Panasonic BD30 comes with RCA cables? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 25 Old 01-13-2008, 08:10 PM - Thread Starter
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I just got my new Panny BD30 and was unpacking it from the box when I stumbled across a set of cables in the bottom of the box. Not an HDMI cable like I was hoping for just a brand new set of RCA connections. Yep, good old red, white and yellow.

Why would Panasonic do this?

1. They think this is the best connection for their player.
2. They think no one buying a blu-ray player has an HDTV.
3. 1995 was a big year for them and they have a warehouse full of them.

Anyone?

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post #2 of 25 Old 01-13-2008, 08:34 PM
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4. The retailers love selling the customer a $100 HDMI cable

And Panasonic wants to keep their retailers happy.
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post #3 of 25 Old 01-13-2008, 09:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miata View Post

4. The retailers love selling the customer a $100 HDMI cable

And Panasonic wants to keep their retailers happy.

I think OP is talking about, if they aren't including an HDMI cable then why include anything at all? It's not like anyone who buys a BR player will really use RCA cables.
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post #4 of 25 Old 01-13-2008, 10:33 PM
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Apart from the Costco Sony S301, no other BD players, nor the PS3, as far as I'm aware of, include one, so it's not a Panasonic specific issue.

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post #5 of 25 Old 01-13-2008, 11:28 PM
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I think this is one of the most damaging things these high definition manufactures are doing to themselves. So many times I hear from people, Blu-ray/HD DVD/PS3 doesn't look better than standard dvd. I always follow-up with what cable are you using? What is the typical response, the one it came with. Is it a big deal for these companies to throw in a cheap HDMI cable? It might help prevent some returns because I know a lot of people who return these players because they used RCA cables, didn't see a difference, and thought they were throwing out their money.
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post #6 of 25 Old 01-13-2008, 11:41 PM
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These same companies often sell a $60 HDMI cable.

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post #7 of 25 Old 01-14-2008, 06:55 AM
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In my younger years I worked for Canon.

When USB printers first hit the market Canon began including usb cables. While parallel cables are rather expensive and most consumers already had one it made sense to include a parallel cable. Our cost for a 6 foot usb cable in bulk was about $0.80.

Virtually every big box store refused to carry the printer. I remember BB specifically changed their wholesale selection policy to specifically exclude any printer than included an connection cable. The model was yanked and model number changed slightly and re-issued without a usb cable.

I have no proof but I am positive this continues for CE devices and component/HDMI cables. The Toshiba HD-A3 has no HDMI cable. The Toshiba HD-D3 which is the exact same product and same MSRP is only sold at costco and does incude an HDMI cable.

Costco = looking for best value for their consumers
BB/CC/Frys/etc = know they have more profit margins on a $200 Monster cable which performs identically to a $4 monoprice cable than on the player itself.
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post #8 of 25 Old 01-14-2008, 07:37 AM
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I've never understood this either... Why include the composite cables... At least put component in there, that should at least keep the retailers possible... I also don't even understand why BR and HD DVD players have s-video, or component outputs... Who in there right mind would pay that kind of money for a BR player and then hook it up with those outputs?

Over Christmas I was at my inlaws house who just bought a new panny plasma and a up converting HTIB... My step-father-in-law was telling me about the deal he got from Circuit City, saying he bought 2 Monster HDMI cables, because that was what was recommended to him... The funny thing was is that the salesperson told him to get a more expensive HDMI cable for the upconverting DVD player then for the cable box...

I told him to immediately take those cables back and order a couple for $10 on monoprice... (I also told him he didn't need the $450 extended warranty, he got on the TV, but I guess somepeople think a piece of mind is worth that much)... I haven't talked to him since, to see if he took my advice, but I'd guess he probably didn't... It's a shame how the retailers take advantage of the unknowing consumer when it comes to cables...

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post #9 of 25 Old 01-14-2008, 07:39 AM
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Back in the 70s there was a big consumer stink about audio components (cassette decks, turntables, and such at the time) not including the cables necessary to alow them to work.

I'm hazy on the details, but I believe there was an agreement reached at the time (with the FTC?) that henceforth AV equipment would be supplied with the minimum cabling necessary to coneect it to the consermer's system.

