Band of Brothers DVD, HBO MPEG-2, HD DVD & Blu-ray comparison *PIX* - Page 6 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #151 of 257 Old 11-19-2008, 02:00 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Canary_Jules's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Leicester, UK
Posts: 1,141
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
My immediate thoughts are whether the reviewer has had opportunity to access the HD-DVD version of BOB. Had he been able to do the comparisons which Xylon has enabled us to do he might not have been quite so happy - though no doubt the Blu-ray version of BOB is still a fine presentation in its own right. It's just that it isn't perhaps the best ever presentation. No doubt most audiences aren't going to notice an application of DNR, but then most audiences don't own projectors and huge screens. Debates like this are part of the fun of Home Cinema!
Canary_Jules is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #152 of 257 Old 11-19-2008, 04:01 AM
AVS Special Member
 
MovieSwede's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Gothenburg
Posts: 6,772
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked: 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by sspears View Post

I believe this title was filtered with the Digi Vision box. HBO strongly dislikes grain.

So its HBO who made that descision and not Warner?
MovieSwede is offline  
post #153 of 257 Old 11-19-2008, 05:40 AM
Member
 
DrXym's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 27
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
This thread is stupid. The DNR in the shots is so slight that it wouldn't hurt normal viewing. It's barely noticeable even in the still closeups. Certainly nothing to cancel an order for. Now the DNR in Patton or Zulu are reasons to cancel an order, but not this.
DrXym is offline  
post #154 of 257 Old 11-19-2008, 05:44 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Canary_Jules's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Leicester, UK
Posts: 1,141
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrXym View Post

This thread is stupid. The DNR in the shots is so slight that it wouldn't hurt normal viewing. It's barely noticeable even in the still closeups. Certainly nothing to cancel an order for. Now the DNR in Patton or Zulu are reasons to cancel an order, but not this.

What's 'normal' viewing?
Canary_Jules is offline  
post #155 of 257 Old 11-19-2008, 05:48 AM
Member
 
JJ79's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 30
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Canary_Jules View Post

My immediate thoughts are whether the reviewer has had opportunity to access the HD-DVD version of BOB. Had he been able to do the comparisons which Xylon has enabled us to do he might not have been quite so happy - though no doubt the Blu-ray version of BOB is still a fine presentation in its own right. It's just that it isn't perhaps the best ever presentation. No doubt most audiences aren't going to notice an application of DNR, but then most audiences don't own projectors and huge screens. Debates like this are part of the fun of Home Cinema!

For the record, the last time I saw the DVD version of BoB was when it first came out. And I never had the HD DVD import.
JJ79 is offline  
post #156 of 257 Old 11-19-2008, 05:54 AM
Member
 
DrXym's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 27
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Canary_Jules View Post

What's 'normal' viewing?

Normal in the sense of sitting down and watching the movie, rather than slavishly taking screencaps of various versions and then highlighting slight differences in the texture of a closeup of a tunic. Which is what the DNR amounts to. Very slight differences. It's not the house of wax.

Some movies have horrid DNR or EE and are rightly villified. This release has such slight DNR that it shouldn't be an issue for anybody.
DrXym is offline  
post #157 of 257 Old 11-19-2008, 06:06 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Canary_Jules's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Leicester, UK
Posts: 1,141
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
You're right, from what I've seen from the screencaps BOB on Blu is not a house of wax and if I didn't already have the HD-DVDs I'd be buying the Blu version in a shot - I just love BOB! But these are the AVScience forums and folks who frequent here don't have 'normal' set ups or watch 'normally'. We've spent thousands, perhaps tens of thousands, of shekels on AV equipment to get the best and biggest displays that our incomes will permit. In such circumstances small degradations in quality, such as are apparent between the Blu and HD-DVD versions of BOB, do matter and some guys who have both versions have already said that in motion the effects of the slight DNR on the Blu discs are more noticeable than on the screencaps.
Canary_Jules is offline  
post #158 of 257 Old 11-19-2008, 06:54 AM
Newbie
 
Polyglot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 5
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Just my two cents worth. I bought from Costco last night 54.99 and watched the first three episodes.

