectly select RGB, which you don't want.

For picking between 4:2:2 and 4:4:4, the easiest way is with a copy of Spears and Munsil. They have a nice write-up about it here:

http://www.spearsandmunsil.com/artic...olorspace.html

I also use the chroma plate and multiburst patterns to select one. With the plate, you will see the edges get darker and it should be bright all the way to the edges. With the multiburst, the fine vertical line pattern will be too dark if it is incorrect usually. I wouldn't worry about it really, since if your display handles 4:2:2 or 4:4:4 worse than RGB, the usual issue is a loss of fine chroma detail. When using RGB with this Sony, the issue is that you're losing a ton of contrast range as colors will be blown out (for example) and you won't have as much dynamic range to the image, which is much worse than a slight loss of chroma detail.

So pick 4:2:2 or 4:4:4, not RGB and not Auto, at least until this is fixed. Those two are correct, any other setting from the player is wrong.

I have had zero issues with auto. Never once did it push out RGB, and I've being using the players for over a month now each day with multiple display devices.
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post #845 of 4022 Old 04-28-2012, 05:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roscoejackson View Post


Is update 320 supposed to stop the Screen Format setting from affecting Netflix? If i set it to Full, it changes the output in Netflix. I read in an earlier post that this update would prevent this setting from affecting Netflix. This is why I'm thinking maybe my update didn't take.

Yes. I posted a comment about screen format changing slightly on the first updated firmware from Sony. In truth I never tested Netflix. Only the other streaming services that used the sony playback player .. Crackle, amazon vod, Hulu, etc.
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post #846 of 4022 Old 04-28-2012, 05:14 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by sacflies View Post


OK, thanks. So these are auto downloads that doesn't involve an action by the user?

Sometimes you will see a new icon in the XMB that says Internet content refresh required. When this happens it updates the links or adds new links to new services.
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post #847 of 4022 Old 04-28-2012, 05:18 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by roscoejackson View Post


So you don't find the info in post 833 to be true for your tv?

No.
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post #848 of 4022 Old 04-28-2012, 05:21 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sacflies View Post

I just turned my 590 on for the first time in several days and none of the functions worked. I couldn't scroll thru the menu. I was able to power it off but the display has been flashing "off" for 20 minutes now. Gonna have to find the plug on the power strip and put it out of its misery. Has anyone else seen this? I guess it has just frozen up on me, and I have read a few posts here where others have said their players froze up.

Still flashing "off".

Edit: Unplugged it and plugged it back in. Seems OK now. That's the first time I have seen that.

Still can't get over how light and cheaply made this player is. This is probably the lightest player of any kind I have ever owned. It's been said a gazillion times...they don't make 'em the way they used to.

Yes. This happens when the player locks up. It also happens on the s790 BTW. Clearly there are some firmware bugs in there. Only way is to yank the power cord. Most of my lockups have being due to the games rather than playing back content.
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post #849 of 4022 Old 04-28-2012, 06:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apw2607 View Post

I have had zero issues with auto. Never once did it push out RGB, and I've being using the players for over a month now each day with multiple display devices.

That's fine, but since people can easily select 4:2:2 or 4:4:4 to make sure they're getting an accurate image, and be 100% sure they aren't getting RGB, there's no reason to say to use Auto until the RGB issue is fixed. Do your display devices tell you if they are receiving 4:2:2, 4:4:4 or RGB? Most do not, so most people would have no idea if they were receiving an RGB signal or not when set to Auto.

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post #850 of 4022 Old 04-28-2012, 09:10 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smackrabbit View Post


That's fine, but since people can easily select 4:2:2 or 4:4:4 to make sure they're getting an accurate image, and be 100% sure they aren't getting RGB, there's no reason to say to use Auto until the RGB issue is fixed. Do your display devices tell you if they are receiving 4:2:2, 4:4:4 or RGB? Most do not, so most people would have no idea if they were receiving an RGB signal or not when set to Auto.

Both the projector and tv are receiving 4:4:4 with 12 bit deep color. The receiver (denon Avr 4310ci) can show the hdmi signal info. The 4310 is also equipped with 2 hdmi outs which can work separately or together. Very handy indeed.
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post #851 of 4022 Old 04-28-2012, 06:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apw2607 View Post

Both the projector and tv are receiving 4:4:4 with 12 bit deep color. The receiver (denon Avr 4310ci) can show the hdmi signal info. The 4310 is also equipped with 2 hdmi outs which can work separately or together. Very handy indeed.

