Why do CE companies support Blu-Ray? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 58 Old 01-08-2007, 06:23 PM - Thread Starter
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i don't understand why so many CE companiers are adamantly backing Blu-Ray given that Sony's PS3 will likely undercut their own much pricier players for some time to come. Any thoughts?
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post #2 of 58 Old 01-08-2007, 06:54 PM
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i don't understand why so many CE companiers are adamantly backing Blu-Ray given that Sony's PS3 will likely undercut their own much pricier players for some time to come. Any thoughts?

Because it's got the studio support, and because they can make money on it.

There was obviously something that they all didn't like about HD, otherwise they'd bei n their camp
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post #3 of 58 Old 01-08-2007, 07:37 PM
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The patents etc. are also spread around so everyone profits. Pioneer and Panasonic have played a large role in the development. And Philips is a long-time ally of Sony.

This was the big change that Sony instituted over its previous behavior: try to build a coalition of CE companies all of whom have a piece of the action.

Obviously, Toshiba did not join this, although still has rights (e.g., the PS3's Cell processor is developed by a consortium of Sony, IBM, and Toshiba, believe it or not).

Microsoft had its own proprietary interests as well. One must ask: where would HD DVD be today without Microsoft?

Overall, Sony must be commended for building a coalition that held together even some hard times.

They appear to have stayed the course at least for this CES.
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post #4 of 58 Old 01-08-2007, 07:44 PM
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Because they are stupid!.

I am the CEO of Bologna Electronics. I drink the BR cool aid.
I then decide to build a BR player! When I build it, I realize I have to charge $999.99 for it to turn a profit.
Now, I have to compete against a $499.99 BR player that also plays games and is half the price of my recently built BR player.

Hence, the reason why I am stupid!
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post #5 of 58 Old 01-08-2007, 07:47 PM
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You want to know why? just post this on the HDDVD are and it will answer your question just read the responses for the HDDVD fanboys
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post #6 of 58 Old 01-08-2007, 08:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paintit77 View Post

I then decide to build a BR player! When I build it, I realize I have to charge $999.99 for it to turn a profit.
Now, I have to compete against a $499.99 BR player that also plays games and is half the price of my recently built BR player.

Um, I know I'm probably responding to a joke and maybe flame bait but do you realize that's exactly one of the reasons why CE companies aren't exactly flocking to HD DVD's side? That they have to compete with a subsidized $499 standalone player?

At least on the Blu-ray side there are enough people claiming they will never watch movies on a game machine so manufacturers can justify building a $999 player (for now).

peace
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post #7 of 58 Old 01-08-2007, 08:35 PM
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I believe a lot of it has to do with Sony's marketing. They were able to convince a lot of manufacturers to release players.... it's just too bad they aren't selling. Brings an old saying to mind "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me"
I wouldn't expect to see much more in terms of new CE blu-ray players. Why release a $1000 player if the PS3 can be bought for $500 and Chinese HD DVD's will likely be selling for ~$300
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post #8 of 58 Old 01-08-2007, 09:14 PM
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I believe a lot of it has to do with Sony's marketing. They were able to convince a lot of manufacturers to release players.... it's just too bad they aren't selling

Really? They all seemed to move pretty well this Christmas. BDP-1 sold out, Pioneer Elite doing well, Panasonic did well. Samsung got burned pretty hard and deservedly so, but them's the breaks when you rush things

You do realize that they didn't make that many decks right? On purpose?

And they're turning a nice profit on them
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post #9 of 58 Old 01-08-2007, 09:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark0 View Post

I believe a lot of it has to do with Sony's marketing. They were able to convince a lot of manufacturers to release players.... it's just too bad they aren't selling. Brings an old saying to mind "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me"
I wouldn't expect to see much more in terms of new CE blu-ray players. Why release a $1000 player if the PS3 can be bought for $500 and Chinese HD DVD's will likely be selling for ~$300

Tweeter is claiming they've been selling the Sony BD players at a much higher clip than the HD DVD units. I don't remember the exact numbers, but it was something like almost 2:1.
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post #10 of 58 Old 01-08-2007, 09:33 PM
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You want the real reason? Here it is. Because the format "war" is not about just 2006. It's about 2007 and the future. BDA has more releases, a strong release schedule, and an aggressive title list for this year. It was clear from the outset that the real release of Blu-ray was at PS3 launch. Disney stepped it up, Fox/MGM are stepping it up. Sony's slow and steady. Lionsgate is sticking to its guns with Blu-ray.

Universal's faltering. They've launched an incredible title list for 2006 and they've got less to do now. HD DVD's success last year? On the back of Universal's incredible releases and WB's favoritism. Universal's got less for the future now and WB's going to true neutrality.

If I were a CE manufacturer, where would I go? To the format who won 2006 or the format who'll win 2007 and beyond? I'd go with the future.

If I were you, I'd go with the format that has the titles and the players. Nothing I've seen suggests that beyond the LG BLu-ray player that hacks in crude HD DVD playback there will be another HD DVD player by someone other than Toshiba until late 2007. If then. Delays happen.

