Fox Blu-ray Discs - Go Bad? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 119 Old 12-10-2010, 05:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Greetings,

This morning I discovered that Alien vs. Predator (AVP) a disc that I have had for three or four years now which has played fine in the past no longer loads in any of my Blu-ray players (Oppo, PS3, Samsung, Toshiba, Panasonic).

In the Oppo it will get past the FBI warning but freezes at the menu. All of the other players report it as a bad or unsupported disc. Perplexed I reached for Speed, another Fox title released around the same time. The initial run of Speed on Blu-ray had problems but I have the reissued version which I have never had a problem with. Well it won't play either and reads like AVP.

I successfully loaded the following Fox titles released around the same time: Windtalkers, Men of honor, Fantastic Four and Flyboys. Thinking back I seem to recall AVP being a problematic disc and the Speed issues are well documented although with the reissue there have been fewer problems.

These discs are kept on a shelf, in their original cases away from sunlight, heat etc. I am wondering if the coating on these discs has deteriorated or something similar.

Anyone owning them for the same length of time care to give them a try and see if they play?

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post #2 of 119 Old 12-10-2010, 05:33 AM
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they could have, two of my netflix streaming disks for the ps3 stopped working. I tried it on my friends and didn't load either. Both disks were mint.
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post #3 of 119 Old 12-10-2010, 05:57 AM
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Well, first there was laser disc rot...now maybe DVDs...this is not good news!!! If that is what's happening, there could go our collections.

Note, just bought Alien vs Predator BD yesterday. Did I just waste $10, we'll see.

Thansk Ralph for the heads up!!!

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post #4 of 119 Old 12-10-2010, 06:10 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inspector View Post

Well, first there was laser disc rot...now maybe DVDs...this is not good news!!! If that is what's happening, there could go our collections.

Note, just bought Alien vs Predator BD yesterday. Did I just waste $10, we'll see.

Thansk Ralph for the heads up!!!

Greetings,

Don't jump to any conclusions. If you just bought AVP I would assume that it is a newer pressing (?) that SHOULD be fine. I have plenty of discs purchased around the same time period as these two that play perfectly fine so I don't think our collections are going to disintegrate.

I am hoping to hear from those who have had one or both for two to four years to see if their's are still working or not.

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post #5 of 119 Old 12-10-2010, 07:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Potts View Post

Greetings,

Don't jump to any conclusions. If you just bought AVP I would assume that it is a newer pressing (?) that SHOULD be fine. I have plenty of discs purchased around the same time period as these two that play perfectly fine so I don't think our collections are going to disintegrate.

I am hoping to hear from those who have had one or both for two to four years to see if their's are still working or not.

Regards,

I bought AVP in 2007 I think, I just put it in the computer and it plays fine. I haven't tried it in my Blu-ray player because it is only connected to my projector and I don't feel like dealing with it right now. For what it's worth the advertising insert says copyright 2007, it has ads for The Simpsons, Fantastic 4, Independence Day, Cast Away and The Die Hard Collection on the flip-side.
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post #6 of 119 Old 12-10-2010, 08:44 AM
 
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Since they began removing extras from rental discs, I no longer purchase discs from Fox. However, I have had problems with the Fox rental discs not loading as well. FANTASTIC MR FOX and THE JONESES are two that I recall not being able to play. I assumed it was a by-product of the stripped-down rentals.
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post #7 of 119 Old 12-10-2010, 09:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Potts View Post

Greetings,

This morning I discovered that Alien vs. Predator (AVP) a disc that I have had for three or four years now which has played fine in the past no longer loads in any of my Blu-ray players (Oppo, PS3, Samsung, Toshiba, Panasonic).

Can you see any discoloration on the data side near the hub of the disc? I've seen reports of issues with BD discs separating at the hub and/or developing some kind of rot near the hub.
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post #8 of 119 Old 12-10-2010, 09:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdgrimes View Post

Can you see any discoloration on the data side near the hub of the disc? I've seen reports of issues with BD discs separating at the hub and/or developing some kind of rot near the hub.

Greetings,

I didn't notice anything out of the ordinary when I examined the discs but I will take a closer look and report back.


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post #9 of 119 Old 12-10-2010, 09:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ComputerCowboy View Post

I bought AVP in 2007 I think, I just put it in the computer and it plays fine. I haven't tried it in my Blu-ray player because it is only connected to my projector and I don't feel like dealing with it right now. For what it's worth the advertising insert says copyright 2007, it has ads for The Simpsons, Fantastic 4, Independence Day, Cast Away and The Die Hard Collection on the flip-side.

Greetings,

Thanks for checking.


