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post #1 of 120 Old 09-30-2008, 04:18 PM - Thread Starter
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post #2 of 120 Old 09-30-2008, 04:18 PM - Thread Starter
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post #3 of 120 Old 09-30-2008, 04:18 PM - Thread Starter
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post #4 of 120 Old 09-30-2008, 04:19 PM - Thread Starter
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post #5 of 120 Old 09-30-2008, 04:19 PM - Thread Starter
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The transfer for Blu-ray is cleaned up like The Mummy movies and U-571 and some attempt to patch up some rough spots like scratches and dusts:



But for the rest of the transfer DNR was applied resulting in less detail compared to HD DVD. Can they improve one aspect of the PQ without drastically affecting the other?


Pick your poison.




*sigh*
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post #6 of 120 Old 09-30-2008, 04:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Why is it NONE of the online reviewers mentioned any of this? The change in PQ is drastic on my setup (see my profile). The helicopter fly-by in the beginning of the movie alerted me of the grain scrubbing. I don't understand why they missed all of this.
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post #7 of 120 Old 09-30-2008, 04:20 PM - Thread Starter
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HD DVD File size: 13.40 GB

Bitrate: 15.02 mbps

Code:
                                                                                        Total   Video
Title                                   Codec   Length  Movie Size      Disc Size       Bitrate Bitrate Main Audio Track        IME     Secondary Audio Track
The Thing                               VC-1    1:48:35 14,438,524,928* 21,196,942,048  17.72   15.02   DDPlus 5.1 1536Kbps     No

Blu-ray File size: 20.30 GB

Bitrate: 18.19 mbps


Code:
                                                                                                                Total   Video                                             
Title                                                           Codec   Length  Movie Size      Disc Size       Bitrate Bitrate Main Audio Track                          Secondary Audio Track
-----                                                           ------  ------- --------------  --------------  ------- ------- ------------------                        ---------------------
The Thing                                                       VC-1    1:48:42 21,842,233,344  22,394,537,024  26.79   18.19   DTS-HD Master 5.1 3898Kbps (48kHz/24-bit) DTS-HD Hi-Res 2.0 192Kbps


DISC INFO:

Disc Size:      22,394,537,024 bytes
Protection:     AACS
BD-Java:        Yes

PLAYLIST REPORT:

Name:           00000.mpls
Size:           21,842,233,344 bytes
Length:         1:48:42 (h:m:s)
Total Bitrate:  26.79 Mbps
Description:    

FILES:

Name            Size            Length          Time In         Time Out        
----            ----            ------          -------         --------        
00106.M2TS      21,842,233,344  1:48:42.432     0:00:00.000     1:48:42.432     

VIDEO:

Codec               Bitrate         Description     
-----               -------         -----------     
VC-1 Video          18190 kbps      1080p / 23.976fps / 16:9 / Advanced Profile 3
VC-1 Video          1941 kbps       480p / 23.976fps / 4:3 / Advanced Profile 2

AUDIO:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description     
-----                           --------        -------         -----------     
DTS-HD Master Audio             English         3898 kbps       5.1 / 48kHz / 24-bit / 3898kbps (DTS Core: 5.1 / 48kHz / 24-bit / 1536kbps)
DTS Audio                       French          768 kbps        5.1 / 48kHz / 24-bit / 768kbps
Dolby Digital Audio             English         192 kbps        2.0 / 48kHz / 192kbps
DTS-HD Audio                    English         192 kbps        2.0 / 48kHz / 192kbps

SUBTITLES:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description     
-----                           --------        -------         -----------     
Presentation Graphics           English         21 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           French          14 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           Spanish         18 kbps                         

CHAPTERS:

