New Theater Design Concept - Feedback Requested - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 15 Old 06-26-2011, 03:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi everyone - I've been reading through the forum for awhile now and come up with a couple of ideas for my home theater set up I'm considering building. I'd love to get input on these, as well as better ideas for how to set up my theater. I'm considering an Epson 8700UB project and an Elite ezFrame Fixed Frame. I'm debating the size of the screen, but would like something in the 100" to 120", which is really pushing it in the small room size. Points I'm considering:
  • Which wall to put the screen on?
  • How to configure furniture
  • Thoughts on a best projector/screen for small room size
  • I'll be driving my audio with an Onkyo TX-SR707, so any suggestions on speakers, especially in wall are welcome

Thanks in advance!
Option #1

Option #2
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post #2 of 15 Old 06-27-2011, 06:08 AM
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If I understand the diagram you won't do well with a 10ft 6in room width.

The PJ will take up about 1.5ft which would net you only about a 9ft throw. Same with seating and with that sofa your eyeball to screen distance would be less than 9ft. I wouldn't want to sit that close to a 60in television much less a projection screen with a larger image.

In our first room - 14ft wide - throw was 12.5ft - we sat along the wall under the shelf mounted projector - eyeball to screen was about 12 ft - image was about 100in diagonal - it worked well and in that sized room at that distance we achieved a decent "at the movies" visual experience.

Our current image is about 120in diagonal with eyeballs about 14.5ft from the screen and I could probably increase the image size a bit without a problem.

I think you should go the length of your room instead of that small width.
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post #3 of 15 Old 06-28-2011, 07:53 PM
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Length +1.

A 54x96" DIY AT screen up front is a possiblity. The door up front, is AT space accessibility.

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post #4 of 15 Old 06-28-2011, 08:17 PM
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i agree with the others that option #2 will be hard for the projector throw. I do like the seating and speaker arrangement in #2 but you would have to find a projector that would work with that throw if there even is one.
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post #5 of 15 Old 06-29-2011, 04:45 AM
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AT screen and front wall.

You could black out the front of the room with an acoustically transparent screen. Keep the seating area more flexible in color
choices. The area under the stairs could make house the equipment rack.
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post #6 of 15 Old 06-29-2011, 08:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks everyone for the input!

I like the idea of the AT screen - I do have flexibility to install speakers behind the screen in the unfinished part of the basement. I would have to cover the door with the screen and do something to cover up the bottom of the door, but that wouldn't be too hard. I will think through the potential of just building a new wall for the screen and speakers in front of the door.

One thought on option #2 that has the shorter throw... I can actually mount the project in the unfinished area and shoot through a hole in the wall to get almost 11' of throw. According to the projector calculator using the Epson 8700UB (what I think I want), that throw should be OK to get around 100".

I am leaning towards putting the screen on the long side of the room though.

Thanks Tedd for the new design option picture and the PM, I checked out the links. The Pocoloco theater helped me visualize how an "L" couch would look in a HT setup. Question on the Seymour screens... are those better than an Elite EZframe screen? I had my eye on one of those.
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post #7 of 15 Old 07-24-2011, 07:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Resurrecting this thread, we have now moved into the house and I've had alot more time to study the layout of the theater room. I have posted some photos of the room and an updated design layout that I'm considering.

My biggest concerns at this point are:

1) Height of room is only 6' 9" - will that impact a ceiling mounted projector? Considering Epson 8700UB.

2) Do I need to extend the wall on the right side to close off the room? Wife wants it left open.

3) Speaker distance from listener's ear on the left and right surround channels, especially the left side - very little distance.

4) Viewing distance - am I leaving enough distance for a 115ish inch screen?

Appreciate any guidance on these questions or any others from the group!

Updated Floor Plan (Option 3)


Back of Theater looking to Front


Screen Wall & Circuit Box


Front of theater looking back


Looking into back of theater room from opening at back right
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post #8 of 15 Old 07-24-2011, 10:00 AM
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Reminds me of koach's room:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1065426

1) Height of room is only 6' 9" - will that impact a ceiling mounted projector? Considering Epson 8700UB.

-Yes it will. You want to make sure the projector doesn't end up over the second row of seating/aisle space where heads and projector will compete for headroom. A short throw projector might be one option.

