Official OPPO BDP-105 Owner's Thread - Page 427 - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #12781 of 12784 Unread Yesterday, 10:52 PM
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Originally Posted by HowardV View Post
Just to add a note/question.....Isn't an amplifier with a gain control actually an amp which has a pre-amp built-in?

Unlike Patchesj, my amp needs more output from the Oppo. I can have the Oppo volume at 100% and still need more. I live in an apartment, so I won't get a pre-amp - this limitation is a blessing for my neighbors and a guide for me to not crank it up really loud when I've been drinking

But my speakers and amp are clearly saying to me "is this all you got? Give us more!". If I ever move into a house where neighbors aren't an issue, I would have to add a pre-amp. Sometimes I wish my amp had gain controls. But many amps don't.





Hi,




Here's something that might help you get a bit louder.


Try connecting a hybrid I/C from the XLR outs of your OPPO to the RCA ins on your Gallo's.


The XLR outputs on the OPPO are 4V whereas the RCA's are 2V.


You should still be able to achieve a higher volume level and get some of the benefits that OPPO claim to have added to the XLR outs.

Apologies if you are ALREADY doing this!!!




Cheers
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post #12782 of 12784 Unread Today, 12:05 AM
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Originally Posted by stehno View Post
Thanks for the correction.
Right... I have turned down the gains on the amps, turned up the Oppo volume and noticed increased detail. I've dug into the DAC specs and it appears they are expanding out the DSD signal to 32 bits and truncating for volume control, similar to the method with PCM but without converting DSD to PCM. The actual magic behind this is hush hush apparently... The claim is that this method does not impact sound quality or increase S/N ratios, but I have a repeatable test to say it does (at least in a non-blind subjective test ). I would love to have other people try this to make sure I'm not just hearing things. An interesting note is that PCM material does not seem to have the same increase in detail. So either the claim of their method being magic is not true and PCM is always losing detail, or the nature of DSD makes it more susceptible to bit truncation (even with a string of 0's) than PCM. This seems odd as PCM would only give an extra 8 bits of 0's for volume (24bit material for hi-res, expanded to 32bit) vs 26 bits of 0 (DSD @ 6 bits)
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post #12783 of 12784 Unread Today, 05:43 AM
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Originally Posted by HowardV View Post
Just to add a note/question.....Isn't an amplifier with a gain control actually an amp which has a pre-amp built-in?
Actually, not necessarily. The gain control on a power amp is often really just an input level control - a variable attenuator that comes very shortly after the input circuit that controls the signal level entering the power amp circuit. Not always - some power amps definitely DO have preamps "hiding" at their inputs.

"Gain" controls are kind of misleadingly named. The actual amplifier part of an amplifier circuit, whether a voltage amp (preamp) stage or power amp stage, has its actual amplification level fixed to one level. It is the job of attenuator circuits to control signal levels entering or leaving that stage. When you turn up the gain control on an amp, you are really just turning DOWN the amount of attenuation being applied by an attenuator circuit. On a power amp, this is almost always placed before the first part of the amp circuit - often right after the input stage. There are exceptions, of course. I have built some designs for class A/B power amps where the volume control was between the phase inverter and the power amp section, called "post-PI volume" for obvious reasons.

The point I was trying to make is about matching. You buy a power amp, with or without a preamp circuit, and for the input on that amp, there is an optimal range of circuit characteristics in the source device that work best for that amp. This often has to do with signal levels, but it can also have lot to do with impedances and sometimes, at least with longer cable lengths, cable capacitance (this is not usually an issue in hi-fi though). If you purchase a piece of source gear, it may well be able to produce a signal that is pretty close to the middle of those characteristics. But that is a bit like winning the lottery. You just got lucky. MOST of the time, the source gear outputs are far from ideal for a given power amp input. Adapting the one to "play nicely" with the other is exactly what a preamp is for.

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post #12784 of 12784 Unread Today, 09:43 AM
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Originally Posted by LairdWilliams View Post
Actually, not necessarily. The gain control on a power amp is often really just an input level control.....
Thanks for the explanation, although it goes above the level of my understanding. But I completely agree that it's a crap shoot in hoping that the Oppo's output will match an amplifier's input perfectly.

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Originally Posted by linger63 View Post
Hi,

Here's something that might help you get a bit louder.

Try connecting a hybrid I/C from the XLR outs of your OPPO to the RCA ins on your Gallo's.


The XLR outputs on the OPPO are 4V whereas the RCA's are 2V.
I appreciate the advice. But most of my music listening is multichannel. Unfortunately, Oppo only has RCA outputs for multichannel. I could still use the XLR output for front left/right, but I'd have to turn down the levels to match the center/rear RCA outputs...which would defeat the purpose of using XLR for the higher output.

My main amp is the Spectron (which has both RCA and XLR inputs). The Gallo amps just power the 2nd voice coil of the speakers. I wish the Oppo had all XLR outputs as well.

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