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post #121 of 3126 Old 11-02-2009, 11:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterTHX View Post

Is it just me or a Tier 0 should not be "front heavy".

360-degree soundfield is the goal here.

It depends, we don't have a hard set criteria. Sound that "killz" is the main goal.


Some movies might call to be more front heavy because of heavy dialogue, which works artistically then the soundfield will open up. I think Kill Bill is good example of this, it's a little front heavy(because Tarantino loves his words) but it's still prime demo material.

Inglorious Basterds is like that to a greater degree, its just people talking in foreign languages for 2.5hours(and it's fantastic.) but at the same time all of the sound effects were spot on.

Ridiculous codec tier sig gone. Still AVC/24bit lossless fanboy.

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post #122 of 3126 Old 11-03-2009, 03:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadowrage View Post

It depends, we don't have a hard set criteria. Sound that "killz" is the main goal.


Some movies might call to be more front heavy because of heavy dialogue, which works artistically then the soundfield will open up. I think Kill Bill is good example of this, it's a little front heavy(because Tarantino loves his words) but it's still prime demo material.

Inglorious Basterds is like that to a greater degree, its just people talking in foreign languages for 2.5hours(and it's fantastic.) but at the same time all of the sound effects were spot on.

Agreed %100 and for another example,I look no further than No Country For Old Men.
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post #123 of 3126 Old 11-03-2009, 08:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadowrage View Post

It depends, we don't have a hard set criteria. Sound that "killz" is the main goal.


Some movies might call to be more front heavy because of heavy dialogue, which works artistically then the soundfield will open up. I think Kill Bill is good example of this, it's a little front heavy(because Tarantino loves his words) but it's still prime demo material.

Inglorious Basterds is like that to a greater degree, its just people talking in foreign languages for 2.5hours(and it's fantastic.) but at the same time all of the sound effects were spot on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by alexg75 View Post

Agreed %100 and for another example,I look no further than No Country For Old Men.

Still seems though Tier 1 would be a more suitable spot for something weighted towards the front. Tier 1 is still pretty darn good.

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post #124 of 3126 Old 11-03-2009, 04:48 PM
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Front heavy mix won't get Tier 0 from me but as it's been stated, everyone creates their own criteria which they use to vote.

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post #125 of 3126 Old 11-03-2009, 06:13 PM
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Thinking back upon IA3 (and looking through the tier 0 list) I really think tier 1 is more appropriate. Is it too late to change my vote? I really wanted to like this one, but it was very front heavy and for this type of film that just does not work. I think I was trying to give it the benefit of the doubt, but the reality is (for me atleast) this should be a tier 1 vote from my end.

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post #126 of 3126 Old 11-03-2009, 07:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toe View Post

I really think tier 1 is more appropriate. Is it too late to change my vote?

Haha....I don't think Bryan is going to go all communist on us, Toe. Pretty sure you can change your vote.

Stephen.

Chances are very good that I was drinking when I posted the above.

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post #127 of 3126 Old 11-03-2009, 07:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sb1 View Post

Haha....I don't think Bryan is going to go all communist on us, Toe. Pretty sure you can change your vote.

Yeah I guess it is not a big deal

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post #128 of 3126 Old 11-03-2009, 07:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Just make sure you put it in BOLD for emphasis.

I have nothing against people changing their votes. I keep track of who voted what for each movie, so it isn't possible to throw the election like they do in other parts of the world.
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post #129 of 3126 Old 11-03-2009, 08:25 PM
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G.I. JOE: RISE OF THE COBRA- TIER 1

I was looking forward to this mix, especially given some of the good reviews i've read. I have to say I do not agree. Yes, there was some bass with the explosion but this track lacked the deep extension that those scenes deserved. I felt all through the film like something was missing. It has a busy surround track but I found it a bit muddled. Explosions, gunshots, shots from the particle gun should have been clear and defined but they were neither. I'd almost rate this closer to a 2 than to a 1.
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post #130 of 3126 Old 11-03-2009, 08:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan Beckman View Post

Just make sure you put it in BOLD for emphasis.