I see a massive improvement over regular DVD. I would not let this thread deter anyone from buying this set. The sound is awesome the picture is great. Yes some DNR in shots but coming from a military family. Do not let this forum deter from what this series was about. Remembering the Heroes from EZ Company.

Buy it, show your kids and grandkids. Let's not forget these men.
Polyglot is offline  
post #159 of 257 Old 11-19-2008, 09:18 AM
AVS Special Member
 
sspears's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: Sammamish, WA, USA
Posts: 5,250
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked: 53
Quote:


So its HBO who made that descision and not Warner?

The HBO titles are controlled by HBO. They dictate what is done, not WHV.
sspears is offline  
post #160 of 257 Old 11-19-2008, 01:43 PM
Senior Member
 
classical's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Vancouver █♣█
Posts: 244
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Canary_Jules View Post

But these are the AVScience forums and folks who frequent here don't have 'normal' set ups or watch 'normally'. We've spent thousands, perhaps tens of thousands, of shekels on AV equipment to get the best and biggest displays that our incomes will permit. In such circumstances small degradations in quality, such as are apparent between the Blu and HD-DVD versions of BOB, do matter and some guys who have both versions have already said that in motion the effects of the slight DNR on the Blu discs are more noticeable than on the screencaps.

Not all folks who frequent AVS forums are like what you've stated--me, for instance. I do understand that the guys reading this particular thread will tend to be of the picky sort. That's the nature of this thread, obviously.
classical is offline  
post #161 of 257 Old 11-19-2008, 01:51 PM
AVS Special Member
 
ack_bk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Maple Grove, MN
Posts: 8,836
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 26 Post(s)
Liked: 105
I apprciate the work of Xylon and others, and can also appreciate their stance on DNR and trying to hold studios accountable. Some people on AVS seem to go a little overboard though with this stuff. Now I prefer the HD DVD grain levels to the Blu-Ray, which clearly has some slight DNR, but to not rent or buy this BD because of this (DNR) seems extreme to me (unless you had the HD DVD). It is clearly better than the DVD and the cable/sat broadcasts that I have seen. There have been some titles (such as Gangs Of New York) where I canceled my order because of the excessive DNR and EE, but BoB is not even close to being on that level IMHO.
ack_bk is offline  
post #162 of 257 Old 11-19-2008, 02:14 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Gary Murrell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 10,927
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by sspears View Post

The HBO titles are controlled by HBO. They dictate what is done, not WHV.

why in the hell would HBO hire a team of filmmakers that knowingly would make a grainy gritty WWII series a la Saving Pvt. Ryan and then make sure it was DNR'd to remove the grain on video release, DVD and BD

someone needs to slap whoever at HBO is responsible for this and hard

-Gary
Gary Murrell is offline  
post #163 of 257 Old 11-19-2008, 02:22 PM
AVS Special Member
 
ack_bk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Maple Grove, MN
Posts: 8,836
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 26 Post(s)
Liked: 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Murrell View Post

why in the hell would HBO hire a team of filmmakers that knowingly would make a grainy gritty WWII series a la Saving Pvt. Ryan and then make sure it was DNR'd to remove the grain on video release, DVD and BD

someone needs to slap whoever at HBO is responsible for this and hard

-Gary

Honestly. Some marketing genius probably took some informal poll or survey amongst people (many of which do not even own HDTV's) and found that people preferred less grain to more grain and presented it at a meeting of executives and it was decided that DNR was the way to go because that is what "the masses" wanted. I have worked in many large tech companies (and also the government) and you would be shocked at how these types of decisions are made without actually talking to resident experts and the end users who actually buy the products. The suits and beancounters often make the decisions... And quite often, they are wrong...
ack_bk is offline  
post #164 of 257 Old 11-19-2008, 02:32 PM
Advanced Member
 
bruceames's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: San Rafael, CA
Posts: 803
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 121 Post(s)
Liked: 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by ack_bk View Post

I apprciate the work of Xylon and others, and can also appreciate their stance on DNR and trying to hold studios accountable. Some people on AVS seem to go a little overboard though with this stuff. Now I prefer the HD DVD grain levels to the Blu-Ray, which clearly has some slight DNR, but to not rent or buy this BD because of this (DNR) seems extreme to me (unless you had the HD DVD). It is clearly better than the DVD and the cable/sat broadcasts that I have seen. There have been some titles (such as Gangs Of New York) where I canceled my order because of the excessive DNR and EE, but BoB is not even close to being on that level IMHO.

