One-and-Only PS4 as Blu-Ray Player Thread - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 172 Old 08-21-2013, 06:20 PM - Thread Starter
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One-and-Only PS4 as Blu-Ray Player Thread...
Since the Sony PlayStation 4 in U.S. Stores November 15 for $399, it's time for this!

Post away fellow AVS members.
fwiw, I've got a 2008 "fat" PS3, been waiting for this PS4.
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post #2 of 172 Old 08-22-2013, 04:07 AM - Thread Starter
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PS4 FAQ:

http://blog.us.playstation.com/2013/10/30/ps4-the-ultimate-faq-north-america/

Current Firmware: 1.51 (11/19/13)
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post #3 of 172 Old 08-22-2013, 04:07 AM - Thread Starter
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post #4 of 172 Old 08-22-2013, 09:42 AM
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Can we expect any improvements overall in terms of using the PS4 as BD player vs. the PS3? If so, what kinds of improvements?

I've noticed that the PS3 had a 2xCAV speed for BD while the PS4 has a 6xCAV speed. I'm also aware the PS4 interface is quite different from the PS3's XMB.
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post #5 of 172 Old 08-30-2013, 02:57 AM
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I cannot see any vast improvements over PS3

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post #6 of 172 Old 08-30-2013, 05:19 PM
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The big improvements for the PS4 (over the PS3) as a video player (not just Blu-ray) are:

1. supports 4K Ultra HD video output

2. serves as a video player for the Sony 4K video download service

3. potentially can accept a future firmware update to enable support of playback of Blu-ray 4K discs (target date 2nd half 2014)

4. potentially can support future 1080p discs at 48Hz and 60Hz including in 3D

5. potentially can support future Blu-ray discs (1080p and 4k) recorded with increase color bit depth (e.g., 10-bit and 12-bit)

Items 1 and 2 are more or less confirmed capabilities of the PS4. Item 3, 4, and 5 will depend on what gets defined for the next generation Blu-ray standard (due late 2013 or more likely early 2014), if the PS4 Blu-ray ROM drive can support the additional capacity defined for the next generation of Blu-ray, and if the PS4 can support HDMI 2.0. If all of the essential hardware pieces are already there, then future firmware releases will potentially enable these features for the next generation of Blu-ray discs.
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post #7 of 172 Old 10-18-2013, 12:38 PM
 
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I also wonder if Sony have had the foresight to be ready for 4K Blu Ray when it eventually arrives?

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post #8 of 172 Old 10-18-2013, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tele1962 View Post

I also wonder if Sony have had the foresight to be ready for 4K Blu Ray when it eventually arrives?

Probably, but we won't know until sometime in 2014.

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post #9 of 172 Old 10-19-2013, 09:32 AM
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Any reason to think that the PS4 won't have at least the same apps the PS3 have? I really like having Netflix, Amazon, Vudu, and Hulu+ in the same box as my BR player (and if they could hack iTunes support into it........drool). Everything official I can find is surprisingly vague about app support.

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post #10 of 172 Old 10-21-2013, 02:20 PM
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I am afraid that 4K Blu Ray discs will require new hardware just like going from DVD to Regular Blu Ray.
What is different now that gives hope? Just asking because Upscaling 2K to 4K is clearly mentioned but nothing about 4K Blu Ray disc future compatibility.

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post #11 of 172 Old 10-22-2013, 06:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrA View Post

I am afraid that 4K Blu Ray discs will require new hardware just like going from DVD to Regular Blu Ray.
What is different now that gives hope? Just asking because Upscaling 2K to 4K is clearly mentioned but nothing about 4K Blu Ray disc future compatibility.

You're likely correct. However, given Sony's muscle on the BRF it's possible that they strong arm the forum to accept as standard the hardware that's already in the PS4, which could then presumably be enabled for 4K bluray with a FW update. Not saying it's likely, but it's possible.
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post #12 of 172 Old 10-22-2013, 06:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrA View Post

I am afraid that 4K Blu Ray discs will require new hardware just like going from DVD to Regular Blu Ray.
What is different now that gives hope? Just asking because Upscaling 2K to 4K is clearly mentioned but nothing about 4K Blu Ray disc future compatibility.

