"Once upon a dream . . . . " Sleeping Beauty comparison *PIX* - AVS Forum
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post #2 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 03:12 AM - Thread Starter
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post #3 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 03:12 AM - Thread Starter
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post #5 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 03:12 AM - Thread Starter
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post #6 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 03:13 AM - Thread Starter
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Special Edition DVD 2003

Platinum Edition DVD 2008

Blu-ray File size: 17.00 GB

Bitrate: 24.06 mbps


Code:
                                                                                                                Total   Video                                             
Title                                                           Codec   Length  Movie Size      Disc Size       Bitrate Bitrate Main Audio Track                          Secondary Audio Track
-----                                                           ------  ------- --------------  --------------  ------- ------- ------------------                        ---------------------
Sleeping Beauty                                                 AVC     1:15:10 18,360,612,864  37,705,310,447  32.57   24.06   DTS-HD Master 5.1 4459Kbps (48kHz/24-bit) DD AC3 4.0 640Kbps


DISC INFO:

Disc Size:      37,705,310,447 bytes
Protection:     AACS
BD-Java:        Yes

PLAYLIST REPORT:

Name:           00049.mpls
Size:           18,360,612,864 bytes
Length:         1:15:10 (h:m:s)
Total Bitrate:  32.57 Mbps
Description:    

FILES:

Name            Size            Length          Time In         Time Out        
----            ----            ------          -------         --------        
00048.M2TS      18,360,612,864  1:15:10.088     0:00:00.000     1:15:10.088     

VIDEO:

Codec               Bitrate         Description     
-----               -------         -----------     
MPEG-4 AVC Video    24059 kbps      1080p / 23.976fps / 16:9 / High Profile 4.1
MPEG-4 AVC Video    1094 kbps       480p / 23.976fps / 16:9 / High Profile 3.2

AUDIO:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description     
-----                           --------        -------         -----------     
DTS-HD Master Audio             English         4459 kbps       5.1 / 48kHz / 24-bit / 4459kbps (DTS Core: 5.1 / 48kHz / 24-bit / 1536kbps)
Dolby Digital Audio             English         640 kbps        4.0 / 48kHz / 640kbps
Dolby Digital Audio             English         192 kbps        2.0 / 48kHz / 192kbps

SUBTITLES:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description     
-----                           --------        -------         -----------     
Presentation Graphics           English         32 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           English         6 kbps                          
Presentation Graphics           English         225 kbps                        
Presentation Graphics           English         2 kbps                          
Presentation Graphics           English         83 kbps                         

CHAPTERS:

Number          Time            Length          Avg Video Rate  Max 1-Sec Rate  Max 1-Sec Time  Max 5-Sec Rate  Max 5-Sec Time  Max 10Sec Rate  Max 10Sec Time  Avg Frame Size  Max Frame Size  Max Frame Time  
------          ----            ------          --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  
1               0:00:00.000     0:01:47.316     19,094 kbps     35,027 kbps     00:01:35.679    22,873 kbps     00:00:14.848    22,423 kbps     00:00:14.848    99,548 bytes    760,627 bytes   00:00:18.060    
2               0:01:47.316     0:01:10.528     27,885 kbps     35,284 kbps     00:01:48.483    29,749 kbps     00:01:53.780    29,355 kbps     00:02:42.954    145,380 bytes   645,664 bytes   00:01:49.359    
3               0:02:57.844     0:01:57.618     27,341 kbps     34,101 kbps     00:04:12.002    29,753 kbps     00:03:21.618    29,520 kbps     00:03:41.805    142,543 bytes   663,326 bytes   00:04:21.970    
4               0:04:55.462     0:00:55.597     24,703 kbps     30,550 kbps     00:05:29.788    29,531 kbps     00:05:12.604    29,378 kbps     00:05:06.056    128,792 bytes   660,623 bytes   00:04:59.508    
5               0:05:51.059     0:01:46.732     22,073 kbps     31,646 kbps     00:07:21.274    29,269 kbps     00:07:29.032    26,229 kbps     00:07:27.822    115,081 bytes   491,833 bytes   00:07:33.995    
6               0:07:37.791     0:02:17.137     22,300 kbps     32,643 kbps     00:09:13.303    29,785 kbps     00:09:23.897    29,224 kbps     00:09:19.392    116,261 bytes   733,217 bytes   00:09:13.595    
7               0:09:54.928     0:01:49.150     24,271 kbps     32,635 kbps     00:09:59.265    29,718 kbps     00:11:07.417    29,293 kbps     00:10:31.714    126,540 bytes   510,051 bytes   00:11:12.422    
8               0:11:44.078     0:03:59.239     25,220 kbps     37,895 kbps     00:15:24.924    30,430 kbps     00:15:20.962    29,908 kbps     00:15:15.915    131,487 bytes   727,613 bytes   00:15:27.552    
9               0:15:43.317     0:02:03.999     24,854 kbps     34,956 kbps     00:15:48.823    30,042 kbps     00:15:56.455    29,093 kbps     00:16:59.727    129,575 bytes   668,073 bytes   00:17:18.579    
10              0:17:47.316     0:04:53.210     23,285 kbps     33,040 kbps     00:18:03.582    29,930 kbps     00:19:23.871    29,415 kbps     00:17:57.952    121,395 bytes   669,925 bytes   00:18:11.507    
11              0:22:40.526     0:01:34.928     24,522 kbps     33,638 kbps     00:23:25.279    29,777 kbps     00:23:02.423    29,549 kbps     00:23:02.715    127,848 bytes   733,591 bytes   00:22:47.825    
12              0:24:15.454     0:01:19.329     24,666 kbps     35,732 kbps     00:25:14.012    30,225 kbps     00:25:10.092    29,407 kbps     00:25:08.841    128,598 bytes   689,862 bytes   00:25:22.646    
13              0:25:34.783     0:04:07.497     23,712 kbps     35,971 kbps     00:28:27.748    30,425 kbps     00:27:43.954    29,480 kbps     00:25:51.884    123,626 bytes   759,895 bytes   00:28:29.458    
14              0:29:42.280     0:03:22.077     23,199 kbps     35,860 kbps     00:32:22.399    30,541 kbps     00:32:18.395    29,521 kbps     00:32:14.057    120,951 bytes   786,371 bytes   00:32:58.560    
15              0:33:04.357     0:02:57.594     24,446 kbps     35,310 kbps     00:34:04.960    30,159 kbps     00:35:17.407    29,464 kbps     00:34:45.250    127,452 bytes   552,907 bytes   00:34:06.544    
16              0:36:01.951     0:04:19.927     23,309 kbps     33,506 kbps     00:36:55.755    30,160 kbps     00:40:09.532    29,352 kbps     00:36:47.747    121,524 bytes   804,833 bytes   00:36:57.757    
17              0:40:21.878     0:04:00.281     24,518 kbps     34,365 kbps     00:42:07.358    30,084 kbps     00:43:26.187    29,359 kbps     00:43:01.829    127,826 bytes   685,622 bytes   00:40:30.511    
18              0:44:22.159     0:02:17.847     24,724 kbps     34,045 kbps     00:46:02.510    29,680 kbps     00:44:40.344    29,384 kbps     00:44:35.298    128,900 bytes   803,175 bytes   00:46:03.469    
19              0:46:40.006     0:01:46.564     24,884 kbps     34,942 kbps     00:47:52.578    29,650 kbps     00:46:44.927    29,163 kbps     00:46:52.935    129,732 bytes   689,093 bytes   00:48:07.384    
20              0:48:26.570     0:03:42.556     24,780 kbps     33,430 kbps     00:51:44.184    30,191 kbps     00:51:40.222    29,352 kbps     00:51:35.217    129,191 bytes   668,984 bytes   00:48:50.010    
21              0:52:09.126     0:01:34.136     22,521 kbps     31,447 kbps     00:52:26.935    29,736 kbps     00:52:36.945    29,203 kbps     00:52:31.940    117,416 bytes   611,966 bytes   00:52:43.410    
22              0:53:43.262     0:02:50.462     25,955 kbps     32,853 kbps     00:55:21.151    29,869 kbps     00:54:10.330    29,487 kbps     00:54:18.755    135,319 bytes   571,661 bytes   00:54:16.003    
23              0:56:33.724     0:02:17.470     23,609 kbps     40,161 kbps     00:58:48.608    29,754 kbps     00:57:20.312    29,020 kbps     00:56:34.182    123,088 bytes   603,409 bytes   00:56:46.069    
24              0:58:51.194     0:03:19.783     24,735 kbps     33,045 kbps     01:00:51.398    30,054 kbps     01:00:47.352    29,423 kbps     01:00:57.696    128,957 bytes   740,012 bytes   01:01:16.673    
25              1:02:10.977     0:03:14.069     21,607 kbps     32,811 kbps     01:04:37.082    29,265 kbps     01:04:33.078    27,089 kbps     01:04:50.720    112,649 bytes   725,916 bytes   01:04:44.089    
26              1:05:25.046     0:02:19.765     25,691 kbps     35,618 kbps     01:06:23.021    29,688 kbps     01:06:57.639    28,732 kbps     01:06:55.970    133,941 bytes   697,089 bytes   01:06:46.920    
27              1:07:44.811     0:01:05.065     25,896 kbps     33,263 kbps     01:08:27.353    29,595 kbps     01:08:23.433    29,061 kbps     01:08:22.432    135,011 bytes   550,541 bytes   01:08:48.249    
28              1:08:49.876     0:01:55.615     26,282 kbps     34,896 kbps     01:08:53.296    30,141 kbps     01:09:50.103    29,618 kbps     01:09:45.098    137,023 bytes   629,399 bytes   01:10:37.942    
29              1:10:45.491     0:01:39.058     21,494 kbps     31,224 kbps     01:11:57.188    29,626 kbps     01:11:53.226    27,609 kbps     01:10:45.825    112,059 bytes   626,550 bytes   01:11:08.222    
30              1:12:24.549     0:02:45.540     23,079 kbps     32,707 kbps     01:14:41.852    29,735 kbps     01:12:44.527    29,350 kbps     01:12:39.730    120,322 bytes   629,846 bytes   01:12:29.762    