Right, but most displays and projectors lack that, and then whatever format Auto is sending is a crap-shoot, whereas selecting 4:2:2 or 4:4:4 ensures you will not get RGB. Any issue that selecting one of those would cause is going to be far less than selecting RGB and getting the side effects of it.

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post #852 of 4022 Old 04-29-2012, 01:46 PM
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Although I love the S590 for video (BD, DVD and streaming), I'm glad I kept my Oppo 980. I'm going to plug it back into my system for audio discs. With the Oppo, I stick in a disc, it starts playing automatically, and I don't think it's ever choked on a disc. With the S590, you almost have to have a monitor on to press play once it's fully loaded, and I've had several discs that won't play properly (posted previously). Last night, it froze on a CD, but it did play after I waited a minute or two for it to power cycle and properly read the disc.

I'm not complaining. The S590 is a wonderful value for the $119 I paid, and it's much more robust than the previous BD player I owned. It's just not as convenient or reliable on audio discs as the old Oppo.

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post #853 of 4022 Old 04-30-2012, 09:41 AM
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Just wanted to post a quick update for the s590 recently acquired to replace an ailing samsung 6500 that wouldn't operate properly for a friends setup that was using an older Panny Plasma (ie., 720p, 1080i). With the default settings (resolution set to "auto" and 24p on) I could not get picture or audio. I had to manually change the resolution to 1080i and turn 24p "off" before it would work properly. So, just a reminder to those with older TV's, that you may need to manually set this resolution and turn 24p off to get it to work. Evidently the "auto" setting isn't reading the TV's resolution and adjusting.
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post #854 of 4022 Old 04-30-2012, 10:57 AM
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Originally Posted by darylc View Post

Just wanted to post a quick update for the s590 recently acquired to replace an ailing samsung 6500 that wouldn't operate properly for a friends setup that was using an older Panny Plasma (ie., 720p, 1080i). With the default settings (resolution set to "auto" and 24p on) I could not get picture or audio. I had to manually change the resolution to 1080i and turn 24p "off" before it would work properly. So, just a reminder to those with older TV's, that you may need to manually set this resolution and turn 24p off to get it to work. Evidently the "auto" setting isn't reading the TV's resolution and adjusting.

Most plasmas before 1080p were 768p, but mine (5-plus years old) will accept a 1080p signal. I always force my players to send 1080p to my Panasonic. I tested a couple of times, and couldn't really see much difference between 720p, 1080i, or 1080p, but I figured I might as well feed the highest resolution if the TV can handle it.

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post #855 of 4022 Old 04-30-2012, 11:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darylc View Post

Just wanted to post a quick update for the s590 recently acquired to replace an ailing samsung 6500 that wouldn't operate properly for a friends setup that was using an older Panny Plasma (ie., 720p, 1080i). With the default settings (resolution set to "auto" and 24p on) I could not get picture or audio. I had to manually change the resolution to 1080i and turn 24p "off" before it would work properly. So, just a reminder to those with older TV's, that you may need to manually set this resolution and turn 24p off to get it to work. Evidently the "auto" setting isn't reading the TV's resolution and adjusting.

My older panasonic plasma wont take 24p but will accept 1080p.


Quote:
Originally Posted by dougotte View Post

Most plasmas before 1080p were 768p, but mine (5-plus years old) will accept a 1080p signal. I always force my players to send 1080p to my Panasonic. I tested a couple of times, and couldn't really see much difference between 720p, 1080i, or 1080p, but I figured I might as well feed the highest resolution if the TV can handle it.

Doug

The 768p era plasmas usually don't have good scalers compared to the sony x90 blu ray players. Is it better to let the plasma upscale 720p than downscale 1080? I see 720 size as being closer to 768 than 1080, unless the higher 1080 resolution is the most important element to getting a good picture on 768. Any opinions?
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post #856 of 4022 Old 05-01-2012, 06:30 AM
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Originally Posted by keagy View Post

The 768p era plasmas usually don't have good scalers compared to the sony x90 blu ray players. Is it better to let the plasma upscale 720p than downscale 1080? I see 720 size as being closer to 768 than 1080, unless the higher 1080 resolution is the most important element to getting a good picture on 768. Any opinions?

