Official OPPO BDP-103 Owner's Thread - Page 292 - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #8731 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 10:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu_One View Post

like others have said, good luck trying to find a sound difference between internal (LPCM output) and external (DTS-HD / Dolby True HD bitstream output) decoding.

That been said, I'm kinda like you, now that I'm using the 103 for BD playback instead of my fat PS3 80GB, I kinda like seeing that DTS-HD logo light up on my Onkyo AVR biggrin.gifcool.gif

Oh yeah... it sounds better too wink.gif

We agree that although it's kind of fun to see the HD audio lights illuminated on the receiver, there is no audible difference in the quality of HD audio decoded internally by the BD player and that which is sent in raw form to the receiver and decoded there.
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post #8732 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 12:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu_One View Post

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Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

That depends on whether you think your AVR or the 103 will do the best job with DVD sources. I use these settings with an OPPO 93.

TV Aspect Ratio: 16:9 Wide/Auto
Output Resolution: 1080p
1080P24 Output:: OFF

On your Oppo 93, with the settings above for SD-DVD, are you using HDMI1 or HDMI2?
I'm using HDMI1 and direct pass through in our Denon 3312 and the Denon 3806 before it. UMR, when calibrating, and I haven't detected any signs of excessive processing from the OPPO 93.

Being movie buffs, we probably watch as much DVD as Blu-ray.
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post #8733 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 12:15 PM
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^^^

Good stuff, thx very much for your reply smile.gif

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post #8734 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 12:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwsat View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu_One View Post

like others have said, good luck trying to find a sound difference between internal (LPCM output) and external (DTS-HD / Dolby True HD bitstream output) decoding.

That been said, I'm kinda like you, now that I'm using the 103 for BD playback instead of my fat PS3 80GB, I kinda like seeing that DTS-HD logo light up on my Onkyo AVR biggrin.gifcool.gif

Oh yeah... it sounds better too wink.gif

We agree that although it's kind of fun to see the HD audio lights illuminated on the receiver, there is no audible difference in the quality of HD audio decoded internally by the BD player and that which is sent in raw form to the receiver and decoded there.
+++++ smile.gif

Maybe it's the "p" word, or just pulling our chain. wink.gif

In another logical fallacy, appeal to authority, UMR has calibrated our audio with both Denon receivers, and I've always used LPCM output from our OPPO players. Now I'm getting an itch to see our AVR tell me what we are hearing, but unfortunately it's housed in another room. eek.gif

Oh, I remember now, some problems have been fixed for other owners by switching from bitstream to LPCM. I think I'll just let it itch. wink.gif

I'm not going to make any financial decisions today. I'm feeling a little dingy. On the other hand, I almost never make financial decisions. rolleyes.gif
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post #8735 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 12:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

+++++ smile.gif

Maybe it's the "p" word, or just pulling our chain. wink.gif

In another logical fallacy, appeal to authority, UMR has calibrated our audio with both Denon receivers, and I've always used LPCM output from our OPPO players. Now I'm getting an itch to see our AVR tell me what we are hearing, but unfortunately it's housed in another room. eek.gif

Oh, I remember now, some problems have been fixed for other owners by switching from bitstream to LPCM. I think I'll just let it itch. wink.gif

I'm sure you know I was joking around with that statement.. but what's the 'p' word ? confused.gif PM me if need be lol

I'm sticking to bitstream until I encounter any problems in that regard (knock on wood) cool.gif

But yeah for you, why fix what ain't broken.. especially when we both agree that there's no perceptible audible difference between LPCM and bitstream.

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post #8736 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 12:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Manic_D View Post

I don't have Windows 8 but here's a post from earlier in the thread with some info:

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1432162/official-oppo-bdp-103-owners-thread/6420#post_23054304

Many thanks for the tip!
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post #8737 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Blu_One View Post


I'm sure you know I was joking around with that statement.. but what's the 'p' word ? confused.gif PM me if need be lol
There have been folks make the argument that bitstream is clearly better, and for them the "p" word is placebo. Yes, I did know you were joking, and it seemed to set me off to somewhere strange. No idea why.
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I'm sticking to bitstream until I encounter any problems in that regard (knock on wood) cool.gif
That's exactly why I'm sticking with LPCM. smile.gif

My memory is fuzzy every day, but I think that the switch to LPCM in the OPPO had to do with problems in some bitstreaming AVRs. I started with LPCM because the Denon 3806 didn't know bitstream from Adam. The 3312 does know bitstream, but I just never made the change.
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post #8738 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 01:00 PM
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Originally Posted by gwsat View Post

We agree that although it's kind of fun to see the HD audio lights illuminated on the receiver, there is no audible difference in the quality of HD audio decoded internally by the BD player and that which is sent in raw form to the receiver and decoded there.

