Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind - HD DVD vs Blu-rays comparison PIX - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 23 Old 09-06-2009, 05:35 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
msgohan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 2,856
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
I posted a comparison last year between the Japanese Blu-ray and American HD DVD, but since I didn't have access to the HD DVD it was a little tough.

[EDIT Jan 2011: Added US Blu-ray shots and specs courtesy of Cinema Squid]

Well, they're clearly all from the same film-to-video transfer. IMDB indicates that the movie was shot on 35mm and edited on 2K Digital Intermediate so I guess this is about as good as this movie will look (and the overlay/credits texts are definitely digitally-sourced).

But apparently Alliance's authoring house for this disc (La Boîte numérique) felt that they needed to boost the brightness... And at times, their encode also kills grain and large chunks of detail.

Universal's HD DVD VC-1 holds up admirably to the 187% larger Japanese AVC -- in fact it contains some I-frames that are larger than their counterparts on the AVC disc.

Note that I added 4 black lines to the top of the HD DVD image and cropped 4 from the bottom in order to align it properly with the other two (this was the final step, after conversion to RGB). It's one of those discs where the top and bottom matte bars are different sizes.
msgohan is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 23 Old 09-06-2009, 05:35 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
msgohan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 2,856
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15


15.00Mbps AVC | Blu-ray | Canada | Alliance | 2009-06-02
20.08Mbps VC-1 | HD DVD | United States | Universal | 2007-04-24
33.02Mbps AVC | Blu-ray | United States | Universal | 2011-01-25
37.57Mbps AVC | Blu-ray | Japan | GAGA Communications | 2008-03-21

Blu-ray (CA) bitrate and frame size/type graphs

HD DVD bitrate and frame size/type graphs

Blu-ray (US) bitrate and frame size/type graphs

Blu-ray (JP) bitrate and frame size/type graphs
msgohan is offline  
post #3 of 23 Old 09-06-2009, 05:36 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
msgohan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 2,856
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
....... Alliance CA Blu-ray vs Universal HD DVD vs Universal Blu-ray vs GAGA JP Blu-ray
#01:
#02:
#03:
#04:
#05:
#06:
#07:
#08:
#09:
#10:
#11:
#12:
#13:
msgohan is offline  
post #4 of 23 Old 09-06-2009, 06:47 AM
 
Thunderbolt8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 643
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
just wondering, does wmv9 perhaps look a tiny bit better than libavcodec for vc-1?
Thunderbolt8 is offline  
post #5 of 23 Old 09-06-2009, 08:02 AM
AVS Special Member
 
stumlad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 2,399
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Jap seems to be a bit better than the HD DVD, but neither of them look to have a lot of fine detail -- may just be the way the master was. Canadian looks smoothed, and once again shows why we should wait for US blu release.

Lex Luthor, Ruler of Australia, activate the machine!
stumlad is offline  
post #6 of 23 Old 09-06-2009, 09:14 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Deviation's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Coon Rapids, MN
Posts: 2,780
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by stumlad View Post

Jap seems to be a bit better than the HD DVD, but neither of them look to have a lot of fine detail -- may just be the way the master was. Canadian looks smoothed, and once again shows why we should wait for US blu release.

The Canadian release is from an HD cable master, opened up from 1.85 to 1.78 and is at a much lower bit rate, which are both typical of Alliance releases.

I love how they severely blew out the contrast on the cover art of the Japanese release - to the point where Kate Winslet almost looks Japanese in that image.
Deviation is offline  
post #7 of 23 Old 09-06-2009, 09:30 AM
AVS Special Member
 
lgans316's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Barking, Essex, London
Posts: 6,807
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 17
It should be noted that the JP Blu is transferred from a film source instead of DI.

Blu-ray : 340
lgans316 is offline  
post #8 of 23 Old 09-06-2009, 11:09 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Kram Sacul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 5,257
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
They're all from the same transfer so I don't think so.

The JP BD and HD-DVD appear to have less definition in the house shot.
Kram Sacul is offline  
post #9 of 23 Old 09-06-2009, 11:33 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Deviation's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Coon Rapids, MN
Posts: 2,780
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 16
Too bad about all of the EE in this title. I know it's way too much to expect Universal to fix it for their eventual BD release.
Deviation is offline  
post #10 of 23 Old 09-06-2009, 05:14 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
msgohan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 2,856
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kram Sacul View Post

The JP BD and HD-DVD appear to have less definition in the house shot.