STREAM DIAGNOSTICS:

File            PID             Type            Seconds         Bytes           Packets         Bitrate         
----            ---             ----            -------         -----           -------         -------         
00048.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            4510.09         13,563,388,671  73,777,739      24,059          
00048.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x86            4510.09         2,513,905,700   14,365,360      4,459           
00048.M2TS      4608 (0x1200)   0x90            4510.09         17,858,803      103,750         32              
00048.M2TS      6912 (0x1B00)   0x1B            4510.09         616,868,340     3,410,897       1,094           
00048.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x81            4510.09         360,808,960     2,114,115       640             
00048.M2TS      4609 (0x1201)   0x90            4510.09         3,610,475       21,812          6               
00048.M2TS      4610 (0x1202)   0x90            4510.09         126,701,708     706,654         225             
00048.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x81            4510.09         108,242,688     704,705         192             
00048.M2TS      4611 (0x1203)   0x90            4510.09         1,371,218       8,079           2               
00048.M2TS      4612 (0x1204)   0x90            4510.09         46,543,930      263,941         83
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post #7 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 03:13 AM - Thread Starter
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An end of an era . . . .

To me the most beautiful piece of animation ever made. Without the help of any of the technical advances available today the level of craftmanship is unmatched. The background paintings are so exquisitely "rendered" that at one time there was a "mini" mutiny from the animators against Eyvind Earle who was the supervisor of backgrounds and characters. They are having a hard time "blending" the animations.

