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post #1 of 25 Old 09-05-2014, 12:07 PM - Thread Starter
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4k Blu-Ray finalized, player/sw shipping 2015

http://www.techradar.com/news/televi...s-2015-1264317

gah... i dont think i'll be replacing my 1,000+ Blu-Rays this time

to the edge of eternity and depth of infinity, stupidity knows no bound.
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post #2 of 25 Old 09-05-2014, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JediFonger View Post
http://www.techradar.com/news/televi...s-2015-1264317

gah... i dont think i'll be replacing my 1,000+ Blu-Rays this time
Me neither but for good new movies when the price is $9.99 then I will.

But that won't happen until Dec 2015
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post #3 of 25 Old 09-05-2014, 12:16 PM - Thread Starter
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yeah maybe 2017? 2018?

not in that link but other links, there is talks about expanded color depth and HDR, that is what i look forward to the most! that's amazing! hope all DI were already in high color depths!

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post #4 of 25 Old 09-05-2014, 01:19 PM - Thread Starter
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also if they really want to 'future-proof' this, i'd setup this standard with the ability to go 8k, atmos/uhd audio, 16bit color depth and variable fps all using h266 codecs... from the future.... they should have done with the first DVD standard... but that's not how business works lolz

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post #5 of 25 Old 09-07-2014, 11:55 AM
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Considering how much trouble the studios have with releasing 1080p releases, it'll be interesting to se them screwing up the 4K releases. Let's see some "OK" 4K releases in the first release and then the re-releases a couple of years later as they should.
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post #6 of 25 Old 10-09-2014, 08:35 PM
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Can someone explain HEVC and HDCP in the 4K chain of equipment

Hello,


I found this helpful article but I'm still not clear on what needs what for me to show what I want. http://hdguru.com/three-must-have-4k-tv-features/


My TV has HDMI 2.0
My next receiver has Hdmi 2.0
My next BR player will have HDMI 2.0.


All I want to do is play 4K BR discs on my BR player through my receiver to my TV but most of the time I'll be streaming from my PC over Ethernet (to either my BR player or a HTPC) and I'm pretty sure any copy protection the discs once had would be stripped by the ripping program (as they are now on my current gen BR discs).


So I guess what I need to know is, other than my BR player, does anything else have to have hevc or HDCP? From what I'm reading it doesn't sound like anything else does for my needs but I thought I'd check.
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post #7 of 25 Old 10-10-2014, 07:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boe View Post
Hello,


I found this helpful article but I'm still not clear on what needs what for me to show what I want. http://hdguru.com/three-must-have-4k-tv-features/


My TV has HDMI 2.0
My next receiver has Hdmi 2.0
My next BR player will have HDMI 2.0.


All I want to do is play 4K BR discs on my BR player through my receiver to my TV but most of the time I'll be streaming from my PC over Ethernet (to either my BR player or a HTPC) and I'm pretty sure any copy protection the discs once had would be stripped by the ripping program (as they are now on my current gen BR discs).


So I guess what I need to know is, other than my BR player, does anything else have to have hevc or HDCP? From what I'm reading it doesn't sound like anything else does for my needs but I thought I'd check.

Here's the spec: http://www.digital-cp.com/files/stat...TS_Finalv2.pdf
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post #8 of 25 Old 10-10-2014, 09:04 AM
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Thanks unfortunately I wasn't able to glean from that the answer to my question.
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post #9 of 25 Old 10-10-2014, 04:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boe View Post
Thanks unfortunately I wasn't able to glean from that the answer to my question.
The short answer is no one knows for sure since there is no 4K Blu-ray standard nailed down not to mention there are no studio's signed up for content as the format doesn't exist as yet.

But, HDMI 2.0 unto itself is not enough. You're going to need HDMI 2.0 and HDCP 2.2 with your equipment. Or at least that is the expectation.

If you bother to read the spec, you'll find it will be necessary (expected) to have an internet connection to play any 4K content from a disc. Your equipment will be checked via internet (phone home) to see if it is valid 4K equipment before keys will be passed to the equipment to allow 4K content access. That means the display, Blu-ray player, receiver, etc.; any thing that connects via HDMI to the source. This check can be preformed continuously and randomly to verify no corruption of the copy protection. Etc., etc., etc...

HDCP 2.2 is a clean sheet of paper and is not backward compatible. The HDMI 2.0 transmitter and receiver will however support older versions of HDCP for comparability of 1080 Blu-ray.

