Prince Caspian comparison *PIX* - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 05:37 AM - Thread Starter
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post #2 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 05:38 AM - Thread Starter
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post #3 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 05:38 AM - Thread Starter
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post #4 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 05:38 AM - Thread Starter
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Blu-ray File size: 30.10 GB

Bitrate: 19.02 mbps


Code:
                                                                                                                Total   Video                                        

     
Title                                                           Codec   Length  Movie Size      Disc Size       Bitrate Bitrate Main Audio Track                     

     Secondary Audio Track
-----                                                           ------  ------- --------------  --------------  ------- ------- ------------------                   

     ---------------------
Prince Caspian                                                  AVC     2:29:58 32,334,280,704  48,701,230,477  28.75   19.02   DTS-HD Master 5.1 4034Kbps 

(48kHz/24-bit) 


DISC INFO:

Disc Size:      48,701,230,477 bytes
Protection:     AACS
BD-Java:        Yes

PLAYLIST REPORT:

Name:           00034.mpls
Size:           32,334,280,704 bytes
Length:         2:29:58 (h:m:s)
Total Bitrate:  28.75 Mbps
Description:    

FILES:

Name            Size            Length          Time In         Time Out        
----            ----            ------          -------         --------        
00034.M2TS      32,334,280,704  2:29:58.656     0:00:00.000     2:29:58.656     

VIDEO:

Codec               Bitrate         Description     
-----               -------         -----------     
MPEG-4 AVC Video    19016 kbps      1080p / 23.976fps / 16:9 / High Profile 4.1

AUDIO:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description     
-----                           --------        -------         -----------     
DTS-HD Master Audio             English         4034 kbps       5.1 / 48kHz / 24-bit / 4034kbps (DTS Core: 5.1 / 48kHz / 24-bit / 1536kbps)
Dolby Digital Audio             Chinese         640 kbps        5.1 / 48kHz / 640kbps
Dolby Digital Audio             French          640 kbps        5.1 / 48kHz / 640kbps
Dolby Digital Audio             Portuguese      640 kbps        5.1 / 48kHz / 640kbps
Dolby Digital Audio             Spanish         640 kbps        5.1 / 48kHz / 640kbps
Dolby Digital Audio             Thai            640 kbps        5.1 / 48kHz / 640kbps
Dolby Digital Audio             English         192 kbps        2.0 / 48kHz / 192kbps

SUBTITLES:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description     
-----                           --------        -------         -----------     
Presentation Graphics           English         13 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           English         50 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           Chinese         10 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           Chinese         10 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           Chinese         40 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           Chinese         38 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           French          13 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           French          0 kbps                          
Presentation Graphics           French          44 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           Indonesian      13 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           Korean          8 kbps                          
Presentation Graphics           Korean          38 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           Malay           14 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           Portuguese      12 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           Portuguese      0 kbps                          
Presentation Graphics           Portuguese      43 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           Spanish         11 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           Spanish         0 kbps                          
Presentation Graphics           Spanish         42 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           Thai            16 kbps                         
Presentation Graphics           Thai            0 kbps                          
Presentation Graphics           Thai            60 kbps                         

CHAPTERS:

Number          Time            Length          Avg Video Rate  Max 1-Sec Rate  Max 1-Sec Time  Max 5-Sec Rate  Max 5-Sec Time  Max 10Sec Rate  Max 10Sec Time  Avg 

Frame Size  Max Frame Size  Max Frame Time  
------          ----            ------          --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  ---

-----------  --------------  --------------  
1               0:00:00.000     0:08:32.512     17,487 kbps     33,525 kbps     00:07:01.171    28,766 kbps     00:00:33.408    24,817 kbps     00:01:12.614    

91,168 bytes    456,817 bytes   00:07:59.229    
2               0:08:32.512     0:07:18.772     20,305 kbps     30,402 kbps     00:15:37.436    27,907 kbps     00:15:39.772    27,338 kbps     00:15:33.182    

105,859 bytes   428,470 bytes   00:15:50.783    
3               0:15:51.284     0:04:03.284     19,311 kbps     27,331 kbps     00:19:03.601    23,466 kbps     00:16:18.477    22,928 kbps     00:16:18.561    

100,680 bytes   367,082 bytes   00:17:31.259    
4               0:19:54.568     0:07:09.846     19,646 kbps     34,304 kbps     00:23:43.547    30,088 kbps     00:23:40.210    26,219 kbps     00:19:59.198    

102,426 bytes   430,533 bytes   00:19:54.610    
5               0:27:04.414     0:05:53.061     18,835 kbps     33,111 kbps     00:31:54.329    24,654 kbps     00:32:09.052    21,798 kbps     00:32:04.047    

