David Lynch's 'DUNE' BD - Page 7 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #181 of 215 Old 06-08-2013, 11:51 AM
AVS Special Member
 
KBMAN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Grass Valley, CA
Posts: 2,875
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 28 Post(s)
Liked: 42
that's pretty funny! And yes Josh, I SUPPOSE I could turn the volume down.....but.....but....hehe biggrin.gif

Terrence
"Hey Vasquez, have you ever been mistaken for a man?...."No, have you?" -ALIENS

KBMAN is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #182 of 215 Old 06-08-2013, 12:05 PM
AVS Special Member
 
KBMAN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Grass Valley, CA
Posts: 2,875
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 28 Post(s)
Liked: 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

Considering the age of the movie, I think the audio on the latest release is fairly good.


I don't know if you have seen this yet, but it appeared in a quick shot in a Simpson's episode a few weeks back:



This is what I was laughing at.....

Terrence
"Hey Vasquez, have you ever been mistaken for a man?...."No, have you?" -ALIENS

KBMAN is offline  
post #183 of 215 Old 06-08-2013, 06:10 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
oink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Shuloch
Posts: 26,553
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 67 Post(s)
Liked: 818
The whole Cashworms of Dune thing has become ridiculous beyond the pale.
Frank Herbert's kid and his co-writing pal have churned out umpteen sequels and prequels of the Dune Universe the old man had created earning themselves millions in the process.

Frank wrote SIX Dune novels....period.

A.P.S. deserve our protection....join the cause today!
oink is offline  
post #184 of 215 Old 06-09-2013, 10:00 AM
AVS Special Member
 
MSchu18's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 1,120
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 44 Post(s)
Liked: 145
it's time for a legitimate DUNE remake...

Klipsch Image Ones
Klipsch x11i
Rega P5/Groovetracer/Denon DL-103R
Parks Audio Budgie Phono Pre/SUT
Pioneer SC35
Bel Canto REF 500M
Klipsch Cornwall/Crites/Aletheia Audio
Klisch RC64II
Klipsch SW-115
OPPO BDP-93
Samsung PN64D8000
MSchu18 is online now  
post #185 of 215 Old 06-09-2013, 11:30 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
oink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Shuloch
Posts: 26,553
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 67 Post(s)
Liked: 818
Quote:
Originally Posted by MSchu18 View Post

it's time for a legitimate DUNE remake...
The Herbert family has been trying to get it done for a long time.
At one point, Peter Berg was slated to direct, but that fell thru.
I assume the Dune re-make resides in "development hell" now.

They have also tried to get a TV series going.
IMO, the FH's Dune saga would be perfect for such a thing.
No doubt why it hasn't happened is the production costs would be very high (if it is to be done "right").

A.P.S. deserve our protection....join the cause today!
oink is offline  
post #186 of 215 Old 06-10-2013, 02:13 AM
AVS Special Member
 
tenthplanet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: North of Mexico, South of Oregon, Not as far east as Vegas
Posts: 1,487
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 126 Post(s)
Liked: 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

Compared this new release to my French BD.

I consider this to be of superior AV.


I watched this Dune very closely and was saddened by the copious amounts of dirt and white flecks.

.
Remember film societies. Just show the disc in a lecture hall with 200 or so people and the dirt and flecks complete the equation. biggrin.gif

"Bring out yer dead!".."Wait I'm not dead yet!"..(Sound Austrian here) "WRONG !!" (You know what happens next..)
tenthplanet is online now  
post #187 of 215 Old 06-10-2013, 10:11 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Josh Z's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Planet Boston, source of the spice, Melange.
Posts: 20,215
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 403 Post(s)
Liked: 394
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

Frank wrote SIX Dune novels....period.

And only the first one was any good.
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

The Herbert family has been trying to get it done for a long time.
At one point, Peter Berg was slated to direct, but that fell thru.
I assume the Dune re-make resides in "development hell" now.