Yeah, not sure what's going on there. They also have some lines inside the windows that aren't there in the Alliance though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunderbolt8 View Post

just wondering, does wmv9 perhaps look a tiny bit better than libavcodec for vc-1?

Nope.

I can't even get WMV9 to produce output identical to itself -- it occasionally smooths random frames in one instance of a graph and not another. libavcodec doesn't have this problem...

AviSynth script (I have to remux EVO files to MKV or M2TS to get them to seek properly)
Code:
libavcodec = DirectShowSource("I-EternalSunshineHDDVD.mkv_libavcodec.grf",audio=false).ConvertToRGB(matrix="rec709")
wmv9codec1 = DirectShowSource("I-EternalSunshineHDDVD.mkv_WMV9AdvancedProfileDecoder.grf",audio=false).ConvertToRGB(matrix="rec709")
wmv9codec2 = DirectShowSource("I-EternalSunshineHDDVD.mkv_WMV9AdvancedProfileDecoder.grf",audio=false).ConvertToRGB(matrix="rec709")

# Make the differences between clip1 and clip2 blatantly obvious
Stack1 = StackHorizontal(Overlay(libavcodec, wmv9codec1, mode="Difference", pc_range=true).Levels(127, 1, 129, 0, 255),Overlay(wmv9codec1, wmv9codec2, mode="Difference", pc_range=true).Levels(127, 1, 129, 0, 255))
Stack2 = StackHorizontal(libavcodec,wmv9codec1)
StackVertical(Stack1,Stack2)
Here's an example of the random smoothing happening in one WMV9 instance and not the other:



When WMV9 isn't being retarded like that, it sometimes produces bit-identical output to libavcodec and sometimes "only" visually-identical:



The differences are there, but I certainly can't see them without zooming in 400% or more in Photoshop and looking for tiny brightness variations in the pixel areas indicated by the mask.
msgohan is offline  
post #11 of 23 Old 09-10-2010, 05:59 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
msgohan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 2,856
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15


There's a Russian Blu-ray of this as well, not sure when it was released. But it looks like they just ported over the Alliance encode, dropping the lossless audio and the French dub in favor of a lossless Russian dub. The English DD448 remains on the disc.

Some screenshots here, but that site lists the incorrect video bitrate.

Just like the Alliance encode, it's 1.78:1, 15.00Mbps AVC and appears to be gamma-boosted.

Here's the partial BDInfo scan I found on a random Russian site.

Code:
DISC INFO:
  
Disc Size:      16,609,359,156 bytes
Protection:     AACS
BD-Java:        No
BDInfo:         0.5.3

PLAYLIST REPORT:

Name:                   00001.MPLS
Length:                 1:47:44 (h:m:s)
Size:                   16,220,645,376 bytes
Total Bitrate:          20,07 Mbps

VIDEO:

Codec                   Bitrate             Description    
-----                   -------             -----------    
MPEG-4 AVC Video        15000 kbps          1080p / 23,976 fps / 16:9 / High Profile 4.1

AUDIO:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description    
-----                           --------        -------         -----------    
DTS-HD Master Audio             Russian         3426 kbps       5.1 / 48 kHz / 3426 kbps / 24-bit (DTS Core: 5.1 / 48 kHz / 1509 kbps / 24-bit)
Dolby Digital Audio             English         448 kbps        5.1 / 48 kHz / 448 kbps

SUBTITLES:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description    
-----                           --------        -------         -----------    
Presentation Graphics           Russian         48,499 kbps
msgohan is offline  
post #12 of 23 Old 09-11-2010, 07:26 AM
Advanced Member
 
Pincho's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 720
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I like the Jap cover best. The rest are boring.

Genius is an insult to my intelligence!

Pincho is offline  
post #13 of 23 Old 01-26-2011, 08:04 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Cinema Squid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 2,864
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Here is a link to the BDInfo scan for the US version from Universal released this week:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=2594

Also matching frames to the current set:

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Spoiler  
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

I-frame, #3633, 0:02:31.526


B-frame, #5774, 0:04:00.823


I-frame, #11905, 0:08:16.537


B-frame, #26157, 0:18:10.964


B-frame, #33093, 0:23:00.253


P-frame, #61242, 0:42:34.301


B-frame, #83727, 0:58:12.113


B-frame, #87609, 1:00:54.025


B-frame, #103672, 1:12:03.986


I-frame, #105557, 1:13:22.606


I-frame, #108444, 1:15:23.018


I-frame, #122419, 1:25:05.892


I-frame, #136958, 1:35:12.289



Feel free to add these into the main post.
Cinema Squid is offline  
post #14 of 23 Old 01-26-2011, 10:05 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Deviation's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Coon Rapids, MN
Posts: 2,780
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 16
Looks just like the HD-DVD, to my eyes.
Deviation is offline  
post #15 of 23 Old 01-26-2011, 10:34 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
msgohan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 2,856
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Awesome Squid, thanks! To me the Japanese is still the champion, but for those darn lines around the letterbox.

