Official OPPO BDP-103 Owner's Thread - Page 581 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #17401 of 21655 Old 06-25-2014, 09:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post
I can't figure out what you are saying here. Are you saying that the player is putting out the incorrect choice of Color Space on HDMI 1?

There is a known bug in the current firmware where the 103D and 105D output RGB PC Level on HDMI 1 despite RGB Video Level being selected, but only if you have the Resolution set to Source Direct.

I'm not aware of any other such issue in the current firmware.

There is also a type of HDMI handshake failure where the source and destination fail to agree on whether YCbCr or RGB is in use on the cable. The symptom is that you get video which is tinted either Shocking Pink or Ghastly Green depending on which way the confusion arises. Fixing THAT is tackled the same way you fix any other HDMI handshake failure: Improve your HDMI cabling and set settings to simplify the HDMI handshake. Or simply force a new handshake by, e.g., changing output Resolution to something else and back again.

Also, there is a separate thread for the 103D player. You may want to take this discussion there as the 103D and 105D have different HDMI output circuitry from the 103 and 105:

Official OPPO BDP-103D (Darbee Edition) Owner's Thread

--Bob
Thanks.

Ill move to the 103D thread, and see if i can document and explain better.

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post #17402 of 21655 Old 06-25-2014, 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post
So just to be clear here, you've managed to get both dsf and dff files to play as DSD when "pushed" from JRiver DLNA server to the 10x players in current firmware? I.e., if you set SACD Output DSD the player reports the audio type as DSD -- with DSD-Direct-to-Analog Conversion in effect?

Which version of JRiver are you using? Did you have to use some sort of updated profile in JRiver for the 10x players?
--Bob
Yes, I can push .dsf and .dff files to the 10x players. Yes, setting SACD output to DSD on the Oppo player turns on the "DSD" led on the front panel display.

As far as when the 10x players supported DSD audio playback via DLNA, that one is a mystery. A few individuals around the end of 2013 started tweaking their DLNA servers to send specific mime-types for the .dsf/.dff container formats, and magically the 10x players began playing DSD audio via DLNA. Then, a few individuals communicated to JRiver support group about having their server implement a fix for allowing users to change the DSD audio mime-types to make it compatible for the 10x players. I think it was either Dec/'13 or the beginning of this year that the JRiver server (beginning with build 104) actually included the compatible DSD audio mime-types in one of their default Resources files ("FileAssociation.xml" file (Windows OS)).

There may be a bandwidth glitch concerning multi-ch DSD file playback via DLNA. I don't have many multi-ch DSD files, but another gentleman (and myself) reported random hiccups/pausing during playback of multi-ch DSD audio via DLNA some months ago.
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post #17403 of 21655 Old 06-25-2014, 09:41 AM
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^ Cool! I'm surprised there hasn't been MORE discussion about this.
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post #17404 of 21655 Old 06-25-2014, 10:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanF8500 View Post
There may be a bandwidth glitch concerning multi-ch DSD file playback via DLNA. I don't have many multi-ch DSD files, but another gentleman (and myself) reported random hiccups/pausing during playback of multi-ch DSD audio via DLNA some months ago.
I haven't seen any issue with 5.1 DSD accessed via SMB, but I only test a few files and don't regularly use it.
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post #17405 of 21655 Old 06-25-2014, 10:32 AM
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Originally Posted by DanF8500 View Post
There may be a bandwidth glitch concerning multi-ch DSD file playback via DLNA. I don't have many multi-ch DSD files, but another gentleman (and myself) reported random hiccups/pausing during playback of multi-ch DSD audio via DLNA some months ago.
Out of interest, do you know the 'sample rate' of your multi-ch DSD files? All mine are 'single rate' 2.8224 MHz files.

I'm yet to try any of them with the Oppo (to my Onkyo amp) via UPnP. But I will report back soon

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post #17406 of 21655 Old 06-25-2014, 10:47 AM
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^ Only single rate DSD (stereo or multi-channel) is supported for streaming or for playing from an attached drive. This is a hardware limitation in the 10x players.