After Peter Berg dropped out, Pierre Morel (Taken) was attached for a while. But then his From Pairis with Love flopped, and nobody trusted him with a big budget production anymore.

I believe the project is currently in turnaround. Paramount (which was producing) had to get the ball rolling by a specific deadline or their rights would lapse, and they missed it.

Josh Z
Writer/Editor, High-Def Digest (Blog updated daily!)
Curator, Laserdisc Forever

My opinions are my own, and do not necessarily reflect those of my employers.

Josh Z is offline  
post #188 of 215 Old 06-10-2013, 11:29 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
oink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Shuloch
Posts: 26,553
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 67 Post(s)
Liked: 818
Quote:
Originally Posted by tenthplanet View Post

Remember film societies. Just show the disc in a lecture hall with 200 or so people and the dirt and flecks complete the equation. biggrin.gif
LOL.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

And only the first one was any good.
You keep saying that....tongue.gif

Quote:
After Peter Berg dropped out, Pierre Morel (Taken) was attached for a while. But then his From Pairis with Love flopped, and nobody trusted him with a big budget production anymore.

I believe the project is currently in turnaround. Paramount (which was producing) had to get the ball rolling by a specific deadline or their rights would lapse, and they missed it.
"In limbo" it would seem.wink.gif

Here is the official Dune site run by the Herbert family:
http://www.dunenovels.com/
In the forum, there is the latest official info of where everything stands at this moment in time.

FWIW, I think Dune 1 has been done well on film....Lynch's (the preferred) and the Sci-fi presentation for those who didn't like DL's interpretation.

IMO, what the Dune saga REALLY needs is a Game of Thrones treatment.
It's the best way to tell the story, as far as I am concerned.

A.P.S. deserve our protection....join the cause today!
oink is offline  
post #189 of 215 Old 06-10-2013, 11:48 AM
AVS Special Member
 
LexInVA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,960
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 39 Post(s)
Liked: 42
Unfortunately, there are no networks left with openings for a GOT-type Dune adaptation except for Starz and I'm not sure they would want to tackle a big-budget operatic sci-fi epic. What's really sad though is that we'll never get to see the SciFi Channel Dune movies on Blu-Ray in the US. The first one was film-based with no HD master and non-HD VFX and the second was shot on Sony F900 HDCAM but I don't think it had HD VFX from what I read in the past. There is a foreign Blu-Ray of Children of Dune but I'm not sure how the quality is.
LexInVA is offline  
post #190 of 215 Old 06-10-2013, 01:16 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
oink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Shuloch
Posts: 26,553
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 67 Post(s)
Liked: 818
Quote:
Originally Posted by LexInVA View Post

Unfortunately, there are no networks left with openings for a GOT-type Dune adaptation except for Starz and I'm not sure they would want to tackle a big-budget operatic sci-fi epic.
You may be right.frown.gif

Quote:
What's really sad though is that we'll never get to see the SciFi Channel Dune movies on Blu-Ray in the US. The first one was film-based with no HD master and non-HD VFX and the second was shot on Sony F900 HDCAM but I don't think it had HD VFX from what I read in the past. There is a foreign Blu-Ray of Children of Dune but I'm not sure how the quality is.
I have been awaiting a long time for the BDs.
I don't know what the problem with releasing these is.mad.gif

A.P.S. deserve our protection....join the cause today!
oink is offline  
post #191 of 215 Old 06-15-2013, 07:39 AM
AVS Special Member
 
LexInVA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,960
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 39 Post(s)
Liked: 42
Well Dune has no HD master so far as I know but Lionsgate did announce it as part of their second wave of Blu-Ray releases back when the format came out and they showed the Blu-Ray case mock-up at tradeshows back then. For some unknown reason, it just never hit the market. As for the second one, I don't know why it didn't get released in the US either but France is the only country that has it on Blu-Ray and it is a PAL release. Both could use new Director's Cut editions but I suspect that both mini-series are now lost for good without someone to pick up the tab for them. Lionsgate probably has no interest whatsoever in releasing either one and they are out of print on DVD.
LexInVA is offline  
post #192 of 215 Old 06-15-2013, 11:27 AM
AVS Special Member
 