Since there is not a lot of equipment out there yet that supports both HDMI 2.0 and HDCP 2.2 it's possible what you've bought may or may not work with coming 4K Blu-ray. If it does work it is also possible that it may not be 100% compatible with a standard that does not yet exist.
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post #10 of 25 Old 10-10-2014, 04:36 PM
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Thanks for the reply. I guess I'll just have to wait and see.
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post #11 of 25 Old 10-12-2014, 12:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b curry View Post
If you bother to read the spec, you'll find it will be necessary (expected) to have an internet connection to play any 4K content from a disc. Your equipment will be checked via internet (phone home) to see if it is valid 4K equipment before keys will be passed to the equipment to allow 4K content access. That means the display, Blu-ray player, receiver, etc.; any thing that connects via HDMI to the source. This check can be preformed continuously and randomly to verify no corruption of the copy protection. Etc., etc., etc...
Wow, very interesting... I can understand this for digital downloads (though, I don't like it), but this is B.S. for content on physical discs.
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post #12 of 25 Old 10-13-2014, 11:39 AM
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I recently went to our new cinema watching a movie specifically for 4K film "The Maze Runner" (2014). It did not leave me so great impression, as I was hoping. It seemed to me that the 4K did not give me the WOW factor on this film as I desired. Heightened framerate on past "The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug"(2013) movie left me a much stronger impression (High Frame Rate 3D (HFR 3D) with 48fps) than the 4K.

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post #13 of 25 Old 10-27-2014, 10:17 AM
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For now everyone can get the New Pioneer Referenc bluray players

Pioneer BDP-88 and BDP-85 flagship Blu-ray Players


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post #14 of 25 Old 10-27-2014, 10:26 AM
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That's a nice BR player - but the interview really just made me want to watch Eureka all over again.
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post #15 of 25 Unread 12-06-2014, 10:37 AM
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Question

Quote:
Originally Posted by JediFonger View Post
http://www.techradar.com/news/televi...s-2015-1264317

gah... i dont think i'll be replacing my 1,000+ Blu-Rays this time
We're now almost at the end of 2014. Any more news about the new 4K Blu-ray standard?...
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post #16 of 25 Unread 12-09-2014, 10:24 PM - Thread Starter
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no idea... i haven't read any. i'm sure someone else will post about this if there is something new to report.

they should *NOT* finalize the 4k BD until Dolby Vision comes out en masse. i really want to see color gamut expanded and encoded on future disc formats.

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post #17 of 25 Unread 12-10-2014, 08:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Michael9009 View Post
We're now almost at the end of 2014. Any more news about the new 4K Blu-ray standard?...
according to s/v pushed at least to the 3rd qtr 2015...

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post #18 of 25 Unread 12-11-2014, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Michael9009 View Post
We're now almost at the end of 2014. Any more news about the new 4K Blu-ray standard?...

Probably will come at the upcoming CES.
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post #19 of 25 Unread Yesterday, 01:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b curry View Post
The short answer is no one knows for sure since there is no 4K Blu-ray standard nailed down not to mention there are no studio's signed up for content as the format doesn't exist as yet.

But, HDMI 2.0 unto itself is not enough. You're going to need HDMI 2.0 and HDCP 2.2 with your equipment. Or at least that is the expectation.

If you bother to read the spec, you'll find it will be necessary (expected) to have an internet connection to play any 4K content from a disc. Your equipment will be checked via internet (phone home) to see if it is valid 4K equipment before keys will be passed to the equipment to allow 4K content access. That means the display, Blu-ray player, receiver, etc.; any thing that connects via HDMI to the source. This check can be preformed continuously and randomly to verify no corruption of the copy protection. Etc., etc., etc...
Dunno if this poster is still active, but I just read through the HDCP 2.2 on HDMI Compliance Test Spec document, and I don't see a requirement to verify via an external connection (the internet) the validity of 4K equipment before "keys" are passed to allow access.

Is there another Spec that defines this? Because I couldn't find it in the Spec that I read, downloaded from the link provided in Post 7.

All I see is the standard testing for handshaking up-and-down the HDMI stream every time a device is added or deleted, and previously-connected devices are remembered ("Stored_Km"), with simplified re-handshakes. So for a 4KBD Player -> 4K Receiver -> 4KTV set-up, I see no reason for "phone home via internet" behavior.

Or did I completely miss something?

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post #20 of 25 Unread Yesterday, 05:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shinksma View Post
Dunno if this poster is still active, but I just read through the HDCP 2.2 on HDMI Compliance Test Spec document, and I don't see a requirement to verify via an external connection (the internet) the validity of 4K equipment before "keys" are passed to allow access.

Is there another Spec that defines this? Because I couldn't find it in the Spec that I read, downloaded from the link provided in Post 7.

All I see is the standard testing for handshaking up-and-down the HDMI stream every time a device is added or deleted, and previously-connected devices are remembered ("Stored_Km"), with simplified re-handshakes. So for a 4KBD Player -> 4K Receiver -> 4KTV set-up, I see no reason for "phone home via internet" behavior.

