Official OPPO BDP-105 Owner's Thread - Page 319 - AVS Forum
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post #9541 of 12050 Old 03-10-2014, 09:56 PM
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Originally Posted by gsr View Post

HDM1 vs HDMI2 definitely shouldn't make a night and day difference - if Netflix on HDMI1 looks radically different compared to your Chromecast, I wouldn't expect using HDMI2 to solve the problem.
Again (I feel like I keep repeating this point...), if the Netflix picture quality on the Chromecast is high quality ON THE SAME HOME NETWORK, then the problem isn't in the Netflix / Verizon network. It could be something like the Chromecast version of the Netflix app being more aggressive about forcing / requesting a higher bitrate from Netflix than the Netflix app on the 105 is. Or it could be something like Netflix giving preferential bandwidth to certain devices (just keep in mind that this is just an example possibility as I have no proof to back up such a claim).


I'm pretty sure that the oppo does not apply it's video processing to the internal streaming options. You would be better served to plug a roku/Apple TV/chromcast into the hdmi in port.
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post #9542 of 12050 Old 03-10-2014, 09:59 PM
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Okay, I did some further testing tonight on the disabled speaker trim setting while turning on test tones on the 105. It's a small bug, and may never be seen by any other 10x owners. I can disable the trim settings everytime while test tones are on if I play any DSD audio files beforehand. I understand that while playing DSD audio, all audio processing is disabled, so trim would not be functional during DSD audio playback, but after I stop the DSD track, I should be able to go into the speaker configuration and set the trim settings while the test tones are audible, but I cannot do this. I either have to turn off the 105 or I can play a non-DSD audio track, and that somehow resets an internal "variable" in the software to allow the trim to begin functioning again during the enabling of test tones.
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post #9543 of 12050 Old 03-10-2014, 10:03 PM
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Originally Posted by DanF8500 View Post

Okay, I did some further testing tonight on the disabled speaker trim setting while turning on test tones on the 105. It's a small bug, and may never be seen by any other 10x owners. I can disable the trim settings everytime while test tones are on if I play any DSD audio files beforehand. I understand that while playing DSD audio, all audio processing is disabled, so trim would not be functional during DSD audio playback, but after I stop the DSD track, I should be able to go into the speaker configuration and set the trim settings while the test tones are audible, but I cannot do this. I either have to turn off the 105 or I can play a non-DSD audio track, and that somehow resets an internal "variable" in the software to allow the trim to begin functioning again during the enabling of test tones.

AHA! By George, err I mean Dan, I think you nailed it!

~Dave

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post #9544 of 12050 Old 03-10-2014, 10:50 PM
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Originally Posted by DanF8500 View Post

I might have an answer for you. Are you trying to connect to the internet from your Oppo via wireless? If you are, are you using WEP encryption? If yes, then you've been affected by a bug that Oppo introduced in a previous firmware build regarding this wifi encryption method.

It's actually wired Ethernet.

All network functions work beautifully - EXCEPT for attempts to upgrade/check for upgrade, which receive the "couldn't contact server" error message.
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post #9545 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 06:26 AM
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Originally Posted by MDRbone View Post


I have noted that on initial Netflix start, my 105 takes far longer to reach the HD quality level than does my Panny ZT60 through Comcast. After a certain period of time, however, PQ is just about the same.

I have this same experience with my Sony TV and Netflix. PQ is awful at first then slowly improves.

 

PS my 105D will be delivered today!

 

James

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post #9546 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 06:36 AM
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Originally Posted by wse View Post


I was able to do the trims before playing any SACDs

But they do not apply at all when in DSD mode.


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post #9547 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 07:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Redogfizbal View Post

I'm pretty sure that the oppo does not apply it's video processing to the internal streaming options. You would be better served to plug a roku/Apple TV/chromcast into the hdmi in port.
Incorrect. You can't make adjustments to the video processing options while using the internal apps, but the settings do apply.
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Originally Posted by DanF8500 View Post

Okay, I did some further testing tonight on the disabled speaker trim setting while turning on test tones on the 105. It's a small bug, and may never be seen by any other 10x owners. I can disable the trim settings everytime while test tones are on if I play any DSD audio files beforehand. I understand that while playing DSD audio, all audio processing is disabled, so trim would not be functional during DSD audio playback, but after I stop the DSD track, I should be able to go into the speaker configuration and set the trim settings while the test tones are audible, but I cannot do this. I either have to turn off the 105 or I can play a non-DSD audio track, and that somehow resets an internal "variable" in the software to allow the trim to begin functioning again during the enabling of test tones.
Thanks Dan - I have confirmed this on my 105D and this has been reported through the beta channels. There would be no harm in you reporting it to Oppo customer support too.
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post #9548 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 07:38 AM
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Originally Posted by haggis999 View Post

Erratic track playback order when using MediaControl HD

I have just hit this problem when trying to play a sequence of MKV files in a folder using MediaControl HD on my new iPad Air. According to the App Store, my copy of Media Player HD is version 2.0.4 dated 24 Jan 2014, so Oppo's promise to RichB back in November that this bug would be fixed in the next release did not happen.