KBMAN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Grass Valley, CA
Posts: 2,875
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 28 Post(s)
Liked: 42
The 2010 release of Dune that I bought says it has a running time of 2 hours 17 minutes....is this one of 'the' extended cuts? I heard there was a 4, and even a 6 hour version eek.gif

Terrence
"Hey Vasquez, have you ever been mistaken for a man?...."No, have you?" -ALIENS

KBMAN is offline  
post #193 of 215 Old 06-15-2013, 03:56 PM
Advanced Member
 
neveser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Near St. Loser, Misery
Posts: 565
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by KBMAN View Post

The 2010 release of Dune that I bought says it has a running time of 2 hours 17 minutes....is this one of 'the' extended cuts? I heard there was a 4, and even a 6 hour version eek.gif

From IMDB -

Runtime:137 min | 190 min (special edition) | 177 min (extended cut) | 314 min (Extended Edition)

I've only seen the 137 minute version. I do own the disc. I'd buy that 314 minute version in a heartbeat.

Pain Gauge - my electro-industrial music project

neveser is offline  
post #194 of 215 Old 06-15-2013, 05:35 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Jedi2016's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,457
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 19 Post(s)
Liked: 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by neveser View Post

From IMDB -

Runtime:137 min | 190 min (special edition) | 177 min (extended cut) | 314 min (Extended Edition)

I've only seen the 137 minute version. I do own the disc. I'd buy that 314 minute version in a heartbeat.
No, you wouldn't... at least not if it's the cut I've seen. There's a reason it's an Alan Smithee film. It's like a poorly made fan edit based on crap that was put on the cutting room floor for a reason. I watched it a few years ago, and it was downright painful to sit through, and I'm normally a fan of the film.

Welcome to Rivendell, Mister Anderson.
Jedi2016 is online now  
post #195 of 215 Old 06-15-2013, 06:21 PM
Advanced Member
 
neveser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Near St. Loser, Misery
Posts: 565
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedi2016 View Post

No, you wouldn't... at least not if it's the cut I've seen. There's a reason it's an Alan Smithee film. It's like a poorly made fan edit based on crap that was put on the cutting room floor for a reason. I watched it a few years ago, and it was downright painful to sit through, and I'm normally a fan of the film.

I didn't know that. Have you seen the other extended cuts? It always felt like the film could have benefited from a longer runtime.

Pain Gauge - my electro-industrial music project

neveser is offline  
post #196 of 215 Old 06-15-2013, 09:13 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
oink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Shuloch
Posts: 26,553
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 67 Post(s)
Liked: 818
Quote:
Originally Posted by neveser View Post

I didn't know that. Have you seen the other extended cuts? It always felt like the film could have benefited from a longer runtime.
There are some scenes cut that COULD have been added back.
However, Lynch has never agreed to do a Director's Cut of Dune.
In fact, he is downright hostile towards the idea (which is why there is an Alan Smithee version).
Maybe some day it will happen, but don't hold your breath.wink.gif

A.P.S. deserve our protection....join the cause today!
oink is offline  
post #197 of 215 Old 06-16-2013, 06:31 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Jedi2016's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,457
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 19 Post(s)
Liked: 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by neveser View Post

I didn't know that. Have you seen the other extended cuts? It always felt like the film could have benefited from a longer runtime.
I've only seen the one, the super-long "TV cut". I agree the film could probably stand to be a bit longer. I was reading the Wiki article on the film yesterday and they mentioned that the original "director's" cut of the film, once the initial editing was done, was around three hours long. But they didn't just excise stuff to trim it down to where it is, they actually re-shot some scenes to give quicker exposition, and added the voiceover to fill in some of the backstory. Lynch's preferred cut is the one that we've already got.