Number          Time            Length          Avg Video Rate  Max 1-Sec Rate  Max 1-Sec Time  Max 5-Sec Rate  Max 5-Sec Time  Max 10Sec Rate  Max 10Sec Time  Avg Frame Size  Max Frame Size  Max Frame Time  
------          ----            ------          --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  
1               0:00:00.000     0:02:07.794     3,603 kbps      24,126 kbps     00:02:04.416    20,696 kbps     00:02:00.412    19,365 kbps     00:01:55.657    18,787 bytes    202,735 bytes   00:01:36.013    
2               0:02:07.794     0:02:27.106     22,878 kbps     32,634 kbps     00:04:09.916    28,703 kbps     00:03:29.751    27,010 kbps     00:03:25.664    119,275 bytes   283,994 bytes   00:02:33.862    
3               0:04:34.900     0:02:27.981     19,221 kbps     28,807 kbps     00:05:45.303    25,874 kbps     00:06:27.721    24,161 kbps     00:06:25.010    100,210 bytes   235,525 bytes   00:04:48.955    
4               0:07:02.881     0:03:21.368     21,111 kbps     29,493 kbps     00:08:37.100    27,087 kbps     00:09:31.988    26,146 kbps     00:09:31.571    110,061 bytes   246,137 bytes   00:08:18.873    
5               0:10:24.249     0:03:58.738     18,663 kbps     29,770 kbps     00:13:50.496    26,902 kbps     00:14:02.133    26,326 kbps     00:14:00.131    97,301 bytes    246,346 bytes   00:12:54.816    
6               0:14:22.987     0:01:26.295     17,512 kbps     23,116 kbps     00:14:48.262    20,408 kbps     00:15:35.184    19,666 kbps     00:15:35.685    91,299 bytes    219,885 bytes   00:14:28.201    
7               0:15:49.282     0:06:24.968     17,517 kbps     26,673 kbps     00:22:13.290    24,090 kbps     00:21:46.597    22,871 kbps     00:21:45.137    91,324 bytes    305,385 bytes   00:21:37.213    
8               0:22:14.250     0:02:36.197     17,321 kbps     24,166 kbps     00:22:18.003    23,821 kbps     00:22:17.086    23,312 kbps     00:22:14.875    90,303 bytes    208,395 bytes   00:24:50.489    
9               0:24:50.447     0:02:11.173     15,833 kbps     23,646 kbps     00:25:59.391    21,046 kbps     00:25:58.724    19,647 kbps     00:25:56.972    82,545 bytes    213,196 bytes   00:24:52.491    
10              0:27:01.620     0:03:12.192     17,143 kbps     27,221 kbps     00:27:32.776    26,488 kbps     00:27:32.526    24,008 kbps     00:28:42.304    89,377 bytes    293,671 bytes   00:28:40.344    
11              0:30:13.812     0:02:49.669     20,130 kbps     33,673 kbps     00:32:24.359    27,585 kbps     00:32:23.859    24,316 kbps     00:32:18.854    104,946 bytes   323,903 bytes   00:32:27.320    
12              0:33:03.481     0:01:12.239     15,742 kbps     20,687 kbps     00:33:03.481    19,175 kbps     00:33:03.481    17,835 kbps     00:33:03.481    82,071 bytes    240,139 bytes   00:33:20.790    
13              0:34:15.720     0:01:47.691     16,021 kbps     20,235 kbps     00:35:09.107    18,723 kbps     00:34:27.524    17,947 kbps     00:35:30.420    83,525 bytes    212,599 bytes   00:34:54.342    
14              0:36:03.411     0:01:19.246     18,378 kbps     23,504 kbps     00:37:17.402    21,546 kbps     00:36:26.726    21,173 kbps     00:36:24.974    95,815 bytes    245,938 bytes   00:37:07.725    
15              0:37:22.657     0:02:42.788     19,582 kbps     27,328 kbps     00:39:46.384    24,374 kbps     00:38:11.247    24,110 kbps     00:38:06.242    102,092 bytes   329,083 bytes   00:38:19.589    
16              0:40:05.445     0:01:39.182     18,315 kbps     24,023 kbps     00:40:13.786    22,705 kbps     00:40:10.450    21,079 kbps     00:40:08.114    95,486 bytes    295,995 bytes   00:40:11.492    
17              0:41:44.627     0:03:47.686     19,540 kbps     27,479 kbps     00:42:12.989    26,754 kbps     00:42:11.154    25,313 kbps     00:42:06.566    101,871 bytes   237,634 bytes   00:43:06.667    
18              0:45:32.313     0:00:59.434     17,294 kbps     20,206 kbps     00:45:38.152    19,235 kbps     00:45:36.692    18,575 kbps     00:45:34.899    90,163 bytes    387,487 bytes   00:46:31.789    