I have nothing against people changing their votes. I keep track of who voted what for each movie, so it isn't possible to throw the election like they do in other parts of the world.

Thanks Bryan In that case.....

Ice Age Dawn Of The Dinosaurs (DTS-MA 7.1) tier 1

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post #131 of 3126 Old 11-03-2009, 10:50 PM
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G.I. Joe: The Rise of Cobra (DTS-HD MA 5.1) — Tier 1
This track is quite typical of your summer action blockbuster, relying on lots of booms and bangs, design wise. Surrounds were quite active, pans were accurate, LFE was decent, and dialogue was never hard to discern (perhaps only limited by the actors' mumblings and/or accent). What this lacked was oomph in many areas, due to inconsistencies: some parts would have lots of bass, while in others where you expect ass-whooping bass, it just felt tepid. Another thing missing was sound density; the mix just was not dense. I was expecting more. I did like some of the sound effects though.

Anyway, cannot wait for Up, Monster's Inc. and Star Trek in the next two weeks! Reference tracks, I'm expecting.
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post #132 of 3126 Old 11-04-2009, 07:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikenike View Post

G.I. Joe: The Rise of Cobra (DTS-HD MA 5.1) Tier 1
This track is quite typical of your summer action blockbuster, relying on lots of booms and bangs, design wise. Surrounds were quite active, pans were accurate, LFE was decent, and dialogue was never hard to discern (perhaps only limited by the actors' mumblings and/or accent). What this lacked was oomph in many areas, due to inconsistencies: some parts would have lots of bass, while in others where you expect ass-whooping bass, it just felt tepid. Another thing missing was sound density; the mix just was not dense. I was expecting more. I did like some of the sound effects though.

G.I. Joe: The Rise of Cobra (DTS-HD MA 5.1) Tier 1

Completely agree with the above assessment. I hated this movie so much that I didn't want to waste time writing anything up, so I'm glad I can agree with what Mike wrote above.

Anyone that makes it through the end of this movie should get a prize.

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post #133 of 3126 Old 11-04-2009, 01:13 PM
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The Taking of Pelham 123 DTS-HD Master Audio Tier 1

More of a dialogue-driven movie than I expected. Very "un-Tony Scott" like. One of those mixes that isn't necessarily weak or strong. Just delivers what it's supposed to. Certainly not demo-worthy though.
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post #134 of 3126 Old 11-05-2009, 12:34 AM
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Ghost in the Shell 2.0 [2008](DTS-MA 6.1) - Tier 1
Almost constant surround use. Gunshots had a nice pop-pop crack sound that was similar to something you would hear in a Michael Mann film. None of the small caliber weapons ate up any of the LFE channel(I'm looking at you IH and Max Payne). There were variations in the weapon sounds. Dialogue was always clear, the score had good fidelity, providing a bit of thump(it's loud but doesn't really extend deep). This also has some fine sound design used to make sequences more dramatic, the score will dial out at the right time and all you hear are localized sounds when appropriate - very nice.

One complaint - LFE is a bit lacking, it does extend deep a bit, but not as often as it should in my opinion. Overall I was really impressed with it, sounds much better than Akira(GitS = more modern sound + better mixing).

Ridiculous codec tier sig gone. Still AVC/24bit lossless fanboy.

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post #135 of 3126 Old 11-06-2009, 12:46 PM
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G.I. Joe: Rise of Cobra DTS-HD Master Audio Tier 1

Disappointing. Should have been much better. I want to also note I had to turn up the volume a few notches because I think dial norm was applied again. Overall volume seemed too low.

Stargate (15th anniversary edition) DTS-HD Master Audio Tier 0

Possibly the best catalog title I've heard on disc yet. Incredibly dynamic, LFE support all the way and surround usage along with the front soundstage just enveloped me in the movie. Along with the pristine picture quality, this is a must own.
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post #136 of 3126 Old 11-06-2009, 07:50 PM
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Twilight: (DTS-HD MA 5.1) - Tier 1

This was a tough movie to rank for me because this movie has very little in the way of dramatic sound effects. Nada, nothing, zippo. No real LFE, not much surround panning, not much of anything really. On the scale of impressive demo worthy material, this movie is certainly not a Tier 0 movie. However, this movie doesn't really require much in the way of effects because it is not an action movie.

