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post #451 of 562 Old 11-22-2009, 11:27 PM
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Originally Posted by PeterTHX View Post

Because soundtracks seem bombastic and juiced?

All I know is I can't watch Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen with my 3 year old because it's "too loud" for him as his mother says (no DRC, thanks DTS).

that's why God invented subtitles
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post #452 of 562 Old 11-22-2009, 11:53 PM
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Originally Posted by tsb View Post

that's why God invented subtitles

Dude, he's three (albeit an advanced three). I didn't have this issue with the original Transformers.

I also can watch Heat after his bedtime and not have the gunbattle wake him up, thanks to TrueHD's DRC availability.

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post #453 of 562 Old 11-23-2009, 08:38 AM
 
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Well, this new release has at least one line of dialog deleted ("Ferocious, aren't I"). Perhaps more. Glad I rented.
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post #454 of 562 Old 11-23-2009, 08:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joel Clemons View Post

Well, this new release has at least one line of dialog deleted ("Ferocious, aren't I"). Perhaps more. Glad I rented.

Yes, removing that line completely destroys the movie and makes the inferior 480i SD DVD better to watch.

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post #455 of 562 Old 11-23-2009, 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Joel Clemons View Post

Well, this new release has at least one line of dialog deleted ("Ferocious, aren't I"). Perhaps more. Glad I rented.

I always thought that line was lame and self-indulgent. I'm glad it is gone.

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post #456 of 562 Old 11-23-2009, 09:23 AM
 
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Originally Posted by TimV View Post

I always thought that line was lame and self-indulgent. I'm glad it is gone.

Well, there are a number of lines that you can say that about. My concern is whether other lines are missing as well.
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post #457 of 562 Old 11-23-2009, 12:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Milt99 View Post

Re: DTS, it just seems to me that the most bombastic\\juiced soundtracks happen to be DTS\\DTS-MA.
It was that way on DVD and it's that way on BD. I know that inherently, there aren't supposed to be any differences between lossless codecs but for whatever reason, TrueHD soundtracks sound more balanced\
atural whatever you want to call it, to me.


Isn't that the nature of DTS - turning up the db's?

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post #458 of 562 Old 11-23-2009, 01:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joel Clemons View Post

Well, there are a number of lines that you can say that about. My concern is whether other lines are missing as well.

One could argue if you don't remember them being there, maybe they weren't that memorable to begin with.

Heat is one of my favorites, and it would not be an exaggeration to say watching this on BD is the most I've enjoyed it since the first time I saw it. Whatever Mann did change, he did not change the essence of the film.

I mean it's not like he changed to McCauley Shoots First.
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post #459 of 562 Old 11-23-2009, 03:55 PM
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Originally Posted by tripleM View Post

Isn't that the nature of DTS - turning up the db's?

The folklore will never end.

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post #460 of 562 Old 11-23-2009, 04:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joel Clemons View Post

Well, this new release has at least one line of dialog deleted ("Ferocious, aren't I"). Perhaps more. Glad I rented.

I'm not familiar. Which character said this in the original film and when?


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post #461 of 562 Old 11-23-2009, 04:53 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Rob Tomlin View Post

I'm not familiar. Which character said this in the original film and when?

Pacino said it during the "Great A$$!" part.

NSFW Link.
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post #462 of 562 Old 11-23-2009, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Rob Tomlin View Post

I'm not familiar. Which character said this in the original film and when?

Vincent Hanna at 118mins. 36 secs.
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post #463 of 562 Old 11-23-2009, 05:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Steeb View Post

Pacino said it during the "Great A$$!" part.

NSFW Link.

Thanks Steeb.

That scene works better without that line imo.


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post #464 of 562 Old 11-23-2009, 06:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thehun View Post

The folklore will never end.

Seeing that the folklore of DTS-MA somehow sounding "better" than TrueHD is rampant on these (and other) boards are you surprised?

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post #465 of 562 Old 11-23-2009, 06:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Tomlin View Post

Thanks Steeb.

That scene works better without that line imo.

I looked at the BD today, because someone brought it up before in this thread that the whole line about the great ass etc was gone, but it wasn't. I thought the ferocious part was left in and I looked again a little while ago and it is gone on the BD and it is on the DVD as the video link shows. I can see why it was cut. As much as I thought the line cut was an integral part of Pacino going off in that scene, the camera isn't even on him when he says the now cut line and the scene flows better without it. Interesting.
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post #466 of 562 Old 11-23-2009, 09:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterTHX View Post

Seeing that the folklore of DTS-MA somehow sounding "better" than TrueHD is rampant on these (and other) boards are you surprised?

I did qualify my statement about lossless codecs but I still stand by observation that DTS tracks have a history of hot LFE and still do.
That doesn't mean that I think DTS-MA is inherently hot in the LFE because I don't.
I also don't understand the current preference for DTS-MA over TrueHD.
Bottom line, I like a good balanced mix and I really don't care what codec is used.
To me the main advantage of lossless that I hear is not in the lower frequencies but in the dialog and upper frequencies.

 

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post #467 of 562 Old 11-23-2009, 10:49 PM
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Originally Posted by PeterTHX View Post

Seeing that the folklore of DTS-MA somehow sounding "better" than TrueHD is rampant on these (and other) boards are you surprised?

My m(d)isinformation and letter writing campaign totally worked. Seriously.
...Then Paramount starting releasing TrueHD titles and I liked Dolby again(not more than DTS though), but by then it was too late.
But yeah both mostly work the same.

