Official OPPO BDP-105 Owner's Thread - Page 429 - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #12841 of 12856 Old Yesterday, 03:26 PM
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Originally Posted by malcolmp6 View Post
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Originally Posted by JimSatala77 View Post
I don't see why you couldnt but the sync will be all messed up
So does it mean that i need to sacrifice the analog outputs if i want to decode Atmos/ DTS X(future).
Any plans by Oppo to update the player to support Atmos/ DTS X or will it be a new model?
Can I have a configuration where the front 3 channels are driven by oppo analog outputs and the rest from the AVR (to support 11 channel)?
OPPO is probably waiting to see what the next format will be before making the next new models. If you want the bells and whistles from your AVR, better off with the 103. Sorry to say, you can't have your cake and eat it too.
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post #12842 of 12856 Old Yesterday, 03:31 PM
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Originally Posted by malcolmp6 View Post
Can one use the analog outs for just the front 3 channels and use the receiver outs for the rest?
Can I have the player HDMI out go to the receiver for bit stream decoding and have the receiver feed the output to the oppo for analog out? I would like to benefit from Audyssey room correction.
I would like to avail of Atmos and in the future DTS decoding by the receiver.
Since all outputs are active, you could use HDMI to that new AVR/prepro for video (including ATMOS/DTS X) and analog outs for other things. You would merely need to do the appropriate switching in your AVR/prepro. So the answer is Yes.

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post #12843 of 12856 Old Yesterday, 03:38 PM
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JazzGuyy, He wants to use the LCR coming out of the OPPO Analog Outputs (I assume he has a 3ch amp) and the other 8 channels out of his AVR.

Last edited by Mongo171; Yesterday at 03:44 PM.
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post #12844 of 12856 Old Yesterday, 03:48 PM
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Originally Posted by malcolmp6 View Post
Can one use the analog outs for just the front 3 channels and use the receiver outs for the rest?
Can I have the player HDMI out go to the receiver for bit stream decoding and have the receiver feed the output to the oppo for analog out? I would like to benefit from Audyssey room correction.
I would like to avail of Atmos and in the future DTS decoding by the receiver.
If you want to use the receiver for Audyssey and/or Atmos decoding then the answer to your first 2 questions is simple: don't try either of those approaches. Simply pass the audio to the receiver via HDMII and hook all of your speaker channels up to the receiver. It's the simplest way to do things by far and it's the only way you're going to be sure of getting all of the channels co-ordinated in volume without running into control problems at some point.

To answer your first 2 questions, the first may be possible but it would be complicated, you'd have to do a full manual speaker setup using the Oppo's speaker configuration panel, you'll effectively lose access to Audyssey since you'd give up receiver control of the front 3 channels, and you would not be able to avail of Atmos in the future. Since it seems as if you're using Audyssey at present and you want to use Atmos in future, the simple answer is that it is not possible.

As for your second option, it isn't possible. You can't use the Oppo to play a disc and to decode and play an audio signal on another input at the same time because the Oppo can only deal process data from one input at a time. You can have it play the disc or you can have it play a digital audio source from another input but you can't do both at once.
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post #12845 of 12856 Old Yesterday, 05:54 PM
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Don't agree with you guys. He can have the front three channels in analog (provided his AVR has analog inputs) and he can have ATMOS/DTS X with all channels via HDMI from the Oppo when he watches movies. I am assuming the same AVR powers the speakers with only 3 speakers being fed an analog input. I don't see where he says anywhere that he wants to play two different sources simultaneously. I currently can easily switch from HDMI input to analog on my setup.