Stereo-only, double rate DSD is available only on the 105D (recent firmware), and only when using its Asynchronous USB DAC Input. That goes straight to the DACs and thus bypasses the processing clock limit just mentioned.
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post #17407 of 21655 Old 06-25-2014, 01:49 PM
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Thanks for the confirmation Bob

Well I'm currently playing via UPnP (from my NAS) the 5.1Ch version of "Morning Light Western Town by David Elias" which available as a free download from Oppo's web site... It's playing perfectly. Even the .dsf files 'meta-data' is correctly displayed.

Nice one Oppo

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post #17408 of 21655 Old 06-25-2014, 02:51 PM
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Originally Posted by SeeMoreDigital View Post
Thanks for the confirmation Bob

Well I'm currently playing via UPnP (from my NAS) the 5.1Ch version of "Morning Light Western Town by David Elias" which available as a free download from Oppo's web site... It's playing perfectly. Even the .dsf files 'meta-data' is correctly displayed.

Nice one Oppo
What DLNA server are you using on your NAS box? I'm currently using ReadyDLNA on my ReadNAS box and minidlna on a FreeBSD system and neither of these (they are really mostly the same DLNA software) support either dsf or dff file types.
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post #17409 of 21655 Old 06-25-2014, 03:00 PM
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Programming BDP-103 into Harmony One

Does anyone have comprehensive instructions on how to best set this up? The Logitech site forum says you need to program it as a "mini system". There is no Blu-ray player in their drop down menu, only DVD, but you need to select Mini System because the Oppo has HDMI and USB inputs. However, the setup then asks some setup questions that simply don't make sense, particularly at the end where a set of remote button selections (which don't match what's on the remote) are required.

Can someone provide a detailed walk-through on ALL the steps and inputs required to properly set up an Oppo BDP-103?
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post #17410 of 21655 Old 06-25-2014, 03:15 PM
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I can confirm that with the newest firmware, I am able access and play DSD files stored on my Synology NAS with an .dsf and .dff file extension via SMB and UPnP...
SMB has been capable of that for a year now but UPnP needs the appropriate DLNA software (like MinimServer) on the NAS. Is something new here?

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post #17411 of 21655 Old 06-25-2014, 04:13 PM
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Does anyone have comprehensive instructions on how to best set this up? The Logitech site forum says you need to program it as a "mini system". There is no Blu-ray player in their drop down menu, only DVD, but you need to select Mini System because the Oppo has HDMI and USB inputs. However, the setup then asks some setup questions that simply don't make sense, particularly at the end where a set of remote button selections (which don't match what's on the remote) are required.

Can someone provide a detailed walk-through on ALL the steps and inputs required to properly set up an Oppo BDP-103?
I used the Oppo BDP-83 in the Logitech software menu. As far as I can tell, all the remote commands are the same for both. Any extra features/buttons on the BDP-103 that I needed, I programed in manually using the learning function in the Logitech software.
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post #17412 of 21655 Old 06-25-2014, 05:15 PM
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Out of interest, do you know the 'sample rate' of your multi-ch DSD files? All mine are 'single rate' 2.8224 MHz files.

I'm yet to try any of them with the Oppo (to my Onkyo amp) via UPnP. But I will report back soon
2.8224 MHz 1 bit 5 channel DSD DSF format is the file that won't stream and play. It adds to playlist but no audio and no time change on track play. When I access this file from oppo network DLNA server it sees the files (there are 5 files for the channel Classic Budapest festival orchestra Mahler symphony #2 ) but quickly reads and skips over each track. This same file plays perfectly from USB thumbdrive plugged into oppo 105.

2.8224 MHz 1 bit 5 channel DSD DFF format streams and plays perfectly. Dsd64 says channel classics.

Regarding possible bandwidth limitation, I corrected that problem on my end by changing jriver option to play from memory rather than from disc. My jriver is set to play original format with no conversion or transcoding. There must be a better explanation of why DSD DFF files won't stream and play via jriver or oppo network DLNA server.

Kal asks what is new? The new isn't ability to play DSD files but rather continued difficulties with streaming DFF file format. For those of us who are multichannel DSD nuts like me, always searching...

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post #17413 of 21655 Old 06-25-2014, 06:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post
^ Only single rate DSD (stereo or multi-channel) is supported for streaming or for playing from an attached drive. This is a hardware limitation in the 10x players.