Thus the AV cable in an HD player box. It's the minimum necessary. I agree that it's actually counterproductive.

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post #10 of 25 Old 01-14-2008, 07:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thane11 View Post

I just got my new Panny BD30 and was unpacking it from the box when I stumbled across a set of cables in the bottom of the box. Not an HDMI cable like I was hoping for just a brand new set of RCA connections. Yep, good old red, white and yellow.

Why would Panasonic do this?

1. They think this is the best connection for their player.
2. They think no one buying a blu-ray player has an HDTV.
3. 1995 was a big year for them and they have a wherehouse full of them.

Anyone?

I just got my unit the other day, and thought the EXACT same thing. GOof timing- funny!

2 reasons

1) dirt cheap
2) retailers need cable sales
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post #11 of 25 Old 01-14-2008, 10:11 AM - Thread Starter
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In Best Buy this week looking at cables last week. The cheapest HDMI cable they had was $60, and one of them run to over $100. Now tell me if I'm wrong but, doesn't HDMI carry a digital signal so there's not a real need for the expensive trapings of analog cables (gold tips, copper this, oxygen free).

To make matters worse they didn't have an AR HDMI cable (Accoustic Research is my preferred brand of cable). I ended up getting a no name HDMI Cable on Amazon for $12.

So here's my question to all you cable snobs, do you still pay 5x, 10x for premium cable with HDMI?

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post #12 of 25 Old 01-14-2008, 11:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thane11 View Post

In Best Buy this week looking at cables last week. The cheapest HDMI cable they had was $60, and one of them run to over $100. Now tell me if I'm wrong but, doesn't HDMI carry a digital signal so there's not a real need for the expensive trapings of analog cables (gold tips, copper this, oxygen free).

To make matters worse they didn't have an AR HDMI cable (Accoustic Research is my preferred brand of cable). I ended up getting a no name HDMI Cable on Amazon for $12.

So here's my question to all you cable snobs, do you still pay 5x, 10x for premium cable with HDMI?

I won't and I always (and still do) pay a premium for analog cables.

The cable doesn't know/care what "kind" of digital is going down the line. We have had cheap DVI cable for computers, cheap usb cables, cheap SATA cables, cheap firewire cables for years.

By cheap I don't mean poor quality they simply meet the standard. Look at ethernet. Cat5e rated to push gigabit ethernet costs about $0.07 per foot. Could you imagine if monster tried to sell Monster Ethernet cable to businesses for $20.00+ per foot? They would be laughed out of the building.

The same thing applies to HDMI. I buy cables from monoprice for $5-$10 and have never had a problem.

My brother once worked at BB and the markup on cables is 500%-1,000%. You are buying a $10 cable and handing BB a $100 bill in profit. This is the single reason why no HD DVD / BD / DVD / Tivo / SACD or any other CE device will EVER have a HDMI cable in the box and be sold at BB/CC/Frys/etc.
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post #13 of 25 Old 01-14-2008, 01:54 PM
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Panasonic's dvds77 upconverting player includes an HDMI cable in the box.
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post #14 of 25 Old 01-14-2008, 02:52 PM
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One of the cheap RCA upconverting DVD players from Walmart included cheap HDMI cable too. It was ok - but I ended up returning the DVD player because it was crap!! Apple sells the AppleTV with no cable whatsoever - which is better than including RCA cables!! The only nice thing is Apple's website actually sells HDMI cables for $20 - which is better than those $60 cables that BB tries to sell. Still, with Apple's clout, they should just sell the AppleTV with the $20 cable in the box and not charge the buyer anything. If there is any company that can change retail policy it it is Apple if and when it gets a hot item to sell.
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post #15 of 25 Old 01-14-2008, 03:00 PM
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I pay 6 bucks for my hdmi cables from firefold.com and they actually carry 1080p and dtsma. Imagine that.

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post #16 of 25 Old 01-15-2008, 10:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdclark View Post

Back in the 70s there was a big consumer stink about audio components (cassette decks, turntables, and such at the time) not including the cables necessary to alow them to work.

I'm hazy on the details, but I believe there was an agreement reached at the time (with the FTC?) that henceforth AV equipment would be supplied with the minimum cabling necessary to coneect it to the consermer's system.