Or did I completely miss something?

Probably missed something and I'm not sure that I linked the final version of HDCP 2.2. I'm too lazy to go back and look...


If you read this ( https://torrentfreak.com/sony-video-...irates-130703/ ) you'll see Sony's take on HDCP 2.2 requiring an internet connection and they did indeed implement it this way, requiring an internet connection, for their 4K products.


As I said in an earlier post, "The short answer is no one knows for sure since there is no 4K Blu-ray standard nailed down not to mention there are no studio's signed up for content as the format doesn't exist as yet." I think it's wait and see at this point, OTOH, I also think it's safe to say that film studio's are not going to support a higher resolution format without a higher form of content protection. HDCP 2.2 supports a "phone home" requirement and I would expect this requirement will be followed by more studio's than just Sony.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b curry View Post
Probably missed something and I'm not sure that I linked the final version of HDCP 2.2. I'm too lazy to go back and look...


If you read this ( https://torrentfreak.com/sony-video-...irates-130703/ ) you'll see Sony's take on HDCP 2.2 requiring an internet connection and they did indeed implement it this way, requiring an internet connection, for their 4K products.


As I said in an earlier post, "The short answer is no one knows for sure since there is no 4K Blu-ray standard nailed down not to mention there are no studio's signed up for content as the format doesn't exist as yet." I think it's wait and see at this point, OTOH, I also think it's safe to say that film studio's are not going to support a higher resolution format without a higher form of content protection. HDCP 2.2 supports a "phone home" requirement and I would expect this requirement will be followed by more studio's than just Sony.
The CTS PDF you linked was indeed the Final version. Or at least the version I downloaded from the link was labeled "Final".

I actually went and hunted down the full Final HDCP 2.2 Spec (which complements that Compliance Test Spec). There wasn't anything in there about external validation either.

I see a lot of "Sony wants" in that old article (3 July 2013), but not a whole lot of "industry has specified". I hope the "Sony wants" stuff got kiboshed in any thoughts about the finalized 4K BD spec.

If Sony implements this "4K phone home" crap beyond that one 4K HD-player/device they had, I won't be buying any Sony 4K stuff. And if other OEMs do the same, I won't buy anything from them. I have no idea whether I am in the majority, but I can't imagine the industry didn't learn from the fubar mentioned in that article: the Xbox One needing to be Internet-connected regularly to function, which got nuked post-haste.

I guess we'll know in a few weeks (CES) or months (when the 4K BD spec gets officially published) with presumably industry chiming on whether they intend to leverage additional requirements beyond what is in the spec.

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post #22 of 25 Unread Today, 08:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shinksma View Post
The CTS PDF you linked was indeed the Final version. Or at least the version I downloaded from the link was labeled "Final".

I actually went and hunted down the full Final HDCP 2.2 Spec (which complements that Compliance Test Spec). There wasn't anything in there about external validation either.

I see a lot of "Sony wants" in that old article (3 July 2013), but not a whole lot of "industry has specified". I hope the "Sony wants" stuff got kiboshed in any thoughts about the finalized 4K BD spec.

If Sony implements this "4K phone home" crap beyond that one 4K HD-player/device they had, I won't be buying any Sony 4K stuff. And if other OEMs do the same, I won't buy anything from them. I have no idea whether I am in the majority, but I can't imagine the industry didn't learn from the fubar mentioned in that article: the Xbox One needing to be Internet-connected regularly to function, which got nuked post-haste.

I guess we'll know in a few weeks (CES) or months (when the 4K BD spec gets officially published) with presumably industry chiming on whether they intend to leverage additional requirements beyond what is in the spec.

I hear you and I'm not real happy about it either but...


You realize the "Sony wants" are coming from Sony Pictures, the same guys that just got hacked by North Korea or someone else... You don't really think Sony Pictures or any of the other film studios are going to back down from a more robust copy protection scheme for a new format do you?


I see the requirement to have full HDCP 2.2 hardware (authentication requirement) for 4K playback as a bigger problem as it more or less requires a complete replacement of all of ones equipment.
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post #23 of 25 Unread Today, 08:09 PM
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Sony should butt out of it. It's pretty much abandoning the blu-ray format anyway.
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post #24 of 25 Unread Today, 08:15 PM
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If and or/when 4k Blu comes out it might not be until 2017-2018 until there are actual titles and movie studio support and even then it may just be upscaled Blu-Ray and not true 4k when the first titles hit.. I still think this a long ways off.. in the meanwhile we will keep enjoying Blu-Ray.. hell, even DVD is still around !!
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post #25 of 25 Unread Today, 09:55 PM
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End of 2015. Most studios have 4K masters of many titles, especially Sony.

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