2) Do I need to extend the wall on the right side to close off the room? Wife wants it left open.

- The room's shape isn't perfect anyways, so it could be left open. Has the Mrs considered the noise escaping the theater area?

3) Speaker distance from listener's ear on the left and right surround channels, especially the left side - very little distance.

-Explore in ceiling surround speaker options? With that space, surround speakers are going to be close and that's a given.

4) Viewing distance - am I leaving enough distance for a 115ish inch screen?

-I think you are leaving too much viewing distance. And maybe slightly too big a screen. You need to draw a sightline diagram (side view) to plot the seats, riser, projector. Remember the rear row needs to see the bottom of the screen. With the low ceiling height, there'll be few workable solutions and lots of poorly working layouts. I suggets you start planning with your seating and not with the screen size.

The sole 6' 9" high theater I've been in, had a 5" riser, and offset seats with 2 seats in the front row, and three on a small island style riser. The projector where you have it drawn, is right in the headroom of the pathway of the second row of seating. You also might shrink the distance between the seats (and go with non reclining seats for the second row. I'd also recommend low backs eating.)

An AT screen could also hide the electrical panel.

So what's on the other side of the wall where you have the media rack drawn? I suspect the furnance is there centrally located, but could the side wall be moved over, to widen the room.
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post #9 of 15 Old 08-01-2011, 09:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Tedd, I've been putting a huge amount of thought into your last post, thank you!

I took your advice and planned my seating first, built a crude sightline diagram, then adjusted screen size to what I think will work. Some key points:

- Selected Seatcraft Rialto Home Theater seats since they offer a 39.5" "middle row" height and 48" "back row" height. Avoids need for riser, which with the low 6' 9" ceiling is good. Their "Front" row is way too low so I'm starting with the middle.

- Is this crude sightline diagram even valid? I used a tool that was not designed for the purpose but it felt like it gave me what I needed.

- I drew to the top of seat height, I suppose that it probably should be higher to get the actual viewline, but I assumed it would be the same amount on both the front row and back so it's a wash.

- Using this diagram, I found that the approx. 120" screen would be too low and the back row sightline interrupted. By going down to a 106" screen, the back row sightline clears the front row, but not by much.

- I left 36" between the rows, any thoughts on moving the back row up or front row back to create more sightline clearance?

- Viewing distance calculator at http://myhometheater.homestead.com/v...alculator.html shows a viewing angle of 38.6 degrees, which seems within reason from what I've read. It also shows THX Recommended screen size of 81.2 inches (NOT LIKING THAT). The back row would be close to ideal at 106" based on this calculator.

Thanks for any feedback!

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post #10 of 15 Old 08-02-2011, 03:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kelton325 View Post

Selected Seatcraft Rialto Home Theater seats since they offer a 39.5" "middle row" height and 48" "back row" height. Avoids need for riser, which with the low 6' 9" ceiling is good. Their "Front" row is way too low so I'm starting with the middle.

- Is this crude sightline diagram even valid? I used a tool that was not designed for the purpose but it felt like it gave me what I needed.

- I left 36" between the rows, any thoughts on moving the back row up or front row back to create more sightline clearance?

Seatcraft's 3-row seating diagram shows row pitch at 70" (almost 6'). Yours are half that. Have you checked what happens when the rear seats are fully reclined with feet overhanging? Maybe they included a couple feet for walkway, which may not be necessary in a friendly theater, but no matter how friendly, no one wants their seatbacks kicked.

Quote:


- I drew to the top of seat height, I suppose that it probably should be higher to get the actual viewline, but I assumed it would be the same amount on both the front row and back so it's a wash.

Not quite. Let's say the seat tops align with tops of heads. The eyeballs in the rear seats are 6" below that. That defines the sightline.

Quote:


- Using this diagram, I found that the approx. 120" screen would be too low and the back row sightline interrupted. By going down to a 106" screen, the back row sightline clears the front row, but not by much.

And if you consider the eyeballs and any extra clearance for recliners, that could change further.

Quote:


Viewing distance calculator ... shows a viewing angle of 38.6 degrees, which seems within reason from what I've read. It also shows THX Recommended screen size of 81.2 inches (NOT LIKING THAT). The back row would be close to ideal at 106" based on this calculator.

