Oppo BDP-105 "Sound Quality" Check Thread for Audiophiles - Page 57 - AVS Forum
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post #1681 of 1705 Old 08-10-2014, 10:13 PM
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^ Using an SPL meter is not tough. Everyone uses the modestly priced digital readout meter sold by Radio Shack.

Set the meter to Slow response and "C" weighting. Hold the meter so that it is pointing straight up towards the ceiling, at seated ear height, at your center seating position. Hold it at arm's length and keep the mic tip away from reflective or blocking surfaces. If you recline your seats for viewing, use the reclined position for seated ear height. If you have high seat backs raise the meter a few inches to clear the seat back or position it a foot or so closer to your Display to get it away from the seat back. If your seating is flush to the rear wall, also move the meter forward like this to get it away from the wall.

Play the test tone track for the Left Front speaker and adjust main Volume to get a reasonable level for measurement -- usually 75dB. Leave main Volume at at level and test the other speakers and the Sub. The goal is to trim them to get the same level for all the speakers and the Sub. Note that you use the same positioning for the meter for all speakers -- i.e., you don't go put the meter in front of each speaker or even point it at each speaker. Do everything at center seating with the meter pointing straight up.
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post #1682 of 1705 Old 08-11-2014, 11:55 AM
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Thx Bob....I checked oppodigital.com and they are sold out of the disc.
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post #1683 of 1705 Old 08-11-2014, 02:28 PM
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post #1684 of 1705 Old 08-12-2014, 11:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jima4a View Post
I have read that the 105 headphone amp works on easy to medium hard to drive headphones (Absolute Sound or Stereophile) but not so good on the very high impedance versions. It has been a while since I saw that so might be difficult to find unless on line now. If headphones are a priority, a stand alone headphone DAC/amp such as Oppo's might be a better choice.
I have the Beyerdynamic DT880 600ohm headphone. Prior to my Oppo 105 I used them with a Little Dot MK III tube amp and the stereo out's on my Oppo 83.


I sold the amp once I ordered the 105 as I wanted to streamline the system (removing the AVR too).


I can't help but feel the standalone amp resulted in a more enjoyable listening experience with music. I wish I had kept the amp, at least temporary, for A - B purposes, but alas.


I mainly use the headphones for late night movies and from that perspective I really don't notice any difference.

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post #1685 of 1705 Old 08-15-2014, 11:19 AM
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Question first: What volumes are people using with the headphone output on their 105s?


Reason for the Question:




I just got a 105 and the PM-2 Oppo headphones, figuring these are bound to be optimally compatible. Before getting them, I had
read (surprising) comments online about people keeping the volume at 90+ levels. Then I read this[ http://wiki.oppodigital.com/index.ph..._Amplifier_FAQ ]:






"[A] volume setting of 80 is actually very good. ...When the volume is set to 100, the digital audio signal is not attenuated at all. The headphone amplifier gets the maximum input level and drives the headphones at the rated output (depending on the impedance of the headphones). If volume level 100 works for your headphones, that's the best. ...A digital volume control with access to the DAC internal data path will behave just like the analog one until it reaches the noise floor of the analog components of the DAC." The noise floor is at -135dB in the ESS Sabre DAC. It is nothing if you reduce the volume 20dB or so, which is volume level 60 on the OPPO BDP-105."








Oh okay, I thought, that makes sense and I expected the PM-2s to put out normal listening volumes somewhere between 60 and 80.
Well, maybe I'm getting too old and everything, but now that I'm set up, anything over the 105's volume setting of 50 is way too loud to listen to.
Is anybody out there actually listening at levels of 60--or 80 for that matter?
Is the implication here that the 105 is actually most suited to very hard-to-drive headphones, which the PM-2s are not?
I certainly find something unsettlingly vague (not to mention auto-translated-sounding) about the "It is nothing if you reduce the [to]volume level 60" that I cited above.
Does that necessarily imply it is "something" if I have to lower it to 45?
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post #1686 of 1705 Old 08-15-2014, 01:10 PM
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I listen to my Denon ah-d5000's at anywhere from 40-75 depending on the source. Mostly 50-60 though. The Denon's are very easy to drive
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Picked up a 105d from the dealer today to audition over the weekend. I'm finding so far that I'm getting much better results out of my trusty Bel Canto DAC1.5. In fairness it's still burning in but the gap is quite significant which my wife notices easily too. Am I better with the 103D and using the coaxial out into the Bel Canto or should I be patient?
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Oppo BDP-105 "Sound Quality" Check Thread for Audiophiles

