Which BDs look BEST with Frame Interpolation, and which DON'T - and why? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 25 Old 11-17-2009, 09:30 AM - Thread Starter
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Just had my first date with my new JVC 950 projector, last night - and spent a lot of time with the new Frame Interpolation feature, on a lot of different content.

I'll just say up front, I prefer the smoother frame rates overall, especially on faster action - but I sympathize with those who prefer regular 24p, over the 48p/96p output of FI gear.

Now - the reason for the post is that I noticed a lot of variation in the enjoyment of different movies, using FI.

For instance, "Iron Man" did not fare as well with FI; there were parts of the film that started to resemble a soap opera. HOWEVER, "I Am Legend" was SUPERB all the way thru with FI. Not once did I feel outside of the film.

I can only attribute this to the style of filmography used. For instance, it seems that Legend generally uses faster pans and scans throughout, whereas, Iron Man at times uses slower movements in dialog scenes?

So... anyone who uses FI to watch 24p Blu-Ray movies - let's have a discussion on which films you thought are the most or least enjoyable with Frame Interpolation.

Open to all who are currently using FI, regardless of what FI gear they are using.

Let's have some thoughts on which Blu-Rays you have viewed and how they looked.
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post #2 of 25 Old 11-17-2009, 09:45 AM
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IMHO nothing looks better with FI because it wasn't what the director wanted us to see.
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post #3 of 25 Old 11-17-2009, 11:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jvillain View Post

IMHO nothing looks better with FI because it wasn't what the director wanted us to see.

Agreed.

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post #4 of 25 Old 11-17-2009, 11:19 AM
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I think you kind of answered your own question: movies with slower pans and little-to-no action will introduce the fewest noticeable artifacts. In a way, you're ruling out most action movies. I admit that the smoother image is attractive in some ways, but I'm constantly distracted by the artifacts.

Keeping in mind that the goal of FI is NOT a purist goal, I'm sure they'll have the technology some day to do FI correctly - by that I mean in a way that eliminates most or all artifacting while offering that window-like smoothness.
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post #5 of 25 Old 11-17-2009, 12:02 PM - Thread Starter
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Yep - kind of wanted to avoid a debate about whether to FI or not.

Would more like to know which movies folks have enjoyed more with FI.

It's not just about smoothness, but also about how comfortable it is to watch.

For instance, there are always scenes that are difficult to watch at 24p due to the natural stutter - when pans or action are fast, it can get fairly annoying. So smoothing it out can make it very watchable.

I think that one still sees what the director intended, after all, since none of the image is removed, etc. However, except in cases like Saving Private Ryan, where specific use was made of 24p, I don't think that the director always INTENDS that we only watch it at 24p.

Artifacting varies from solution to solution, of course. Some of the stuff I've seen is remarkably good (for instance, on the Samsung 240 hz LCDs). The JVC setup on my 950 does introduce the occasional artifacts, but most of the time it just looks more like a MPG compression artifact, not a major deal-breaker.

But a VERY noticeable positive effect on many films.

For instance, going back to I Am Legend, from the very opening scene, where we are flying overhead the city, looking straight down, and first see the red car with Will Smith - the buildings are moving just fast enough to have visible stutter at 24p. However, at 48p, it is FAR clearer and smoother.

Master and Commander was also very good with FI.
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post #6 of 25 Old 11-17-2009, 12:09 PM
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A helpful link:
http://www.projectorcentral.com/frame_interpolation.htm
BIG thanks: Projector Central!

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post #7 of 25 Old 11-17-2009, 12:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG ED View Post

A helpful link:
http://www.projectorcentral.com/frame_interpolation.htm
BIG thanks: Projector Central!

Excellent article.

Yes - I am one of the ones that agrees that 24p motion judder can be distracting.

FI is still not very common, so there are a lot of people who may have seen it one a lesser system, and carry a bad impression, perhaps.

Maybe as FI becomes more widespread, there will be greater acceptance by folks. Certainly the reduction of motion judder is very pleasing to me.
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post #8 of 25 Old 11-17-2009, 12:25 PM
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Battlestar Galactica series is SOOOOOO much more enjoyable with FI employed on my Panny AE4000 at mode 2. I tried it both ways and there is no question that FI works great for that material.

I also think there is a natural benefit with animated titles such as Wall*E, Up, KFP, etc. So much more depth with FI turned on.
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post #9 of 25 Old 11-17-2009, 12:51 PM
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The least enjoyable? Whichever one I'm watching at any given time That would absolutely ruin a movie for me
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post #10 of 25 Old 11-17-2009, 02:04 PM
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Yeah I don't really appreciate FI at all in any instance. It's just too distracting for me and frankly removes me completely from the movie watching experience. I just see this feature as a selling point on a product and not a real improvement to the movie watching experience.

edit

Sorry for the off topic post. To stay on topic, no movies look better with it.
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post #11 of 25 Old 11-17-2009, 02:21 PM
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As someone who tried constantly in the past to get that film cadence in my computer animations, ironically I am one of the few who seems to like FI in my movies.