That calculator is a little odd. Ignore that 81" advice. In reality, the back row and front row would all like the same full image size, say 40-45 deg. THX is saying that the farthest recommended seat in the cinema should not be less than 36 deg. THX farthest acceptable (back row) is 26 deg.

I have 2 rows of seats, 10' and 14' from a 106" diag screen. That gives 42 and 31 deg, respectively. If I had it to do over, I would move the seats a foot closer, but it's darned nice as it is.

Final thought to underscore one of the many good ideas Tedd provided. The AT screen will help the center speaker immensely by raising it up, as otherwise it will be even lower than the bottom of the screen, making it hard to hear from the back row.

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post #11 of 15 Old 08-02-2011, 04:32 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks Roger!

A follow up question.... How did you calculate the 70" spacing between rows? Looking At the seat dimensions, It appeared to me I need 25" for the back row recliner foot rest, plus foot room, which which I allowed 11" to get me to the 3 foot spacing between rows. The front row when reclined would hang over the back row person's feet, is that a concern? I was assuming (maybe badly) that the overhang wouldn't be so low as to risk getting kicked from behind.
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post #12 of 15 Old 08-02-2011, 05:08 AM
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It's not really a wash when the ceiling height is so limited.


Graph paper, ruler, and pencil, and proper measurements are adequate tools for the job. You need to plot seated eyes for the second row and tops of head for the first row. The idea is for the second row to see the bottom of the screen.


Some tricks to help: Spacing the seating rows closer, helps with the sightlines. The second row won't be able to recline though. Offset seating can help if the screen width isn't huge. And an island style riser can help with low ceilings.

You also need to watch carefully the projector's throw and that it doesn't compete for headroom. With a low ceiling, tweaking inches is important.

Screen is listed at 52" high and 106" diagonal? Is that correct? A 16:9 106" screen is 52x92". Are you planning to use zoom for scope?


The THX specs are being pushed these days by many, these days. I personally feel they are a little dated due to improved brightness of projectors and better source resolution.
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post #13 of 15 Old 08-02-2011, 06:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks Ted - the 52x92 dimensions are what I'm looking at (ezFrame Elite 106" AT)

I am also looking at a Zoom factor of 1.70x using an Epson 8700ub according to the calculator at:

http://www.projectorcentral.com/Epso...calculator.htm.

On headroom, based on your earlier advice about head room, which I totally did not think about, I did make adjustments to my floor layout to move the projector above the front row. I read several posts with similar setups where this worked out OK. I was also thinking about recessing the ceiling a inch or two to help out.

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post #14 of 15 Old 08-05-2011, 08:12 PM - Thread Starter
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I have been thinking through wall covering options, previously was leaning towards fabric walls, however now considering having drywall installed. I currently have a drop ceiling, which I've gotten advice will "leak sound like a sieve". I would like to get reasonable sound containment, but I am nowhere near an audiophile so as long as I'm not booming my wife out of bed, I'll be satisfied. I attached a few pics of my ceiling situation currently hidden by my drop ceiling. I'm concerned that mounting drywall will be a challenge due to all of the pipes and ducts - in these pictures you can see drain pipes, air conditioner compressor pipes, a large duct, and a gas line that all run the length of my future theater room and are below joist level. I would have to frame out the entire ceiling area down to a point that would cover all of that, correct? Re-routing the pipes is not something I think is realistic.

I am interested on recommendations on how bad a drywall install will be given this reality. I will be hiring the work out since I swore off drywall after one basement re-model that took months just to make it through theh taping/mudding/sanding stage. My fear is that I will get killed on cost due to all the framing needed to make the ceiling mountable.



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post #15 of 15 Old 08-05-2011, 10:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kelton325 View Post

Thanks Roger!

A follow up question.... How did you calculate the 70" spacing between rows?

I just took it from their diagram. It's in the lower right square here.

One other way to beat the low ceiling issue is to use a 2.40 screen. Then, to project CIH images, you need a cooperative PJ such as the Panny PT4000 or JVC units, which have remote zoom. The the bottom of the screen us up higher, relaxing the riser height or row pitch issues.

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