Blu-ray High Rez Audio thru HDMI? or analog? - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 10 Old 06-22-2007, 09:29 AM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
MRinDenver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Wheat Ridge
Posts: 711
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I am new to this technology, but I think I am about to get my feet wet with the new, lower price Blu-ray players on the market.

I will be running either the Panasonic (currently my first choice) or the Sony through a Denon 4306 with both HDMI and 6-channel analog audio inputs available.

Given the new audio formats on these discs, what am I giving up. sound wise, by selecting HDMI over analog?

Thanks in advance. Sorry if this has bee asked/answered a hundred times before.

Mike

Mike Rife

The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also. -- Mark Twain

MRinDenver is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 10 Old 06-22-2007, 10:00 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
bfdtv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 13,484
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
HDMI is the best choice. Analog output is derived from running the HDMI (LPCM) output through a set of 6-8 DACs. In effect, 5.1 analog output is simply a less pristine version of the HDMI output.

The DACs in shipping Blu-ray players will process 24-bit, 192kHz signals, but the SNR of their output is typically in the 100-105dB range, which means they aren't able to pass 20-bit sound, let alone 24-bit sound, through the analog outputs. The DACs in some new 2007 receivers -- used exclusively with HDMI output -- are much better (~125dB SNR).
bfdtv is offline  
post #3 of 10 Old 06-22-2007, 10:09 AM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
MRinDenver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Wheat Ridge
Posts: 711
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Exactly what I was hoping to hear, pardon the word choice.

Thanks!

Mike Rife

The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also. -- Mark Twain

MRinDenver is offline  
post #4 of 10 Old 06-22-2007, 10:11 AM
AVS Special Member
 
WirelessGuru's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Seattle
Posts: 3,128
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
I agree with bfdtv..... if you have HDMI... smoke em if you got em.

Last Watched 3D: Oz the Great and Powerful

It should be called Violet-Ray

WirelessGuru is offline  
post #5 of 10 Old 06-22-2007, 03:48 PM
Senior Member
 
Desert Pilot's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Posts: 369
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
I would disagree.

If you select UNCOMPRESSED PCM (in order to get hirez audio) on the blu ray disk...the ONLY way I know of to pass this audio to a receiver is via the analog out. Currently, HiRez audio (whatever flavor) is not fully supported until HDMI ver 1.3

marcus

Our Personal Website with movie and music catalog pages.

Marcus & LaMona Home Theater
Desert Pilot is offline  
post #6 of 10 Old 06-22-2007, 03:54 PM
Advanced Member
 
wase4711's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: outside Chicago
Posts: 947
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 79
hoping its ok to ask this here, but which Blu Ray mchine has the best audio output?

I have a Toshiba hd-1a hd dvd player, that I am going to sell, and want to buy the right Blu ray machine..viewing is on a 70inch sony xbr2, and sound is handled by a 7.1 system, featuring denon power and Martin Logan speakers..

That new sony player for 499 at BB looks tempting, but I dont want to find out the audio is a disappointment after buying it..

BTW, its an older Denon 5303, with NO HDMI inputs, so I would be outputting the audio from the player to the Denon...
wase4711 is offline  
post #7 of 10 Old 06-22-2007, 04:20 PM
AVS Special Member
 
lparsons21's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,134
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by Desert Pilot View Post

I would disagree.

If you select UNCOMPRESSED PCM (in order to get hirez audio) on the blu ray disk...the ONLY way I know of to pass this audio to a receiver is via the analog out. Currently, HiRez audio (whatever flavor) is not fully supported until HDMI ver 1.3

marcus

The 7.1 LPCM on some BD disks plays just fine with HDMI, and since all current and all planned players that we know of, will continue to decode those hirez audio codecs to 7.1 LPCM. There has been no plans to change that.

What there has been is lots of speculation in these forums and the AVR fanboys wanting to see things like TrueHD passed out of the players and decoded in the receiver. Ain't happening in the forseeable future.

What those AVRs will get is a nice logo for you to look at...

So unless you think you need 'deep color' or other such video improvement (there are exactly zero sources for that), or you have a source device that is NOT a BD or HDDVD play, you also have no need for HDMI 1.3.

Lloyd
lparsons21 is offline  
post #8 of 10 Old 06-22-2007, 04:44 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
bfdtv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 13,484
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Desert Pilot View Post

I would disagree.

If you select UNCOMPRESSED PCM (in order to get hirez audio) on the blu ray disk...the ONLY way I know of to pass this audio to a receiver is via the analog out. Currently, HiRez audio (whatever flavor) is not fully supported until HDMI ver 1.3

You are a little confused.

HDMI 1.1 will pass 7.1 multichannel LPCM. HDMI 1.3 is required to pass undecoded TrueHD and DTS-HD MA bitstreams. HDMI 1.3 is not required to pass LPCM, nor is it required to pass TrueHD or DTS-HD MA that is decoded into LPCM by the Blu-ray player.

You can't pass LPCM over analog output. LPCM is uncompressed digital audio. The LPCM signal can only be sent over digital output (i.e. HDMI). Analog outputs are, well, analog. To output uncompressed digital audio over an analog output, it must be converted to analog waveform, which is where DACs (digital to analog converters) come into play.
bfdtv is offline  
post #9 of 10 Old 06-22-2007, 07:19 PM
Advanced Member
 
MRMOTA's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 745
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Desert Pilot View Post

I would disagree.

If you select UNCOMPRESSED PCM (in order to get hirez audio) on the blu ray disk...the ONLY way I know of to pass this audio to a receiver is via the analog out. Currently, HiRez audio (whatever flavor) is not fully supported until HDMI ver 1.3

marcus

So I'm also thinking of updating my receiver as well. So regarding what you said. If I hook up my PS3 1.3 ready and I buy one of the new onkyo receivers 1.3 enabled I would be golden for uncompressed and all the latest hirez audio's correct?

Thanks
MRMOTA is offline  
post #10 of 10 Old 06-22-2007, 07:52 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
bfdtv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 13,484
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by MRMOTA View Post

So I'm also thinking of updating my receiver as well. So regarding what you said. If I hook up my PS3 1.3 ready and I buy one of the new onkyo receivers 1.3 enabled I would be golden for uncompressed and all the latest hirez audio's correct?

Thanks

You do not gain anything from a HDMI 1.3 receiver with the PS3. Once again, that poster is confused.

What you need -- with the PS3 -- is a receiver that correctly handles multichannel LPCM over HDMI. Plenty of HDMI 1.1 receivers do that. Of last year's models, I like the 2006 Denons, like the 3806.

If you aren't budget constrained, I personally would spend a little more on the new 2007 models with HDMI 1.3. Not because they have HDMI 1.3, mind you, because that doesn't do anything for the PS3. Rather, because they are improved in other areas. Specifically, I would look at the Onkyo 805/875 or the Denon 3808 and above -- call J&R Music Music World to ask about pricing on those models.

If you are budget constrained, look at the older models Denon 3806 or 4306ci. Those get replaced with the Denon 3808 and 4308 next month, so there may be some hot clearance deals on those units in the very near future.
bfdtv is offline  
Reply Blu-ray Players

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off