98,196 bytes    378,836 bytes   00:32:56.808    
6               0:32:57.475     0:10:11.445     22,887 kbps     34,192 kbps     00:38:01.488    29,953 kbps     00:34:23.561    29,087 kbps     00:36:17.717    

119,320 bytes   435,209 bytes   00:40:44.692    
7               0:43:08.920     0:03:10.857     18,059 kbps     30,139 kbps     00:45:54.251    23,971 kbps     00:45:44.367    22,695 kbps     00:45:46.202    

94,150 bytes    441,216 bytes   00:44:45.516    
8               0:46:19.777     0:09:53.259     21,423 kbps     34,623 kbps     00:46:39.213    30,957 kbps     00:51:28.294    29,512 kbps     00:51:20.619    

111,688 bytes   435,554 bytes   00:50:05.002    
9               0:56:13.036     0:04:47.162     20,780 kbps     32,784 kbps     00:59:59.262    30,613 kbps     00:58:44.187    30,036 kbps     00:58:43.520    

108,340 bytes   423,887 bytes   00:58:40.142    
10              1:01:00.198     0:03:50.647     17,690 kbps     26,644 kbps     01:01:47.370    23,580 kbps     01:01:46.286    20,757 kbps     01:03:50.410    

92,225 bytes    331,409 bytes   01:04:24.235    
11              1:04:50.845     0:16:49.259     18,278 kbps     33,043 kbps     01:17:39.947    25,170 kbps     01:10:32.937    23,583 kbps     01:06:30.904    

95,291 bytes    399,421 bytes   01:12:00.441    
12              1:21:40.104     0:02:23.393     20,311 kbps     30,146 kbps     01:22:54.720    24,015 kbps     01:21:52.366    23,430 kbps     01:21:58.288    

105,891 bytes   383,622 bytes   01:22:37.828    
13              1:24:03.497     0:01:16.618     20,249 kbps     29,552 kbps     01:25:14.526    25,784 kbps     01:25:14.526    24,154 kbps     01:25:10.147    

105,569 bytes   408,020 bytes   01:25:05.684    
14              1:25:20.115     0:08:34.764     19,289 kbps     34,198 kbps     01:30:25.378    26,129 kbps     01:29:20.355    25,492 kbps     01:29:15.600    

100,564 bytes   409,478 bytes   01:29:06.758    
15              1:33:54.879     0:05:17.734     20,551 kbps     30,270 kbps     01:34:36.045    27,346 kbps     01:34:34.711    25,146 kbps     01:36:25.780    

107,144 bytes   415,638 bytes   01:36:28.950    
16              1:39:12.613     0:12:36.256     21,142 kbps     40,309 kbps     01:51:44.114    30,002 kbps     01:39:22.415    27,626 kbps     01:41:16.362    

110,227 bytes   495,239 bytes   01:41:27.290    
17              1:51:48.869     0:06:58.084     21,424 kbps     40,426 kbps     01:53:58.707    29,553 kbps     01:52:22.861    27,075 kbps     01:52:18.690    

111,693 bytes   482,409 bytes   01:52:36.249    
18              1:58:46.953     0:05:07.391     21,883 kbps     34,165 kbps     02:00:57.000    31,112 kbps     02:00:57.000    28,851 kbps     02:00:54.956    

114,087 bytes   487,793 bytes   01:59:12.771    
19              2:03:54.344     0:02:33.403     24,716 kbps     33,109 kbps     02:05:26.310    30,227 kbps     02:05:21.889    29,560 kbps     02:05:20.763    

128,860 bytes   461,930 bytes   02:05:09.919    
20              2:06:27.747     0:04:47.704     20,220 kbps     31,728 kbps     02:10:29.905    26,092 kbps     02:10:11.345    24,891 kbps     02:10:07.383    

105,419 bytes   489,763 bytes   02:08:37.084    
21              2:11:15.451     0:06:30.932     20,901 kbps     43,094 kbps     02:17:21.191    32,770 kbps     02:17:21.191    29,933 kbps     02:17:21.191    

108,971 bytes   483,900 bytes   02:12:50.379    
22              2:17:46.383     0:12:12.273     6,057 kbps      25,523 kbps     02:29:55.528    14,964 kbps     02:29:51.524    13,637 kbps     02:29:46.519    

31,579 bytes    427,534 bytes   02:29:55.570    

STREAM DIAGNOSTICS:

File            PID             Type            Seconds         Bytes           Packets         Bitrate         
----            ---             ----            -------         -----           -------         -------         
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00034.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x81            8998.66         719,895,040     4,218,135       640             
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00034.M2TS      4614 (0x1206)   0x90            8998.66         11,258,193      66,758          10              
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00034.M2TS      4629 (0x1215)   0x90            8998.66         42,558,866      245,285         38


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post #5 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 05:38 AM - Thread Starter
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A natural "film like look" on a transfer? No way! Where is the pasty look? Smearing? Force fields? Did the DNR and EE machine break? tsk, tsk

I can see some minor arti . . . . . . ahh f*** it. Reference PQ and AQ. Film grain visible throughout the movie. A very satisfactory HT viewing experience.