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post #12846 of 12856 Old Yesterday, 06:04 PM
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Don't agree with you guys. He can have the front three channels in analog (provided his AVR has analog inputs) and he can have ATMOS/DTS X with all channels via HDMI from the Oppo when he watches movies. I am assuming the same AVR powers the speakers with only 3 speakers being fed an analog input. I don't see where he says anywhere that he wants to play two different sources simultaneously. I currently can easily switch from HDMI input to analog on my setup.
Yes. It will be the same AVR (denon x7200w). So OPPO analog outs for the front 3 goes to AVR analog inputs, and the OPPO HDMI out goes to AVR HDMI in. I don't see then how the AVR can process the ATMOS/ DTS X signal, given that OPPO will do the decoding and will not bitstream the signal. Also I will lose the audyssey processing on the front 3 channels. I will have to bitstream the signal to get the new sound codecs decoded by the AVR. No other choice.
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post #12847 of 12856 Old Yesterday, 06:12 PM
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Originally Posted by malcolmp6 View Post
Can one use the analog outs for just the front 3 channels and use the receiver outs for the rest?
Nope.

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Originally Posted by malcolmp6 View Post
Can I have the player HDMI out go to the receiver for bit stream decoding and have the receiver feed the output to the oppo for analog out? I would like to benefit from Audyssey room correction.
Can't go from player to receiver to player.

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I would like to avail of Atmos and in the future DTS decoding by the receiver.
You can do this by using HDMI from the player to the receiver.

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post #12848 of 12856 Old Yesterday, 06:14 PM
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Yes. It will be the same AVR (denon x7200w). So OPPO analog outs for the front 3 goes to AVR analog inputs, and the OPPO HDMI out goes to AVR HDMI in. I don't see then how the AVR can process the ATMOS/ DTS X signal, given that OPPO will do the decoding and will not bitstream the signal. Also I will lose the audyssey processing on the front 3 channels. I will have to bitstream the signal to get the new sound codecs decoded by the AVR. No other choice.
I doubt your AVR will be able to process two inputs at once.

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post #12849 of 12856 Old Today, 12:21 AM
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Can one use the analog outs for just the front 3 channels and use the receiver outs for the rest? …
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Originally Posted by Mongo171 View Post
Nope…
It can be done but it's messy and I don't see any benefit to doing it.

In order to do it you would have to control volume using the Oppo's volume control or you end up trying to adjust 2 volume controls, Oppo and receiver, by their respective remotes and keep the volumes matched which can't be reliably done.

So that means you need to send the other channels from the Oppo to the receiver via analog since the Oppo's volume control works on the analog outputs only. Effectively you end up just using the receiver as a power amp for the other channels. Since receivers don't tend to have a HT bypass mode that means you have to always run the multichannel analog input on the receiver at a constant volume level so it effectively acts as an amp with fixed gain.

Then you need to balance the output for all channels and set your time delays/distance settings using the Oppo's speaker configuration settings which aren't going to be as flexible as the receivers. You also have to make all your bass management settings on the Oppo. You would also need to set the speaker setting on the receiver to "Large" for the channels you're using and disable all distance settings. You could connect the sub to the receiver's sub output but it's just as simple to connect it to the Oppo's and that's what I would do since I can't see an advantage to connecting it via the receiver.

It's a really messy way to go but it would work. You wouldn't be able to effectively use Audyssey because the front 3 channels aren't passing through the receiver to be processed, that's always supposing that the receiver can convert the analog signals for the channels you're using it for to digital for Audyssey processing and doesn't simply give an error message because it isn't receiving a signal for the front 3 channels. Audyssey for the surrounds only is not really going to help room response much so I don't think it would be worth trying to use Audyssey at all.

In addition, by having to use the Oppo's speaker configuration settings you limit yourself to one global crossover frequency that is used for all channels for bass management. Any receiver offering Audyssey usually allows the setting of different crossover frequencies for each pair of speakers and the centre speaker. If you're running front channel speakers with good bass response and small surrounds to the sides and rear then you have to use the same crossover frequency for those front speakers as you do for the surrounds if you do this. I don't think that's going to deliver as good a result as using individual crossover frequencies in the receiver.

So it can actually be done but I can't see any reason why anyone would ever want to try running a system this way. You complicate the setup process considerably, you're always running the risk of getting the volume for the surrounds out of step with the volume for the front channels if you or someone else accidentally uses the receiver's volume control, you limit your crossover frequency options for bass management, and you can't use Audyssey which it sounds like malcolmp6 does. That seems to me like a lot of effort and ongoing problems for no real gain and he can't get the benefit of Atmos down the track with this sort of arrangement if he wants to go in that direction.