I guess I will just have to be patient...

David

I encountered the same problem on my 105D. A little experimenting turned this up for me: I only encounter problems when I run the Media Control app in the background, behind another app. If it's the front app, whether the screen is locked or not, there's no problem. My workaround for now is that I'll fire it up, start playing the directory I want to listen to, then close the app until I need it again. If I'm not using any other apps in the meantime, I leave the program open.

Hope it helps,
Omar

Correction: The problem I encountered is not erratic playback, but freezing. If I use the Media Center to play back music and move it to the background, it will cause my system to freeze. I have to not only turn off the 105D to recover from this, I have to unplug it as well. Oppo is aware of the problem.
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post #9549 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 07:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Redogfizbal View Post

So it appears that the oppo does not offer a dynamic volume setting. That is pretty much the only thing holding me back from purchasing the 105. Currently I have a marantz nr1403, and I'm using the pre outs to a crown xls 1500 to power my goldenear titan 2's. The dynamic volume is great for me because I have youngsters.

I wonder if there is some way I could take advantage of the oppo and still use the dynamic volume on my marantz?

There are three settings, I *think* this is what they do, check your manual:

Auto: Sets the baseline audio level. Does not compress or alter dynamic range. Just resets the middle point for content recorded at a lower volumes. This was instituted because of problems with some early BR discs being authored at a low volume level.

Off: Obvious.

On: Does the Dynamic Range Compression you are looking for.

Omar
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post #9550 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 09:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post

But they do not apply at all when in DSD mode.

Interesting so the player assume all channels are calibrated? How about for DD TRUE HD and DYS MASTER HD?
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post #9551 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by wse View Post


Interesting so the player assume all channels are calibrated? How about for DD TRUE HD and DYS MASTER HD?
No, the player can't do any processing when sending DSD direct to the DAC. If you want the trim levels to be applied, DSD has to be converted to PCM before any processing is possible. The trim levels do apply to all other formats, including Dolby True HD and DTS HD Master Audio, which are already PCM by the time they reach the applicable processing.
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post #9552 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 11:36 AM
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Why would you want to "convince" someone of something you can't hear? Unless you are standing in the room with them listening to their system you have no idea what is and is not audible in their system. You are the person who doesn't understand what they are hearing becasue you are not there.

Agreed the data is the same, absolutely...but there are many other factors involved than just the data. As I pointed out a few pages back...a hard drive that I connected to the usb input did not produce the same audible quality as the same files over dlna or via a thumb drive, and that was unexpected, but none the less valid. Logicly the drive should sound the same...and there is logic in why it does not.

Very good point, sir. It's nice to see someone who has an open mind here, and doesn't believe he somehow has godlike perception and omniscience. Your point is the same I was trying to make, but more concisely put.

I thought I would post some findings...I went out on a limb and bought a Mac Mini and downloaded a trial version of Audirvana, and I have to say I'm quite impressed with the sonic results of running through the asynchronous DAC. Esp. with the upconversion and Direct / Integer modes afforded by Audirvana, music is much lovelier than ever before on my 105D. With this setup, my digital music files, be they flac'ed CDs or high res. downloads, take on the sonic quality of vinyl. Smooth, airy, deep sound staging...well worth the investment. Even playing files back without upconversion, the same music is palpably better. The first thing I noticed was how nicely running files in through this input cleaned up the midrange. Something worth investigating, to be sure.

Omar
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post #9553 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by OmarF View PostVery good point, sir. It's nice to see someone who has an open mind here, and doesn't believe he somehow has godlike perception and omniscience. Your point is the same I was trying to make, but more concisely put.

I thought I would post some findings...I went out on a limb and bought a Mac Mini and downloaded a trial version of Audirvana, and I have to say I'm quite impressed with the sonic results of running through the asynchronous DAC. Esp. with the upconversion and Direct / Integer modes afforded by Audirvana, music is much lovelier than ever before on my 105D. With this setup, my digital music files, be they flac'ed CDs or high res. downloads, take on the sonic quality of vinyl. Smooth, airy, deep sound staging...well worth the investment. Even playing files back without upconversion, the same music is palpably better. The first thing I noticed was how nicely running files in through this input cleaned up the midrange. Something worth investigating, to be sure.