BTW this movie has scenes shot in New Zealand.

That is all. Enjoy the pix


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post #6 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 05:38 AM - Thread Starter
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post #7 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 07:11 AM
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I miss the force fields.. It makes me feel like the actors are protected..

Michael

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post #8 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 07:27 AM
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Love this movie, especially the action scenes near the end (Peter v. Miras, etc). Glad to see that Disney treated it so well (though, was there really any doubt? I love you, Disney ).

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post #9 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 07:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffroy View Post

Love this movie, especially the action scenes near the end (Peter v. Miras, etc). Glad to see that Disney treated it so well (though, was there really any doubt? I love you, Disney ).

Or did they?

A couple reviewers in the review thread said there's noise in some dark scenes. Hmmmmmmm...... what to do?

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...with a bitrate meter and screencaps.
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post #10 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 08:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ILJG View Post

Or did they?

A couple reviewers in the review thread said there's noise in some dark scenes. Hmmmmmmm...... what to do?

That could be some film grain. It is more visible in dark scenes, and it's nature of the medium, not something I would call "noise".
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post #11 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 08:21 AM
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Wow in the third set of pictures you can't even make out the steps in the ruins in the background on the DVD. Talk about night and day...

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post #12 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 08:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oliver Klohs View Post

That could be some film grain. It is more visible in dark scenes, and it's nature of the medium, not something I would call "noise".

The problem I've come to realize is many reviewers interpret grain as noise and is something undesirable. I'm not sure what the backgrounds are of many reviewers but it seems as though the majority know how to write yet lack the proper scope of knowledge of the medium of film. Clearly there are those who know what they are discussing, they far and few between.

You are absolutely correct, dependent on the situation grain will become more apparent in darker scenes.

However I did notice on I Am Legend on a buddies Pearl projector in the scene when WS character is entering a building to find his dog that there were instances of blocking in the darker areas. Not terrible and most likely not noticeable on most folks setups, at that time he preferred to have his settings very bright which of course is not the proper way of doing things. ;}

From those pix Xylon has posted so far, this look like a great transfer! Looks like they used one of the newer Kodak film stocks. Very fine grain structure.

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post #13 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 08:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gekkou View Post

Wow in the third set of pictures you can't even make out the steps in the ruins in the background [DVD]. Talk about night and day...

first thing I noticed. Amazing.
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post #14 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 08:45 AM
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A natural "film like look" on a transfer? No way! Where is the pasty look? Smearing? Force fields? Did the DNR and EE machine break? tsk, tsk

I can see some minor arti . . . . . . ahh f*** it. Reference PQ and AQ. Film grain visible throughout the movie. A very satisfactory HT viewing experience.

That is all. Enjoy the pix



very nice
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post #15 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 09:07 AM
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Looks like a... not very good DVD? Look at the third shot.. you can't even see the stairs in the ruins, it just looks like a rock. That's not even what I'd call "fine" detail, and it's still completely missing on the DVD. Hm.

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post #16 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 10:48 AM
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LOL FORCE FIELD!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Xylon i love you (in platonic and virtual way...)

89+ Blu-ray Disc ;)
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post #17 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 11:06 AM
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Xylon, could you please post a couple of screenies of the Mice during the castle raid? It happens around 1hr8min into the movie. I wrote a review of this for the PQ thread, this time frame as well as the backgrounds around when they are being flown into the castle(around 1hr5min) are areas where I personally had issues, although they were so minor I still rated it tier 0. I loved how this movie looked on my setup, but have no idea how to explain the parts that looked weird to me. The mice themselves I found to look fantastic, it was just the background behind them seemed... pixelated/compressed/something. Maybe it was just grain. I'd love to hear/see someone else's take on it.

thanks for the screenies, the BRD ones look fantastic. Especially the first one with the water, I loved how that looked.


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post #18 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 12:03 PM
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For the record, Ralph Potts noted this as reference in his review. I was the person who thought that the title had some noise in dark areas. One thing to keep in mind it that with HD we can sometimes get accustomed to a look lacking grain and then when a film is released on BD that has grain, we see it as noise. I may very well fall into that category with regards to this title I am watching on a 2.35 scope screen that's 16 foot wide, so everything really jumps out. As I mentioned in another thread, if this is film grain, then it is intentional and therefore is a non-issue. To my eyes, upon first viewing, it looked noisy (ONLY in dark scenes). I do plan to watch again, taking note of the "issues" I saw first and will then try to determine what it is that I am seeing, or not seeing, whatever the case may be One thing is for sure, it is VERY refreshing to finally have a level of quality that will allow such scrutiny. When I watch a scope film on HDDVD or BD in my screening room, I am completely engrossed. Standard DVD is fine, despite the limited resolution, but BD really tops the theater going experience.