Stereo-only, double rate DSD is available only on the 105D (recent firmware), and only when using its Asynchronous USB DAC Input. That goes straight to the DACs and thus bypasses the processing clock limit just mentioned.
--Bob
Don't ask me how but tonight I was able to push the multichannel DSF file to the 105 and it played perfectly. Next I tried using oppo network DLNA and the DSF file played perfectly. Finally I used Jremote and the DSF file played perfectly.

Maybe my shutting down PC last night and restarting it tonight changed something. Jriver version 19.0.138 and Jremote version 3.01 . Have been building my own servers since windows 95 and still can't understand these things!

Happy to report that at least tonight the oppo bdp-105 can play dsd64 multichannel files in both DSF and DFF formats.

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post #17414 of 21655 Old 06-25-2014, 06:41 PM
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Kal asks what is new? The new isn't ability to play DSD files but rather continued difficulties with streaming DFF file format. For those of us who are multichannel DSD nuts like me, always searching...
I have not used the Oppo for this in a few weeks but did not have any difficulties with either DSF or DFF in the past. I will give it a try again this weekend to confirm. OTOH, I never use DLNA but only SMB. DLNA is dependent on the software on the NAS.

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post #17415 of 21655 Old 06-25-2014, 08:18 PM
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Originally Posted by helmsman View Post
Does anyone have comprehensive instructions on how to best set this up? The Logitech site forum says you need to program it as a "mini system". There is no Blu-ray player in their drop down menu, only DVD, but you need to select Mini System because the Oppo has HDMI and USB inputs. However, the setup then asks some setup questions that simply don't make sense, particularly at the end where a set of remote button selections (which don't match what's on the remote) are required.

Can someone provide a detailed walk-through on ALL the steps and inputs required to properly set up an Oppo BDP-103?
Not going to walk you through every step, because (a) you're over-thinking it and (b) who remembers all the steps? Yes, the 103 is a "mini system" as far as Harmony is concerned. When it asks you to confirm by pressing non-existent buttons, just skip those buttons and continue following the process. It will eventually do the right thing.
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post #17416 of 21655 Old 06-25-2014, 09:53 PM
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I have 103 connected to Yamaha RX-A3000 and its hdmi video out is connected to Sony 3d-capable tv. My problem is that when I try to play a 3d blu ray movie I get a message that I don't have a 3d capable system so 3d signal not sent. If I change 103's 3d settings to "force 3d" it works fine, so seems like a settings problem of some kind. Has anyone had this problem? Also, if I connect 103 video out directly to tv set that works fine.
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post #17417 of 21655 Old 06-26-2014, 01:24 AM
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What DLNA server are you using on your NAS box? I'm currently using ReadyDLNA on my ReadNAS box and minidlna on a FreeBSD system and neither of these (they are really mostly the same DLNA software) support either dsf or dff file types.
It's a Synology DS212+ NAS running DSM version 5.0-4493. All my DSD (.dsf and .dff) files are now visible by the Oppo's via UPnP.

Sufficed to say, I use the Oppo's GUI to navigate to the files I require. I'm not using a third party device.

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SMB has been capable of that for a year now but UPnP needs the appropriate DLNA software (like MinimServer) on the NAS. Is something new here?
It would appear that something is indeed, new here

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Last edited by SeeMoreDigital; 06-26-2014 at 01:27 AM.
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post #17418 of 21655 Old 06-26-2014, 01:55 AM
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I have 103 connected to Yamaha RX-A3000 and its hdmi video out is connected to Sony 3d-capable tv. My problem is that when I try to play a 3d blu ray movie I get a message that I don't have a 3d capable system so 3d signal not sent. If I change 103's 3d settings to "force 3d" it works fine, so seems like a settings problem of some kind. Has anyone had this problem? Also, if I connect 103 video out directly to tv set that works fine.
So, just leave it on forced then. That is why the settings are there, so you can choose which one works best.

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post #17419 of 21655 Old 06-26-2014, 05:10 AM
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I hope this isn't another one of my stupidly simple solutions that is staring me in the face. I've been reading sync issues via the search feature but didn't see anything pertaining to this.

D* HR44 to 103 to split A/V.