Omar

 

Yes Audirvana rocks

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post #9554 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by wse View Post


Interesting so the player assume all channels are calibrated? How about for DD TRUE HD and DYS MASTER HD?

That's why i asked how you did your calibration in dsd mode.

So, directly connected to the amps while playing a MCH dsd file, can you hear misbalanced sound? mine is completly messed up using this method and it's a bit frustrating as i find
the direct to dsd so9und better than dsd->pcm. Not night and day, but simply more refined and the highs are a tad sweeter.
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post #9555 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by audiman View PostThat's why i asked how you did your calibration in dsd mode.

So, directly connected to the amps while playing a MCH dsd file, can you hear misbalanced sound? mine is completly messed up using this method and it's a bit frustrating as i find the direct to dsd so9und better than dsd->pcm.
Not night and day, but simply more refined and the highs are a tad sweeter.

I will try later on today and will let you know

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post #9556 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 04:15 PM - Thread Starter
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DSD direct will bypass the Speaker Configuration of the player. So any Channel Trims that you normally use to balance your speakers, will be lost when using DSD direct to analog.
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post #9557 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 05:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Neuromancer View Post

DSD direct will bypass the Speaker Configuration of the player. So any Channel Trims that you normally use to balance your speakers, will be lost when using DSD direct to analog.

what is the limitation behind this? would it be possible to add an analog trim after the dsd conversion?
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post #9558 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 05:17 PM
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Originally Posted by audiman View Post

what is the limitation behind this? would it be possible to add an analog trim after the dsd conversion?

If you want to use the channel trims, simply change the DSD setting to output PCM, which is basically what you are asking for.

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post #9559 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 05:23 PM - Thread Starter
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The decoder, not the DAC, controls the Speaker Configuration Channel Trims, which is why you are not able to inject any changes to the Channel Trims when SACD is set to DSD since it is DAC direct.
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post #9560 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 06:45 PM
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So are the volumes matched between speakers when using DSD?

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post #9561 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 06:49 PM
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Originally Posted by wse View Post

So are the volumes matched between speakers when using DSD?
No - that's the whole point, trims are disabled when using DSD that hasn't been converted to PCM.
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post #9562 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 07:11 PM
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Blame this on Sony which originally developed DSD as a stereo format and assumed also that you would be sitting in the sweet spot with a pair of stereo speakers. Thus the DSD standard does not allow for any signal manipulation.

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post #9563 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 07:21 PM
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Originally Posted by JazzGuyy View Post

Blame this on Sony which originally developed DSD as a stereo format and assumed also that you would be sitting in the sweet spot with a pair of stereo speakers. Thus the DSD standard does not allow for any signal manipulation.

the only way to go around this is to use amps with level output function. i do have mac amps in front with this feature but not for the surround speakers, so i,m busted.
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post #9564 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 07:49 PM
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Originally Posted by audiman View Post


what is the limitation behind this? would it be possible to add an analog trim after the dsd conversion?

Not in the Oppo, of course, but it can be done.  I can feed the analog outputs into an analog preamp with individual channel trims.


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post #9565 of 12050 Old 03-11-2014, 08:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post

Not in the Oppo, of course, but it can be done.  I can feed the analog outputs into an analog preamp with individual channel trims.

The marantz 8003 can do that also, but not as good i guess as your AR mp1 wink.gif and it doesnt sound as good as the oopo directly in the amps.

Maybe this feature can be implemented in the next oppo-115.
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post #9566 of 12050 Old 03-12-2014, 12:09 AM
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I am having issues with lip sync on my BDP-105, specifically via optical from my Xfinity X1 STB. I am unable to use HDMi from the STB, as the box outputs stereo only via this output (known issue). Since the video is not running through the Oppo, I know this may be a challenging problem to address. But I'm wondering if anyone has any ideas.
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post #9567 of 12050 Old 03-12-2014, 03:52 AM
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I would like some advice before I go ahead and purchase the BDP-105D.

My system comprises the following:

• Mac Mini (Optical to pre/pro)
• BDP-93 (HDMI to pre/pro)
• Marantz AV-7701 pre/pro (Audyssey-XT always kept ON)
• Marantz MM8801 amp
• 2x B&W 685 (Fronts)
• 2x B&W 686 (Rears)
• HTM62 (Centre)
• ASW608 (Sub)
• Living room treated with 7 absorbers/bass traps

I love 2-ch music, multi-channel SACDs, as well as movies. I would like to improve the soundstage/clarity of my system. However, I am unsure as to whether my current setup will benefit from the analog stage of the BDP-105D. Will my speakers be able to reveal the difference between the AV7701's DACs and those of the OPPO? I just wouldn't want to spend money on another OPPO, if the reason for the upgrade is defeated by my average system.