19              0:46:31.747     0:03:46.477     19,364 kbps     30,233 kbps     00:49:41.687    28,308 kbps     00:49:41.687    26,834 kbps     00:49:41.687    100,956 bytes   244,279 bytes   00:46:37.378    
20              0:50:18.224     0:04:25.974     17,781 kbps     30,320 kbps     00:52:19.011    26,800 kbps     00:52:18.260    25,702 kbps     00:54:03.699    92,701 bytes    267,940 bytes   00:54:38.066    
21              0:54:44.198     0:02:52.213     21,102 kbps     28,286 kbps     00:54:51.205    28,159 kbps     00:54:51.205    27,675 kbps     00:54:49.036    110,016 bytes   262,230 bytes   00:56:31.346    
22              0:57:36.411     0:01:32.384     20,112 kbps     25,133 kbps     00:57:44.544    23,774 kbps     00:57:40.540    22,960 kbps     00:57:36.453    104,855 bytes   332,744 bytes   00:57:45.504    
23              0:59:08.795     0:03:38.594     18,605 kbps     32,374 kbps     00:59:13.383    27,808 kbps     00:59:09.796    25,798 kbps     00:59:08.837    96,997 bytes    270,582 bytes   01:01:21.344    
24              1:02:47.389     0:02:40.994     17,986 kbps     23,818 kbps     01:04:39.501    22,137 kbps     01:05:21.042    20,985 kbps     01:05:18.331    93,769 bytes    228,647 bytes   01:02:47.430    
25              1:05:28.383     0:04:23.596     20,758 kbps     31,906 kbps     01:07:11.694    30,108 kbps     01:07:11.152    28,007 kbps     01:07:10.318    108,224 bytes   310,064 bytes   01:05:41.646    
26              1:09:51.979     0:04:31.689     20,742 kbps     32,688 kbps     01:10:33.354    28,392 kbps     01:13:36.746    27,570 kbps     01:13:33.451    108,141 bytes   302,396 bytes   01:10:33.646    
27              1:14:23.668     0:03:20.033     22,176 kbps     34,745 kbps     01:16:36.425    31,996 kbps     01:16:34.340    31,364 kbps     01:16:34.340    115,614 bytes   409,166 bytes   01:17:07.164    
28              1:17:43.701     0:01:01.102     19,025 kbps     25,837 kbps     01:18:39.173    21,958 kbps     01:18:35.419    20,775 kbps     01:18:32.625    99,189 bytes    240,889 bytes   01:17:54.920    
29              1:18:44.803     0:06:33.769     20,883 kbps     35,002 kbps     01:24:39.741    29,317 kbps     01:25:05.642    27,971 kbps     01:24:10.504    108,874 bytes   268,721 bytes   01:24:10.754    
30              1:25:18.572     0:01:22.666     17,752 kbps     23,036 kbps     01:26:00.405    20,936 kbps     01:25:56.276    20,291 kbps     01:25:26.663    92,550 bytes    206,933 bytes   01:25:20.699    
31              1:26:41.238     0:02:37.949     20,289 kbps     29,527 kbps     01:28:23.048    27,690 kbps     01:27:10.600    25,757 kbps     01:27:09.307    105,776 bytes   206,341 bytes   01:27:14.187    
32              1:29:19.187     0:01:55.782     21,446 kbps     33,010 kbps     01:29:24.609    27,145 kbps     01:30:42.354    25,633 kbps     01:30:39.517    111,811 bytes   283,609 bytes   01:29:23.650    
33              1:31:14.969     0:03:10.733     22,772 kbps     38,178 kbps     01:32:40.972    31,861 kbps     01:32:31.171    30,668 kbps     01:32:32.297    118,724 bytes   309,163 bytes   01:32:52.066    
34              1:34:25.702     0:02:53.631     20,430 kbps     35,867 kbps     01:35:41.194    31,576 kbps     01:35:40.777    30,962 kbps     01:35:40.777    106,514 bytes   304,957 bytes   01:35:58.252    
35              1:37:19.333     0:01:55.115     20,978 kbps     37,089 kbps     01:38:40.540    27,174 kbps     01:38:37.578    25,664 kbps     01:38:32.532    109,370 bytes   291,155 bytes   01:38:40.581    
36              1:39:14.448     0:02:54.758     20,840 kbps     24,908 kbps     01:41:01.430    22,562 kbps     01:40:23.976    22,412 kbps     01:40:23.434    108,652 bytes   276,339 bytes   01:39:56.532    
37              1:42:09.206     0:06:33.227     2,854 kbps      7,672 kbps      01:48:26.667    7,103 kbps      01:48:28.585    6,564 kbps      01:48:23.914    14,881 bytes    148,029 bytes   01:46:54.533    