The film does have its problems, for sure.. as a fan of the books, I'm keenly aware of all the stuff they changed or added, especially the concept of the "weirding modules", which I think is kinda stupid. No one's gotten the ornithopters right yet, but I did like how they did the worms and the stillsuits.

Welcome to Rivendell, Mister Anderson.
Jedi2016 is online now  
post #198 of 215 Old 06-16-2013, 10:17 AM
AVS Special Member
 
MSchu18's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 1,120
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 44 Post(s)
Liked: 145
perhaps being TO FAITHFUL to the book is the issue.

I think a modernization of the mythology of DUNE is appropriate and would be a commercial and a cinematic success.

Klipsch Image Ones
Klipsch x11i
Rega P5/Groovetracer/Denon DL-103R
Parks Audio Budgie Phono Pre/SUT
Pioneer SC35
Bel Canto REF 500M
Klipsch Cornwall/Crites/Aletheia Audio
Klisch RC64II
Klipsch SW-115
OPPO BDP-93
Samsung PN64D8000
MSchu18 is online now  
post #199 of 215 Old 06-16-2013, 11:13 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
oink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Shuloch
Posts: 26,553
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 67 Post(s)
Liked: 818
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedi2016 View Post


The film does have its problems, for sure.. as a fan of the books, I'm keenly aware of all the stuff they changed or added, especially the concept of the "weirding modules", which I think is kinda stupid.
The weirding modules actually made a lot of sense in Lynch's film.

How can, given the length of time allotted for the movie, Lynch convince an audience it was possible for a little group of people in the desert possibly defeat a mighty galactic empire with knives and kung-fu?
No one would buy that who wasn't familiar with the books....wink.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by MSchu18 View Post


I think a modernization of the mythology of DUNE is appropriate and would be a commercial and a cinematic success.
Certainly it would take a re-imagining.
I don't see how anything resembling Frank Herbert's Dune can be brought to the big screen any better than what Lynch did.

A.P.S. deserve our protection....join the cause today!
oink is offline  
post #200 of 215 Old 06-17-2013, 11:32 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Josh Z's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Planet Boston, source of the spice, Melange.
Posts: 20,215
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 403 Post(s)
Liked: 394
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedi2016 View Post

I was reading the Wiki article on the film yesterday and they mentioned that the original "director's" cut of the film, once the initial editing was done, was around three hours long.

The claims of a three-, four-, or sometimes five-hour "Director's Cut" are a myth. David Lynch was under contract to deliver a movie under 2 1/2 hours. When he fell behind schedule and it was obvious that the movie was going to run long, the producers ordered him to stop shooting several subplots that would have fleshed out the narrative in the last half of the movie. Those scenes were never filmed.

Lynch prepared one and only one final cut of Dune. It runs 2 hours 17 minutes.

The myth of the "Director's Cut" stems from stories of a cast and crew screening that took place after principal photography. What was shown then was a Rough Assembly, which is when all of the footage shot for the movie is very crudely spliced together in approximate chronological order with minimal editing. All Rough Assemblies run four, five or more hours long, because they contain numerous duplicate takes, repeated action photographed from different angles, flubs, clapboard markers and tons of footage never intended for an audience to see. The movie is not considered "edited" at this point.

After the movie bombed in theaters, MCA (which owned Universal at the time) hired a couple of incompetent hacks who had never seen a movie before in their lives to put together an extended version for television. They threw in as much of the deleted footage as they could get their hands on at the time, then padded out the running time furter (in order to stretch to a 4-hour TV timeslot with commercials) with cartoon drawings, countless repeated shots, and fake scenes pieced together from random shots stolen from other scenes. David Lynch had his name removed from this version of the movie.