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post #10 of 119 Old 12-10-2010, 12:33 PM
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Benes said the same thing about Speed: Blu-ray Discs Rotting??
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post #11 of 119 Old 12-10-2010, 12:42 PM
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This makes me want to revisit backing up my collection. I don't currently have the hard drive space or appropriate hardware, but with all I've spent collecting, maybe it would be worth the additional cost and time.

Back off man, I'm a scientist.
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post #12 of 119 Old 12-10-2010, 01:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msgohan View Post

Benes said the same thing about Speed: Blu-ray Discs Rotting??

Not rotting, certain copies of "Speed" were actually blank un-written discs.

The proper setting for sharpness is always0.
Also my Oppo BDP-103D is region free.
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post #13 of 119 Old 12-10-2010, 02:27 PM
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Mine said 2004/2007 and I just played it and it works fine on my Panny BD-30!

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post #14 of 119 Old 12-10-2010, 05:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fanboyz View Post

Not rotting, certain copies of "Speed" were actually blank un-written discs.

Had you read the linked post you would have seen it was previously working for him...
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post #15 of 119 Old 12-10-2010, 06:29 PM
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I'm very worried about this. I have the Finnish BD of the Protector - and it is like your discs Ralph, it just don't work anymore but used to play fine. Bought this disc about 2 years ago. Should I ask either the shop or the distributor (Future Film) for a refund or exchange?
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post #16 of 119 Old 12-10-2010, 09:26 PM
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Does it make any difference if you clean the discs with warm water and mild detergent?

I have a suspicion that the cases outgas plasticiser or other chemicals and that these vapours deposit on the disc surface over time, interfering with the laser transmission.
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post #17 of 119 Old 12-10-2010, 10:45 PM
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The only warped disc of mine is Saw IV, and I'm not sure what caused it. I ended up caving in and getting a new copy.

Haven't heard of any other issues though.
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post #18 of 119 Old 12-11-2010, 08:04 AM
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I imagine if you send the studio your original disc that they would replace it for you. Discs do occasionally fail from time to time, even retail ones.

My father had a legitimate copy of a Bollywood movie (rare, I know) that was new and played fine for years. One day we try to play it and the DVD has a discoloration on the data side, almost as if someone had spilled something on it. It won't play at all and I could not read the disc on my computer either.
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post #19 of 119 Old 12-11-2010, 08:39 AM
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Checked my copy of AVP which I bought within a week of it's street date a few years ago and it still plays fine. menus, scenes, ect - no problems. In fact, I was surprised to be reminded how fast the movie or chapters load and play when selected in the menu unlike most titles these days.

Regarding laser rot, I'm sure there will be incidents reported concerning specific titles as time goes on and more titles are available. I remember back in the early days of laserdiscs, I had the first release (full screen) of "Greystoke: The Legend of Tarzan" and after about a year, I went to play the movie and noticed copper/brass colored "speckles" all over one side of one of the two discs and it wouldn't play. This introduced me to laser rot and as many laserdisc collectors know, late in the format's history in the mid/late 90's many titles from Sony/Tri Star including "Starship Troopers" and "Contact" from a certain factory were prone to laser rot due to contaminants in the chemicals and process used to bond the plastic clear layers to the metallic data disc. Entire runs of these titles quickly rotted and became unplayable within a few month's time.

Laser rot has been noted in certain titles produced on dvd through the 90's as well. "Kentucky Fried Movie" and certain Anchor Bay Hammer Horror dvds were prone to rot and become unplayable for instance.

Laser rot doesn't always manifest itself as physical discoloration on a disc. Usually it will show as either speckles as noted on the LD example I mention but it can also show as a coppery or gold colored discoloration on the entire data side surface of the disc that grows more pronounced over time. This is usually due to excess moisture/ high humidity contaminating the laminating process causing the thin metallic data disc to actually "rust" over time. Sometimes it can show as a sort of "clouding" like the plastic or acrylic resin laminate begins to outgas or break down, usually due to improper mix or contamination of the chemicals to make the layers at the manufacturers plant. However, there can be no outward visual signs the disc is going bad until the day you try to play it and it fails to load.

As the process to manufacture consumer discs has evolved in 30+ years, such problems have been addressed only to have different issues with similar negative results occur. But the instances of such problems has greatly been reduced over time.

I've run into laser rot in every type of data disc at some point. CDs, DVDs, LDs.... I have yet to find laser rot on a Blu-ray title (I have about 300 titles so far) but I'm sure I'll run into it sooner or later.