STREAM DIAGNOSTICS:

File            PID             Type            Seconds         Bytes           Packets         Bitrate         
----            ---             ----            -------         -----           -------         -------         
00106.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0xEA            6522.43         14,830,721,443  80,696,043      18,190          
00106.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x86            6522.43         3,178,269,016   18,289,159      3,898           
00106.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x82            6522.43         626,154,496     3,668,874       768             
00106.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x81            6522.43         156,539,136     1,019,135       192             
00106.M2TS      4608 (0x1200)   0x90            6522.43         16,766,632      96,399          21              
00106.M2TS      4609 (0x1201)   0x90            6522.43         14,956,644      85,849          18              
00106.M2TS      4610 (0x1202)   0x90            6522.43         11,535,737      67,138          14              
00106.M2TS      6912 (0x1B00)   0xEA            6522.43         1,582,908,406   8,703,274       1,941           
00106.M2TS      6656 (0x1A00)   0xA2            6522.43         156,538,880     917,220         192

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post #8 of 120 Old 09-30-2008, 05:15 PM
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This is going to be interesting. Don't throw away the HD-DVD yet.
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post #9 of 120 Old 09-30-2008, 07:45 PM
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It's supposed to look the same as the HD DVD version, but I suppose that remains to be seen.
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post #10 of 120 Old 09-30-2008, 08:58 PM
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for some reason this is one i never got around to buying on hd dvd...
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post #11 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 03:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kram Sacul View Post

This is going to be interesting. Don't throw away the HD-DVD yet.

Well, if you own the HD DVD, then keep it... the Blu-Ray has NONE of the extras that were on the HD DVD version (except the commentary).

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post #12 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 03:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Don May Jr View Post

Well, if you own the HD DVD, then keep it... the Blu-Ray has NONE of the extras that were on the HD DVD version (except the commentary).

It has the doc as PiP.


But yes I see little reason to rebuy this title to get the doc as PiP.

Good movies are as rare as an on topic discussion.
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post #13 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 03:24 AM
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Based on the comparison pix, it looks like Universal pulled another Mummy and U-571 with The Thing.

Blu-ray : 340
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post #14 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 03:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lgans316 View Post

Based on the comparison pix, it looks like Universal pulled another Mummy and U-571 with The Thing.

I think I have to agree, I wonder why?

Hope Xylon brings out the more grainy scenes, aswell.

Good movies are as rare as an on topic discussion.
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post #15 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 03:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MovieSwede View Post

I think I have to agree, I wonder why?

Hope Xylon brings out the more grainy scenes, aswell.

Xylon has posted few more and the Blu-ray definitely looks CRYSTAL CLEAR.

Blu-ray : 340
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post #16 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 03:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lgans316 View Post

Xylon has posted few more and the Blu-ray definitely looks CRYSTAL CLEAR.

Glad, I keept my HD DVDs.

Good movies are as rare as an on topic discussion.
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post #17 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 03:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xylon View Post

The transfer for Blu-ray is cleaned up like The Mummy movies and U-571 and some attempt to patch up some rought spots like scratches and dusts:

But for the rest of the transfer DNR was applied resulting in less detail compared to HD DVD. Can they improve one aspect of the PQ without drastically affecting the other?

Pick your poison.

*sigh*

I think schratches like that, is charming. Give me a more cinema feel of the movie.

Good movies are as rare as an on topic discussion.
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post #18 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 04:25 AM
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Another waxjob by Universal. This is supposed to be the last straw. Can we riot already?
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post #19 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 04:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MovieSwede View Post

It has the doc as PiP.


But yes I see little reason to rebuy this title to get the doc as PiP.

It does? Oh, wow! I'll have to check that out, but I'd hate to have to view it in a tiny little window as PIP. I put it in last night and checked the special features menu and all that was listed was the commentary.

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post #20 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 04:42 AM
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I think waxjob is a bit of a stretch all things considered, but it's certainly been de-grained/low-pass filtered/whatever.

