Star Wars on BD Confirmed by Lucas for Fall 2011 - Pre Release Discussion - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 6227 Old 04-20-2010, 11:47 PM
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Originally Posted by DavidHir View Post

If Lucas really said that it just goes to show how clueless and detached he became not even recognizing the greatness of ANH - which doesn't surprise me considering how far off he's gone. Indy 4 took it to a whole new low level.

I think he knew exactly what he was doing with ANH.
Lucas is a very self-effacing guy.

And I DO agree Indy 4 is complete shite.

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post #92 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 06:40 AM
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Originally Posted by oink View Post

I think he knew exactly what he was doing with ANH.
Lucas is a very self-effacing guy.

And I DO agree Indy 4 is complete shite.

I don't get the Indy 4 hate. It is completely unbelievable nonsense. Just like flaming hearts, 2000 year old knights, exploding heads, and ramping runaway rail cars were. I have no problem with alien seeking, mind reading Communists. There was nothing in Indy 4 as absurd as the last hour of Temple of Doom. I like Indy 4. Please, sir, can I have more?
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post #93 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 07:18 AM
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Originally Posted by giantchicken View Post

I think that after his death, George Lucas is going to have his body burned up in a Jedi funeral pyre like Qui-Gon, and his corpse will be clutching the master negatives of the original theatrical versions of the first three films, just to be sure that the special editions are the ones that will go down in history.

If Lucas won't take the rights to Star Wars with him to the grave you will be sorry. Studios will be releasing different Ultimate editions every 6 months.

PSN: GeminiEffect
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post #94 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 07:51 AM
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Originally Posted by BaronVH View Post

I don't get the Indy 4 hate. It is completely unbelievable nonsense. Just like flaming hearts, 2000 year old knights, exploding heads, and ramping runaway rail cars were. I have no problem with alien seeking, mind reading Communists. There was nothing in Indy 4 as absurd as the last hour of Temple of Doom. I like Indy 4. Please, sir, can I have more?

The movie may have been accepted better if it weren't called an Indy movie. It has no "Indy feel" to it at all.

I still think Lucas is a great writer, but not so much a director. I'd call any of his directorial success accidental (luck). Plus, don't forget that Star Wars happened in the 70's, which may as well have been a different galaxy compared to today's society.

Stephen.

Chances are very good that I was drinking when I posted the above.

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post #95 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 08:59 AM
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Originally Posted by sb1 View Post

The movie may have been accepted better if it weren't called an Indy movie. It has no "Indy feel" to it at all.

I still think Lucas is a great writer, but not so much a director.

That's for sure! Though he didn't write anything for indy 4, did he? It was Koepp I think.
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post #96 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by baronvh View Post

i don't get the indy 4 hate. It is completely unbelievable nonsense. Just like flaming hearts, 2000 year old knights, exploding heads, and ramping runaway rail cars were. I have no problem with alien seeking, mind reading communists. There was nothing in indy 4 as absurd as the last hour of temple of doom. I like indy 4. Please, sir, can i have more?

+1

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post #97 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 12:52 PM
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Originally Posted by sb1 View Post

I still think Lucas is a great writer, but not so much a director. I'd call any of his directorial success accidental (luck).

I couldn't disagree more. AMERICAN GRAFFITI, THX-1138 and STAR WARS -- all groundbreaking films. Three-in-a-row can hardly be characterized as directorial "luck."
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post #98 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Morpheo View Post

That's for sure! Though he didn't write anything for indy 4, did he? It was Koepp I think.

indy 4 story (and the previous 3) were done by lucas, Koepp did the script
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post #99 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by reanimator View Post

I couldn't disagree more. AMERICAN GRAFFITI, THX-1138 and STAR WARS -- all groundbreaking films. Three-in-a-row can hardly be characterized as directorial "luck."

Three good films from the 70's and he's a directorial legend? What about the rest of his work? The last three SW films are enough to make me believe his success as a director was a product of the times, like I said before. The newest Star Wars movies simply couldn't be made by someone who has the slightest clue as to what the original trilogy embodied. Plus, we don't know how those original films would hold up if released today given how much nostalgia plays a part in their success with many people. Other than Star Wars (which again, has a strong basis in nostalgia even for me), I never had much of an urge to watch AG or 1138 more than once, though I do consider AG a fine piece of character driven work.

Stephen.

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post #100 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 01:39 PM
 
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I was about to write five full paragraphs but then i thought nahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh as i'll have to do it all over again next year when they do finally arrive.
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post #101 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 01:48 PM
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AG is pretty much considered a classic by most.

http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/...301010301/1023

""American Graffiti" is not only a great movie but a brilliant work of historical fiction; no sociological treatise could duplicate the movie's success in remembering exactly how it was to be alive at that cultural instant..."