Widely considered to be the last movie from the studio's "Golden Age", the last to be made with hand-inked cels. With the direction W. Disney want to take on this movie, it took six years and $6 million. Shot in 70mm Super Technirama 70 process with "6 channel stereophic surround", a first for an animated feature. The studio almost went bankrupt because of the spiraling cost. I think one of the directors got fired for that.

Sleeping Beauty was scanned at 4K resolution then downrezzed to 2K for Blu-ray. Lowry Digital did the restoration including DNR. The resulting image is pristine, sharp and detailed picture. The colors may not have the "gradiations" like we see on modern hand drawn animations, nevertheless it doesn't detract at all with the overall PQ. There are some scenes that looks like it is out of focus but thats just me nitpicking

When you hear the score do you associate it with this movie or the ballet? The AQ especially the musical score is so good compared to the old DVD is not even funny. From the VHS copy I watched a loooooong time ago, the digital stereo sound from my laserdisc, the improvement is night and day.

Disney's first "Platinum Edition" for Blu-ray is a winner. And if you go ahead and explore all the extras you will realize they don't hold back. For most people with kids the interactivity can be used to baby sit With all that stuff they crammed in there the little ones can spend hours playing with it. More hours if you are connected to the internetS
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post #8 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 03:13 AM - Thread Starter
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post #9 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 03:13 AM - Thread Starter
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post #10 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 03:14 AM - Thread Starter
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Take a good look at the backgrounds. With the available technology we have right now, our calibrated viewing set and HD format this is the first time we are seeing the real movie in its entirety. Nothing is cropped or blurred (due to the limitation of the DVD format).

If I'm going to rank these restored catalogs its going to be like this:

1. How The West Was Won

2. Sleeping Beauty

3. Grand Prix

4. The Searchers
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post #11 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 03:14 AM - Thread Starter
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post #12 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 05:41 AM
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What a tease, Xylon! Looking forward to seeing these!!!
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post #13 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 05:49 AM
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Sweet
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post #14 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 08:42 AM
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Looking forward to your impressions and pics, Xylon! Anyway, here are my thoughts...

This disc looks absolutely amazing. So detailed, so clear. I found myself looking at the backgrounds a lot because they were so beautifully rendered.

What this disc doesn't seem to look like is film. Its been polished and buffed to an inch of its life, and is a super-clean and colorful image. But there's nothing that says its film to me - it looks almost like digital animation.

I know this film was shot on 70mm which might account for the absence of grain. One of the endless previews before you can get to the menu (you have to click through them or fast forward rather than being able to hit the menu key - BOO) showed images from upcoming Disney films, like Pinocchio, which did have a look of grain.

So - what's on this Blu-ray disc looks phenomenal. But how much does it look like what theatergoers saw back in the fifties?
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post #15 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 08:53 AM
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Unbelievable. I was going to send a PM if you were going to do this for Sleeping Beauty. Guess I got my answer!
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post #16 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 09:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleddyn H Williams View Post

Looking forward to your impressions and pics, Xylon! Anyway, here are my thoughts...

This disc looks absolutely amazing. So detailed, so clear. I found myself looking at the backgrounds a lot because they were so beautifully rendered.

What this disc doesn't seem to look like is film. Its been polished and buffed to an inch of its life, and is a super-clean and colorful image. But there's nothing that says its film to me - it looks almost like digital animation.

I know this film was shot on 70mm which might account for the absence of grain. One of the endless previews before you can get to the menu (you have to click through them or fast forward rather than being able to hit the menu key - BOO) showed images from upcoming Disney films, like Pinocchio, which did have a look of grain.

So - what's on this Blu-ray disc looks phenomenal. But how much does it look like what theatergoers saw back in the fifties?