I'll beg to differ ! there is indeed a difference to be heard in my setup which consist of an Oppo 105 and Marantz 8801, setting the Oppo to LPCM for hdmi audio out rolls off the high frequencies and while the sound can be perceived as more robust and weighty in the mid and lower bass , the overall presentation seems lower in volume as well lackinking dynamics if you will! Now setting the 105 to bitstream via hdmi audio restores the dynamic presentation to the upper frequencies and to some degree more clarity and a perceived loudness increase overall. I'm not sure if this is still true from the latest update but I'll test and post back. but there is an audible difference and it's not subtle!
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post #8739 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 01:06 PM
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post #8740 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 01:09 PM
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^ That strongly suggests there is something wrong in the way your Marantz is handling HDMI LPCM input. You mention a volume difference for example. If there is a volume difference then the Marantz is doing something wrong, either with the Bitstream or the LPCM (or both).

Just to cover the basics, settings to check in the OPPO: Dynamic Range Control OFF, DTS Neo:6 Mode OFF, Secondary Audio OFF (needed for the Bitstream comparison). And if you are using a dual HDMI cable hookup, confirm that Split A/V is set (with audio carried on the HDMI 2 output).

Another check would be to use the multi-channel Analog outputs of your 105, since of course they are fed with the LPCM that results from the decode in the player. If the decode to LPCM in the player was faulty, the 105 thread would be FULL of howls from the Analog enthusiasts.
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post #8741 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 01:34 PM
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post #8742 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 01:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

^ That strongly suggests there is something wrong in the way your Marantz is handling HDMI LPCM input. You mention a volume difference for example. If there is a volume difference then the Marantz is doing something wrong, either with the Bitstream or the LPCM (or both).

Just to cover the basics, settings to check in the OPPO: Dynamic Range Control OFF, DTS Neo:6 Mode OFF, Secondary Audio OFF (needed for the Bitstream comparison). And if you are using a dual HDMI cable hookup, confirm that Split A/V is set (with audio carried on the HDMI 2 output).

Another check would be to use the multi-channel Analog outputs of your 105, since of course they are fed with the LPCM that results from the decode in the player. If the decode to LPCM in the player was faulty, the 105 thread would be FULL of howls from the Analog enthusiasts.
--Bob

I wouldn't say faulty! just different remember who your talking to Bob! the 1k power cord ring a bell biggrin.gif If that doesn't help I also hear a difference between PCM and DSD, I have all the above recommendations covered and sorry I don't fall into bits are just bits camp! ( in perfect world perhaps) I'm of the change a variable change the end result camp!
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post #8743 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 01:48 PM
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Now I've got to figure out if a HDMI cable can be faulty when transmitting LPCM, but not faulty when transmitting bitstream. Maybe it's a bandwidth problem.
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post #8744 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

Now I've got to figure out if a HDMI cable can be faulty when transmitting LPCM, but not faulty when transmitting bitstream. Maybe it's a bandwidth problem.

Good question , for awhile I did like the sound of LPCM as it had a closer presentation to the Sabre dac's via xlr ( more analog sounding) but as the 8801 settled and sounded more refined the switch back to bitstream was prefered after a lot of A/b listening on movies with hires codecs and multi/ch sacd! because of the differences I noted above.
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post #8745 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 02:16 PM
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Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

Now I've got to figure out if a HDMI cable can be faulty when transmitting LPCM, but not faulty when transmitting bitstream. Maybe it's a bandwidth problem.

Really ??

You think that's possible with an HDMI Cable ? confused.gif

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post #8746 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 02:24 PM
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I'd be among the first to agree that change should not be discounted.