I also think anyone who has to ask if it can be done and how to do it is probably not someone who should attempt to do it because you would need to know what you're doing and be confident in doing a manual setup if you were to end up with your system working well. If you don't get everything matched up very well, the end result is probably going to sound worse than just sending digital audio to the receiver via HDMI and running all speakers from the receiver.
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post #12850 of 12856 Old Today, 05:00 AM
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Thanks everyone. It looks like the 105 does not work out for me.
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post #12851 of 12856 Old Today, 07:02 AM
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I don't think there is anything that would do what you want, especially if you also want Atmos/DTS X/Auro(?). The chances of anyone building a player that will decode any of these "immersive" formats is close to or actually zero. You're just not going to see a player with 11.1 or 11.2 analog audio outs unless some high-end company maybe makes a many thousands of dollars player and I don't even find that likely. The AVR or a pre/pro is really the place to do this kind of decoding.

I did misunderstand what you wanted to do. I thought you wanted AVR decoding for Atmos etc. and 3-channel analog for other stuff (like music). That is very doable the way I described it.

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post #12852 of 12856 Old Today, 07:22 AM
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Originally Posted by malcolmp6 View Post
Can one use the analog outs for just the front 3 channels and use the receiver outs for the rest? ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mongo171 View Post
Nope?
It can be done but it's messy and I don't see any benefit to doing it.

In order to do it you would have to control volume using the Oppo's volume control or you end up trying to adjust 2 volume controls, Oppo and receiver, by their respective remotes and keep the volumes matched which can't be reliably done.

So that means you need to send the other channels from the Oppo to the receiver via analog since the Oppo's volume control works on the analog outputs only. Effectively you end up just using the receiver as a power amp for the other channels. Since receivers don't tend to have a HT bypass mode that means you have to always run the multichannel analog input on the receiver at a constant volume level so it effectively acts as an amp with fixed gain.

Then you need to balance the output for all channels and set your time delays/distance settings using the Oppo's speaker configuration settings which aren't going to be as flexible as the receivers. You also have to make all your bass management settings on the Oppo. You would also need to set the speaker setting on the receiver to "Large" for the channels you're using and disable all distance settings. You could connect the sub to the receiver's sub output but it's just as simple to connect it to the Oppo's and that's what I would do since I can't see an advantage to connecting it via the receiver.

It's a really messy way to go but it would work. You wouldn't be able to effectively use Audyssey because the front 3 channels aren't passing through the receiver to be processed, that's always supposing that the receiver can convert the analog signals for the channels you're using it for to digital for Audyssey processing and doesn't simply give an error message because it isn't receiving a signal for the front 3 channels. Audyssey for the surrounds only is not really going to help room response much so I don't think it would be worth trying to use Audyssey at all.

In addition, by having to use the Oppo's speaker configuration settings you limit yourself to one global crossover frequency that is used for all channels for bass management. Any receiver offering Audyssey usually allows the setting of different crossover frequencies for each pair of speakers and the centre speaker. If you're running front channel speakers with good bass response and small surrounds to the sides and rear then you have to use the same crossover frequency for those front speakers as you do for the surrounds if you do this. I don't think that's going to deliver as good a result as using individual crossover frequencies in the receiver.

So it can actually be done but I can't see any reason why anyone would ever want to try running a system this way. You complicate the setup process considerably, you're always running the risk of getting the volume for the surrounds out of step with the volume for the front channels if you or someone else accidentally uses the receiver's volume control, you limit your crossover frequency options for bass management, and you can't use Audyssey which it sounds like malcolmp6 does. That seems to me like a lot of effort and ongoing problems for no real gain and he can't get the benefit of Atmos down the track with this sort of arrangement if he wants to go in that direction.