The Blu-ray contains an additional 17 minutes of footage that didn't make the TV cut. I'm aware of at least one more scene that was filmed but hasn't turned up anywhere yet (a garden scene on Caladan before the journey to Arrakis), but beyond that, most of the other unused footage consisted of random establishing shots, some footage of daily life among the Fremen, and some other odds & ends that Lynch played around with but were never likely to make it into the film. Lynch likes to experiment on set and overshoot his movies, so that he can pare them down to the essentials in editing. Not everything he films is intended to make the final cut.

Josh Z
Writer/Editor, High-Def Digest (Blog updated daily!)
Curator, Laserdisc Forever

My opinions are my own, and do not necessarily reflect those of my employers.

Josh Z is offline  
post #201 of 215 Old 06-17-2013, 11:44 AM
Member
 
shiftyeyes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 137
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I'm quite fond of Lynch's Dune, but my own tastes would prefer a film done more as a futuristic Hamlet-meets-Lawrence of Arabia. I don't like some of the changes made for the film, and while the production design is great, some of it is too gross and just too weird.

As for the deleted material, I would've loved it if they added the Thufir scene and the Chani/Jessica moment from the end of the film back in. Those beats are great.
shiftyeyes is offline  
post #202 of 215 Old 06-17-2013, 11:48 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Josh Z's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Planet Boston, source of the spice, Melange.
Posts: 20,215
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 403 Post(s)
Liked: 394
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

The weirding modules actually made a lot of sense in Lynch's film.

How can, given the length of time allotted for the movie, Lynch convince an audience it was possible for a little group of people in the desert possibly defeat a mighty galactic empire with knives and kung-fu?
No one would buy that who wasn't familiar with the books....wink.gif

The "Weirding Way" of fighting described in the books was a simple Macguffin used to expedite the plot. It gave the Atredies a skill that they could teach the Fremen in order to: 1) Allow Paul and Jessica to be accepted by the Fremen quickly, and 2) Give the Fremen a combat advantage over the Harkonnens, who otherwise had superior numbers and military might.

The "Weirding Modules" in the film are shorthand that accomplishes the same narrative goals in less screen time.

Also, as Lynch said at the time, filming a bunch of guys in bulky rubber suits try to kung-fu fight with each other in a big sandbox would look ridiculous on screen. Letting them shoot at one another is much more cinematic.

The type of people who get upset about this are the sort who refuse to accept any deviation from the novel. I once endured a screaming fit from a Frank Herbert fan who was absolutely furious that one scene that took place indoors in the book had been moved to outdoors in the movie. He could not abide such a heinous desecration of the text.

Frank Herbert, meanwhile, liked the movie a lot.

Josh Z
Writer/Editor, High-Def Digest (Blog updated daily!)
Curator, Laserdisc Forever

My opinions are my own, and do not necessarily reflect those of my employers.

Josh Z is offline  
post #203 of 215 Old 06-17-2013, 12:38 PM
Senior Member
 
coati858's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: San Diego
Posts: 303
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

The "Weirding Way" of fighting described in the books was a simple Macguffin used to expedite the plot. It gave the Atredies a skill that they could teach the Fremen in order to: 1) Allow Paul and Jessica to be accepted by the Fremen quickly, and 2) Give the Fremen a combat advantage over the Harkonnens, who otherwise had superior numbers and military might.

1, yes. 2, not so sure: the Fremen were already at least as good (one on one) as Sardaukar,* who were already superior to the Harkonnens. What they lacked was unity and leadership.

It was Paul's strategic and tactical knowledge from all of his teachers (Gurney, Duncan, Thufir, Yueh, Leto and Jessica, not to mention being prescient) that helped him turn the tables on everone else using the Fremen.


*Remember the scene in the book where the smashed Atreides forces (and Gurney?) witness Fremen taking out Sardaukar:
Atreides soldier: "Those men were Sardaukar!" eek.gif
Fremen (after killing them all): "They fought very well!" biggrin.gif

We have our heading. Here we gooooooo!
coati858 is offline  
post #204 of 215 Old 06-17-2013, 04:14 PM
Newbie
 
trk2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 11
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

The "Weirding Way" of fighting described in the books was a simple Macguffin used to expedite the plot. It gave the Atredies a skill that they could teach the Fremen in order to: 1) Allow Paul and Jessica to be accepted by the Fremen quickly, and 2) Give the Fremen a combat advantage over the Harkonnens, who otherwise had superior numbers and military might.