That's why. Content sells players. Content sold HD DVD players last year. Content's going to sell Blu-ray players this year.
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post #11 of 58 Old 01-08-2007, 10:11 PM
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I do not care why CE companies support Blu-Ray, but I am surely happy to see this great support. And that's what counts, at least for me.

In Blu-Ray Veritas!
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post #12 of 58 Old 01-08-2007, 10:38 PM
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The following is a excerpt from the original press release:

Quote:


News Release 2002/2/19

Hitachi, Ltd.
LG Electronics Inc.
Matsushita Electric Industrial Co., Ltd.
Pioneer Corporation
Royal Philips Electronics
Samsung Electronics Co., Ltd.
Sharp Corporation
Sony Corporation
Thomson Multimedia

Tokyo Japan, February 19, 2002: Nine leading companies today announced that they have jointly established the basic specifications for a next generation large capacity optical disc video recording format called Blu-ray Disc.

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post #13 of 58 Old 01-08-2007, 11:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WickyWoo View Post

BDP-1 sold out, Pioneer Elite doing well, Panasonic did well. Samsung got burned pretty hard and deservedly so, but them's the breaks when you rush things

Where are the numbers...Sold out where...Please how do you know this.

Joe V.
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post #14 of 58 Old 01-09-2007, 12:17 AM
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Originally Posted by rlsmith View Post

Overall, Sony must be commended for building a coalition that held together even some hard times.

They appear to have stayed the course at least for this CES.

COME ON MAN, THEY HAVE BOTH BEEN OUT FOR A FEW MONTHS, WHAT HARD TIMES HAVE THEY STUCK THROUGH? GIVE IT ANOTHER SIX MONTHS, IF THE PS3 BUYERS DO NOT AFFECT THE BD MOVIE SALES AS EXPECTED, WE CAN ALL PREPARE FOR SOME MORE DEFECTIONS, OR NEUTRALITY JUST LIKE LG'S.

KEEP BOTH FORMATS ALIVE!
This translates to better PQ & AQ.
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post #15 of 58 Old 01-09-2007, 12:58 AM
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Originally Posted by LAGOSIAN View Post

COME ON MAN, THEY HAVE BOTH BEEN OUT FOR A FEW MONTHS, WHAT HARD TIMES HAVE THEY STUCK THROUGH? GIVE IT ANOTHER SIX MONTHS, IF THE PS3 BUYERS DO NOT AFFECT THE BD MOVIE SALES AS EXPECTED, WE CAN ALL PREPARE FOR SOME MORE DEFECTIONS, OR NEUTRALITY JUST LIKE LG'S.


WTF are you talking about???
Relax...this isn't the end of the world for HD-DVD.
It is only the beginning of the end....

A.P.S. deserve our protection....join the cause today!
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post #16 of 58 Old 01-09-2007, 01:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LAGOSIAN View Post

COME ON MAN, THEY HAVE BOTH BEEN OUT FOR A FEW MONTHS, WHAT HARD TIMES HAVE THEY STUCK THROUGH? GIVE IT ANOTHER SIX MONTHS, IF THE PS3 BUYERS DO NOT AFFECT THE BD MOVIE SALES AS EXPECTED, WE CAN ALL PREPARE FOR SOME MORE DEFECTIONS, OR NEUTRALITY JUST LIKE LG'S.



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post #17 of 58 Old 01-09-2007, 02:22 AM
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Why is it the HDdvd trolls can run rampant in the BD forum today with no chastising ...
What happened to "if you're not here for BD, move on...?"
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post #18 of 58 Old 01-09-2007, 06:53 AM
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Why is it the HDdvd trolls can run rampant in the BD forum today with no chastising ...
What happened to "if you're not here for BD, move on...?"

They're mad because a big hole got made in their bubble world and reality is leaking in.

How do I know? Observation. The Elite is moving pretty much as expected, Best buys around here moved through their BDP-1 stock. There were at least half a dozen at each store, and they were gone before the 20th. Where there once was a dozen Samsungs, there is now 1. They also sold 4 A2s, and they now have a restock of 2 sitting up on top all lonesome.
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post #19 of 58 Old 01-09-2007, 07:35 AM
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Onkyo has a HD-DVD player on the horizon.
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post #20 of 58 Old 01-09-2007, 07:42 AM
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As an owner of both formats the HD-DVD forum is quite frankly a cesspool of blithering stupidity. When I see people post about how many people are VIEWING the respective forums it just seems as if they are grasping for straws. The fanatical behavior in there is pretty much going to put an end to my visiting THAT forum.

I know this place has its problems too but there are more posts fanatically bashing BD than anything constructive. The mods need to get off their asses and keep things in check or else I won't be using avsforum anymore.
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post #21 of 58 Old 01-09-2007, 07:50 AM
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In Japan when you do something stupid and costs your company money, aren't you supposed to fall on your sword or something like that? I mean, trying to compete with a toy that plays games and has a BR player in it for half the price of what your selling yours for is pretty stupid! My favorite part of this is that for twice the money, it won't even play CDs! Hell it won't even play the movie "The Decent"!
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post #22 of 58 Old 01-09-2007, 07:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WickyWoo View Post

They're mad because a big hole got made in their bubble world and reality is leaking in.

