Weird Audio-Visual Desynchronization Issue, looking for any solutions! - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 12 Old 08-11-2012, 10:08 AM - Thread Starter
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Hey Everyone,

I apologize if this isn't in the right place. I have an Onkyo Ht-S3500 sound system out in the living room http://*******/RB7Gog, and a Sony Bravia T.V http://*******/RB8nho. I've been trying to play games out there from my computer in an adjacent room, to that end I have a Nvidia Geforce 460 Graphics card, and a SB Recon Pcie sound card, with an hdmi cable going from the graphics card to the onkyo receiver and a SPDIF/toslink cable going from the sound card to the receiver.

I get this weird audio visual desynchronization issue with anything I play on the T.V (movies, games, anything). I can 'fix' this by adjusting the AV setting on the onkyo receiver to around -170MS. However, it was only recently that I started trying to play games out there. As it turns out, the receiver only supports 1080i, and 30hz seems pretty low for gaming on, so I switched the hdmi cable over to the T.V which gives me full 1080p.

The problem is that when I do this I can no longer adjust the AV setting on the receiver to a negative amount, it only lets me set it positive, the result being that the lips and the voices are way off (as well as every other sound). I've tried adjusting the speaker distance config in the system to fake a delay, but it just doesn't help enough. My brain isn't really working anymore after 8 hours of working on this, is there something I'm missing or any other solution out there?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

- Adam
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post #2 of 12 Old 08-11-2012, 11:14 AM
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The delay is in the TV as it does video processing - if the TV has a "game mode", use that. Also, try turning off anything about "motion flow" or whatever it is that Sony calls it (the frame interpolation stuff used in the same sentence as 120/240Hz, etc.). That will reduce or eliminate the video delay, hopefully enough to avoid using the other settings...

That receiver should support 1080p just fine - if the Bravia is new, it should support the HDMI Lip Sync feature, too, which would also help. Although if you're setting all of these, they may interact and cause some odd results. See the Onkyo manual about how all this works...

Hope that helps,

Jeff


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post #3 of 12 Old 08-11-2012, 12:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Jeff,

Thanks for the reply, I do have the TV set to game mode, and it doesn't have a motion flow setting because this is the 60hz version of the T.v not 120hz (unless you're talking about a emulated 120hz thing, in which case I still don't see it anywhere.

As to 1080p, my video card is detecting the receiver as having a native resolution of 1920x1080 with a refresh rate of 30hz, whenever I change that to 60, the TV doesn't receive the picture at all (unless I plug the hdmi cable directly into TV). I've tried this with every 1080p resolution, not just 1920x1080 and got the same result every time.

Unfortunately, the TV is a few years old, so it doesn't seem to have a lip sync feature. Also, I just realized that those bitly links didn't post correctly, this is the link for the onkyo sound system http://www.intl.onkyo.com/products/system_components/home_theater/ht-s3500/index.html and here is the link for my specific TV. http://store.sony.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10551&storeId=10151&langId=-1&partNumber=KDL46EX400#specifications

Thanks,

- Adam
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post #4 of 12 Old 08-11-2012, 01:41 PM
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Well the receiver should pass 1080p fine, so there's something going on... Set the Onkyo to HDMI papas though and see if that makes any difference. Also look up any HDMI issues with that video card and ensure you're running the latest drivers...

Also turn off any HDMI control or CEC just to get everything out of the way...

Jeff


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post #5 of 12 Old 08-11-2012, 02:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Jeff,

Thanks again! Are you sure it should pass 1080p? On the onkyo page that I linked you, if you click on specifications it has this line "HDTV-Capable (720p/1080i) Component Video Switching (2 Inputs and 1 Output)" Am I just reading that wrong?

In any case, I turned off HDMI control on both the receiver and the T.V, I set it to HDMI Pass through and still no luck with 1080p. My video card drivers are up to date, and it does export 1080p to the T.V directly.

What/Where is CEC?

Thanks!