Quote:
Originally Posted by coati858 View Post

1, yes. 2, not so sure: the Fremen were already at least as good (one on one) as Sardaukar,* who were already superior to the Harkonnens. What they lacked was unity and leadership.

It was Paul's strategic and tactical knowledge from all of his teachers (Gurney, Duncan, Thufir, Yueh, Leto and Jessica, not to mention being prescient) that helped him turn the tables on everone else using the Fremen.

I'm also fairly certain the Harkonnens did not have superior numbers (although they probably did if including the Sardaukar), it was simply that the Fremen were spread throughout the planet instead of clustered in the few towns and cities. I agree with Coati that what Paul brought to the Fremen was leadership - organization, strategy and tactics just like Lawrence of Arabia.

Btw, is anyone else in awe at how well the forced perspective effects shots in Dune have aged? These shots (particularly the Atriedes disembarking the ship on Dune) still look flawless and really give those scenes an epic scope. I'll take good model work and imaginative perspective shots over flat CGI effects any day.
trk2 is offline  
post #205 of 215 Old 06-18-2013, 11:14 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Josh Z's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Planet Boston, source of the spice, Melange.
Posts: 20,215
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 403 Post(s)
Liked: 394
Quote:
Originally Posted by trk2 View Post

I'm also fairly certain the Harkonnens did not have superior numbers (although they probably did if including the Sardaukar), it was simply that the Fremen were spread throughout the planet instead of clustered in the few towns and cities.

When I said that the Harkonnens had superior numbers, I was counting the emperor's Sardaukar forces with them. They also had air power, which the Fremen completely lacked. Of course, they later learned that, "On Arrakis, it is desert power" that matters. smile.gif
Quote:
I agree with Coati that what Paul brought to the Fremen was leadership - organization, strategy and tactics just like Lawrence of Arabia.

I don't disagree. Regardless, it was his ability to teach them the Weirding Way (or how to use Weirding Modules) that convinced the Fremen he could lead them.
Quote:
Btw, is anyone else in awe at how well the forced perspective effects shots in Dune have aged? These shots (particularly the Atriedes disembarking the ship on Dune) still look flawless and really give those scenes an epic scope. I'll take good model work and imaginative perspective shots over flat CGI effects any day.

Aside from the first appearance of the Ornithopher, which has always looked pretty dodgy, the other forced-perspective shots in the movie are stunning, especially the scene you cite.

Josh Z
Writer/Editor, High-Def Digest (Blog updated daily!)
Curator, Laserdisc Forever

My opinions are my own, and do not necessarily reflect those of my employers.

Josh Z is offline  
post #206 of 215 Old 06-18-2013, 12:46 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
oink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Shuloch
Posts: 26,553
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 67 Post(s)
Liked: 818
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

The "Weirding Modules" in the film are shorthand that accomplishes the same narrative goals in less screen time.

Also, as Lynch said at the time, filming a bunch of guys in bulky rubber suits try to kung-fu fight with each other in a big sandbox would look ridiculous on screen. Letting them shoot at one another is much more cinematic.
He was right.

"The Weirding Way of Battle" in the book didn't involve "modules."
It was a combination of known fighting styles, ancient and new, with a strong of dose of Bene Gesserit techniques.

Quote:
Originally Posted by coati858 View Post

the Fremen were already at least as good (one on one) as Sardaukar,* who were already superior to the Harkonnens. What they lacked was unity and leadership.

It was Paul's strategic and tactical knowledge from all of his teachers (Gurney, Duncan, Thufir, Yueh, Leto and Jessica, not to mention being prescient) that helped him turn the tables on everone else using the Fremen.