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marantz-NZ View Post
Picked up a 105d from the dealer today to audition over the weekend. I'm finding so far that I'm getting much better results out of my trusty Bel Canto DAC1.5. In fairness it's still burning in but the gap is quite significant which my wife notices easily too. Am I better with the 103D and using the coaxial out into the Bel Canto or should I be patient?

Give us more info on how you're auditioning your 105D. What settings and connections are you using on the player? Are you enabling any speaker configuration settings? Are you using the 105's volume, or do you have volume fixed at 100? What music formats are you playing? Stereo or multichannel? In all fairness, the 105D is much more than just a DAC for less than the price of the Bel Canto.
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I'm using the coaxial out from the 105D into the Bel Canto and then into my Perreaux Eloquence. Then using the analogue outs straight into the amp. This allows me to switch between the two sources at a flick of a switch.

I'm only spinning CDs. The conundrum is I already own the 103D and was hoping the 105D might show up or be on par with the Bel Canto but my ears aren't telling me that yet.

Reading through the posts things seem to improve after a substantial break in however the gap is quite wide.
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post #1690 of 1705 Old 09-06-2014, 04:46 AM
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Oppo BDP-105 "Sound Quality" Check Thread for Audiophiles

So, are you controlling volume with your Perreaux amp, and have the 105's volume fixed on 100? I also assume you're using the dedicated stereo output section of the 105D (either its rca or xlr outputs). At fixed volume, the 105D is outputting 2.1 Vrms out its rca's, and 4.2 Vrms out its xlr's. The 105's xlr outs are 6 dB hotter than its rca outs. How does that compare with the Bel Canto's analog outs?

Last edited by DanF8500; 09-06-2014 at 05:24 AM.
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post #1691 of 1705 Old 09-06-2014, 05:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marantz-NZ View Post
I'm using the coaxial out from the 105D
That's using it as a digital transport, which bypasses the 105D's DACs. A 103 would be the same for this use.

-Bill


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post #1692 of 1705 Old 09-06-2014, 05:21 AM
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I'm also using the analogue outs so I can switch between the two to compare.
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Originally Posted by Marantz-NZ View Post
I'm also using the analogue outs so I can switch between the two to compare.
Oh, I get it. You're doing this to test the player's DACs. I'll let the audiophiles help with this.

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Oppo BDP-105 "Sound Quality" Check Thread for Audiophiles

One other thing (some food for thought). If you are using your amp's preamp section(volume control), is that there may be an impedance mismatch between the 105 and your amp's preamp section. I noticed your Perreaux amp's preamp section has an input impedance of 12K ohms (rca) and 22 K Ohm (xlr). Oppo recommends at least a 47 K Ohm input impedance for proper matching of its players. The higher the better. If you bypass your preamp section of your amp, you gain a little more impedance, as your power amp section has a 33 K Ohm input impedance. With the low impedance of your preamp, you may be losing fidelity. The music may sound strained, not reaching its full potential. I have a Levinson amp with an input impedance of 100 K Ohms, and paired with the 105, it is pure magic.