T.B.
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post #20 of 119 Old 12-11-2010, 09:17 AM
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Checked out my copy of AvP and it seems to work fine, however my copy of Speed also magically stopped loading. I tried a few other of the older Fox titles nearby on the shelf (28 Days/Weeks later, Behind Enemy Lines) and they seemed OK, but who knows if the movies won't freeze up while watching. I am going to see if I can get a replacement for Speed.
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post #21 of 119 Old 12-11-2010, 09:34 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IanD View Post

Does it make any difference if you clean the discs with warm water and mild detergent?

I have a suspicion that the cases outgas plasticiser or other chemicals and that these vapours deposit on the disc surface over time, interfering with the laser transmission.

Greetings,

I tried cleaning the discs to no avail. Examination doesn't reveal any obvious damage etc. I just ordered replacements from Amazon for $10 each. I am not interested in querying the studios at this point. If this occurs with any more of my discs then I will take it farther. I wanted to check in with folks here to see if anyone else experienced this as well as bring it to the attention of those that may not be aware of it.

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post #22 of 119 Old 12-11-2010, 01:21 PM
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Just checked my uk copy of speed and it plays fine.
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post #23 of 119 Old 12-11-2010, 03:05 PM
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I'm going to try out Speed which was purchased back in 2006. I have an Oppo BDP-93 and a Panasonic BDT-300. I'll report back.

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post #24 of 119 Old 12-11-2010, 03:16 PM
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Ralph,

I came across something interesting. I played Speed on my Panasonic BDT-300 and after the spinning dotted circles it went to the FBI Warning screen and I had green blotches all over. It kept playing with these green pixelated blotches. I than went to my living room setup and played it on my Oppo BDP-93. It loaded but skipped the FBI warning logos and went straight to the main menu. In the main menu I could see the menu selections but the rest of the screen was blank. I selected a scene and it played ok. There is a definite problem with Speed. I haven't watched this disc since I bought it in 2006. I don't own AVP.

EDIT: I just checked Flyboys and I do see a white coloration around the hub of the disc. I played it on my Panasonic and it loaded fine. If anyone is interested I could post a pic of the coloration.

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post #25 of 119 Old 12-11-2010, 03:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePrisoner View Post

Ralph,

I came across something interesting. I played Speed on my Panasonic BDT-300 and after the spinning dotted circles it went to the FBI Warning screen and I had green blotches all over. It kept playing with these green pixelated blotches. I than went to my living room setup and played it on my Oppo BDP-93. It loaded but skipped the FBI warning logos and went straight to the main menu. In the main menu I could see the menu selections but the rest of the screen was blank. I selected a scene and it played ok. There is a definite problem with Speed. I haven't watched this disc since I bought it in 2006. I don't own AVP.

EDIT: I just checked Flyboys and I do see a white coloration around the hub of the disc. I played it on my Panasonic and it loaded fine. If anyone is interested I could post a pic of the coloration.

Greetings,

Thanks Hank. Flyboys plays fine for me as well but I will check the condition of the disc anyway.

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post #26 of 119 Old 12-11-2010, 06:32 PM
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No issues with a 2006 US Speed on a PS3 60GB.
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post #27 of 119 Old 12-12-2010, 04:28 AM - Thread Starter
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No issues with a 2006 US Speed on a PS3 60GB.
Greetings,

Good to hear. Thanks!


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post #28 of 119 Old 12-12-2010, 07:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Greetings,

I checked the following Fox titles that were early Blu-ray releases from the same era as Speed and AVP and all played fine:

Behind enemy lines
Entrapment
Hart's war
Courage under fire

I also tried Master and commander and I Robot which are a little newer and they are fine as well.


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post #29 of 119 Old 12-12-2010, 03:45 PM
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Tried Speed, Master and Commander, Kingdom of Heaven, and - based on other feedback I read - the Lionsgate titles Basic Instinct and The Descent.

Basic Instinct has rotted. All others play fine. Tested on 2 Panasonic (BD-30 and new BDT-100, and PS3 80GB model from 2008 - all with latest FWs). The basic Instinct disc played fine when I bought it back in late 2007. i believe I may have seen it again in 2008-2009, but it has definitely been a while since I spun it up. The disc is in pristine condition. No marks or blemishes.

These discs were all kept in a dedicated home theater room, cool, dry, etc.

Anyone have Lionsgate's contact info? Hope this is not a trend and only affected certain runs of certain titles early in the Blu-ray format life...
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post #30 of 119 Old 12-12-2010, 04:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benes View Post
Told ya so...

I was able to get a replacement for Speed by just emailing Fox with the number listed here. They asked for my address and I got the new disc with case within the week.
I just sent them an email about exchanging my copy of Speed.

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