I also think anyone who has to ask if it can be done and how to do it is probably not someone who should attempt to do it because you would need to know what you're doing and be confident in doing a manual setup if you were to end up with your system working well. If you don't get everything matched up very well, the end result is probably going to sound worse than just sending digital audio to the receiver via HDMI and running all speakers from the receiver.
This is why I really hate helping people out. The OP asked if a certain scenario can be accomplished. I said no. Then, as if I were speaking of heresey, another person comes along and composes a PhD thesis on how it can be done, but won't really work. Thank you, Professor Aiken.
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post #12853 of 12856 Old Today, 10:34 AM
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In the end, my purchasing the 105D based on any one of those reviews was a complete crapshoot for me and I never would have done the crapshoot based on those reviews had it not been for OPPO's 30-day satisfaction guaranteed or your money back.

The Esoteric was sold shortly thereafter and I won the performance crapshoot. Six months later, after switching to the 105D's passive volume attenuator and started using the USB ports, I realized I won the performance crapshoot big time!!!!



Hi Stehno,


It didn't have to be a crapshoot buddy!!!
All you had to do was come here first and check out this Thread!!!

I heard my OPPO 105 clean up a $15K Gryphon Tabu CDP1.
I would think there would be numerous stories abounding here regarding
the OPPO's SUPERB SQ.

I never put TOO much faith in PRO reviewers.
Sometimes they may have a different agenda.

As you have discovered......only an owner REALLY knows!!!!



Cheers
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post #12854 of 12856 Unread Today, 12:48 PM
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This is why I really hate helping people out. The OP asked if a certain scenario can be accomplished. I said no. Then, as if I were speaking of heresey, another person comes along and composes a PhD thesis on how it can be done, but won't really work. Thank you, Professor Aiken.
It can be done, and it can work. It's just that it's a lot of effort for no real advantage.

I'd actually said earlier in the thread that it could be done and you came along saying it couldn't as if I were speaking of heresy. Have I no right to correct your error or should I have left people thinking you were right and I was wrong when in fact the opposite is the case?
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post #12855 of 12856 Unread Today, 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Mongo171 View Post
This is why I really hate helping people out. The OP asked if a certain scenario can be accomplished. I said no. Then, as if I were speaking of heresey, another person comes along and composes a PhD thesis on how it can be done, but won't really work. Thank you, Professor Aiken.
It can be done, and it can work. It's just that it's a lot of effort for no real advantage.

I'd actually said earlier in the thread that it could be done and you came along saying it couldn't as if I were speaking of heresy. Have I no right to correct your error or should I have left people thinking you were right and I was wrong when in fact the opposite is the case?
If you were so right, then please explain to me how he will get Audyssey and the various new audio codecs to play on the LCR, the way he wants to hook it up?
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post #12856 of 12856 Unread Today, 04:42 PM
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I said quite clearly he couldn't get Audyssey that way, and that Audyssey was one of the things he would have to give up in order to get that type of connection to work, and I also said that the new codecs like Atmos weren't available this way.

Look carefully at what he originally asked. His first question was about running the centre channels from the Oppo and the others from the receiver with no mention of getting Audyssey. As I said, that can be done but you can't do it and get Audyssey.

The second question was about sending audio via HDMI from the Oppo to the AVR, getting Audyssey on the AVR and then passing the front 3 channels back to the Oppo and connecting those channels directly to the Oppo. That can't be done and I said that.

The third question was about Atmos at some future time and I said that was impossible via this connection approach.

So his first question was very limited in scope and I said that connection was possible but that I didn't think he'd gain anything beneficial by it. I said the things he was asking about in his other 2 questions weren't possible.

The only thing I've said can be done is that you can drive the front 3 channels from the Oppo and the other channels from the AVR if you use it only as a power amp, and that in order to do that you have to give up all processing in the AVR including speaker configuration, Audyssey, and codecs like Atmos, and do all of your speaker configuration in the Oppo. Doing that is no different to using the Oppo to directly drive power amps for all of your channels plus any sub. The 105 has always been capable of that. The only difference in this case is using an AVR to drive the speakers for some channels rather than a power amp and to do that you just need to ensure that you run the AVR at a fixed gain level whenever you're using it as an amp for the other channels.
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