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post #1695 of 1705 Old 09-06-2014, 12:38 PM
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Yes that would make some sense. I'm using XLR from the Bel Canto and RCA from the Oppo and notice a DB drop when switching between the two. I will try XLR out from the Oppo.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanF8500 View Post
One other thing (some food for thought). If you are using your amp's preamp section(volume control), is that there may be an impedance mismatch between the 105 and your amp's preamp section. I noticed your Perreaux amp's preamp section has an input impedance of 12K ohms (rca) and 22 K Ohm (xlr). Oppo recommends at least a 47 K Ohm input impedance for proper matching of its players. The higher the better. If you bypass your preamp section of your amp, you gain a little more impedance, as your power amp section has a 33 K Ohm input impedance. With the low impedance of your preamp, you may be losing fidelity. The music may sound strained, not reaching its full potential. I have a Levinson amp with an input impedance of 100 K Ohms, and paired with the 105, it is pure magic.
That's interesting, I'm using a Cambridge 752 directly into Emotiva XPA-1's which have 20kohms input impedance, and it sounds fantastic.
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post #1697 of 1705 Old 09-10-2014, 11:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanF8500 View Post
One other thing (some food for thought). If you are using your amp's preamp section(volume control), is that there may be an impedance mismatch between the 105 and your amp's preamp section. I noticed your Perreaux amp's preamp section has an input impedance of 12K ohms (rca) and 22 K Ohm (xlr). Oppo recommends at least a 47 K Ohm input impedance for proper matching of its players. The higher the better. If you bypass your preamp section of your amp, you gain a little more impedance, as your power amp section has a 33 K Ohm input impedance. With the low impedance of your preamp, you may be losing fidelity. The music may sound strained, not reaching its full potential. I have a Levinson amp with an input impedance of 100 K Ohms, and paired with the 105, it is pure magic.
I've a question about this. Anthem Statement P5 which is one of the best multi channel amps has an input impedance of 18 K Ohm (RCA). Are you saying that if I connect Oppo 103 / 105 directly to Anthem P5, I'll lose fidelity?
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post #1698 of 1705 Old 09-11-2014, 06:47 AM
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Oppo BDP-105 "Sound Quality" Check Thread for Audiophiles

^ I think the pairing will pose no issues. Another factor to look at is the input sensitivity of the amp. For the Anthem P5, it is 1 Vrms. The 103/105 put out 2.1 Vrms out their rca's. Those players will put out 1 Vrms at around a 6 dB reduction of their max volume (100). This equates to about 12 volume steps/clicks of the 103/105's volume control. So, the voltage divider (voltage attenuation) created from the output impedance of the 103/105 (100 Ohms) and input impedance of the Anthem P5 (18 K Ohms) is fairly small, which means you should be able to reach the Anthem amp's max output (if you so desire) near a 103/105 volume just shy of 90, with room to spare.

Reports from owners who have connected their Oppo players direct to amps have been mixed. A few say they have maxed out the Oppo volume control and wish they could increase vol a little more for quieter passages of classical music or a low output audio disc, while most say they have more than enough reserve volume, and typically listen with volume in the 40-80 range.

I've read that Oppo recommends a 47K input impedance for a load, so just about anything at or over 47K will pose no issues. That's not to say a load of a little under 47K won't work...it's just not ideal.

There's other factors that I will not discuss that can affect fidelity between player/amp (i.e. load on the output amp stage of the 105). If you want more details, read Official OPPO BDP-105 Owner's Thread post 8287 in the 105 owner's thread by Laird Wiiliams.

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post #1699 of 1705 Old 09-11-2014, 10:47 AM
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^ I think the pairing will pose no issues. Another factor to look at is the input sensitivity of the amp. For the Anthem P5, it is 1 Vrms. The 103/105 put out 2.1 Vrms out their rca's. Those players will put out 1 Vrms at around a 6 dB reduction of their max volume (100). This equates to about 12 volume steps/clicks of the 103/105's volume control. So, the voltage divider (voltage attenuation) created from the output impedance of the 103/105 (100 Ohms) and input impedance of the Anthem P5 (18 K Ohms) is fairly small, which means you should be able to reach the Anthem amp's max output (if you so desire) near a 103/105 volume just shy of 90, with room to spare.

Reports from owners who have connected their Oppo players direct to amps have been mixed. A few say they have maxed out the Oppo volume control and wish they could increase vol a little more for quieter passages of classical music or a low output audio disc, while most say they have more than enough reserve volume, and typically listen with volume in the 40-80 range.

I've read that Oppo recommends a 47K input impedance for a load, so just about anything at or over 47K will pose no issues. That's not to say a load of a little under 47K won't work...it's just not ideal.