I've tried to put these on the screenshot comparison mouseover site but it keeps giving me an error about not being able to copy the source file. Anyone have any tips..?
msgohan is offline  
post #16 of 23 Old 01-26-2011, 11:10 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Cinema Squid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 2,864
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by msgohan View Post
Awesome Squid, thanks! To me the Japanese is still the champion, but for those darn lines around the letterbox.
No problem. I actually used the Japanese shots as the reference pictures for finding the frame matches which look like they probably all came out exact - anyway, there didn't seem to be much ambiguity in the selection.

Quote:
I've tried to put these on the screenshot comparison mouseover site but it keeps giving me an error about not being able to copy the source file. Anyone have any tips..?
Not sure about that, since I haven't ever tried to upload anything there. The links you currently have in the second post for the mouseover comparisons, however, don't seem right since the first is the wrong movie (is it Airplane?) and the second link gives a "not found" on the site. I guess I do have my shots in RGB32, so I don't know if that might be the issue.
Cinema Squid is offline  
post #17 of 23 Old 01-27-2011, 08:50 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
msgohan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 2,856
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Yeah, all the old links to that site are messed up since they went down and then changed servers. I'm kinda surprised that they redirect to the new domain at all.
msgohan is offline  
post #18 of 23 Old 01-27-2011, 09:26 AM
Advanced Member
 
Stinky-Dinkins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 912
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by msgohan View Post

I've tried to put these on the screenshot comparison mouseover site but it keeps giving me an error about not being able to copy the source file. Anyone have any tips..?

If it's the site I'm thinking of it will only ever work from me if I upload it directly from my computer. Whenever I host it on another site like photobucket and try to have the screen comparison site use that URL it never works.
Stinky-Dinkins is offline  
post #19 of 23 Old 01-27-2011, 12:57 PM
Advanced Member
 
Makaveli Tha Don's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 768
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I already have the Jap release of this. So the consensus is that the jap version actually has a better transfer than the new US release?
Makaveli Tha Don is offline  
post #20 of 23 Old 01-27-2011, 04:53 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
msgohan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 2,856
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinky-Dinkins View Post

If it's the site I'm thinking of it will only ever work from me if I upload it directly from my computer. Whenever I host it on another site like photobucket and try to have the screen comparison site use that URL it never works.

I did try that as well but it just redirected me to the main page after transferring all 61MB and doesn't show anything uploaded for my IP. Gave it a shot twice! In the old incarnation I could only get it to accept Imageshack URLs but even those aren't working now.
msgohan is offline  
post #21 of 23 Old 01-27-2011, 10:11 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Cinema Squid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 2,864
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
I made some further shots of the US edition here:
http://www.cinemasquid.com/blu-ray/m...ieid=16582#top

I wonder if no screeners of this were sent out to review sites. I have only seen one review at dvdauthority.com thus far for this new US Blu-ray edition.
Cinema Squid is offline  
post #22 of 23 Old 01-30-2011, 01:04 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
msgohan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 2,856
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
I've edited the first few posts, replacing the direct image links with a nice big thumbnail grid. Having now viewed all the shots, I stand by my rankings. Still don't get why the shutters in #10 look better on the Canadian disc though. And I wouldn't pay the premium for the slight bump with the JP disc now when the US disc is available with the full complement of extras.
msgohan is offline  
post #23 of 23 Old 02-01-2011, 08:59 PM
AVS Special Member
 
stumlad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 2,399
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I'm first a bit surprised that universal used AVC as most of their re-issued catalogs are VC-1. What's even more surprising is the very slight increase in PQ. I guess it goes to show that when VC-1 is used right, it can do well...

Thanks for the screens!

Lex Luthor, Ruler of Australia, activate the machine!
stumlad is offline  
Reply Blu-ray Software

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off