Aris.
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post #9568 of 12050 Old 03-12-2014, 07:06 AM
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Originally Posted by MDRbone View Post

I am having issues with lip sync on my BDP-105, specifically via optical from my Xfinity X1 STB. I am unable to use HDMi from the STB, as the box outputs stereo only via this output (known issue). Since the video is not running through the Oppo, I know this may be a challenging problem to address. But I'm wondering if anyone has any ideas.

You may be able to work around this using the AV Sync setting in the OPPO (Setup > Audio Processing). That setting is not "per input" so you would need to change it back when not using that Optical feed. That's pretty inconvenient of course. Since you aren't running the video through the OPPO, your best bet may also be to bypass the OPPO for the audio as well. If your display is cable of ARC output on its currently not selected HDMI Inputs, another possibility is HDMI plus Optical to the Display, then ARC audio output from the Display back to the OPPO on the HDMI line that normally feeds OPPO video to the Display.
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post #9569 of 12050 Old 03-12-2014, 07:19 AM
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Originally Posted by anoutsos View Post

I would like some advice before I go ahead and purchase the BDP-105D.

My system comprises the following:

• Mac Mini (Optical to pre/pro)
• BDP-93 (HDMI to pre/pro)
• Marantz AV-7701 pre/pro (Audyssey-XT always kept ON)
• Marantz MM8801 amp
• 2x B&W 685 (Fronts)
• 2x B&W 686 (Rears)
• HTM62 (Centre)
• ASW608 (Sub)
• Living room treated with 7 absorbers/bass traps

I love 2-ch music, multi-channel SACDs, as well as movies. I would like to improve the soundstage/clarity of my system. However, I am unsure as to whether my current setup will benefit from the analog stage of the BDP-105D. Will my speakers be able to reveal the difference between the AV7701's DACs and those of the OPPO? I just wouldn't want to spend money on another OPPO, if the reason for the upgrade is defeated by my average system.

Aris.

Keep in mind that the DACs (Digital to Analog Converters) in the 105 are not in the signal path when you use digital, HDMI Audio output to your Marantz.

Even if you use stereo or multi-channel Analog audio to your Marantz (which would use the OPPO DACs), if you then pass that through Audyssey the Marantz has to re-digitized that Analog audio input -- the audio processing is done in the digital domain -- and then convert the result BACK to Analog for output. So even though the Analog input is produced by the OPPO DACs, the output of the Marantz is produced by the Marantz DACs. The quality of these extra re-digitization, processing, and conversion back to Analog stages may mask the quality of the Analog input from the OPPO DACs.

Another approach folks have taken is to skip the AVR altogether and connect Analog from the OPPO direct to their speaker power amp. That would lose Audyssey of course.

Now, in terms of whether you can hear an improvement in your room with your speakers, that's awfully tough to predict. My usual recommendation is that you try it and see for yourself. If you buy from the OPPO web site, they offer an easy 30-day return period. All you risk is the shipping costs.

If you know you are going to use HDMI Audio -- for example to keep Audyssey in the path without requiring the re-digitization step for Analog input -- then you should save the money and get a 103 or 103D instead. If you know you want to switch to Analog audio, or want to keep the option open for experimentation, that's when the 105 or 105D would be worth considering. Analog output from the 103/103D is no slouch, but the 105/105D Analog output is in a different class.
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post #9570 of 12050 Old 03-12-2014, 07:32 AM
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Thanks, Bob.

I understand what you are saying and I knew about the options you mentioned. My question was more about the difference between:

Oppo 93 (HDMI) Marantz AV7701 with Audyssey

and

Oppo 105 (Analog 5.1 RCAs) Marantz AV7701 in Pure Direct (no Audyssey)

using the same speakers. I would not use Audyssey with the analog outs of the 105.

I realise that it is difficult to predict the difference it would make for my room/setup. I guess what I just wanted to ask is whether my speakers are capable of revealing the difference in sound quality between the analog stage of the BDP-105 (second setup, above) and what I have now (first setup). In other words, what kind of money would people invest in speakers to be able to reap the benefits of the 105's analog circuitry? I thought that I'd be wasting money by upgrading the electronics without matching it with proper speakers.

Aris.
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