True, it's not enough to cancel orders for those who really want it, especially with the awesome interactive extras, audio, and low price, but it certainly is disappointing that they dumbed down the PQ in any case. The Blu-ray version has a higher bitrate than the HD DVD, and yet it comes up short. For many that it not acceptable, and although they may settle for it and buy it, I understand people being upset and I don't think (hardly) anybody are overreacting. And the reactions are not only to this, it's the obvious trend toward grain scrubbing that will compromise future releases that have moderate to heavy grain.
bruceames is offline  
post #165 of 257 Old 11-19-2008, 03:53 PM
Senior Member
 
paulstachniak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Sunny Canada
Posts: 222
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
this thread just saved me 70 bucks.

HBO made a REALLY silly move with this title. I would hope Sopranos and other older titles don't suffer from this move as well in the future, or they'll be losing all my business.

hd-dvd vs blu-ray: whoever wins... we lose.
paulstachniak is offline  
post #166 of 257 Old 11-19-2008, 09:54 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Milt99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: West Of California
Posts: 5,146
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 48 Post(s)
Liked: 79
I don't know, I wouldn't blow off BOB because of this issue.
I had the DVD(gave it away) & HD DVD set and although I haven't watched it in awhile, I've watched the HD set 3 times through and plan on doing so again over Thanksgiving with friends and family.
Yeah, it sucks a bit that they didn't leave well enough alone, but I would bet that after one episode you'll forget about it enough to realize that this is one the best, if not the best, productions ever put together and it just gets better from there.

BOB is stirring, inspiring, touching and kick-ass without ever being maudlin or fake.
Every single actor portrays their character with an honesty that is rare and real.
If you're thinking about passing on this because of the DNR, do yourself a favor and Netflix it.

 

It ain't ignorance causes so much trouble; it's folks knowing so much that ain't so

Milt99 is offline  
post #167 of 257 Old 11-19-2008, 10:06 PM
tsb
AVS Special Member
 
tsb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 4,917
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
since I've seen the series in the last year I can easily wait for a better release

I want to go for the Japanese HD DVD set, but I think we'll get a better BD release somewhere eventually
tsb is offline  
post #168 of 257 Old 11-20-2008, 05:06 PM
Senior Member
 
paulstachniak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Sunny Canada
Posts: 222
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsb View Post

since I've seen the series in the last year I can easily wait for a better release

I want to go for the Japanese HD DVD set, but I think we'll get a better BD release somewhere eventually

i wouldn't see why. unless maybe enough people complain - otherwise this is just more silliness in the HD era. Now stuff looks TOO good, so we have to clean it up to make it look digital.

hd-dvd vs blu-ray: whoever wins... we lose.
paulstachniak is offline  
post #169 of 257 Old 11-20-2008, 05:19 PM
Senior Member
 
zinfamous's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 379
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsb View Post

since I've seen the series in the last year I can easily wait for a better release

I want to go for the Japanese HD DVD set, but I think we'll get a better BD release somewhere eventually

a ~$150 price premium to import a title from Japan, imo, verges on lunacy considering the relative difference in quality.
zinfamous is offline  
post #170 of 257 Old 11-20-2008, 05:57 PM
Advanced Member
 
webdev511's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 528
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by shadowrage View Post

I still think it's the way Warner uses the VC-1 codec and not DNR. If any of the other studios that still use VC-1 were to encode it like .... weinstein(?). Weinsten and Warner are the only VC-1 studios left?? at least Uni got it right with Doomsday when they used it.

It would probably look completely identical to the HD-DVD. Now if Warner would have just used the same AVC encode, well then they would have to look the same. Stupid studio/codec exclusivity. Switch teams Warner, everyones doing it.