Current BD now has a way to get 33gb per layer and triple layer BD has been mentioned as feasible. It's been suggested that the 99gb combined with new more efficient compression schemes will be good for 4K BD.

So the main question is whether the PS4 would be capable of reading triple layer discs.
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post #13 of 172 Old 10-23-2013, 02:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seanbryan View Post

Current BD now has a way to get 33gb per layer and triple layer BD has been mentioned as feasible. It's been suggested that the 99gb combined with new more efficient compression schemes will be good for 4K BD.

So the main question is whether the PS4 would be capable of reading triple layer discs.

I know that SNE and MSFT have a cost control imperative for these boxes but I still have to assume that they will use the latest/greatest laser assembly pickup thingy possible.

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post #14 of 172 Old 10-27-2013, 10:22 AM
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Just noticed that the day one update to 1.5 enables, among many other pretty basic features, the ability to use the Ps4 as a DVD/BR player. Amazing to think what a time crunch they've faced, putting these into boxes without been being able to play movies!

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post #15 of 172 Old 10-31-2013, 07:41 AM
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Massive FAQ for PS4:

http://blog.us.playstation.com/2013/10/30/ps4-the-ultimate-faq-north-america/
Quote:
Will PS4 support 4K content for video or gaming?

Support for high-resolution 4K output for still images and movie content is in consideration, but there are no further details to share at this time. PS4 does not currently support 4K output for games.

In consideration? Ridiculous.

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post #16 of 172 Old 11-01-2013, 10:09 AM
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When the PS3 came out it was considered a high quality BD player if not the best one for a pretty good while anyway. There is a real good chance that I will be upgrading my 65" Mit DLP to an LED model this holiday season and I may make the jump to the PS4 as well. But I really need it to remain a quality BD player as I really like not having to have the extra component (game system and BD player). The only thing I've heard and read so far is that the PS4 is faster, which is an improvement but theoretically, should also be a given.
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post #17 of 172 Old 11-01-2013, 11:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Closet Geek View Post

When the PS3 came out it was considered a high quality BD player if not the best one for a pretty good while anyway. There is a real good chance that I will be upgrading my 65" Mit DLP to an LED model this holiday season and I may make the jump to the PS4 as well. But I really need it to remain a quality BD player as I really like not having to have the extra component (game system and BD player). The only thing I've heard and read so far is that the PS4 is faster, which is an improvement but theoretically, should also be a given.
How do you control it? The PS4 doesn't work with a bluetooth remote or a universal remote, as far as I know. You'll have to use a controller, or a smartphone app possibly. I think I'd rather a real BD player with an actual remote.
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post #18 of 172 Old 11-01-2013, 12:07 PM
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Originally Posted by mdavej View Post

How do you control it? The PS4 doesn't work with a bluetooth remote or a universal remote, as far as I know. You'll have to use a controller, or a smartphone app possibly. I think I'd rather a real BD player with an actual remote.

With the PS3, you can control it with the controllers but I bought a remote for it. Surely, they'll have a remote option for the PS4 as well.
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post #19 of 172 Old 11-01-2013, 12:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Closet Geek View Post

With the PS3, you can control it with the controllers but I bought a remote for it. Surely, they'll have a remote option for the PS4 as well.
According to the FAQ linked above, they don't.
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post #20 of 172 Old 11-01-2013, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdavej View Post

According to the FAQ linked above, they don't.

I saw that the PS3 remote isn't compatible but it doesn't say there isn't a PS4 option. Then again, it doesn't say there is an option either. I'm still figuring there will be a remote control available.
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post #21 of 172 Old 11-02-2013, 07:45 AM
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Originally Posted by anthonymoody View Post

You're likely correct. However, given Sony's muscle on the BRF it's possible that they strong arm the forum to accept as standard the hardware that's already in the PS4, which could then presumably be enabled for 4K bluray with a FW update. Not saying it's likely, but it's possible.