And the fact that they bothered to reduce the amount of film artifacts makes me doubtful that the BD-50 version will be any different. I will pass until it's re-transferred or priced the same as the DVD.
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post #21 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 04:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xylon View Post

Why is it NONE of the online reviewers mentioned any of this? The change in PQ is drastic on my setup (see my profile). The helicopter fly-by in the beginning of the movie alerted me of the grain scrubbing. I don't understand why they missed all of this.

I guess it's all subjective, but these screenshot comparisons seem like the most offensive DNR job Universal has done yet. I didn't think the U-571 comparisons looked as extreme as these. Plus, there goes my theory that they were only doing this due to BD-25 disc space issues... larger file size, higher bitrate... loss of detail.

This is ridiculous.

And I agree about the other online reviewers. Of course, I can't say I'd ever notice it without the screenshot comparisons, but, then again, I'm not a reviewer. I should've known to wait. It seemed like the review I read had given the "all clear" and I placed the order. It should be here today... along with other Universal product I now have to question ("Dawn of the Dead", "Land of the Dead").
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post #22 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 04:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xylon View Post

Why is it NONE of the online reviewers mentioned any of this? The change in PQ is drastic on my setup (see my profile). The helicopter fly-by in the beginning of the movie alerted me of the grain scrubbing. I don't understand why they missed all of this.

Because you weren't and aren't posting these comparison PIX on time.

Blu-ray : 340
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post #23 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 04:52 AM
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this film is exactly why I got full force back into HD-DVD, I knew this was going to be DNR'd, no excuse for this crap

-Gary
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post #24 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 04:54 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lgans316 View Post

Because you weren't and aren't posting these comparison PIX on time.

I have the Blu-ray copy for two weeks. Its just this recently I'm able to watch it. Really hard putting this up before street date. Very rarely I'm successful. Comparison threads with DVD is even harder especially when they are new release. Got Iron Man blu-ray weeks ago but the DVD I just got from Walmart last Sunday (shhhhhhh).
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post #25 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 06:19 AM
 
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higher bitrate, more sucking
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post #26 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 07:06 AM
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FFFFFFFUUUUUUUDDDDDDDGGGGGGGEEEEEEE!!!!!!!

Why Why?!?! Anyone have Universal's physical address, oh I'll just search for it.
Time to write a bunch of disgruntled letters. Ditto for Warner/NL.

Seriously, how come Universal can go to the expense of dinking around with the transfer anew and have someone muck it up but can't afford or wait to get BD-50s?
Begin with an awesome transfer just to end up with a Tier ZERO-quality one.

Just wait for Serenity and Bourne series, all will be 1080p upconverts of DVD. Not even a good dvd transfer at that too.

Thanks Xylon for your time and effort in providing these screen shots, been saving me money. ;}

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post #27 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 07:16 AM
 
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Great, yet another title I will not buy on BRD. Thanks Universal
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post #28 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 07:26 AM
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Universal is the absolute worst supporter of Blu-Ray at the moment, IMO.

Not only do they continue to add DNR, but this thing where they re-purpose old DVD supplements into their horrible U-Control track is ridiculous. When someone creates content specificially suited for a PIP overlay, great. When they chop up a making of doc, then sprinkle it throughout a movie and make the user search for it... how is this progress?

Poor PQ, missing supplements... it's like I've time travelled back to the first few months of the Blu-Ray launch...
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post #29 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 07:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MovieSwede View Post

I think I have to agree, I wonder why?

It seems they are trying to remove dirt and print defects, but as a side effect it's removing grain too. It's too bad that can't keep the grain intact while removing the other issues.

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post #30 of 120 Old 10-01-2008, 07:44 AM
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If they were attempting to remove defects then they did so with lamest and easiest method, a dab of DNR over the whole film.
Instead the proper method to do it rather than softening up the entire film is to go in and digitally 'repair' the print damage, as in by hand fix it up, heck with a little time and effort the clone tool in photoshop will do a great job at that and still retain proper high frequency detail and grain structure.
Look at the bottom most BR shot, the damage is still there, just glossed over now it is nice and soft so it's not as obvious. Back in the day, if you have an imperfection throw the focus off a little bit, essentially what they did here digitally and from what I gather applied to the whole film.

Bummer.

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