There has been much debate about the proper restoration of cell animation. I beleive it was a Disney stance that the film was not the true medium, and the cell art, sans film artifacts, was closer to the artists true intent. I do not know if that is still their stance, but I don't see the two sides of that argument ever coming close to an agreement.
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post #17 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 09:15 AM
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It's supposed to look-like cell art captured on 70mm film.
Just to confuse everyone! ;-)

Oh yeah & thanks Xylon; looking forward too the rest of the pics!

"I wonder if any of the releases had slipcovers though."
"Are these comfirmed to have slipcovers?"
"They look nice in those slips."
"This slipcover looks too good to pass up."
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post #18 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 02:07 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleddyn H Williams View Post

I know this film was shot on 70mm which might account for the absence of grain. One of the endless previews before you can get to the menu (you have to click through them or fast forward rather than being able to hit the menu key - BOO) showed images from upcoming Disney films, like Pinocchio, which did have a look of grain.

So - what's on this Blu-ray disc looks phenomenal. But how much does it look like what theatergoers saw back in the fifties?

It was photographed in the 35 mm 8-perf Technirama process and optically enlarged to 70 mm 5-perf prints for exhibition at cinema's.

Super Technirama didn't specifically shoot directly to 65mm film.
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post #19 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 02:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleddyn H Williams View Post

Looking forward to your impressions and pics, Xylon! Anyway, here are my thoughts...

This disc looks absolutely amazing. So detailed, so clear. I found myself looking at the backgrounds a lot because they were so beautifully rendered.

What this disc doesn't seem to look like is film. Its been polished and buffed to an inch of its life, and is a super-clean and colorful image. But there's nothing that says its film to me - it looks almost like digital animation.

I know this film was shot on 70mm which might account for the absence of grain. One of the endless previews before you can get to the menu (you have to click through them or fast forward rather than being able to hit the menu key - BOO) showed images from upcoming Disney films, like Pinocchio, which did have a look of grain.

So - what's on this Blu-ray disc looks phenomenal. But how much does it look like what theatergoers saw back in the fifties?

Is Pinocchio's OAR 4:3 or 1.78? Anyone?
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post #20 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 02:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rieper View Post

Is Pinocchio's OAR 4:3 or 1.78? Anyone?

The trailer had it in 4:3
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post #21 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 03:00 PM
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The Platinum DVD so far doesn't look to shabby in comparison to the BD. It will be interesting to see more.
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post #22 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 03:20 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rieper View Post

Is Pinocchio's OAR 4:3 or 1.78? Anyone?

1.37:1 which is roughly 4:3 - It was released in 1940 well before widescreen productions became the norm.
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post #23 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 06:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hughmc View Post

The Platinum DVD so far doesn't look to shabby in comparison to the BD. It will be interesting to see more.

It's because it's not moving. IMHO DVD always look better in Screenshot than moving because you can't see the arfacting moving. Same with some blu-rays..

89+ Blu-ray Disc ;)
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post #24 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 07:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hughmc View Post

The Platinum DVD so far doesn't look to shabby in comparison to the BD. It will be interesting to see more.

The backgrounds are really key to this film. And the Platinum DVD, while very nice, just doesn't come close to this HD presentation.

Standouts (so far, I'm watching now)...

- The shrunk fairies decided what to do, look at the cup and spoon.
- The "fleeing-the-castle" scene, the pock marks in the stonework. Not only shows the detail of HD, but the attention paid by the artists.
- The whole Forrest sequence when Aurora wanders out... look at the trees, and pay attention.
- The first entry into Maleficent's castle, where they face the drawbridge.

The original caps in this thread are actually the softest scenes. The animation itself is where the disc really shines.

It's like owning a work of Fine Art. We are so blessed to have a medium like Blu-ray, especially when it's used to its fullest and shows off such magnificent artwork. I love Eyvind Earle's style!