I watch it every couple of years and IMHO it's one of the truly "perfect" little films ever made. I don't think that was luck. That was Lucas really, really being tuned into the subject matter.
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post #102 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 05:39 PM
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Originally Posted by sb1 View Post

Three good films from the 70's and he's a directorial legend? What about the rest of his work?

You realize you can apply that exact same criteria to Francis Ford Coppola, right? Coppola's status as a directorial legend is almost entirely built on THE GODFATHER, THE GODFATHER PART II, and APOCALYPSE NOW - three good movies he made in the 1970s.

Choosing to grade Lucas solely on a personal dislike for the prequel STAR WARS films is short-sighted. If nothing else, with the prequel films Lucas single-handedly dragged Hollywood into the hi-def, digital age of cinema. And he made a few billion dollars while doing so.

I'd say the man is a genius.
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post #103 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted by sb1 View Post

Three good films from the 70's and he's a directorial legend? What about the rest of his work? The last three SW films are enough to make me believe his success as a director was a product of the times, like I said before. The newest Star Wars movies simply couldn't be made by someone who has the slightest clue as to what the original trilogy embodied. Plus, we don't know how those original films would hold up if released today given how much nostalgia plays a part in their success with many people. Other than Star Wars (which again, has a strong basis in nostalgia even for me), I never had much of an urge to watch AG or 1138 more than once, though I do consider AG a fine piece of character driven work.

Ever heard of a highly profitable move franchise called Indian Jones? Take a guess at who created that story.

Ever see a movie called American Graffiti? The movie that was so successful that it was the reason behind the creation of "Happy Days". As they took the opportunity to capitalize on the popularity of the renewed interest in nostalgia entertainment. And then created a highly successful TV comedy based in the 50s/60s. It's due to the fact that American Graffiti brought back the popularity for late 50s/early 60s nostalgia.

And THX 1138 is one of my favorite Dystopian thrillers. Not bad for a kid who wrote it and produced the first version of that flick while a kid in college.
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post #104 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 08:43 PM
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Ever heard of Jar-Jar Binks? Lucas single handedly destroyed his Star Wars fan base with that one creation. There was no salvaging the prequels after that travesty. I still feel cheated!
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post #105 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 08:58 PM
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Originally Posted by tofana10am View Post

Ever heard of Jar-Jar Binks? Lucas single handedly destroyed his Star Wars fan base with that one creation. There was no salvaging the prequels after that travesty. I still feel cheated!

You think one unfavorable character destroyed the Star Wars franchise? That's quite humorous and a bit sensationalized.

You're obviously not really a Star Wars fan. What 6 movie franchise can you name that didn't have a bad apple in the bunch?

Ever seen Aliens 3 or Star Trek V The Final Frontier? Any of the Nightmare on Elm Street flicks after the original movie? Friday the 13th franchise..Oh god, where to start.

Star Wars I-III aren't that bad, if you're a fan. If you're simply a film critic, then you can see that it ultimately came down to bad casting. Primarily the role of Anakin Skywalker. Both of the Anakins that played in I - III. And George Lucas' well know difficulty in setting up romantic subplots. The guy is a genius, but that aspect of film is not his forte.
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post #106 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 09:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave Mack View Post

AG is pretty much considered a classic by most.

http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/...301010301/1023

""American Graffiti" is not only a great movie but a brilliant work of historical fiction; no sociological treatise could duplicate the movie's success in remembering exactly how it was to be alive at that cultural instant..."

I watch it every couple of years and IMHO it's one of the truly "perfect" little films ever made. I don't think that was luck. That was Lucas really, really being tuned into the subject matter.

I've never seen AG, but have always heard positive things about it and will assume it's a quality film. I agree - I think Lucas was really tuned into filmmaking in those days as you don't make AG, A New Hope, Empire Strikes Back, and Raiders of the Lost Ark by luck within an eight year period! Now, whatever happened after that is certainly curious.

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post #107 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 09:16 PM
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Originally Posted by LowBudget5.1 View Post

Star Wars I-III aren't that bad, if you're a fan. If you're simply a film critic, then you can see that it ultimately came down to bad casting. Primarily the role of Anakin Skywalker. Both of the Anakins that played in I - III. And George Lucas' well know difficulty in setting up romantic subplots. The guy is a genius, but that aspect of film is not his forte.

I'm a huge Star Wars fan (I was five when A New Hope came out) and the prequels hold up less now for me than when they were released. I have found The Phantom Menace almost unwatchable and just cringe at much of Hayden's acting. Now, I will give him a small break as some of his dialogue was atrocious and would have been hard for any actor to deliver.