When I FF (multiple consecutive pushes on the FF button) on my HR44, when I stop the sound is 1 second behind the video, or it hiccups (quick sound, quick no sound, quickly the sound is restored - about 2 seconds). Everything is in sync so I can't see using any sync settings to compensate for this. Its as if this is happening too fast for the 103 to process. If I FF one push at a time there are no sync issues. This audio delay will also occur when I'm not watching a recorded program. When a commercial break is initiated, there will be a second before the audio catches up with the video. No problems during any of the commercials, but when returning to the program the audio will be a second behind the video. Maybe a handshake issue?

To simplify this; I see video and lips moving, but no sound for a second or two.
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post #17420 of 21655 Old 06-26-2014, 06:22 AM
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I hope this isn't another one of my stupidly simple solutions that is staring me in the face. I've been reading sync issues via the search feature but didn't see anything pertaining to this.

D* HR44 to 103 to split A/V.

When I FF (multiple consecutive pushes on the FF button) on my HR44, when I stop the sound is 1 second behind the video, or it hiccups (quick sound, quick no sound, quickly the sound is restored - about 2 seconds). Everything is in sync so I can't see using any sync settings to compensate for this. Its as if this is happening too fast for the 103 to process. If I FF one push at a time there are no sync issues. This audio delay will also occur when I'm not watching a recorded program. When a commercial break is initiated, there will be a second before the audio catches up with the video. No problems during any of the commercials, but when returning to the program the audio will be a second behind the video. Maybe a handshake issue?

To simplify this; I see video and lips moving, but no sound for a second or two.
The old handshake problem!

It does take audio a second or two slower to catch up with the video. Also, when going from program to commercial or vice versa, going from 2.0 to 5.1, or vice versa, audio will take a sec or two to catch up with the video.

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post #17421 of 21655 Old 06-26-2014, 07:40 AM
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Official OPPO BDP-103 Owner's Thread

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Originally Posted by SeeMoreDigital View Post
It's a Synology DS212+ NAS running DSM version 5.0-4493. All my DSD (.dsf and .dff) files are now visible by the Oppo's via UPnP.

Sufficed to say, I use the Oppo's GUI to navigate to the files I require. I'm not using a third party device.

Please clarify for me. I have a Synology NAS also. You didn't mention if you're using Synology's embedded DLNA Media Server. Your comment about using the Oppo's GUI to navigate to your files on your NAS tells me you're either "pulling" files from your NAS via its DLNA media server, or you're using SMB shares to play back audio files from your NAS. I'm doing neither of those methods of playback and I have a Synology NAS. I don't turn my tv on (i.e. not using the Oppo network gui interface). I "push" audio files from my NAS via iOS-based media control apps from my iPad. I'm using apps such as DSaudio (from Synology), or 8player, to name a couple. I can use Oppo's MediaControl app, which accesses my NAS's digital audio files via SMB shares(no DLNA Media Server required). Pushing" digital audio files to your Oppo player requires that you have a DLNA media server (i.e. Synology's Media Server) running on your NAS or somewhere else on your home network.

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post #17422 of 21655 Old 06-26-2014, 07:52 AM
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I'm not using any third party tools or apps to navigate to the DSD files stored on my Synology NAS via UPnP. Just the Oppo, the Oppo remote and my TV...

Obviously, the Synology NAS's 'media server' application is enabled.

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post #17423 of 21655 Old 06-26-2014, 08:11 AM
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Official OPPO BDP-103 Owner's Thread

^ That's interesting. I wish I could take a poll of the number of individuals who are "pulling" media files from a DLNA media server using Oppo's network GUI interface as you are. There can't be that many doing this. The beauty of a DLNA media server is the ability to "push" files to a supported media player. I would estimate that a high majority of Oppo customers who are using Oppo's onscreen GUI interface are using SMB shares from a network drive in their homes or an attached usb drive.

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post #17424 of 21655 Old 06-26-2014, 08:32 AM
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Unfortunately for me, my experience with hardware media players dates back over a decade... In those early days, SMB speeds were much slower than UPnP speeds. But UPnP did not support many container types. So you had to switch between the two connection protocols in order to play the files you required.