I would not expect Sony to say anything about the PS4 compatibility with Blu-ray 4K until sometime after the standard for this new disc format is finalized (likely 1st quarter 2014). As for the BD drive in the PS4, we do know that there have been BD ROM and BD burners shipping for perhaps a year now from a few companies (e.g., LG) that support the BD-XL standard (with up to 33 GB per layer and up to 4 layers). So Sony certainly could be providing compatible BD Rom drives in the PS4.

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post #22 of 172 Old 11-02-2013, 11:50 AM
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The reason there isn't a 4K blu-ray in many ways is that the standards are still being worked out. Specifically the HDMI 2.0 spec which will the basis for the new chipsets that need to be made. Cables are still the same but the chips on each of the connection will need to be HDMI 2.0 compliant and so Sony had to go to production months ago with no HDMI 2.0 spec and therefore no chips to even broadcast 4K.

So any thoughts of the PS4 being a 4K player at launch were pretty much nullified unless they wanted to wait and see, which I doubt Sony really wanted to Microsoft launch Xbox ahead of the PS again.

Rumors of firmware upgrades to chipsets is a nice story to pitch to the media, but anyone who has ever worked on chipsets know that standards-based chips need the standards to be finalized so it doesn't become a locked eco-system (Samsung players for Samsung TVs, Sony players for Sony TVs, etc.).

Sony will do what it can to make sure it can make the PS4 4K friendly, but realize the first function is gaming which will never be at 4K (CPU/GPU couldn't handle it), so any 4K video is really not a hard requirement as it is a great market differentiator.
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post #23 of 172 Old 11-03-2013, 08:21 AM
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Sony already has a HDMI 2.0 chipset this is going into their latest 4K UHD TVs and their new 4K projectors. A Sony rep at the IFA trade show in Berlin (September 2013) said the PS4 will also have HDMI 2.0. This initial Sony HDMI 2.0 implementation is not a full capability HDMI 2.0 as it is limited to 10.2 Gbps data rate/bandwidth while the HDMI 2.0 standard (approved Sept. 2014) allows for up to 18 Gbps. I have recently published a blog (HERE) that shows the 4K UHD signal formats allowed by the HDMI 2.0 standard at both the 10.2 Gbps and the 18 Gbps bandwidths. In any case if the PS4 comes equipped with both the HDMI 2.0 output and a Blu-ray ROM drive that support the BD-XL formats then it should be possible to have a future firmware update to add support for playback of Blu-ray 4K discs.

There are two standards under development that must be completed before Blu-ray 4K can become a reality. First is amendment 1 to the h.265 standard for the HEVC codec. While the basic HEVC codec has been defined by the already published version of h.265 there are 4K UHD related extensions being defined to support higher bit depths, higher frame rates, 3D, etc. This amendment is due out in about two months. The BDA is also developing the spec. for the next generation of Blu-ray, which is expected to use HEVC for 4K video, and it is on a timetable to be completed in early 2014. If these new/updated standards are completed on time then it should be possible to have the first commercial Blu-ray 4K products shipping by 4th quarter of 2014.

Thus, I don't expect to see the first BD 4K discs and standalone players coming to the market before this time next year. Given Sony's history with upgrades to the PS3, we may not hear anything from Sony about PS4 compatibility with Blu-ray 4K until perhaps a year from now.

As for the remote to control the Blu-ray player function on the PS4, I assume a new remote is in the works and it will probably be more complete with improved functionality for also controlling the Sony movie download service and other web based streaming services.