Adam
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post #6 of 12 Old 08-11-2012, 04:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captroper View Post

Jeff,
Thanks again! Are you sure it should pass 1080p? On the onkyo page that I linked you, if you click on specifications it has this line "HDTV-Capable (720p/1080i) Component Video Switching (2 Inputs and 1 Output)" Am I just reading that wrong?

That would be "component video" - we're talking about HDMI.
The receiver supports HDMI v1.4 features like ARC and lip sync, and even mentions 3D pas-through, so there's just no way it doesn't support 1080p...

Do you have another 1080p source or can you borrow one (any Blu-ray player, for example)? Hooking PC's up to AVR's is probably the most common source of compatibility issues as the two worlds collide... Actually, did you say you tried 1080p/30? That may be the problem - try 1080p/60 or 1080p/24.

Also, how long are the cables involved? And when you say you get no picture on the TV, do you get audio through the receiver?
Quote:
What/Where is CEC?

The HDMI Consumer Electronics Control protocol, which does automatic switching and settings and so forth. When troubleshooting, we want to turn off as many "automatic" things as possible to narrow down where the issues are...

Jeff


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post #7 of 12 Old 08-11-2012, 04:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Jeff,

I apologize, I was reading that as two seperate lines as in "HDTV Capable" and "Component Video Switching" Thanks for the clarification. I currently have it set to 1080i 30, I haven't tried 1080p 30 or 24, but I have tried 1080p 60. Ok, I just tried 1080p 24 also, same problem, The T.V pops up with a message saying, "Unsupported signal. Please check the device output signal" I do continue to receive audio however.

The cables are quite long, around 50 feet, however both of these cables have predated the lag issues. I previously had a different receiver and a different sound card with the HDMI going directly to the TV and the Optical cable directly to the receiver with no issues at all.

I can try to find another HDMI source and try it quick.


Thanks,

Adam
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post #8 of 12 Old 08-11-2012, 08:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captroper View Post

The cables are quite long, around 50 feet, however both of these cables have predated the lag issues.

I think this is your issue. Since you're getting audio, it means the receiver is getting the HDMI signal ok. I see lots of reports of folks having long (and 50' is long) HDMI runs that work from some sources, but not from AVRs. What's happening is when you go to 1080p, the data rate is going way up, and it's too much for the AVR's HDMI output to push at that distance. You'lll probably need to look into an HDMI repeater for the run between the AVR and the display.

Jeff


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post #9 of 12 Old 08-12-2012, 07:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Jeff,

Thanks again; I'm going to try and get another HDMI device to test this out first. Just for clarification a repeater for the 2 feet between the receiver and the TV? (As opposed to somewhere in between the 50 feet between the computer and the receiver)

Thanks,

Adam
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post #10 of 12 Old 08-12-2012, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captroper View Post

Just for clarification a repeater for the 2 feet between the receiver and the TV? (As opposed to somewhere in between the 50 feet between the computer and the receiver)

Well, no, if *that* cable is only a few feet, it doesn't explain the behavior... But bringing the PC into the same room with 6' cable instead of a 50' one would at least eliminate the cables from the equation... Still going to bet on a compatibility bug (mabye an EDID issue?) between the video card and the receiver.

Jeff


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post #11 of 12 Old 08-13-2012, 06:33 PM
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I agree with everything Jautor has said and I want to add that hdmi is the most unstable connection. There are so many variables through a hdmi connection that could possibly go wrong. Even that short hdmi cable you are talking about could be the problem. I dont use anything under 6 feet because of the possible reflection issue. 50 feet is really long and it can work with some components but not with others. Then again it may not be a hdmi issue. By the way, the lip sync option is on the avr and not the tv. try adjusting that if you have not. Good luck and let us know if you figured it out.


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post #12 of 12 Old 08-14-2012, 01:02 PM - Thread Starter
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Well, I never did figure out what the cause of the problem was scientifically, but after replacing the video card it appears to be working perfectly with no log at all.

Thanks for all of the help guys!

- Adam
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