There's other factors that I will not discuss that can affect fidelity between player/amp (i.e. load on the output amp stage of the 105). If you want more details, read Official OPPO BDP-105 Owner's Thread post 8287 in the 105 owner's thread by Laird Wiiliams.
Many thanks. Based on your explanation, my understanding is that the safest way is to use a surround processor between Oppo and amp (at least in my case with a P5).

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Oppo BDP-105 "Sound Quality" Check Thread for Audiophiles

^ I would try both configurations (Oppo->amp and oppo->ssp->amp) and let your ears be the final decider. However, With a SSP, you will most likely be doing digital signal processing in that component, which would defeat the digital to analog conversion of the Sabre DAC's in the 105. No reason to purchase a 105 if you do that.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marantz-NZ View Post
Yes that would make some sense. I'm using XLR from the Bel Canto and RCA from the Oppo and notice a DB drop when switching between the two. I will try XLR out from the Oppo.
I think if you reverse your set up you will be shocked-and by that I mean use RCA with your DAC and XLR from the Oppo.

This type of volume difference will totally throw you-I know from experience.

Let us know how you get on.
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Haven't read through all 57 pages, but hopefully someone can give me some advice.

I recently bought a Modwright Oppo 105D. The idea is to completely integrate my dedicated stereo and multi-channel/blu-ray systems into one without losing any audio quality; but I also have a Marantz AV8801 processor... perhaps you can sense my dilemma--I'm not entirely sure what the optimal setup is. I have several options:

1. Oppo direct to amp via stereo/multi-channel analog outputs. - This may be ideal for stereo, and it would allow me to sell the Marantz, but I wonder how well multi-channel music and movies will do without the Audyssey processing on the Marantz.

2. Oppo HDMI & stereo analog outputs to Marantz - With this I could use the digital processing on the Marantz for multi-channel/blu-ray, and (I presume?) set it to "pure direct" mode when listening to stereo audio.

3. Oppo HDMI & Stereo analog outputs & multi-channel analog outputs to Marantz - This would require cable overkill, but the advantage is that I could still use the Oppo DAC for stereo & multi-channel music, and use the Audessy processing for movies only.

Any thoughts on these options?

Also, would it hurt the sound quality at all to pass the analog signal through the Marantz before going to the amp? I assume the "Pure Direct" mode would essentially just allow the analog signal to pass through without using the Marantz's DAC or converting to digital, correct?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SolRage View Post
I recently bought a Modwright Oppo 105D. The idea is to completely integrate my dedicated stereo and multi-channel/blu-ray systems into one without losing any audio quality; but I also have a Marantz AV8801 processor... perhaps you can sense my dilemma--I'm not entirely sure what the optimal setup is. I have several options:

1. Oppo direct to amp via stereo/multi-channel analog outputs. - This may be ideal for stereo, and it would allow me to sell the Marantz, but I wonder how well multi-channel music and movies will do without the Audyssey processing on the Marantz.

2. Oppo HDMI & stereo analog outputs to Marantz - With this I could use the digital processing on the Marantz for multi-channel/blu-ray, and (I presume?) set it to "pure direct" mode when listening to stereo audio.

3. Oppo HDMI & Stereo analog outputs & multi-channel analog outputs to Marantz - This would require cable overkill, but the advantage is that I could still use the Oppo DAC for stereo & multi-channel music, and use the Audessy processing for movies only.

Any thoughts on these options?

Also, would it hurt the sound quality at all to pass the analog signal through the Marantz before going to the amp? I assume the "Pure Direct" mode would essentially just allow the analog signal to pass through without using the Marantz's DAC or converting to digital, correct?
Given you have both the modded Oppo and Marantz, you can select the option you prefer based on your own judgement in your own room, an ideal way to go. If you like the sound with Option 1, that seems the obvious solution if you don't have other analog sources. You can judge for yourself if passing the signal through the Marantz impinges on sound quality. You might use borrowed cables for your observation until you settle on a setup.

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post #1704 of 1705 Old Yesterday, 11:18 AM
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I use a Pioneer BDP 140 now. I cant decide if it worths to spend more for oppo..
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post #1705 of 1705 Old Yesterday, 12:52 PM
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