*Remember the scene in the book where the smashed Atreides forces (and Gurney?) witness Fremen taking out Sardaukar:
Atreides soldier: "Those men were Sardaukar!" eek.gif
Fremen (after killing them all): "They fought very well!" biggrin.gif
True.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trk2 View Post


I'm also fairly certain the Harkonnens did not have superior numbers (although they probably did if including the Sardaukar)
There is 3 different military campaigns involving Harkonnens on Arrakis: the original occupation, the destruction of the Atreides on Arrakis, and the final battle.
The crushing of House Atreides by the Baron did involve SOME Sardaukar, but not all.
It wasn't until Rabban had completely f_cked up the governorship of Arrakis and spice mining had stopped, that the Emperor sent in his entire force of Sardaukar (including reserves).
There was also CHOAM and other allies thrown at the Fremen....of course, to no avail.wink.gif

Quote:
it was simply that the Fremen were spread throughout the planet instead of clustered in the few towns and cities.
The Empire had always used the ancient European strategy of Divide and Conquer against tribal societies on Dune.

Quote:
I agree with Coati that what Paul brought to the Fremen was leadership - organization, strategy and tactics just like Lawrence of Arabia.
Gotta wonder if Herbert picked up on this....

Quote:
Btw, is anyone else in awe at how well the forced perspective effects shots in Dune have aged? These shots (particularly the Atriedes disembarking the ship on Dune) still look flawless and really give those scenes an epic scope. I'll take good model work and imaginative perspective shots over flat CGI effects any day.
+1

A.P.S. deserve our protection....join the cause today!
oink is offline  
post #207 of 215 Old 06-18-2013, 01:37 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Josh Z's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Planet Boston, source of the spice, Melange.
Posts: 20,215
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 403 Post(s)
Liked: 394
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

>> I agree with Coati that what Paul brought to the Fremen was leadership - organization, strategy and tactics just like Lawrence of Arabia.

Gotta wonder if Herbert picked up on this....

David Lean certainly did. He was attached to direct a movie version of Dune for some time in the late '60s/early '70s.

Josh Z
Writer/Editor, High-Def Digest (Blog updated daily!)
Curator, Laserdisc Forever

My opinions are my own, and do not necessarily reflect those of my employers.

Josh Z is offline  
post #208 of 215 Old 06-18-2013, 01:43 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
oink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Shuloch
Posts: 26,553
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 67 Post(s)
Liked: 818
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

David Lean certainly did. He was attached to direct a movie version of Dune for some time in the late '60s/early '70s.
Wasn't aware, certainly would have been something to see.wink.gif

A.P.S. deserve our protection....join the cause today!
oink is offline  
post #209 of 215 Old 06-20-2013, 08:26 PM
Senior Member
 
dwisniski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Florence, NJ
Posts: 498
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
"There is a foreign Blu-Ray of Children of Dune but I'm not sure how the quality is.
'

The
PQ of the french "Children Of Dune" Blu-ray release was actually not bad, worst thing is that all the permanent subtitles (like the Irulan and Reverend Mother Mohiam scene) are all in French, so it kind of ruins the scene for those not well versed in French.
dwisniski is offline  
post #210 of 215 Old 06-20-2013, 10:19 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
oink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Shuloch
Posts: 26,553
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 67 Post(s)
Liked: 818
Quote:
Originally Posted by dwisniski View Post

"There is a foreign Blu-Ray of Children of Dune but I'm not sure how the quality is.
'

The
PQ of the french "Children Of Dune" Blu-ray release was actually not bad, worst thing is that all the permanent subtitles (like the Irulan and Reverend Mother Mohiam scene) are all in French, so it kind of ruins the scene for those not well versed in French.
That won't work for me.
I need a proper English Language release.

A.P.S. deserve our protection....join the cause today!
oink is offline  
Reply Blu-ray Software

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off