I figure I want the best PQ when the source is 1080p. So, if the player feeds the TV w/ the original resolution, the TV just has to scale once, to 768p. If I have the player scale it to 720p or 1080i, then the TV has to do an additional scaling to 768p.

Of course, for any other source (e.g. 480p), two separate scaling steps are required regardless.

Doug
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post #857 of 4022 Old 05-01-2012, 11:14 AM
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Hi,
Got a Sony HDRTD10 3D handycam and was wondering if the BDP-S590 would play thos i60 3D files directly from an external drive via it's USB port??

Or would the files need processing with PMB first and then stored on an external drive then connected to the player?? Looking for a way to have a storage area for my 3D vidoes produced by the TD10.

Thanks in advance!
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post #858 of 4022 Old 05-01-2012, 05:17 PM
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I'm looking at picking up the S490, but I think it might be UK only. http://www.hdtv-news.com/sony/bdps490/

It has netflix support, but can anyone confirm whether it streams in HD or not, I know some players don't stream in HD.
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post #859 of 4022 Old 05-01-2012, 05:53 PM
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The S490 appears to be UK-only. As I recall, its specs make it to be an S590 without built-in WiFi (you can see its page at Sony's UK site here). If it's running the same Netflix app as on the S390, S590 and S790, then it's 1080p capable.

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post #860 of 4022 Old 05-02-2012, 07:50 AM
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I had the opportunity to play with the S390 and Panasonic BDT320 last night. From my understanding, both players should be representative of the PQ and AQ from the S590 & S790 and BDT120 & BDT220 respectively, as these other models only add/subtract various optional features and settings - none of which affect the default playback quality. My impressions from viewing on my new 82" DLP:

Build Quality - Both the Sony and Panasonic felt fairly cheap and plastic-y to me. The Panasonic did feel a little better, but that is likely because I was comparing Sony's lowest-end to Panasonic's current highest-end. The Panasonic was also abnormally long for a player, which made it awkward to find a spot in my entertainment center. Ultimately, the build quality is of minimal concern to me, as it will remain on a shelf until the day I retire it. I do wish the S390 had a front display, however this feature is available on the S590 and S790.

Remote - Jesus Christ, Panasonic - what was the idea here? I'm a gadget guru and play with laptops and smart phones all day, but this touchpad remote had me baffled. Luckily, I was able to use an older Panasonic remote I had lying around (they also have a smart phone app). Thankfully, the 220 comes with a normal remote. The Sony remote did its job admirably enough, no complaints. I definitely preferred the Sony remote, and a smart phone media remote is available for it as well.

Interface - I was pleased with both the Panasonic and Sony UI. I give the slight edge to the Sony, but probably because I'm more familiar with it from the PS3. I think most folks would be happy with either. The Sony just seemed more intuitive to me from previous personal experience.

Disc Loading Time - The Panasonic was faster with just about everything. I did not break out a stopwatch, so I can only tell you it was quicker - but not by how much. I didn't spend much time evaluating this, as I'm typically grabbing snacks and blankets and getting settled while the disc is loading anyway. My old BD35 took forever and a day, yet it never really bothered me. The Sony was no slouch, but it was slower.

DVD Playback - Both players did an excellent job and I would be hard pressed to choose one over the other. The Panasonic had more tweaks to the picture available, if that's your sort of thing. I usually disable just about every "enhancement", so they didn't factor into my observations. I did not have these players showing side-by-side, so there could be some subtle differences, but I would be more than happy with either player. I still buy quite a few used DVDs (they're so hard to turn down at $2-$3 a pop), so this is great news. I have not used an Oppo, so I could not tell you how the picture compares. I do find it hard to believe that standard DVD could look any better than it does here.

Blu-ray Playback - No discernible differences. Aside from the aforementioned load times, I could not tell you which player was which.

Network/Online Features - The Sony wins here for functionality and sheer number of online apps. The Netflix interface was especially quick on the Sony compared to the sluggish version on the Panasonic. Both players were able to eventually get to the movie just fine, but it seemed like a much smoother process on the Sony. My brief experiment with DLNA proved to benefit the Sony as well, though the Panasonic worked fine with some content. I would pick up the Sony if DLNA was a priority, as it seemed to play more formats with less of a hassle.

3D Playback - I did not evaluate, as I don't care for 3D content. Mileage may vary, so see other reviews.