Thus the AV cable in an HD player box. It's the minimum necessary. I agree that it's actually counterproductive.

Yup. Lowest common denominator.

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post #17 of 25 Old 01-15-2008, 11:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bommai View Post

... If there is any company that can change retail policy it it is Apple if and when it gets a hot item to sell.


True. Just ask all those early iPhone buyers who got shafted when Apple dropped its price by 30% after only 4 months on the market. Although Apple did offer a $100 refund to them, I personally don't feel it quite made up for Steve Jobs' backhanding. Nope, I don't have an iPhone, and never wanted one. I just feel it was a bad way to treat their "initial buzz" customers.

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post #18 of 25 Old 01-15-2008, 11:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolls-Royce View Post

True. Just ask all those early iPhone buyers who got shafted when Apple dropped its price by 30% after only 4 months on the market. Although Apple did offer a $100 refund to them, I personally don't feel it quite made up for Steve Jobs' backhanding. Nope, I don't have an iPhone, and never wanted one. I just feel it was a bad way to treat their "initial buzz" customers.

What does this have to do with the tea in China... Oh wait, when I bought some Tea over there I felt I got shafted because there bags where too small and the tea tasted water down.. How about a Snickers health bar or just
candy bars in general, shorten them and still charge the same price.. I mean we can really waste bandwidth discussing this....

Now to address the cheap cables included, they could have at least put in some decent Component cables...
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post #19 of 25 Old 01-15-2008, 01:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Garman View Post

What does this have to do with the tea in China... Oh wait, when I bought some Tea over there I felt I got shafted because there bags where too small and the tea tasted water down.. How about a Snickers health bar or just
candy bars in general, shorten them and still charge the same price.. I mean we can really waste bandwidth discussing this....

Now to address the cheap cables included, they could have at least put in some decent Component cables...

Nothing. I don't drink tea.

I was just responding to a previous comment about Apple being able to influence market behavior. Sorry for going off-topic. We now return to our regularly-scheduled topic...

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post #20 of 25 Old 01-15-2008, 03:18 PM
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Somewhere in the owner's manual is the comment:

We recommend you use a Panasonic HDMI cable.

Says it all
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post #21 of 25 Old 01-15-2008, 05:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arkiedan View Post

Somewhere in the owner's manual is the comment:

We recommend you use a Panasonic HDMI cable.

Says it all

It's because Panasonic's cables have apparently been "tested" for use with their players. It's too bad that all cables that meet the HDMI specification will provide identical performance.
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post #22 of 25 Old 01-15-2008, 08:43 PM
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As silly as it may seem, sometimes there is a use for those RCA connected composite and two channel audio cables. Being able to setup the player on any display can eliminate frustrations that may occur when HDMI handshakes or the like prevent seeing anything at all. With the composite connection at least the customer can be sure that it is not some setting which prevents output on the HDMI or whatever.

The lack of an HDMI cable is just plain dumb.

My XA1 came with an HDMI cable, my Series three Tivo boxes came with an HDMI and component cables, my XA2s NOPE. By the time I got my XA2 Best Buy was selling the HD DVD product. So it is probably Best Buy that asked CEs to not package the correct cables with the player.

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post #23 of 25 Old 01-16-2008, 07:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HT Nut View Post

The lack of an HDMI cable is just plain dumb.

It doesn't bother me as long as I'm not paying for it. Good quality HDMI cables are still not cheap enough , even at wholesale, to just write off. And how many installations can be accommodated by a 3-foot cable? That would be too short for many, yet 3' HDMI cable is a hell of a thing to let go to waste.

The injustice of cable prices at the box stores is indeed galling, and I would applaud electronics manufacturers including HDMI cables as a way to keep buyers from feeling forced to pay those prices. But protecting consumers from avaricious retailers is not the manufacturers' job. It's the consumer's job to understand what he's buying.

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post #24 of 25 Old 01-16-2008, 09:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by namechamps View Post

BB/CC/Frys/etc = know they have more profit margins on a $200 Monster cable which performs identically to a $4 monoprice cable than on the player itself.

In fact, DVD players of any type have such small margins as to make it pointless to sell them as standalone items.

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post #25 of 25 Old 01-20-2008, 07:41 PM - Thread Starter
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