DNR <> Codec

Case in point. Patton: encoded with AVC, yet some say it has a touch too much DNR.

@ lower bit rate AVC > VC-1
@ higher bit rate VC-1 > AVC

If a studio uses DNR, then all bets are off.

I have the HD DVD version, but don't have a single issue with endorsing the Blu release for my friends that ask me if the double dip is worth it or not.

Thanks for the Snaps Xylon!

Webdev511
San Jose, CA
TrueHD = DTS-MA = LPCM
Low Bit Rate AVC > Low Bit Rate VC-1
High Bit Rate VC-1 > High Bit Rate AVC
MPEG-2 = Great for DVD and that's about it.
webdev511 is offline  
post #171 of 257 Old 11-20-2008, 06:00 PM
AVS Special Member
 
42041's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 3,289
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 54
It's unfortunate that additional DNR has been applied but ultimately the loss of detail isn't great and I think this thread is quite an overreaction
42041 is offline  
post #172 of 257 Old 11-20-2008, 07:05 PM
Senior Member
 
SLUDGE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 420
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by zinfamous View Post

I'm not knocking Xylon's work--I think he contributes more to these pages than 90% of the members, and I think it is excellent work.

However, it is incredibly strange that so many people look at 2 screen grabs...2 SCREEN GRABS and are "OMFGDNRNOGRAINBBQ DO NOT WANT!!!" It's insane.

the majority of you that dump on this set haven't even seen it to compare--Many are admitting as much in their venomous posts. Those of us that have watched through this set seem to have come to some consensus:
--softness and detail fluctuate throughout.
--the majority of the grain remains throughout the series. (hell, in some shots, you can't see anything BUT grain--Eindhoven episode)
--it is clearly better than SD (though I don't think it's "far and away superior")

...being that those of us who have watched it agree that the softness fluctuates throughout, shouldn't you take the information you gain from a handful of pics with a grain of salt? And seriously, what kind of sense does it make to assume that a 2 second example of "DNR" means that it has been applied to the remaining 600 minutes? Ridiculous....

I guess this is the wrong forum--tech buffs more than film buffs. I know there are some true film fans in here, and I enjoy a lot of those comments. ...But when you take a series like this, and brand it "unpalatable" b/c of what you suddenly call DNR--even if it isn't there (see Kaiser's recent post in the Baraka thread...)--you probably shouldn't be into film collecting in the first place.

I can appreciate the criticism of studios using sub-par techniques, erasing the director's vision and such, catering to the least common denominator....but come on! Crying the end of the world on a set like this is beyond petty. There is absolutely nothing in the BD presentation of Band of Brothers that ruins the content of the series. Seriously, anyone willing to hold judgment until they hear what Hanks/Spielberg think about the transfer? What if they dub it "flawless?" Would heads explode?

Filmmakers are storytellers first and foremost. I personally can't understand owning a copy of, I don't know...."Click," just b/c it's on BD...what's the point? Who cares what the picture looks like when it's vomit on celluloid to begin with? Taste aside, so many enthusiasts in here seem to define film as PQ first, then Audio, then........story? what's story?

yeah, yeah, I know...wrong forums....

Zin


Very well written. The best post I read here in months. I totally agree with you.
SLUDGE is offline  
post #173 of 257 Old 11-20-2008, 08:43 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Hughmc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Oregon
Posts: 7,557
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by 42041 View Post

It's unfortunate that additional DNR has been applied but ultimately the loss of detail isn't great and I think this thread is quite an overreaction

I think as of late the whole BD forum is an overreaction to EVERY title and there are a large number of us who feel the same. It has become the "new drug". Heading off any comments, we that feel this way LOVE films and DO NOT settle for mediocrity or less than as some would try to lead everyone to believe. Condescending posts that alude to that belief do an injustice to those who feel like I and so many others do.


I certainly do not speak for the mods, but I will say with assurance that the mods feel the same and some comments in recent BD software threads by mods reflect that stance. When I got booted out of a thread, a first in four years of heavy posting at AVS, I mentioned to a mod in a PM how it must get old hearing the same bickering over and over about PQ issues. He got a chuckle out of it, because he and the other mods know. Its beyond old for a majority of us.