But then, if you buy enough $1K power cords you soon won't HAVE any change.

biggrin.gif
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post #8747 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 02:29 PM
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FYI: Seems the latest firmware fixes the 422 and 444 color space issues I was experiencing using Source Direct from HDMI 2 into a Lumagen Radiance vp and from there to a Sharp Elite (post 5276). RGB (both video and PC) is still screwed up. Didn't notice any change in noise reduction on HDMI 1 Source Direct. Would have been nice if the release notes had mentioned the fix since I found it by accident while evaluating a change in setup configuration.
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post #8748 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 02:36 PM
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Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

+++++ smile.gif

Maybe it's the "p" word, or just pulling our chain. wink.gif


In another logical fallacy, appeal to authority, UMR has calibrated our audio with both Denon receivers, and I've always used LPCM output from our OPPO players. Now I'm getting an itch to see our AVR tell me what we are hearing, but unfortunately it's housed in another room. eek.gif

Oh, I remember now, some problems have been fixed for other owners by switching from bitstream to LPCM. I think I'll just let it itch. wink.gif

I'm not going to make any financial decisions today. I'm feeling a little dingy. On the other hand, I almost never make financial decisions. rolleyes.gif


Jeff said to me on his last visit here a month ago that there are pros and cons to both. For one, lpcm is 4db low whereas bitstream is at Dolby level. So if your receiver is calibrated for audio and you want 0db to truly represent Dolby level, put player to bitstream. On the other hand, lpcm is less prone to potential data errors. Choose your poison.

If you're talkin, you ain't learnin.
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post #8749 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 02:41 PM
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^^^

Now that I'm getting used to it I need that DTS-HD Logo to light up on my AVR.. cool.gifbiggrin.gif


if I don't see it... I start twitching wink.gif

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post #8750 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 02:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

I'd be among the first to agree that change should not be discounted.

But then, if you buy enough $1K power cords you soon won't HAVE any change.

biggrin.gif
--Bob

Nice one wink.gif
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post #8751 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 02:52 PM
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Originally Posted by hifi59 View Post

Jeff said to me on his last visit here a month ago that there are pros and cons to both. For one, lpcm is 4db low whereas bitstream is at Dolby level. So if your receiver is calibrated for audio and you want 0db to truly represent Dolby level, put player to bitstream. On the other hand, lpcm is less prone to potential data errors. Choose your poison.

LPCM should not be low, although it is easy to get an effect like that if, for example you are testing with Dolby tracks and the AVR is not paying attention to the Dialog Normalization meta-data in the incoming Bitstream. (4dB is common for that.)
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post #8752 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 03:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Blu_One View Post

^^^

Now that I'm getting used to it I need that DTS-HD Logo to light up on my AVR.. cool.gifbiggrin.gif


if I don't see it... I start twitching wink.gif

Remember the Info button on the OPPO remote (along with Page Up/Down to see the rest of the info) can be used to find what type of track is playing and whether the player is sending out the Bitstream or not.

Think of it as a "patch" to help reduce the anxiety of little lit-up logo withdrawal.
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post #8753 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 03:53 PM
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...
2) SMB credentials not remembered. I temporarily set up a second server with SMB access for some testing. Switching between the servers required that re-enter my credentials even though they're the same on each one which seems fine as I'm sure the player is server-based since my servers are NOT on a domain. Now, though, I'm no longer using my test server. Every time I turn on the player and navigate to my server, it fails to log in with the "saved" credentials and I have type them in all over again. What's strange is that it won't accept the user name if I type it in the log in screen directly, however, it will accept it if I enter the user name in the keyboard input screen. This particular issue seems to be only related to the user name and not the password. Once I log in, it'll work fine until I turn off the player.
I heard back from Oppo on this issue and they said they're aware of it and are working on a solution in a future firmware. I'm hoping it's the next one.

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post #8754 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 04:12 PM
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Remember the Info button on the OPPO remote (along with Page Up/Down to see the rest of the info) can be used to find what type of track is playing and whether the player is sending out the Bitstream or not.

Think of it as a "patch" to help reduce the anxiety of little lit-up logo withdrawal.
--Bob

Nice ! Now I can confirm, and double-confirm, that's perfect for my anxiety tongue.gif

Thx Bob !

