PS3 BLu Ray at 720p - do i need to replace this system? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 24 Old 07-25-2007, 06:14 PM - Thread Starter
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HI everyone! I have searched AVS for a topic discussing my problem but cant find anything specifically related to it.

I have the ps3 hooked up to my 720p Sony 40" lcd hdtv (XBR1) and when watching planet earth on bluray - there are noticeable artifacts all over the screen. I mean, if you sit across the room they are very much less noticeable, but the image is still clearly not perfect and looks worse then when I watched that series on Discovery HD. Setting the ps3 to output 1080i instead of 720p changes nothing - same ugliness.

I was wondering if playing blu ray movies at 1080i or 720p caused there to be artifacts from the downscaling from 1080p 24Hrz or if I was as unlucky with the ps3 as I was with the 360 (fixed three times) and if I needed to take my ps3 back to Bestbuy for a free new unit.

I have looked all over AVS forums and cant find an answer.

SO - does anyone else here have a 720p or 1080i set and a ps3. IF so, what is your expereince with watching bluray movies? The only two BR movies i own are Planet Earth series and Mi:3. Neither look much better then HD cable, with PE having a lot of artifacts and Mi:3 being rediculous overly grainy, more so then how its suppose to look with that "film grain" effect they used.

Any help would be great - i am starting to feel like i wasted $500.00
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post #2 of 24 Old 07-25-2007, 06:15 PM
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post #3 of 24 Old 07-25-2007, 06:18 PM - Thread Starter
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post #4 of 24 Old 07-25-2007, 09:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Does anyone at leas have any blue ray movies they know look perfect on a 720p tv using ps3? IF I see the same problem across several discs, then i know its the ps3 that is screwed up.
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post #5 of 24 Old 07-25-2007, 09:49 PM
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hellboy looked really good on my brother's 720p screen.

are you outputting the picture at 720p or 1080i? If 1080i switch it to 720p. You'd rather have the PS3 do the scaling.
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post #6 of 24 Old 07-25-2007, 09:56 PM
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The first question to ask is what scenes in Planet Earth are you looking at? There are some sections that are not in high definition at all due to the filming process used, and those parts are going to look ugly and pixelated no matter what you do because it's part of the source material.
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post #7 of 24 Old 07-25-2007, 10:00 PM
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People are under the impression that just because most discs are encoded @ 1080p there is something wrong with watching them on a 720p display. I can tell you that you are much better off watching on a good 720p display than a mediocre 1080p one. I have a 56" 720p DLP display and it looks excellent.

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post #8 of 24 Old 07-25-2007, 11:12 PM
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I watch Blu Ray and HD DVDs on my 720p Sony RP LCD all the time and they look great! I also have the Planet Earth series.......which looks really damn good most of the time, but sometimes it's pretty soft and grainy.......but this is due to the camera limitations. If you want to see what a near flawless Blu Ray looks like, rent or buy Pirates of the Caribbean (1 or 2) or Apocalypto.

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post #9 of 24 Old 07-25-2007, 11:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steven975 View Post

hellboy looked really good on my brother's 720p screen.

are you outputting the picture at 720p or 1080i? If 1080i switch it to 720p. You'd rather have the PS3 do the scaling.

Not neccessarily.......my Blu Ray movies look softer when I set the PS3 to 720p. It really depends on the display you're using.

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post #10 of 24 Old 07-27-2007, 04:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Icemage View Post

The first question to ask is what scenes in Planet Earth are you looking at? There are some sections that are not in high definition at all due to the filming process used, and those parts are going to look ugly and pixelated no matter what you do because it's part of the source material.

I know that the quality in that seriea can alter depending on what they shot and how - but i see artifacts in every scene - every singel one. Sometimes you have to look for them because their showing something thats busy, but they are there all the time.

bottom line, when i saw it on HD cable (which was pixiliated a little from compression over the network) it looked noticeably better then what i see when im watching the blu ray disc on my ps3. That is simply unacceptable to me - I paid $500 + $100 so it could look worse then i paid nothing to watch it? lol ew

Considering the reviews have said of what Planet Earth looks like on Blu RAy and HD DVD - I cannot imagine if they saw what i see that they would have such glowing things to say about it.