Many of us who do want the best possible PQ, but we feel like we are back to where the forum was last year with that other major forum dividing issue. It becomes an your either with us or against us situation, all or nothing, and it pisses me off, because I know it doesn't have to be that way.

Most important for many of us is that we know the PQ issues are there, but we aren't or try not to be extremists. We do want the closest possible presentation to film and the theatre as we can get and because some of us take the stance we do, it does not mean we don't want the best PQ.

We would probably get more done and more results from studios to make changes if we were close to being in agreement as opposed to thinking if one person or group doesn't agree entirely with the other, he or they are against us and our intent for better PQ.

IMO perception and approach on how to deal with these issues needs to change and we will get make more progress in the long term for the better of this forum and especially BD.
Hughmc is offline  
post #174 of 257 Old 11-20-2008, 09:27 PM
Senior Member
 
guste's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 329
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
These screencap threads (or the threads dedicated to each BR release) should include a poll, so that those who actually own the movie can let it be known how they feel about the PQ. Something with several poll options, so that those who are on the fence about the purchase can get a better idea of what the general mood is.

I suggest this, because it isn't as simple as two warring factions. It's many shades of grey, with varying levels of tolerance. Sure you have the extremes on both ends, but I think a lot of people are more moderate, ie. I want the best possible PQ, but we don't live in a perfect world, so I'll buy what I consider acceptable.

It's an imperfect solution, but it's better than this back and forth.
guste is offline  
post #175 of 257 Old 11-20-2008, 09:27 PM
AVS Special Member
 
rover2002's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 2,690
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hughmc View Post

I think as of late the whole BD forum is an overreaction to EVERY title and there are a large number of us who feel the same. It has become the "new drug". Heading off any comments, we that feel this way LOVE films and DO NOT settle for mediocrity or less than as some would try to lead everyone to believe. Condescending posts that alude to that belief do an injustice to those who feel like I and so many others do.


I certainly do not speak for the mods, but I will say with assurance that the mods feel the same and some comments in recent BD software threads by mods reflect that stance. When I got booted out of a thread, a first in four years of heavy posting at AVS, I mentioned to a mod in a PM how it must get old hearing the same bickering over and over about PQ issues. He got a chuckle out of it, because he and the other mods know. Its beyond old for a majority of us.

Many of us who do want the best possible PQ, but we feel like we are back to where the forum was last year with that other major forum dividing issue. It becomes an your either with us or against us situation, all or nothing, and it pisses me off, because I know it doesn't have to be that way.

Most important for many of us is that we know the PQ issues are there, but we aren't or try not to be extremists. We do want the closest possible presentation to film and the theatre as we can get and because some of us take the stance we do, it does not mean we don't want the best PQ.

We would probably get more done and more results from studios to make changes if we were close to being in agreement as opposed to thinking if one person or group doesn't agree entirely with the other, he or they are against us and our intent for better PQ.

IMO perception and approach on how to deal with these issues needs to change and we will get make more progress in the long term for the better of this forum and especially BD.

I actually find most posters are mature in there posting with the few exceptions to the rule being delt with by mods.
rover2002 is offline  
post #176 of 257 Old 11-20-2008, 09:35 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Hughmc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Oregon
Posts: 7,557
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by guste View Post

These screencap threads (or the threads dedicated to each BR release) should include a poll, so that those who actually own the movie can let it be known how they feel about the PQ. Something with several poll options, so that those who are on the fence about the purchase can get a better idea of what the general mood is.

I suggest this, because it isn't as simple as two warring factions. It's many shades of grey, with varying levels of tolerance. Sure you have the extremes on both ends, but I think a lot of people are more moderate, ie. I want the best possible PQ, but we don't live in a perfect world, so I'll buy what I find acceptable.

It's an imperfect solution, but it's better than this back and forth.

Ding, ding, ding!