How do I know? Observation. The Elite is moving pretty much as expected, Best buys around here moved through their BDP-1 stock. There were at least half a dozen at each store, and they were gone before the 20th. Where there once was a dozen Samsungs, there is now 1. They also sold 4 A2s, and they now have a restock of 2 sitting up on top all lonesome.

Both BB near my house have Magnolias.
All of the Pioneers and Sony Stand Alone Players are on the shelf and ready for a home. Would you like pictures? Also, the BB closer to my house which is at the Flat Irons mall has 5 new Samsungs on the shelf and one open box, which was mine. All for $999.99 or sometimes $799.99 depending on the day.
Just to keep the fanboys happy, they have 3 HDA2s on the shelf as well.

P.S: They used to have 5 HDA2s on the shelf.
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post #23 of 58 Old 01-09-2007, 08:07 AM
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Ok, this is starting to piss me off, everytime a HD-DVD troll comes into a forum on here it gets shut down. I am a fan of both formats but the moderators are not being fair at all, there are a ton of threads on HD-DVD right now bashing the crap out of Blu-Ray and there still up and running? What gives....... again I like both formats using them via game consoles for now before I take the plunge into a standalone.


ihyln: I totally agree with your last post!!!!!
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post #24 of 58 Old 01-09-2007, 10:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Esox50 View Post

Tweeter is claiming they've been selling the Sony BD players at a much higher clip than the HD DVD units. I don't remember the exact numbers, but it was something like almost 2:1.

This is possible.
Though I'd suspect it has to do with what they push and the lack of stock on the toshibas. The Toshiba players seem to be much harder to find in stores than a BD player.
Toshiba hasn't done well keeping places stocked. Someone who wants a HD player is gonna try to buy what they can find in front of them(for those who buy from B&M places)

PS3 & A2 = Format Neutral
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post #25 of 58 Old 01-09-2007, 10:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ihyln View Post

As an owner of both formats the HD-DVD forum is quite frankly a cesspool of blithering stupidity. When I see people post about how many people are VIEWING the respective forums it just seems as if they are grasping for straws. The fanatical behavior in there is pretty much going to put an end to my visiting THAT forum.

I know this place has its problems too but there are more posts fanatically bashing BD than anything constructive. The mods need to get off their asses and keep things in check or else I won't be using avsforum anymore.


Agreed x 1000!
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post #26 of 58 Old 01-09-2007, 11:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ihyln View Post

As an owner of both formats the HD-DVD forum is quite frankly a cesspool of blithering stupidity. When I see people post about how many people are VIEWING the respective forums it just seems as if they are grasping for straws. The fanatical behavior in there is pretty much going to put an end to my visiting THAT forum.

I know this place has its problems too but there are more posts fanatically bashing BD than anything constructive. The mods need to get off their asses and keep things in check or else I won't be using avsforum anymore.


Agreed 10 million %.

A.P.S. deserve our protection....join the cause today!
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post #27 of 58 Old 01-09-2007, 11:11 AM
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Grow up everyone. Like a bunch of little kids. "My toy is better!"

Blu-Ray and HD-DVD supporter.
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post #28 of 58 Old 01-09-2007, 11:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WickyWoo View Post

They're mad because a big hole got made in their bubble world and reality is leaking in.

How do I know? Observation. The Elite is moving pretty much as expected, Best buys around here moved through their BDP-1 stock. There were at least half a dozen at each store, and they were gone before the 20th. Where there once was a dozen Samsungs, there is now 1. They also sold 4 A2s, and they now have a restock of 2 sitting up on top all lonesome.


lol. You guys actually go to BestBuy's and count players ? lmao

Personally I dont own either. Ill wait for a dual player or a format winner before I waste a few grand in either direction.

As a non owner and someone whos been just researching on both the last few months.......

I think both camps are crazy fanboys. Both forums are rediculous. Most of you act as if your getting paid by Sony or MS.


To the original post. My guess is Sonys mamoth presence in Hollywood is why so many studios back Sony .
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post #29 of 58 Old 01-09-2007, 11:45 AM
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Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but blu-ray stand alones are selling very poorly.
Why do you think there aren't any new players being announced at CES? Seriously... why build a player if it's not going to sell? They know they can't compete with a subsidized player (PS3) sold at a loss.
CE's are moving to HD DVD. HD DVD won the war in 2006 and will continue to pull away.
The writing is on the wall, I hate to sound like a dink, but blu-ray is just Sony's latest format flop.
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post #30 of 58 Old 01-09-2007, 11:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark0 View Post

Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but blu-ray stand alones are selling very poorly.
Why do you think there aren't any new players being announced at CES? Seriously... why build a player if it's not going to sell? They know they can't compete with a subsidized player (PS3) sold at a loss.
CE's are moving to HD DVD. HD DVD won the war in 2006 and will continue to pull away.
The writing is on the wall, I hate to sound like a dink, but blu-ray is just Sony's latest format flop.

In what parallel universe is any of that true?
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