-Pie

"The Brothers, they think I don't know a buttload of crap about the Gospel..." -Nacho
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post #25 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 08:11 PM
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That doesn't take away from what Xylon is trying to do as I understand to some extent his intent, but with regards to the last two posts, then within reason the screen caps really do nothing for true accuracy.
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post #26 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 08:22 PM
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I too and a little concerned with how Pinocchio looked in the previews; but then again the original bluray previews for Sleeping Beauty had a little skeptical at first but now I see how truly amazing this film is. It is like each frame is a small masterpiece unto itself. Truly Incredible and a must have for any Bluray Library.
I'm wondering if Pinocchio is just that way, grainy, I'm betting Snow White may come out the same way. But they haven't finished restoring yet so we'll see. Also why did they show Pinocchio in 4:3 and not widescreen, is it because they haven't shown us any restored film yet?
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post #27 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 08:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FoxyMulder View Post

1.37:1 which is roughly 4:3 - It was released in 1940 well before widescreen productions became the norm.

Do you think they can make it into widescreen w/o stretching of course? Do you think the original cells are wider than the movie?
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post #28 of 175 Old 10-08-2008, 09:15 PM
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Pinnochio shown in anything other than 1.33:1/1.37:1 would be an abomination.
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post #29 of 175 Old 10-09-2008, 01:00 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gr689 View Post

Do you think they can make it into widescreen w/o stretching of course? Do you think the original cells are wider than the movie?

No it's not intended to be shown widescreen.

Same goes for Disneys Snow White...Fantasia....Bambi and Dumbo among others.

I'm for OAR all the way....I made the mistake years ago of buying The Evil Dead in a butchered 16/9 aspect ratio ( should be 4/3 ) and even though it was director approved it just sucked and had too much information missing top and bottom of the frame.

Wow i'm mentioning Evil Dead in a Disney thread....Walt would not be pleased.

I am actually picking this one up...Big Disney fan before they went all CGI.....Glad to see the Pixar owners decided to allow hand drawn animation at the studio again when their head ( apple head ? ) became CEO at the company.
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post #30 of 175 Old 10-09-2008, 01:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FoxyMulder View Post

It was photographed in the 35 mm 8-perf Technirama process and optically enlarged to 70 mm 5-perf prints for exhibition at cinema's.

Super Technirama didn't specifically shoot directly to 65mm film.

more info

http://www.geocities.com/enchantedfo...r/9989/sb.html

9. Film Process: Super Technirama 70 - uses two 35mm film prints to create a 70mm film. Its aspect ratio is 2.35:1. Sleeping Beauty was the first Disney animated feature in 70mm film.

http://www.widescreenmuseum.com/widescreen/wingtr3.htm

"The camera uses an entirely new type of anamorphic (squeeze) lens and utilizes a double-frame negative which passes horizontally through the camera. The resulting image on the screen, after being printed on 70-millimeter film, has no "separation lines" and is equally brilliant and undistorted when viewed from any seat in the theatre, no matter how far to the side or how far up front the seat
may be."


http://www.in70mm.com/newsletter/200...rama/index.htm

Super Technirama 70

By 1958, 70mm was becoming well established, helped by the availability of multi-purpose 70mm/35mm dual gauge projectors. 65mm/70mm processing and printing facilities were now being installed in Technicolor's London and Rome laboratories. The dye-transfer system was never adopted to make 70mm prints, with all Technicolor's 70mm prints being made directly on to Eastman Color positive print film. The first Technirama 70mm print was made for Walt Disney. Always closely associated with Technicolor, they had made their cartoon feature "Sleeping Beauty" (1959) in Technirama and wanted to give it the added status of a 70mm release. It was photographed in the Technirama format using a cartoon camera which photographed each of the cells three times through red, green and blue filters in sequence along a single black and white negative. The squeeze was incorporated by a lens supplied by Panavision and this was to form the basis of the printer lens needed to make the 70mm print. Similar lenses were also obtained from Cooke Taylor-Hobson.
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