However, the subtle music in this movie is extremely well presented. Think of hi-res music you might download. Never harsh, just light, airy, and very clean. Take for example the scene where the two listen to Debussy. It almost puts you to sleep, but the music is rendered wonderfully. The piano has great body. Again, this is very very subtle. The dialog is wonderfully clear as well.

So despite the lack of almost any effects, I'd rate the quality of what IS there Tier 0, as compared to the music in other movies that are Tier 0. If impressive effects and more surround are a factor for you, then I'd downgrade this to Tier 1 or even Tier 2.

I just have to give this Tier 1 because of the lack of effects. However, the music that is there is truly nicely mastered.
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post #137 of 3126 Old 11-06-2009, 08:01 PM
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MONSTERS VS ALIENS: REFERENCE

Yes, this track is totally reference for me: dialogue, score, sound effects, surround presence and LFE-extension. As what seems to be the norm with Paramounts tracks I had to put it up about 4 clicks over standard but once there the track totally rocked. Best animated title since KUNG FU PANDA (also from Dreamworks).
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post #138 of 3126 Old 11-06-2009, 08:25 PM
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Children of Men - Tier 0

Talk about 360 degree sound field and immersion this one delivers. Past 1 hr 16 mins this is hands down one of the best sound mix and design in terms of dynamic range, directionality, balanced LFE and surrounds. Explosions and gunshots rips through all directions virtually putting the viewer in the midst of the battlefield. The dialogue driven portions reproduces all sound elements keeping all speakers active throughout. This is a well engineered mix for a dialogue driven movie.

Blu-ray : 340
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post #139 of 3126 Old 11-06-2009, 10:50 PM
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HEAT (TRUE HD) Australian release
Tier 1

dynamics and separation are great, surrounds are active and enveloping. Dialogue is crisp and audible, except for those mouthwatering gun battles which is to be expected. LFE I found to be a bit muddy, not as clean and punchy as i had hoped for.
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post #140 of 3126 Old 11-07-2009, 12:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lgans316 View Post

Children of Men - Tier 0

Talk about 360 degree sound field and immersion this one delivers. Past 1 hr 16 mins this is hands down one of the best sound mix and design in terms of dynamic range, directionality, balanced LFE and surrounds. Explosions and gunshots rips through all directions virtually putting the viewer in the midst of the battlefield. The dialogue driven portions reproduces all sound elements keeping all speakers active throughout. This is a well engineered mix for a dialogue driven movie.

That's exactly my thoughts on this mix. I felt it was a stellar mix, I was puzzled when I read comments from reviewers stating the mix was slightly underwhelming. I personally think it's cause we are so used to unrealistic sounding bombast, we start to think it underwhelming. What I heard was a near reference track with legit sound effects and even moreso an involving surround mix.
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post #141 of 3126 Old 11-07-2009, 01:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davcole View Post

That's exactly my thoughts on this mix. I felt it was a stellar mix, I was puzzled when I read comments from reviewers stating the mix was slightly underwhelming. I personally think it's cause we are so used to unrealistic sounding bombast, we start to think it underwhelming. What I heard was a near reference track with legit sound effects and even moreso an involving surround mix.

The end sequence is still one of my favourite demo scenes. It was just so visceral and made you feel like you were literally standing there next to the action.
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post #142 of 3126 Old 11-07-2009, 05:37 AM
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Transformers 2 ROTF (DTS HD MA)Wal-Mart Big Screen Edition: Tier 0

The major reason I can't rank it as reference is the hopelessly buried dialog. Even after I cranked up the MV about 3-4db from my initial listening level, I wasn't happy with how it was rendered. This was simply a balance issue in the mix. The other smaller complaint is that sound elements were biased to the sound of the transformers as there were nothing else was on the screen. This was mostly on the opening action scene, but it was observable on others as well. Bass was well defined, and other then the muted explosions on the first action scene, it remained consistent through out the picture. Dynamics were very good if not awesome, and the mix generally were exciting. Just a notch below of my favorite Tier 0 title: Iron Man.