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post #19 of 138 Old 12-06-2008, 06:56 PM
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Just finished watching my copy today. This is definitely demo material. Great PQ, but especially nice to have a DTS MA 7.1 audio presentation.
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post #20 of 138 Old 12-07-2008, 12:22 AM
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What a breath of fresh air compared to The Dark Knight screenshots (IMAX shots included).
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post #21 of 138 Old 12-07-2008, 12:49 AM
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Wow in the third set of pictures you can't even make out the steps in the ruins in the background on the DVD. Talk about night and day...

Yeah I noticed that too... and people wonder why I can't go back to DVD now (when I have a choice)...
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post #22 of 138 Old 12-07-2008, 02:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TSHA222 View Post

For the record, Ralph Potts noted this as reference in his review. I was the person who thought that the title had some noise in dark areas. One thing to keep in mind it that with HD we can sometimes get accustomed to a look lacking grain and then when a film is released on BD that has grain, we see it as noise. I may very well fall into that category with regards to this title I am watching on a 2.35 scope screen that's 16 foot wide, so everything really jumps out. As I mentioned in another thread, if this is film grain, then it is intentional and therefore is a non-issue. To my eyes, upon first viewing, it looked noisy (ONLY in dark scenes). I do plan to watch again, taking note of the "issues" I saw first and will then try to determine what it is that I am seeing, or not seeing, whatever the case may be One thing is for sure, it is VERY refreshing to finally have a level of quality that will allow such scrutiny. When I watch a scope film on HDDVD or BD in my screening room, I am completely engrossed. Standard DVD is fine, despite the limited resolution, but BD really tops the theater going experience.

Chris White

Dark scenes mean faster film with coarser grain. I don't think there's any way to avoid this short of nasty digital manipulation.
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post #23 of 138 Old 12-07-2008, 05:49 AM
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Xylon, it appears you have the same version as me (bought in Asia). On the box it list English DTS 7.1, no sign of MA or Uncompressed audio yet you list DTS MA, is this a simple case of there but not listed?
Gonna be a few hours before i can pop it in and check sadly!
Tks
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post #24 of 138 Old 12-07-2008, 09:30 AM
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Congratulations, Xylon. You just forced me to update my sig.

...and I need your sweet love, Latina T-Mobile girl!

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post #25 of 138 Old 12-07-2008, 09:57 AM
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That could be some film grain. It is more visible in dark scenes, and it's nature of the medium, not something I would call "noise".

The problem I've come to realize is many reviewers interpret grain as noise and is something undesirable.

Well, film grain essentially is noise. It's not digital noise, and it's not necessarily something we want removed when film is transferred to digital, as it becomes part of the original art, and there are also negative side effects of removing it. Noise is intentionally added to art all the time, and film grain can be intentional. But in most cases, it is just a side effect of the film process, rather than an intentionally added effect.


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post #26 of 138 Old 12-07-2008, 11:02 AM
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Xylon, it appears you have the same version as me (bought in Asia). On the box it list English DTS 7.1, no sign of MA or Uncompressed audio yet you list DTS MA, is this a simple case of there but not listed?
Gonna be a few hours before i can pop it in and check sadly!
Tks

It has DTS MA just not listed on the case!!
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post #27 of 138 Old 12-07-2008, 11:28 AM
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The difference between the DVD and the Blu-ray is huge; the latter looks outstanding.
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post #28 of 138 Old 12-07-2008, 08:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rover2002 View Post

Xylon, it appears you have the same version as me (bought in Asia). On the box it list English DTS 7.1, no sign of MA or Uncompressed audio yet you list DTS MA, is this a simple case of there but not listed?
Gonna be a few hours before i can pop it in and check sadly!
Tks

You need DTS-HD HR or DTS-HD MA to get to 7.1 with their codecs..

Dinsey's been using MA, and very few are using HR, so I'd say it's MA (like here in the states) and just an oversight on the materials, I would imagine.
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post #29 of 138 Old 12-07-2008, 08:40 PM
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the shot with the stairs looks bad even for DVD...


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post #30 of 138 Old 12-07-2008, 09:42 PM
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I put some captures of this in the Blu-ray HD movie screenshot thread for anyone who want to see more.

I thought this looked fantastic throughout and was a pretty good movie to boot - although I was a little surprised how violent it was.

As far as the nighttime castle raid scenes go, those certainly had quite a bit of grain but it looked fairly natural and well-translated to me.

Here's an example shot where the grain get a little splotchy and blocked up in places if this is what you were referring to geekyglassesgirl:



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