Either my paritucular copy of that is ****ed, or the ps3 is. Since I have seen the artifacts in other movies, it cant just be the disc.
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post #11 of 24 Old 07-27-2007, 05:06 PM - Thread Starter
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Overall updates

Happy Feet and The Ant Bully look noticeably better then the non-cgi movies, with Happy Feet taking the edge - but, artifacts, as much harder as they are to see, are still present. If these were the worst of any of hte movies, i would have nothing bad to say, but they are best, relativiely speaking. Happy Feet really is a beautiful movie, but nonetheless, it has artifacts.

Planet Earth, as I have said, has artifacts all the time, it does vary somewhat from scene to seen, but its either noticeable or worse - looks no where near as good as it did on cable, as I said to someone else above. I cannot understand the glowing reviews considering how it looks when i attempt to watch it. I usually just shut it off becuase being reminded i paid $100 for **** isnt fun. :-P

The Departed looks alot better then Planet Earth, but there are still noticeable artifacts - some scenes seem to be better at showing them then others, but you can still catch them at pretty mich any moment, and its quite obvious even from normal viewing distance.

If THIS is high def, then we have all been sold a terrible lie...
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post #12 of 24 Old 07-28-2007, 12:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BINARYGOD View Post

Overall updates

Happy Feet and The Ant Bully look noticeably better then the non-cgi movies, with Happy Feet taking the edge - but, artifacts, as much harder as they are to see, are still present. If these were the worst of any of hte movies, i would have nothing bad to say, but they are best, relativiely speaking. Happy Feet really is a beautiful movie, but nonetheless, it has artifacts.

Planet Earth, as I have said, has artifacts all the time, it does vary somewhat from scene to seen, but its either noticeable or worse - looks no where near as good as it did on cable, as I said to someone else above. I cannot understand the glowing reviews considering how it looks when i attempt to watch it. I usually just shut it off becuase being reminded i paid $100 for **** isnt fun. :-P

The Departed looks alot better then Planet Earth, but there are still noticeable artifacts - some scenes seem to be better at showing them then others, but you can still catch them at pretty mich any moment, and its quite obvious even from normal viewing distance.

If THIS is high def, then we have all been sold a terrible lie...

Okay, calm down man.

First off, you really need to ensure all the settings are correct on the PS3. If you TV doesn't accept a 24fps signal, make sure that setting is set to off. Here is how I would set up the PS3 if I was you:
PS3 Settings:
1080p/24fps: Off
DVD Upscale: Normal
Force Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr instead of RGB
RGB: Full (if this looks bad, change to limited)
Super White: On

Also, rule out your connection cables, especially since you said you see it with other movies.

Finally, make sure there isn't a TV setting that is screwing things up or that may resolve the issue. I know that on my Pioneer 5080HD, if I don't put it into Cinema Advance Mode I see judder on blue ray content. But when enabled the judder goes completely away.

Good luck and keep us posted.

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post #13 of 24 Old 07-29-2007, 08:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

Okay, calm down man.

First off, you really need to ensure all the settings are correct on the PS3. If you TV doesn't accept a 24fps signal, make sure that setting is set to off. Here is how I would set up the PS3 if I was you:
PS3 Settings:
1080p/24fps: Off
DVD Upscale: Normal
Force Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr instead of RGB
RGB: Full (if this looks bad, change to limited)
Super White: On

Also, rule out your connection cables, especially since you said you see it with other movies.

Finally, make sure there isn't a TV setting that is screwing things up or that may resolve the issue. I know that on my Pioneer 5080HD, if I don't put it into Cinema Advance Mode I see judder on blue ray content. But when enabled the judder goes completely away.

Good luck and keep us posted.

I have played around with the ps3 settings and made sure that they are the best that i can get them; switching cables does nothing; and i have played with my tv settings plenty of times to ensure maximum picture and color quality.