Dolby has one more card to play though - giving me a 16 channel track on the Avatar BD. Someone will figure out how to play it back.

I kind of wish they could have had the original mixing team get new recordings and remix Heat with more modern technology, it would push the audio right over the edge, even though its still very impressive.

Ridiculous codec tier sig gone. Still AVC/24bit lossless fanboy.

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post #468 of 562 Old 11-24-2009, 04:17 AM
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Originally Posted by shadowrage View Post

I kind of wish they could have had the original mixing team get new recordings and remix Heat with more modern technology, it would push the audio right over the edge, even though its still very impressive.

Hard to beat the orginal recording. That live sound is menacing.

But what modern equipment are you talking about that you thought lacked here?
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post #469 of 562 Old 11-24-2009, 07:27 AM
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Originally Posted by MovieSwede View Post

Hard to beat the orginal recording. That live sound is menacing.

But what modern equipment are you talking about that you thought lacked here?

They recorded the shootout sounds when they were filming?

I meant recordings for the cars(those are a little lacking IMO) and maybe some of the guns. And remix with a little more LFE for crashes and things like that.

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post #470 of 562 Old 11-24-2009, 12:28 PM
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Yes after weeks of audio postproduction Mann ditched the postsound and went with the live audiorecording from the shootout. And I have never heard such realistic audio ever.
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post #471 of 562 Old 11-24-2009, 01:11 PM
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Originally Posted by MovieSwede View Post

Yes after weeks of audio postproduction Mann ditched the postsound and went with the live audiorecording from the shootout. And I have never heard such realistic audio ever.

Agreed, except for the lack of sounds of the bullets themselves, which I consider a minor issue. The echos from the buildings is something that no amount of post processing could ever create,
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post #472 of 562 Old 11-24-2009, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by PeterTHX View Post

Seeing that the folklore of DTS-MA somehow sounding "better" than TrueHD is rampant on these (and other) boards are you surprised?

No I'm not surprised, but rather amused by it, that how many times things been explained there are some still spreading silly baseless misinformation about this subject.

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post #473 of 562 Old 11-24-2009, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by MovieSwede View Post

Yes after weeks of audio postproduction Mann ditched the postsound and went with the live audiorecording from the shootout. And I have never heard such realistic audio ever.

I need to sit down and watch those extras. I made the comment when I listened to Predator 2 that I thought the gunshots in the behind the scenes stuff sounded better. If only Mann had used real bullets too

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post #474 of 562 Old 11-24-2009, 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted by MovieSwede View Post

Yes after weeks of audio postproduction Mann ditched the postsound and went with the live audiorecording from the shootout. And I have never heard such realistic audio ever.

I doubt that everything you hear on that scene is original recording, do you have a link or was this disclosed on the commentary?


As for realistic, just how many shootouts were you witnessed in an environment like downtown LA ?

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post #475 of 562 Old 11-24-2009, 04:15 PM
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Originally Posted by thehun View Post

I doubt that everything you hear on that scene is original recording, do you have a link or was this disclosed on the commentary?

The shooting was live, I guess they added other sounds in post.
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As for realistic, just how many shootouts were you witnessed in an environment like downtown LA ?



Cant say that I witnessed many.
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post #476 of 562 Old 11-24-2009, 04:32 PM
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Originally Posted by rdgrimes View Post

Agreed, except for the lack of sounds of the bullets themselves, which I consider a minor issue. The echos from the buildings is something that no amount of post processing could ever create,

Well considering they were using blanks, I won't hold that against him.
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post #477 of 562 Old 11-24-2009, 04:34 PM
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Originally Posted by thehun View Post

As for realistic, just how many shootouts were you witnessed in an environment like downtown LA ?

As far as audio for the firearms used, they were indeed very accurate (gun owner myself). Obviously some loss will occur during capture since they are so loud.
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post #478 of 562 Old 11-24-2009, 06:45 PM
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Originally Posted by metalsaber View Post

As far as audio for the firearms used, they were indeed very accurate (gun owner myself). Obviously some loss will occur during capture since they are so loud.

Same here and I own an AR. The one issue I have is the bullet holes in the vehicles. Those entry holes seem to be much bigger than what the caliber of an AR or most other guns could or would normally create. Maybe a shotgun slug could create those holes. I know they were going for effect, but some of those craters were ridiculous. Oh and the fact that even cars from the 90's really wont stop bullets very well, as in the police cars. Maybe the 60's and before some of that steel was heavy enough gauge, but I laugh at many movies today that people during gun fights use a car for protection. Maybe if you were standing behind the car and had the length of the vehicle to protect you and or the engine block, but side to side, forget it. Unless it is a Volvo or Saab with the reinforced aircraft steel in the doors.
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post #479 of 562 Old 11-24-2009, 07:17 PM
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So, what's the general consensus on the "real" sounding audio?

Does everyone like it, or would you rather hear that than the usual "pumped up" stuff we're all used to getting that shows off our sound systems so well?

Stephen.

Chances are very good that I was drinking when I posted the above.

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post #480 of 562 Old 11-24-2009, 07:38 PM
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Originally Posted by sb1 View Post

So, what's the general consensus on the "real" sounding audio?

Does everyone like it, or would you rather hear that than the usual "pumped up" stuff we're all used to getting that shows off our sound systems so well?

If given the choice, I would prefer to have the real sounds like in Heat. I think it would give the viewer the feeling of actually being there. MM does it so well that you actually feel you are part of a movie rather than just a viewer.
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