I find it pretty natural to navigate to the files I require with the TV switched on. Because that's the only way we were able to do it all those years ago. Admittedly it's a waste of power, when all you want to do is play an audio file

I guess I should buy myself an even smarter, more powerful smart phone and install the appropriate apps so I can push 'audio' files to my Oppo. But then again if I bought myself a new surround sound amplifier with 'network DSD streaming' support (such as the new Onkyo's) I would not need to switch on the Oppo either... Decisions, decisions...

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Last edited by SeeMoreDigital; 06-26-2014 at 08:37 AM. Reason: Onkyo surround sound amplifier reference added...
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post #17425 of 21655 Old 06-26-2014, 08:35 AM
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I hope this isn't another one of my stupidly simple solutions that is staring me in the face. I've been reading sync issues via the search feature but didn't see anything pertaining to this.

D* HR44 to 103 to split A/V.

When I FF (multiple consecutive pushes on the FF button) on my HR44, when I stop the sound is 1 second behind the video, or it hiccups (quick sound, quick no sound, quickly the sound is restored - about 2 seconds). Everything is in sync so I can't see using any sync settings to compensate for this. Its as if this is happening too fast for the 103 to process. If I FF one push at a time there are no sync issues. This audio delay will also occur when I'm not watching a recorded program. When a commercial break is initiated, there will be a second before the audio catches up with the video. No problems during any of the commercials, but when returning to the program the audio will be a second behind the video. Maybe a handshake issue?

To simplify this; I see video and lips moving, but no sound for a second or two.
Got the same issue here with my digital TV box. Also using the hdmi input of the Oppo and using split A/V. Sometimes when doing alot of FF I also got the video and audio out of sync. Changing the input on the Oppo and going back again to the correct input makes a new handshake and solves the problem.

Panasonic TX-P50GT60 / Marantz SR5004 / 4 x KEF HTS 3001 SE (front + rear) + HTC 3001 SE (centre) + REL T-9 sub / Oppo BDP-103EU (MultiRegion+MultiZone)
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post #17426 of 21655 Old 06-26-2014, 08:43 AM
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Thanks for the confirmation Bob

Well I'm currently playing via UPnP (from my NAS) the 5.1Ch version of "Morning Light Western Town by David Elias" which available as a free download from Oppo's web site... It's playing perfectly. Even the .dsf files 'meta-data' is correctly displayed.

Nice one Oppo
Will there be quality loss when I let the Oppo convert this file to PCM ? (instead of doing DSD to the receiver)

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post #17427 of 21655 Old 06-26-2014, 08:50 AM
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^ Theoretically no, but you'll find plenty of folks who believe they hear an improvement keeping it as DSD all the way to the DACs.

Be advised that many AVRs that accept HDMI DSD simply convert that to LPCM themselves upon input, so there's no point in bothering.
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post #17428 of 21655 Old 06-26-2014, 08:54 AM
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Will there be quality loss when I let the Oppo convert this file to PCM ? (instead of doing DSD to the receiver)
In all honesty, that's a very subjective question. By all accounts the Oppo does a fine job at transcoding DSD to PCM

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post #17429 of 21655 Old 06-26-2014, 10:37 AM
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^ That's interesting. I wish I could take a poll of the number of individuals who are "pulling" media files from a DLNA media server using Oppo's network GUI interface as you are. There can't be that many doing this. The beauty of a DLNA media server is the ability to "push" files to a supported media player. I would estimate that a high majority of Oppo customers who are using Oppo's onscreen GUI interface are using SMB shares from a network drive in their homes or an attached usb drive.
That's the way I always do it. I prefer to use the Oppo remote.

Just tested 2 .DFF files and one worked/one didn't using Synology's Media Server through the Oppo interface and the same result using the DS Audio app. Same result with SMB. Not a file format I use personally (but I do have SACD discs) but interesting nonetheless. What program can add metadata to these files, BTW?
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post #17430 of 21655 Old 06-26-2014, 10:50 AM
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I guess I should buy myself an even smarter, more powerful smart phone and install the appropriate apps so I can push 'audio' files to my Oppo. But then again if I bought myself a new surround sound amplifier with 'network DSD streaming' support (such as the new Onkyo's) I would not need to switch on the Oppo either... Decisions, decisions...
AFAIK, none of the "new" surround amps, AVRs or preproduction will support streaming of multichannel tracks except, I am told, the newest Pioneers.

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