I really dont see what else I can do here.

The last test is the hook the ps3 up to my brothers set using a third cable - if i still see this; bestbuy gives me a new ps3, if i dont, then i hate life

I will post what is the final outcome sometime today!
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post #14 of 24 Old 07-29-2007, 05:52 PM
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are you standing in front of your tv, trying really hard to find "artifacts" or what?

i bet nothing will change with your new ps3 too, it doesnt seem to be hardware issue...

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post #15 of 24 Old 07-29-2007, 06:06 PM
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Please describe the artifacts you are seeing with more detail. Are they like boxes? Are they rounded, like False Contouring or Banding? Are you seeing Mosquito Noise?

I will say that I find that digital sources put out a horrid amount of False Contouring / Banding through HDMI on my TV. It has been shown that some TVs just don't do HDMI well. It's NOT like DVI. The added "copysafe features" of HDMI muck up a lot of things when done incorrectly, and here's news for you -- many incompatibilities can result, causing problems from banding to screen door, etc.

People are being trained to assume that HDMI is the be-all-end-all digital connection of the gods.... it's not there yet, IMHO. Problems exist. DVI was wonderful, but alas, it would never gain footing because movie companies and microsoft saw it as a threat, and HDMI as an answer to one day ending copyright issues (or at least, making it much more difficult).

I have to run component from my PS3 to my LG TV, because my TV's HDMI sucks. It is a newer set, but either has some kind of compatibility issue with the PS3, or just can't do HDMI worth a damn. I get much better video through component. I think the culprit is that LG just "tacked on" HDMI without having it go through the regular processing it should when scaling. Whatever it is, HDMI looks like crapola due to excessive banding and screen door coming from my PS3. It's a 768p set (1366x768 downscaling a 1080i signal).

My same PS3 with the same cable looks just fine though my girlfriend's Samsung 768p set.

One more thing -- digital satellite TV can look like utter crap, too, with tons of banding. My sister's Polaroid looks that way. I fault this whole HDMI thing and how there doesn't seem to be any quality control governing compatibility between manufacturers.

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post #16 of 24 Old 07-29-2007, 06:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spwolf View Post

are you standing in front of your tv, trying really hard to find "artifacts" or what?

i bet nothing will change with your new ps3 too, it doesnt seem to be hardware issue...

Awww, did my issues with this ps3 bother you??? Get a life...

Your post doesnt warrant much more of a reply then that.
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post #17 of 24 Old 07-29-2007, 06:41 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Baccusboy View Post

Please describe the artifacts you are seeing with more detail. Are they like boxes? Are they rounded, like False Contouring or Banding? Are you seeing Mosquito Noise?

I will say that I find that digital sources put out a horrid amount of False Contouring / Banding through HDMI on my TV. It has been shown that some TVs just don't do HDMI well. It's NOT like DVI. The added "copysafe features" of HDMI muck up a lot of things when done incorrectly, and here's news for you -- many incompatibilities can result, causing problems from banding to screen door, etc.

People are being trained to assume that HDMI is the be-all-end-all digital connection of the gods.... it's not there yet, IMHO. Problems exist. DVI was wonderful, but alas, it would never gain footing because movie companies and microsoft saw it as a threat, and HDMI as an answer to one day ending copyright issues (or at least, making it much more difficult).

I have to run component from my PS3 to my LG TV, because my TV's HDMI sucks. It is a newer set, but either has some kind of compatibility issue with the PS3, or just can't do HDMI worth a damn. I get much better video through component. I think the culprit is that LG just "tacked on" HDMI without having it go through the regular processing it should when scaling. Whatever it is, HDMI looks like crapola due to excessive banding and screen door coming from my PS3. It's a 768p set (1366x768 downscaling a 1080i signal).

My same PS3 with the same cable looks just fine though my girlfriend's Samsung 768p set.

One more thing -- digital satellite TV can look like utter crap, too, with tons of banding. My sister's Polaroid looks that way. I fault this whole HDMI thing and how there doesn't seem to be any quality control governing compatibility between manufacturers.