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post #108 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 09:23 PM
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Originally Posted by BaronVH View Post

I don't get the Indy 4 hate. It is completely unbelievable nonsense. Just like flaming hearts, 2000 year old knights, exploding heads, and ramping runaway rail cars were. I have no problem with alien seeking, mind reading Communists. There was nothing in Indy 4 as absurd as the last hour of Temple of Doom. I like Indy 4. Please, sir, can I have more?

Indy 4 just got out-of-control-stupid. Sure, you had supernaturalism and the "unbelievable" moments in Temple of Doom, but it had a much better plot, more originality, FAR better acting by Harrison Ford, and I liked the darker tone of the movie. I felt it worked. Indy 4 is exactly what is wrong with Lucas today as it made me appreciate The Phantom Menace a bit more actually!

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post #109 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 11:06 PM
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Originally Posted by thehun View Post

Most people didn't see the 70 mm version it wasn't a wide release, so the Dolby Surround of the 35mm will be what the original for most. Lucas good give us all the different versions on the BD if he wanted to, he probably won't however, so the rare 70mm 6ch track will only stay in the few people's head as a distant memory.

i'm not sure if it is true or not but I vaguely recall something about the original 70mm 6ch mix having been lost or accidentally destroyed somewhere along the way
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post #110 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 11:09 PM
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Originally Posted by tofana10am View Post

Ever heard of Jar-Jar Binks? Lucas single handedly destroyed his Star Wars fan base with that one creation. There was no salvaging the prequels after that travesty. I still feel cheated!

i think that is going pretty far over the top

and he only had like 10 seconds of screen time over parts 2 and 3 combined anyway






although jar-jar, especially combined with the dumb lines like "yousa in deep...." (can't bare to repeat that one again) made it easy for the hate to suddenly boil for some

putting a few lines like the one just mentioned was a bad decision that alone probably flipped the will of quite a few

coupled with the more political story (which took some fans by surprise even though the fact is Lucas actually added a lot of action to the original prequel outlines which were even MORE poltical, so i don't see the reason for surprise myself, they followed the basic idea Lucas had already tossed out there decades ago; and which some critics who derided 1-3 as dumb and simplistic and at the same time too confusing (???) completely utterly did not get, it was kind of funny to read some critic getting all pompous and oooh I have a 900IQ and then not being able to get some pretty basic concepts and plot points) and the desire for a more child-like, innocent opening (to contrast with ROTS all the more, which many did not get and many didn't think too look at it as an opening chapter but a standalone) in an age when people are a lot more hard nosed and all but the youngest kids more worldly than the days of the late 70's and early to mid-80's, in an age where stuff like the Matrix was being worshipped (not saying Matrix, at least the first one for sure, wasn't good, it was good) and the new cool also had to be a lot rougher edged; take all that and then jar-jar along with scattered bits clearly and foolishly and poorly written soley AT young kids and it was suddenly pushed irretrievably off the edge for many

and the story is always to build someone up and then when that runs out, tear 'em down and some who resented Lucas for 'destroying' hollywood, etc. were all to eager to enter the second tear 'em down stage

and then add those who decided that they knew what 1-3 were supposed to be (even if many of their ideas totally went against what hints had been given about 1-3 years ago) and then those who grew out of the mindset they had when ANH came out and were thinking a Kill Bill/Matrix/etc. mindset



1-3 probably should've been spread over 4 films, that would've let them build up more adventures together in the middle and gotten a bit more of that the good old gang feeling of 4-6 going, in some ways a bit too much to fit into just 3 films

anyway despite a few truly hideous lines, the partially questionable jar-jar and a bit too hokied up final ground battle, I thought the TPM was still ok and did have a lot of great stuff

although it's not popular to say, i do like 1-3

anyway enough blah blah blah from me
i wrote this so fast, not sure if it is readable anyway
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post #111 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 11:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BaronVH View Post

I don't get the Indy 4 hate. It is completely unbelievable nonsense. Just like flaming hearts, 2000 year old knights, exploding heads, and ramping runaway rail cars were. I have no problem with alien seeking, mind reading Communists. There was nothing in Indy 4 as absurd as the last hour of Temple of Doom. I like Indy 4. Please, sir, can I have more?

i didn't mind indy4 myself

i'd have to say first is my fav though and then third

apparently Harrison Ford was pretty pleased with it as an Indy movie
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post #112 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 11:15 PM
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Nuke the fridge.
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post #113 of 6227 Old 04-21-2010, 11:20 PM
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Originally Posted by reanimator View Post

If nothing else, with the prequel films Lucas single-handedly dragged Hollywood into the hi-def, digital age of cinema. And he made a few billion dollars while doing so.

Therein lies the rub....there is nothing folks dislike MORE than someone who is super-successful.



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Originally Posted by LowBudget5.1 View Post

You think one unfavorable character destroyed the Star Wars franchise? That's quite humorous and a bit sensationalized.
Star Wars I-III aren't that bad, if you're a fan.