If I had to choose a single player between the two, it would be the S390. While the 320 is a fine player, it just didn't seem to "run on all cylinders" as smoothly as the Sony did for my needs. Each has their pros and cons, so you'll want to evaluate your priorities. They're so close, each could be a winner based on your needs.

Given the negligible price difference online with the S390, I'm inclined to pick up a S590 for the addition of a front display (and the option of 3D if some must-see exclusive comes out one day).
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post #861 of 4022 Old 05-02-2012, 08:45 AM
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Great review LugNutX. Thanks.

Speaking of DLNA, here's a little tip I haven't seen posted yet in this thread. Although US Sonys supposedly won't play avi (Divx, Xvid), you can get many of them to play using Serviio over DLNA if you just add the extension ".mkv" to the name. For example, just rename video1.avi to video1.avi.mkv. That way sony sees the mkv and thinks its a playable format, and you still have avi in the name so you know the actual format. You can easily batch rename in windows from the command prompt "ren *.avi *.avi.mkv". To put them back, use "ren *.mkv *."

Oddly, the manual specifically states mkv won't play over DLNA, but in my experience they play just fine, even avi's masquerading as mkv's.

I've seen some reports this trick doesn't work. But it's worked for me on at least the last 3 generations of sonys (x70, x80, x90) on most of my files. Some won't play, but I've never figured out why. So YMMV.
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post #862 of 4022 Old 05-02-2012, 10:19 AM
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After some issues with my 590, I exchanged it for a Panasonic BDT 220. Yes the panny had faster load times but given a major Netflix glitch (3-5 second audio delay last night when my Sony 55HX729's Netflix app had no issues nor any other device) and despite Netflix on the 220 worked OK this morning , I returned it and gave the Sony BDP-S590 another shot. Everything works fine, 3D, Netflix, appropriate audio output. Very happy to have the Sony 590 back. I didn't even have to look at the manual at this point. Watching Adventures of Tintin 3D now, nice...Everything nice And good to have all those apps back.

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post #863 of 4022 Old 05-02-2012, 05:21 PM
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if anyone was curious about the 509's 2d-3d conversion, it appears to do what I have seen described about the panasonics - it pushes the image back but doesn't really add any depth at all.
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post #864 of 4022 Old 05-02-2012, 06:27 PM
 
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Will either the sony 590 or panasonic 220 be available at costco?
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post #865 of 4022 Old 05-02-2012, 06:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oleus View Post

if anyone was curious about the 509's 2d-3d conversion, it appears to do what I have seen described about the panasonics - it pushes the image back but doesn't really add any depth at all.

My TV has the 2D-3D option. I tired it once and it wasn't worth the trouble. I'd rather watch 2D in 2D and 3D in (native) 3D.

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post #866 of 4022 Old 05-02-2012, 06:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hi_Def_Boss View Post

Will either the sony 590 or panasonic 220 be available at costco?

No reason to think they would stop carrying those brands now. Of course the model numbers will be different. The panny will be a 225 and the sony will be a BX59. They're probably just clearing out old stock before rolling out the new models.
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post #867 of 4022 Old 05-02-2012, 06:57 PM
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I just picked up the BX59 at my local Costco.
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post #868 of 4022 Old 05-02-2012, 07:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Note the bx this time around just come with the hdmi cable. No special remote with glow in the dark buttons and fat finger buttons :-)
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post #869 of 4022 Old 05-02-2012, 09:15 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrucePadgett View Post

I just picked up the BX59 at my local Costco.

Meaning I'll be making a trip.

What was the damage? (to your pocketbook, that is).
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post #870 of 4022 Old 05-02-2012, 11:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hi_Def_Boss View Post

Meaning I'll be making a trip.

What was the damage? (to your pocketbook, that is).


$139.99

Had mine for about a week. Traded in my bx58 and very pleased. Netflix app is 1000x better. Aside from the better menus and FF/RW previews, it also seems to be sustaining better speeds from my router. The bx58 had a 100% signal, but sometimes D/L speeds would crawl. Another thing, on the bx58 whatever speed achieved during the "Checking link speed" test would determine the stream PQ. On the bx59 it will change instantaneously. My net connection is only 6Mbps (with max 5Mbps actually achieved), and shockingly, I'm occasionally getting X-High PQ (1080p). It looks great.

The remote also gives better tactile feedback and is less mushy.

Everything else, aside from a couple of settings options, is about the same, but the Netflix experience makes the upgrade well worth it.
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