The issues persist across multiple tv's and cables in my own residence. I have double checked with some people who have the same tv as me over at a gaming forum, and they don't have these issues. People who has the same BR movies i do don't see these issues. You can see them from normal and beyond viewing distances. Other people see nothing when they press their nose to the screen. I also have mty cable box hooked up to the tv through the hdmi port and that doesnt have these issues, just the regular grainyness that cable always has.

If its not a minor flaw in my particular ps3 - I don't really see what else it could be. It certainly isnt beyond possible that out of the millions of ps3's, there aren't a couple screwed ones. Apparently thats hard from people to swallow.

Thanks for your reply, though. It's certainly better that some other people who either think that i am lieing or a complete AV imbecile who wouldn't know an obvious artifact if he was pissing on one. I am actually suppose to define what an artifact is?

Anyway, for the amount we are all spending on HD - I would think that i SHOULD be able to press my nose against the screen and still be satisifed; nevermind that this cannot be achieved from across the room.

Bestbuy replaces this baby for free , no questions asked (unless it broke and it was totally my fault), so after I pick my new car up from the dealer tomarrow, its ruight to bestbuy for a free new ps3.

And just in case, i will pick up the ps3 component cables proprietary connection too.

EDIT - I am not comming back into this thread - this case is closed.
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post #18 of 24 Old 07-30-2007, 08:16 AM
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Even though you aren't coming back into the thread, I will say that I agree with your final analysis. You ruled out everything else, so the next logical step is the PS3. I do hope it fixes your issues!

Take care.

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post #19 of 24 Old 07-30-2007, 02:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BINARYGOD View Post

Awww, did my issues with this ps3 bother you??? Get a life...

Your post doesnt warrant much more of a reply then that.

good luck with the attitude thing, you will need it...

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post #20 of 24 Old 08-01-2007, 10:26 AM
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post #21 of 24 Old 08-01-2007, 10:32 AM
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I'm betting that this turns out to a be a case of that terrible 'ID-10-T' error.
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post #22 of 24 Old 08-01-2007, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by morgan1112 View Post

I'm betting that this turns out to a be a case of that terrible 'ID-10-T' error.

hahahaha
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post #23 of 24 Old 08-01-2007, 12:47 PM
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Unfortunately I have to say that I am seeing something similar with a PS3 I just bought. The most recent example of this is on the just released "300" movie. I only have 2 bluray discs as of now and both have this very noisy picture quality to them. The best way to describe it is if you are looking at a bowl of maggits squirming around very fast inside of an otherwise sharp picture. I don't see this with SD DVD's or the only game I have so far which is RB6: Vegas. I also have a 720P projector. Is this what is termed "mosquito noise"? The other BR disc I have is Casino Royale. PS3 going into a Monoprice HDMI switcher then to the projector. I don't see this phenomenon with any other source or material. I thought I saw this mentioned in another post somewhere and cannot find it now.
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post #24 of 24 Old 08-02-2007, 06:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by morgan1112 View Post

I'm betting that this turns out to a be a case of that terrible 'ID-10-T' error.

LMAO!
Quote:
Originally Posted by J dog View Post

Unfortunately I have to say that I am seeing something similar with a PS3 I just bought. The most recent example of this is on the just released "300" movie. I only have 2 bluray discs as of now and both have this very noisy picture quality to them. The best way to describe it is if you are looking at a bowl of maggits squirming around very fast inside of an otherwise sharp picture. I don't see this with SD DVD's or the only game I have so far which is RB6: Vegas. I also have a 720P projector. Is this what is termed "mosquito noise"? The other BR disc I have is Casino Royale. PS3 going into a Monoprice HDMI switcher then to the projector. I don't see this phenomenon with any other source or material. I thought I saw this mentioned in another post somewhere and cannot find it now.

I too noticed this on the BR version of 300. However, I think this is how the movie was shot, an "on purpose" sort of thing to make it more comic book like. I even remember thinking the same thing when I saw the flick at the movie theater. I am pretty sure it's not the PS3.

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