+1

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post #114 of 6227 Old 04-22-2010, 04:04 AM
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off topic, but you guys know Lucas changed the DVD of "Phantom" from the theatrical version too right? The only theatrical version is the 1999 laserdisc from Japan.

Isn't there also a trailer of EP1 (post EPIII DVD) that shows Yoda as CG replacing the "puppet"?

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post #115 of 6227 Old 04-22-2010, 06:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by CAVX View Post

Isn't there also a trailer of EP1 (post EPIII DVD) that shows Yoda as CG replacing the "puppet"?

It was one of the extras on Sith, I believe. It also was shown "officially" on the Star Wars In Concert.

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post #116 of 6227 Old 04-22-2010, 08:04 AM
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I grew up a Star Wars nut. I loved the original trilogy, having seen each film dozens of times in the theater. But ever since the prequels and the awful Special Editions, I've found that I'm quickly losing interest. Will I buy the Blu-ray set? Probably. But I have a suspicion that it will probably sit on my shelf unopened until my son gets old enough to watch them.

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post #117 of 6227 Old 04-22-2010, 08:23 AM
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I always get a kick out of people who value differentiate the SW films in terms of their respective trilogies. The prequels are bad, the originals are clearly superior, blah, blah, blah.
And yet these same people are blind to the monumental value differences across the first three films. You might get them to admit that Jedi isn't quite as good the other two, but what the hell, it's got the same characters so how bad could it be?
For me, Jedi has always been the crystal clear point where Lucas' values changed as a storyteller/filmmaker. I get tired of rehashing this just as much as anyone, but hunt down the IGN interview with Gary Kurtz (the producer of the only two really good Star Wars films) to find out what changed between Empire and Jedi, and how that film and the SW universe was originally intended to play out.
But actually, that's not even what prompted me to post.
As much as I love to diss Lucas every chance I can get now, I have to give the guy a heaping ton of credit for Raiders. There was a transcript of the initial story conference between Lucas, Spielberg, and Kasdan going around last year, and as I read thru that thing, my jaw was on the floor.
The guy with the most inane suggestions, the one that didn't have any grasp of the character that eventually wound up on screen, was -surprise- Spielberg! To my utter amazement, Spielberg was the one throwing out the stupidest nonsense (the inflatable life raft gag from TOD was actually something Spielberg originally wanted to shoehorn into Raiders), while Lucas, and to a lesser extent Kasden, is the one keeping the character real and, and the plot on a sensible track. Here all this time I was giving Spielberg credit for being Indy's soul, when the transcripts clearly reveal the character, along with the grand structure of the first film, was almost exclusively Lucas' vision, nuanced and embellished by Kasdan.

Fascinating reading and well worth tracking down.


As for the SW films on Bd- No way I'll be buying these if they are only going to be a massive 6 film set. I won't even bite if the only singles are the SEs. After all these years, Lucas finally soured me on them. The SE's are derogatory versions of the originals. I hate seeing simple scenes, like the entrance to Mos Eisely, now reduced to a distracting parade of CGI crap all over the frame. Or seeing the driving pace of the escape from Cloud City suddenly brake slammed and restarted, all so that we can witness absolutely pointless and inessential departing/arriving shots. That's the mark of a storyteller who has absolutely lost all sense of storytelling priorities. Not having the originals in a decent standard def presentation has been enough slight. I won't bother compounding it by buying the SE's on Bd.
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post #118 of 6227 Old 04-22-2010, 08:27 AM
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although it's not popular to say, i do like 1-3

i also liked 1-3 and will be buying this set the day it comes out

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post #119 of 6227 Old 04-22-2010, 09:02 AM
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I mostly enjoyed 1-3, but Anakin's acting in all movies is distracting/abysmal. #1 has Jar Jar, #3 has Franken vader; two bad decisions you can't help but shake your head at every time you watch the movies. I suppose I enjoyed #2 the most, but it's all a toss up.

With regard to Indiana 4: the movie lost me when Shia LaBeouf started swinging on vines
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post #120 of 6227 Old 04-22-2010, 09:17 AM
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Hey, I would rather watch III the VI any day of the week.
By VI, Ford was bored out of his mind, phoning in his performance, Fisher was in a drug haze looking like a zombie, (a hot zombie in the Slave Leia outfit though) we had the flippin' Ewoks and Jabba band nonsense and basically a retread of the Death Star battle (at least Wedge got props though...)
James Earl Jones sounded like he banged out his lines in one afternoon and gives really dull, bland readings. The only thing that saved it was that Hamill seemed REALLY into it (probably realizing it was his big screen swan song) and the Emperor was excellent.
III imho was MUCH better and is much more watchable to me. When I saw it opening day at the Ziegfeld the crowd loved it.
Dave Mack is offline  
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