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post #8755 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 04:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu_One View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

Now I've got to figure out if a HDMI cable can be faulty when transmitting LPCM, but not faulty when transmitting bitstream. Maybe it's a bandwidth problem.

Really ??

You think that's possible with an HDMI Cable ? confused.gif
Not in this case. The joke that you started is continuing. It has some relation to chaos theory. wink.gif

You know, the flutter of a butterfly wing in China ... sort of thing. Your LPCM joke was that butterfly wing.
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post #8756 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 04:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hifi59 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

+++++ smile.gif

Maybe it's the "p" word, or just pulling our chain. wink.gif


In another logical fallacy, appeal to authority, UMR has calibrated our audio with both Denon receivers, and I've always used LPCM output from our OPPO players. Now I'm getting an itch to see our AVR tell me what we are hearing, but unfortunately it's housed in another room. eek.gif

Oh, I remember now, some problems have been fixed for other owners by switching from bitstream to LPCM. I think I'll just let it itch. wink.gif

I'm not going to make any financial decisions today. I'm feeling a little dingy. On the other hand, I almost never make financial decisions. rolleyes.gif


Jeff said to me on his last visit here a month ago that there are pros and cons to both. For one, lpcm is 4db low whereas bitstream is at Dolby level. So if your receiver is calibrated for audio and you want 0db to truly represent Dolby level, put player to bitstream. On the other hand, lpcm is less prone to potential data errors. Choose your poison.
That's Jeff's job. His last visit was to calibrate our audio with the Denon 3312 installed. wink.gif

I take your point though. I won't be changing to bitstream any time soon anyway.
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post #8757 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 04:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwsat View Post

Bill -- Thanks. Upon further investigation I have discovered that Oppo's implementation of the Bitstream setting is just what I need. I wanted a setting that would allow my receiver to display the information when one of the HD audio formats was being received. On my old PS3, the Bitstream setting does not pass that information to the receiver. All the receiver knows is that it is receiving a PCM stream. Anyway, I now know that my 103 is not so limited so I am a happy camper.
Actually, while I understand the "enjoyment" of seeing DTS-HD MA LED's lit up on your AVR (when delivering bitstream form the 103 to the AVR), the same information is available from the 103 itself even if you set it to do the decoding in the 103 and deliver LPCM to the AVR.

Just push the INFO button on the 103's remote ("i" button, just above the "pop-up menu" button, northeast of the center ENTER and arrow keys collection.

When using external HDMI input, pushing the "info" button produces an "info" display bar at the top of the screen showing the INPUT characteristics audio and video, and an "info" display bar at the bottom of the screen showing the output characteristics audio and video.

When playing a BluRay movie, the two "info" bars present all kinds of interesting and useful information as well, but at the bottom-left you will see the audio information details about the movie. And "DTS-HD MA 5.1 48K" will be shown, if that's what the audio track is.

And if you press the PAGE-DOWN button, the bottom bar will change to show you how the 103 is delivering output to the HDTV (actually to both HDMI-1 and HDMI-2, individually).

It's actually easier to see and more fun and informative to use the 103's "i" button than to try and see little LED's on the AVR panel screen. At least that's what I think, as I have decoding done in the 103 and send out LPCM (to both my HDMI-1/AVR and also to HDMI-2/Smyth Realiser headphone system).
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post #8758 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 04:33 PM
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^^^

Now that I'm getting used to it I need that DTS-HD Logo to light up on my AVR.. cool.gifbiggrin.gif


if I don't see it... I start twitching wink.gif
I've lived without it all my live, and since we've had the the 3312 I wasn't tempted to turn it on before today. The feeling made me a little giddy, but it passed.
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post #8759 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 04:34 PM
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Not in this case. The joke that you started is continuing. It has some relation to chaos theory. wink.gif

Hahah k gotcha !

I'm feeling ya now wink.gif

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post #8760 of 21188 Old 05-13-2013, 04:36 PM
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I've lived without it all my live, and since we've had the the 3312 I wasn't tempted to turn it on before today. The feeling made me a little giddy, but it passed.

Yeah but that cool logo wasn't available all your life. Unless of course you were born within the last decade and are an AVS genius kid wink.gif

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