I was thinking about having a poll earlier today. Excellent idea as long as it doesn't then become a one side berates the other for being in the majority based on poll results. The poll is what it is, we respect it and let it go.
Hughmc is offline  
post #177 of 257 Old 11-20-2008, 09:36 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Hughmc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Oregon
Posts: 7,557
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by rover2002 View Post

I actually find most posters are mature in there posting with the few exceptions to the rule being delt with by mods.

I agree most are reasonable.
Hughmc is offline  
post #178 of 257 Old 11-20-2008, 09:47 PM
tsb
AVS Special Member
 
tsb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 4,917
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hughmc View Post

Many of us who do want the best possible PQ, but we feel like we are back to where the forum was last year with that other major forum dividing issue. It becomes an your either with us or against us situation, all or nothing, and it pisses me off, because I know it doesn't have to be that way.


I wouldn't compare this to the BD/HD DVD divide, but, in a sense, it is a with us or against us issue. If you silently accept even the slightest bit of EE or DNR in a release, you are part of the problem. I'm not saying you should boycott every release, but if you remain silent, the studios won't know what you expect from HDM releases. I'm glad there are those constantly bringing these issues to light because these actions will most likely bring better releases in the future.
tsb is offline  
post #179 of 257 Old 11-20-2008, 09:51 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Dave Mack's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: NYC
Posts: 11,966
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
I think there are a couple of reasons that some get their donuts all knotted up over this title.
One: There IS another HD release that many believe is more faithful. Already released. (Granted as an import and on a format many who even bought in are abandoning)
Two: Why someone would feel compelled to do ANYTHING to the PQ DNR-wise on this title which is SUPPOSED to look gritty, grainy as a stylistic choice. Who made this call? Why? Even if it IS only in a handful of scenes, it does set a scary precedent. Universal released "THE THING" on BD and basically DNR'd the WHOLE film. The HDdvd, (which I DO own) looks better to most. So who's to say when and to what "grainy" film it will happen to again? We've seen "Patton", "Dark City"...
Will "Saving Private Ryan" have a similar "tweaking"...? I watched it in HD (the real HD, not that stretch-o-vision thing they sometimes do) on TNT last week and it looked TOTALLY smoothed over and just wrong.
So I think that's why some ARE making a big noise even if it seems like it is only in a handful of scenes now.


(or, everyone here is just whackapoodles...)


Dave Mack is offline  
post #180 of 257 Old 11-21-2008, 07:30 AM
 
FoxyMulder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Scotland
Posts: 5,860
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Mack View Post

I think there are a couple of reasons that some get their donuts all knotted up over this title.
One: There IS another HD release that many believe is more faithful. Already released. (Granted as an import and on a format many who even bought in are abandoning)
Two: Why someone would feel compelled to do ANYTHING to the PQ DNR-wise on this title which is SUPPOSED to look gritty, grainy as a stylistic choice. Who made this call? Why? Even if it IS only in a handful of scenes, it does set a scary precedent. Universal released "THE THING" on BD and basically DNR'd the WHOLE film. The HDdvd, (which I DO own) looks better to most. So who's to say when and to what "grainy" film it will happen to again? We've seen "Patton", "Dark City"...
Will "Saving Private Ryan" have a similar "tweaking"...? I watched it in HD (the real HD, not that stretch-o-vision thing they sometimes do) on TNT last week and it looked TOTALLY smoothed over and just wrong.
So I think that's why some ARE making a big noise even if it seems like it is only in a handful of scenes now.


(or, everyone here is just whackapoodles...)



We don't often agree Dave ( or do we ? ) But your post hits the nail on the head.....I think it really all depends on your screen size too and i mean that in a non elitist way....The bigger your screen the more likely DNR or other "faults" become objectionable as you notice things more and i don't mean really huge i'm talking 60inch+.

I can't speak for America but over here in the UK i have noticed our digital satellite broadcasts always smooth over everything so films, tv shows, sports shows all have a smooth look to them....Imagine switching on a Blu Ray and watching some film with a grain structure after months of watching hours and hours of television....I was trying to make some point here about all that but i forgot what i was going to write....Gee i'm only 39 and my memory is fading.
FoxyMulder is offline  
Reply Blu-ray Software

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off