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post #143 of 3126 Old 11-07-2009, 08:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dannycj80 View Post

HEAT (TRUE HD) Australian release
Tier 1

LFE I found to be a bit muddy, not as clean and punchy as i had hoped for.

Ouch. Muddy bass is my biggest audio pet peeve.

Stephen.

Chances are very good that I was drinking when I posted the above.

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post #144 of 3126 Old 11-07-2009, 05:28 PM - Thread Starter
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The thread is now up-to-date as of post #143. Here's a summary of the changes:


NEW to Reference:
Talking Heads: Stop Making Sense


REMOVED from Reference:
Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen


NEW to Tier 0:
Children of Men
Ice Age: Dawn of the Dinosaurs
Stargate (15th Anniversary Edition)
Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen


NEW to Tier 1:
G.I. Joe: The Rise of Cobra


NEW to Tier 3:
The Proposal


NEW to the Unfinished Business list:
Ghost in the Shell 2.0
North by Northwest
Soundstage: Michael McDonald
The Taking of Pelham 1 2 3
Twilight


REMOVED from the Unfinished Business list:
Children of Men
Ice Age: Dawn of the Dinosaurs
The Proposal
Stargate (15th Anniversary Edition)
Talking Heads: Stop Making Sense
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post #145 of 3126 Old 11-07-2009, 05:38 PM
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Once again, thanks Byran.

It's nice to have an active updater on this thread again.

Stephen.

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post #146 of 3126 Old 11-07-2009, 05:59 PM
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Nice work Bryan......thanks for staying so on top of this.

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post #147 of 3126 Old 11-07-2009, 09:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sb1 View Post

Ouch. Muddy bass is my biggest audio pet peeve.

Its nothing obtrusive, I'm just very particular with my audio. I just re watched it and somewhere near the bottom of Tier 1 seems about right.
Also I am sure the Australian release of Heat is identical to the US release in regards to Video and Audio.
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post #148 of 3126 Old 11-07-2009, 10:18 PM
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MIDNIGHT MEAT TRAIN (DTS-HD MA 7.1) Tier 0

Some of the best ambiance and directionality i have had the pleasure of listening to, surrounds are used perfectly never overemphasized or distracting.
Subtle sounds and dialogue are clearly reproduced. LFE is tight and never overused. This soundtrack is great but doesn't match up to some of the Reference titles in regard to dynamics. Some excellent work by lionsgate.
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post #149 of 3126 Old 11-08-2009, 08:10 AM
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Haunting In Connecticut (DTS HD MA 7.1) Tier 1

Very predictable and "heard it all before" sound design. The back surrounds were rather quiet throughout, even though there would have been plenty of opportunity for them to be heard. Bass was forceful and tight, and dynamics were good. Forgettable score, but mixed with good balance. Dialog remained natural and intelligible. Overall SQ was very good, as one expects these days, but the sound design and mix were just average IMO.


Star Trek: Generations (Dolby THD) Tier 0

Another dynamite track from the Trek team, especially one from 15 years ago. Nothing sounded dated like many of it's peers do. Crisp yet natural blending surrounds,prodigious bass with good definition. Good balance as well everything including the all important dialog were mixed well. Dynamics were above average as well. Score sounded magnificent with awesome soundstage. Barely miss the reference point IMO. Well done Paramount.

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post #150 of 3126 Old 11-08-2009, 11:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thehun View Post


Star Trek: Generations (Dolby THD) Tier 0

Another dynamite track from the Trek team, especially one from 15 years ago. Nothing sounded dated like many of it's peers do. Crisp yet natural blending surrounds,prodigious bass with good definition. Good balance as well everything including the all important dialog were mixed well. Dynamics were above average as well. Score sounded magnificent with awesome soundstage. Barely miss the reference point IMO. Well done Paramount.

Nice. This is my favorite of the TNG movies, and I used to always used the LD as demo material.

Stephen.

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