.
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post #24 of 172 Old 11-03-2013, 09:32 AM
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I think it's pretty clear Sony has no interest in making the PS4 anything more than a gaming machine. With no remote capability, no DLNA and no CD playback, it's pretty much useless for anything but gaming. As for the remote, I'll believe it when I see it. It just makes me mad that after all these years of putting up with expensive 3rd party add-on solutions, they can't throw us universal remote users a bone a add a 25 cent IR sensor to this g*dd*mn thing.
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post #25 of 172 Old 11-04-2013, 07:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdavej View Post

I think it's pretty clear Sony has no interest in making the PS4 anything more than a gaming machine. With no remote capability, no DLNA and no CD playback, it's pretty much useless for anything but gaming. As for the remote, I'll believe it when I see it. It just makes me mad that after all these years of putting up with expensive 3rd party add-on solutions, they can't throw us universal remote users a bone a add a 25 cent IR sensor to this g*dd*mn thing.

Well, gaming has always been the priority with the PS series and the growth of home theater just caused them to build in more features. I agree that Sony wants a strong gaming machine but I think they are also wanting to try to shift focus from peripheral media to their streaming channels. This would be a long term strategy to attempt to keep users tied to Sony via subscription services. But in the midst of wanting simplicity, consumers still want control and choice so I'm not sure how well this strategy will play out. Perhaps more details will roll out in the coming weeks revealing how these options, or lack thereof will benefit us consumers.
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post #26 of 172 Old 11-06-2013, 05:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdavej View Post

I think it's pretty clear Sony has no interest in making the PS4 anything more than a gaming machine. With no remote capability, no DLNA and no CD playback, it's pretty much useless for anything but gaming. As for the remote, I'll believe it when I see it. It just makes me mad that after all these years of putting up with expensive 3rd party add-on solutions, they can't throw us universal remote users a bone a add a 25 cent IR sensor to this g*dd*mn thing.

The fact that they decided to do away with DLNA, mp3 support, etc. is why I decided against a PS4. Quite a shame, really. I hope they come to their senses. My PS3 is my main media center PC and we routinely review home videos and pictures (as well as stream mp3s). I will HAVE to go with the Xbox if this is the case.

I would love to hear the design logic around this.
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post #27 of 172 Old 11-06-2013, 05:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Closet Geek View Post

Well, gaming has always been the priority with the PS series and the growth of home theater just caused them to build in more features. I agree that Sony wants a strong gaming machine but I think they are also wanting to try to shift focus from peripheral media to their streaming channels. This would be a long term strategy to attempt to keep users tied to Sony via subscription services. But in the midst of wanting simplicity, consumers still want control and choice so I'm not sure how well this strategy will play out. Perhaps more details will roll out in the coming weeks revealing how these options, or lack thereof will benefit us consumers.

This is currently a problem. There are TOO many streaming service options out there and every company wants you to use THEIR cloud service. Hopefully things start to focus over time.
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post #28 of 172 Old 11-06-2013, 09:06 AM
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Quote:
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I would love to hear the design logic around this.

This is kind of my thing. At the very least, explain the reason (benefit) for the changes. Is it just to make something fit a price point? Then I can make a decision based on that. Is it to fit a future protocol for the machine? I can make a decision based on that. Is it for the sole purpose of directing us to use their proprietary streaming services? I can make a decision with that. Is there even a premium system that includes the these things? Again, I can make a decision based on that.

I hate feeling like I'm being held hostage with information.
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post #29 of 172 Old 11-06-2013, 05:33 PM
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I couldn't agree more. When I found out that the PS4 would not support DLNA I cancelled my pre-order. I use my PS3 fatty primarily as a BR player and media server. Without this functionality the PS4 is useless to me. Hopefully Sony will reconsider.
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post #30 of 172 Old 11-09-2013, 06:19 AM
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Quote:
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I couldn't agree more. When I found out that the PS4 would not support DLNA I cancelled my pre-order. I use my PS3 fatty primarily as a BR player and media server. Without this functionality the PS4 is useless to me. Hopefully Sony will reconsider.

It will be too late for me. They will end up shoehorning some half assed interface in. I have to admit that the PS3 media interface and UI leaves a lot to be desired. Sorting through their music is a pain.
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