It took about 1 hr to get used to it on my Sammy (120hz, 'AMP'(FI) = high), and the first movie I watched was American Gangster, which really did look like a soap opera with it on (due to movie itself), but after watching a few more, I really started to like it.

To me, it was all the visual quality of film, but with the smooth motion of video (or even beyond; 120 fps), a win-win.

The Sammy's FI seems to actually figure out which direction entire objects are moving, and creates sub-frames based on it, not just simple frame-repeating or delta's of prev/next frame. It's not perfect, especially on helicopter shots or where the object and the background are moving in 2 different directions, but I like it, and might be better now on the newer 240hz sets.

EDIT: to stay true to topic, American Gangster = Bad FI, 300 = great FI, even more surreal
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post #12 of 25 Old 11-18-2009, 07:53 AM
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Once my wife and I were watching Taken and it looked like it was a daytime soap or some made for TV movie, it was horrible. I couldn't figure out what was going on until I checked the settings on my Epson 6500 and somehow Frame Interpolation had been turned on. A prank by a friend ? possibly. I've never found out. I immediately turned it off and have never used it again. The pj remote is now hidden
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post #13 of 25 Old 11-18-2009, 08:13 AM
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I hate it, makes high budget movies look like low budget BBC sitcoms.

But I would guess that it would work better with movies that has more realistic look to it (like cloverfield). If its a more of an epic look, it would more look like behind the scenes.

Good movies are as rare as an on topic discussion.
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post #14 of 25 Old 11-18-2009, 08:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 42041 View Post

The least enjoyable? Whichever one I'm watching at any given time That would absolutely ruin a movie for me

What he said.
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post #15 of 25 Old 11-18-2009, 09:02 AM
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Maybe Crank and Public Enemies since they're halfway there already.
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post #16 of 25 Old 11-18-2009, 09:20 AM
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I really think alot of it depends on the FI system you are using. I have seen Ironman look bad on FI and have seen it look really good on FI with a different display. (though it really is not a movie that demands fi)

The cool thing about FI is if you do not like it, or you have a bad set up with it, you just turn it off and if you do like it you just turn it on and enjoy.

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post #17 of 25 Old 11-18-2009, 11:43 AM
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Hmm...what would Miami Vice look like with FI turned on?
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post #18 of 25 Old 11-18-2009, 11:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cristobal View Post

Hmm...what would Miami Vice look like with FI turned on?

Since it looks like homevideo with 24P, I would guess it looks even more like homevideo with FI.

Good movies are as rare as an on topic discussion.
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post #19 of 25 Old 11-18-2009, 12:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Hmmm - maybe I should have started the thread title with "FI Lovers Only: .."

Yep - certainly many folks are not used to FI yet, and certainly not all movies are suitable for it - but there are some really dramatic movies that FI looks really good with...

Oh well - Any other FI lovers wanna come out of the closet here?
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post #20 of 25 Old 11-18-2009, 05:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdjam View Post

Hmmm - maybe I should have started the thread title with "FI Lovers Only: .."

Yep - certainly many folks are not used to FI yet, and certainly not all movies are suitable for it - but there are some really dramatic movies that FI looks really good with...

Oh well - Any other FI lovers wanna come out of the closet here?

I LOVE FI. Yep, I said it. I use it on everything!
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post #21 of 25 Old 11-19-2009, 03:32 AM
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Please post on subject. rdjam, say the word and we'll say bye bye to the thread. Heaven forbid somebody create a thread discussing the (non)merits of FI instead of thread crapping.

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post #22 of 25 Old 11-19-2009, 07:31 AM
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As a whole, animation looks better with FI although I use it on other movies at times.
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post #23 of 25 Old 11-19-2009, 07:43 AM
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All.

Back off man, I'm a scientist.
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post #24 of 25 Old 12-02-2009, 05:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Just watched Star Trek. This film looks stunning with FI on, much better than any I've seen yet.
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post #25 of 25 Old 12-02-2009, 05:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdjam View Post

Just had my first date with my new JVC 950 projector, last night - and spent a lot of time with the new Frame Interpolation feature, on a lot of different content.

I'll just say up front, I prefer the smoother frame rates overall, especially on faster action - but I sympathize with those who prefer regular 24p, over the 48p/96p output of FI gear.

Now - the reason for the post is that I noticed a lot of variation in the enjoyment of different movies, using FI.

For instance, "Iron Man" did not fare as well with FI; there were parts of the film that started to resemble a soap opera. HOWEVER, "I Am Legend" was SUPERB all the way thru with FI. Not once did I feel outside of the film.

I can only attribute this to the style of filmography used. For instance, it seems that Legend generally uses faster pans and scans throughout, whereas, Iron Man at times uses slower movements in dialog scenes?

So... anyone who uses FI to watch 24p Blu-Ray movies - let's have a discussion on which films you thought are the most or least enjoyable with Frame Interpolation.

Open to all who are currently using FI, regardless of what FI gear they are using.

Let's have some thoughts on which Blu-Rays you have viewed and how they looked.

So far, all movies like Cloverfield, Diary of the Dead and Quarantine look great.
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